Answered After you reach your genetic potential can you keep any gains after a cycle?

[JoePaul39]

If one has reached their genetic potential (not me, but wondering on this) then when they run a cycle when they come off do they lose all of their gains if they follow the generally accepted rule of time off equals time on cycle plus pct before running their next cycle?

 

[Old Witch]

Ehhhhh... sort of. Most guys never will be this.

But if you look at a pro bodybuilder on stage at the Olympia, they’re way past what any human could naturally achieve by far.

When they take breaks, they definitely don’t look anything like that. However you would be surprised how much weight a guy can hold without drugs, it just won’t be as lean.

 

[Chados]

The pump you have, being hard and grainy is something that while on steroids you just won't keep the same quality off cycle. However I feel that with experience and knowing what you're doing you can look damn good, it's just not for everyone. I eat more strict than anyone I know and it doesn't bother me, cooking is what bothers me, working out bothers me. It feels like it takes so much time of your life but I know that if I did the opposite I'd be having a feeling of regret. It's not really a good place to be in cause working out is like having a lot of money, you want more and if you don't have a goal on the side it just doesn't keep you happy.

You can't look the same off gear unfortunately.

 

[xR1pp3Rx]

BBers reach a "set point" and have to break that point. They usually do so by getting over weight, for several months on end to get the body used to carrying new weight. They also will incorporate use of various drugs to help reach a new set point. Look at J cutler.. hes still huge and probably is on a trt dose of test. once you've re set the bodies ability to hold more mass, the theory is you can keep what you gain... of course we are talking yrs and yrs of work and eating.

Conversely... if you listen much to Rx muscle, you will hear polumbo talk about how hard it was to lose at the muscle. took yrs.

 

[Jeremyk1]

There’s evidence that there’s lasting effects on the body from steroid use. True hypertrophy actually happens when you increase the number of nuclei in each muscle cell (in contrast to sarcoplasmic hypertrophy, which is a swelling of the cells that dissipates over time). Nuclei don’t tend to leave the muscle cells. There’s a study in mice showing that mice given testosterone injections early in life have a greater potential for growth later in life even when testosterone therapy has ended, due to the increased nuclei in each muscle cell. Like Ripper was saying, you essentially have a new “set point”. It will be extremely difficult to exceed that without further use of drugs, but maintaining might be easier than you’d think.

 

[Kratom267]

i found that in the past when I wasn’t very strict on diet, after running a short 4 to 6 week PH cycle I would end up losing everything I gained 6 months later. The key for me was whatever your diet looks like on cycle ( higher protein than usual, higher cals and carbs than usual) needs to either stay that way after the cycle is finished or even almost doubled. To be able to maintain the weight and muscle gained.
Pretty common sense stuff, but for me at least, found it incredibly hard to master!

 

[Kratom267]

You’ll still never be able to maintain the constant pump and strength that you get while on though...strength perhaps.

 

[BarryScott]

Kevin Levrone is the perfect example of what on/off drugs looks like while at/close to genetic limit.

 

[Matthersby]

There’s too many variables for genetic potential and it will change every year as you get older and your body changes, thyroid levels fluctuate. It’s just too complicated and will vary from person to person. I know this much, the muscle you put on naturally is absurdly easy to hang onto, the muscle you put on with gear disappears fast, even if you continue to train hard, you may be able to hang onto the weight with caloric surpluses but it won’t look the same. Nutrient partitioning will shift and your midsection will hold more weight, traps and shoulders will shrink.
I’m sure with enough hard work you can keep some to a degree but genetic limitations are a bytch. There’s a reason people who use steroids attempting to advance with the intention of trying to maintain it naturally, end up just doing more steroids.

 

[Old Witch]

Kevin Levrone is the perfect example of what on/off drugs looks like while at/close to genetic limit.

No, because he stopped bodybuilding altogether for 15 years... if he had kept lifting as a natty, then you would be entirely correct.

Kevin Levrone is more of an example of what I did and am doing/about to do.

 

[Matthersby]

No, because he stopped bodybuilding altogether for 15 years... if he had kept lifting as a natty, then you would be entirely correct.

Kevin Levrone is more of an example of what I did and am doing/about to do.

A trainer here in AZ once said something that I fully agree with.
Kevin has impressive genetics and work ethic, but his hyper-response to Anabolics is truly what makes him capable of making such impressive transformations.
He still trained a little during his hiatus, although nowhere near what he would for competitions, but that goes to show you how important drugs are to the competitive bodybuilder.

 

[Alchemist11]

There’s evidence that there’s lasting effects on the body from steroid use. True hypertrophy actually happens when you increase the number of nuclei in each muscle cell (in contrast to sarcoplasmic hypertrophy, which is a swelling of the cells that dissipates over time). Nuclei don’t tend to leave the muscle cells. There’s a study in mice showing that mice given testosterone injections early in life have a greater potential for growth later in life even when testosterone therapy has ended, due to the increased nuclei in each muscle cell. Like Ripper was saying, you essentially have a new “set point”. It will be extremely difficult to exceed that without further use of drugs, but maintaining might be easier than you’d think.

Exactly this. There was idea to ban all of the athletes, who were caught doping, for life. Because of nuber of nuclei in muscles. One human study showed that people who once, during their life had a cycle of aas, later in life, decades later, showed same number of nuclei in muscle cells, same number as active, young athletes in full training in that moment. One of the factors to slightly surpass genetic limitations perhaps.

 

[Chados]

Exactly this. There was idea to ban all of the athletes, who were caught doping, for life. Because of nuber of nuclei in muscles. One human study showed that people who once, during their life had a cycle of aas, later in life, decades later, showed same number of nuclei in muscle cells, same number as active, young athletes in full training in that moment. One of the factors to slightly surpass genetic limitations perhaps.

Theres a reason you can have 6 months or a year without gear come back and be better. If you Finnish the cycle you're on right now and sure you'll lose a good amount of the "on" cycle look but when you do another cycle you'll surpass what you had before as long as you don't completely let yourself go. The body kinda memorize how you used to look. It's the same without gear it's just so much faster with. What you can do during 6 months without gear you can do in weeks with aas.

 

[Alchemist11]

Theres a reason you can have 6 months or a year without gear come back and be better. If you Finnish the cycle you're on right now and sure you'll lose a good amount of the "on" cycle look but when you do another cycle you'll surpass what you had before as long as you don't completely let yourself go. The body kinda memorize how you used to look. It's the same without gear it's just so much faster with. What you can do during 6 months without gear you can do in weeks with aas.

This exact same thing happened to me after my surgery and hopping back on gear few month later.