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A Wide Back? What to do

kbayne said:
I love doing stiff-arm pulldown and squeezing at the bottom. Definitely feel it in the back. Great exercise. I do wish my gym had a machine pullover though, but I still for DB pullovers to replace it.
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I'd rather dumbell pullovers, I like them better. Easier to concentrate to the muscle plus uch harder. The machine you have to rack much more weight.
 
usealittle said:
when that pic was takin i had NEVER done DLs before......
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They would really make your entire trapezius to pop out, especially the lower to middle part, which is where i see you could use a little improvement. Overall great work!
 
I dead on leg day, I start with squats end with deads. My traps and mid section really grew once I started to add in deads. Also my Glutes are punished from deads.

on back day I do straight leg deads. ( I know there are people who dont like this, but it works for me, and kinda helps my hams cut nicely)

I do back twice a week, really focus on weak point training and width is where I feel I need more.

So day 1 I do this:

Wide Grip Pull Downs 5 sets (1 super light 20 reps to warm up, and then taper up second set heavy but 8 reps, third set 6 last two sets of 4-5 reps)
Superseted with Straight arm pulldowns

Close grip T-bar rows

DB row

tri set of
Straight Leg Deads, Hyperextensions, pullovers. (4 sets)

pull ups till failure

Day 2,
Wide grip pulldown, close reverse grip pull down superset

T bar row

Straight Leg Deads

Cardio for 30 min

Pullups 3 -4 sets till failure

Day 2 I only have 45 -60 minute to workout bc of how late I get off. So It is very fast pace with 30 sec rest. Day 1 is much more slow and concentrated with 60 sec rest.
 
Rodja said:
How would that work in this instance? Pulldowns would not help to increase pullup strength.
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If your starting with pull downs, then finish workout with pull ups till failure. I like multiple sets to failure usually 3. Your now pulling after the muscles been worked and stressed so you are hoping for more fiber tares. It's a concept called grease the groove. It has helped me, started it earlier this year.

The reason why pull downs first is because you can usually move more weight with the pull downs and at the end your body weight is enough to work you out hard.
 
02sixxer said:
If your starting with pull downs, then finish workout with pull ups till failure. I like multiple sets to failure usually 3. Your now pulling after the muscles been worked and stressed so you are hoping for more fiber tares. It's a concept called grease the groove. It has helped me, started it earlier this year.

The reason why pull downs first is because you can usually move more weight with the pull downs and at the end your body weight is enough to work you out hard.
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That's not greasing the groove at all. Greasing the groove is multiple sets and increased frequency of a specific lift to get stronger at it, not using a similar lift in an attempt to strengthen the desired lift.
 
Rodja said:
That's not greasing the groove at all. Greasing the groove is multiple sets and increased frequency of a specific lift to get stronger at it, not using a similar lift in an attempt to strengthen the desired lift.
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Mmmmm.
That was the way I learned "greasing the groove" and what it was refered to when taught to me. I guess you learn something new each day.


Could you give an example just so I am clear? Sorry just want to be on the same page.
 
02sixxer said:
Mmmmm.
That was the way I learned "greasing the groove" and what it was refered to when taught to me. I guess you learn something new each day.

Could you give an example just so I am clear? Sorry just want to be on the same page.
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He's talking about doing multiple sets throughout the day of one exercise at about 50% effort or so.

I first saw it in one of pavel's books.
 
such as everytime I walk past my dip rack, I do about 15 dips, I may do this 5-6 time s a day, or Pull ups each time I walk by the pull up bar through out the day?
 
02sixxer said:
such as everytime I walk past my dip rack, I do about 15 dips, I amy do this 5-6 time s a day, or Pull up each time I walk by the pull up ber through out the day?
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That's basically exactly how he described it. And then as time goes on you'll be able to add 1 or 2 reps each time you do it while using the same amount of effort and then all of the sudden you'll be doing more and more reps when maxing them out.
 
I will join the party late and keep my part simple and sweet. Everything Rodja said I agree with and will say has shown to be true in my personal experience and for others I've trained/observed training on their own for the last 2 decades of lifting. Pullup and variations of the pullup will always yield better results then the pulldown. My back has always grown and excelled over other bodyparts on it's own, however I did spend ALOT of time when I was first training (12-18 years old) focusing on pullups/chins, with weights, and lots of variations of pullups/chins. I actually recall using the article I read in the Muscle Media 2000 January 1997 issue written by Charles Poliquin

Andre the Flying Squirrel Routine:
1-Sternum Chins 5x4-6 6-0-1 tempo/4 min. rest intervals<P>
2-Subscapularis Pull-Ups 3xmax reps 5-0-1 tempo/3 min. rest intervals<P>
3-Negative Close-Grip Chins 3x4-6 6-8 sec. negatives/3 min. rest intervals<P>
*use additional loads if possible
 
02sixxer said:
such as everytime I walk past my dip rack, I do about 15 dips, I may do this 5-6 time s a day, or Pull ups each time I walk by the pull up bar through out the day?
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That's more on the right track. If you're at that level of strength using BW, then you're beyond greasing the groove for pullups or dips kinda like how doing endless sets of 135 will not help you to bench 500.
 
02sixxer said:
Mmmmm.
That was the way I learned "greasing the groove" and what it was refered to when taught to me. I guess you learn something new each day.


Could you give an example just so I am clear? Sorry just want to be on the same page.
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An example of using GTG for pullups would be as follows. You would need to have access to a pullup bar at home. Take your 1 set max (lets use 10 for simpicity), cut it in half to 5. Then, multiple times spaced throught the day (4-5), do 5 pullups. Since you are only doing half of what you are capable of, you wont get worn down on doing pullups, but you are getting lots of pullup practice. At the end of 7 days retest your 1 set max, it should have gone up by a couple. Use this new number (lets call it 12), cut it in half and repeat the protocol. You can do this for a little while and it will work if your someone who sucks at pullups but can do at least a few good reps. I had a friend who could only do 6, he started using 3 as his rep range and after a couple months he could bang out 3-4 sets of 10+ pullups.

As Rodja said above, gains will become dimished as your proficiency increases. But it is an excellent tool to jumpstart bodyweight movements if your not very strong at them.
 
schroedes said:
Deadlifts bro, everything else comes second
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As much as I hate the word, bro, I agree. I do deadlifts to lead off my back workout and I wake up with a sore upper back every time. Dead lifts work everything depending on the grip.
 
Im gunna smash back tonight, heres my workout. Deadlifts, 10-12,7-9,4-6. Bent wg bb row 10-12,7-9,4-6. single arm db rows, pullsups, pulldowns and underhand grip pulldowns. should i change anything or add anything in? im looking for size
 
DrDeca said:
Im gunna smash back tonight, heres my workout. Deadlifts, 10-12,7-9,4-6. Bent wg bb row 10-12,7-9,4-6. single arm db rows, pullsups, pulldowns and underhand grip pulldowns. should i change anything or add anything in? im looking for size
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if size is your goal then try this:

deadlift 3x5 leave one in the tank on each set.
pullups/pulldowns: 3 x 8 leave one in the tank for the first 2 sets.
bent row: 2x5, 1x15+ go to failure.
1 arm rows: 1x20+ go to failure.

done.
 
asooneyeonig said:
if size is your goal then try this:

deadlift 3x5 leave one in the tank on each set.
pullups/pulldowns: 3 x 8 leave one in the tank for the first 2 sets.
bent row: 2x5, 1x15+ go to failure.
1 arm rows: 1x20+ go to failure.

done.
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Alright ill give that a try, thanks man. should i add anything else? warmup anything
 
DrDeca said:
Alright ill give that a try, thanks man. should i add anything else? warmup anything
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ohh ya. i like to do a general warm up to work on mobility and then a specific warm up. for example my deads which for me and a top set of 5 would be:

2x5 @ 135
1x5 @ 185
1x5 @ 225
1x3 @ 275
1x3 @ 315
1x5 @ 365
1x5 @ 385
1x5 @ 405
 
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