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27 years old, testosterone levels under 200...androgel??

juanchonutz

New member
I'd like to go ahead and start off by saying I was an idiot in my youth, did two cycles with no pct when I was 19 and 20 (1st was dianabol, 2nd was dianabol and deca) I also ran a cycle of m-drol with full pct of nolvadex and liver supports (ran liver supports throughout the cycle as well) last year. Just got my testosterone levels checked since I was feeling tired the last few years and it came up at 191ng/dl (free testosterone at 43.9pg/ml. only other things out of range in my bloodwork were globulin 1.9 g/dl and albumin/globulin ratio 2.4). Let me again state I know I'm an idiot, I really would appreciate not getting blasted repeatedly as I already have been yelled at by my endochronologist (who seems to know nothing of roids at all) and have had to come face to face with the probability of test therapy for the rest of my life. I believe I was already prone to low test levels as my dad is in the 300's and both my uncles seem to be more on the feminine side. I also collect fat on my hips and mid-section, and building muscle has always been a brutal struggle. The dr ran bloodwork to make sure my testes were functioning properly, and a brain mri showed no tumors on the pituitary. I have been prescribed androgel at two pumps/day, the dr. hasn't spoken to me about the length of the treatment or the goals in any way. My questions are: is this a life long treatment, or is there a way to raise my levels with this and keep them there after coming off of it? should I take anything with this? Is there any other way to fix or boost my test levels permanently without lifelong treatment? Anxiety levels are up, and I believe I developed an eye twitch over my mistakes (although there is a chance my body was low on test before the roids, and the roids actually didn't mess me up). Just looking for answers. Also, I have no issues with ed or sexual desire, in fact I want it more than ever all the time. Thanks in advance
 
Question
Do you need to be on it in the first place?
Being 27 you should have the ability to make testosterone, the fact being is the signal is probably not strong enough or weaken due to other imbalances with in the body which may be self induced, biological, psychological or environmental. All of these factors need to be properly evaluated to isolate where the issue lies. In majority of cases, Low T is a symptoms of that cause not the root cause. Dr's are just too lazy to look for the the reason.
 
if the issue were psychological, how could that be fixed? usually doctors will prescribe ssri and other drugs, which usually makes other things worse
 
Ya, the endochronologist I'm seeing doesn't seem to care at all, he seems satisfied as long as he gets money. He also blames me 100% and doesn't seem to care about my future. I'm not going to do the androgel as I have done some research and found that it takes sperm levels to zero, (I would like to at least have the option to have kids in the future) and it looks like it's a lifetime commitment. I'm definitely depressed, but it isn't keeping me from the gym or getting out, so I don't want to jump on ssri's
 
WTF man listen to me your 27 you did a cycle so now you need to stop seeing Endo's they are use less when it comes to men's Hormones every Uro's are not much better. Like Matrix says your way to young to spend the rest of your life on TRT when if you see the right Dr. and try to get Jump started again your levels will come back up. And yes Stress can lower ones T levels but taking SSRI's will only make your T levels go lower been there done that read my story.
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Get with a dam good Hormone Dr. try going on some Clomid see if you can't get your body jump started again I am not a Dr. and I will not tell you to stop that gel your on this is a very low dose that might not do anything but shut your down even more. If I were you I would stop this gel and look deeping into why your so low.

In the 30 yrs I have been on TRT and helping men for over 15 or them I have seen a lot of men not go on TRT and find out why they were low on T fix the problem and not need TRT.

But if you don't want to do this here is a file I made about using Gels.
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Starting on Androgel or Testim.
Yes this happens a lot you start on a low starting dose 5 grams when your brain sees the testosterone in your blood even just a little it slows down even stops sending the LH and FSH message to your testis to make the Testosterone you were making. So lets say your labs for Total T were 350 you add this dose of gel your brain sees this and you lose the base level you had before the gel.

Now lets say you need more then 5 grams most do so now all your left with is what the gel is doing so lets say it's doing 200 so you lost 150.

The reason you feel good is your levels go up that 200 the gel is doing in the first 2 weeks so your levels go up to 550 in theory. The brain sees this and you fall back.

Why can this happen it might be how your putting on the gel with Androgel you need to spread it over your upper arms and shoulders and down your back as far as you can reach this is half of your dose then do the other side. Just spread it over the area but don't rub it in.

The other thing is it's not getting through your skin good so you need more. If you have a thyroid problem your skin will become thicker and gels and creams don't get through the skin and you need to switch to shots.

I tell men when they go on Gels to retest in 2 weeks because you can end up feeling worse. Most men just need more gel. Dr.'s that tell men to go on 5 grams of gel and come back in 8 to 12 weeks for labs don't know much about the use of gels. Dr.'s that treat a lot of men for low T on gels see this happen and test them again in 2 weeks.
When you go to do labs get up and shower that morning go do your labs and then put in the gel after your blood test so you don’t spike up your labs. If you can’t do labs in the morning shower put on the gel but don’t get any gel on the spot they take the blood from. Do your labs about 6 hrs later.

Call your Dr. and tell him this and that your not feeling good you were but fell back.
 
When dealing with psychological disorders with people there are many hidden factors that are the root cause of their issue. If the gut and liver is not properly function this will put a huge impact on ones neurotransmitters production. IF you are having a hyper immune system response this will cause anxiety or depression. One needs to look at the brain, gut, liver, endocrine system, environmental imbalances, emotional aspect, ect in order to determine the pathology of the problem. Drs treat the symptoms rarely ever the cause.
 
I've had bloodwork done and it has all come back as good, liver function was fine. Also had a brain mri and was told there were no issues. I really don't know what else to get checked out. I scheduled an appointment with another endo, but who knows if he's any better; also the earliest appointment is in august so I have awhile to wait
 
Don't waste your time on an Endo they are not good Dr.'s for this problem. My MRI was clean Too but I had a head injury that damaged my Pituitary and this is way I am Secondary. One good way to tell is to go on HCG after you check your Estraidol levels if they are high get them down with Arimidex or Aromasin then try HCG 500 IU's 3x's / week for 8 weeks if your TT levels go why up mine went from 600 on Depo T shot 150 mgs / week to 1200 this told my new Dr. after being told I am Primary for 23 yrs that I am in fact Secondary. My Testis work.

To find a good Dr. try calling some Compounding Pharmacy's like collegepharmacy.com and ask for the names and numbers of Dr.'s in your area that buy Testosterone from them. Then call them Dr.'s and ask how many men does the Dr. treat and dose he check why a men is low also will he check for high Estraidol and use Arimidex or Aromasin to get it down. If man are Secondary will he use HCG you will know when you found a good one.
juanchonutz said:
I've had bloodwork done and it has all come back as good, liver function was fine. Also had a brain mri and was told there were no issues. I really don't know what else to get checked out. I scheduled an appointment with another endo, but who knows if he's any better; also the earliest appointment is in august so I have awhile to wait
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Where are you located?
 
Contacted the dr and was told they don't treat my condition but they could reccomend me to someone in Michigan or Pennsylvania. I'm guessing MI is dr John. Any other suggestions?

pmgamer18 said:
Check out Dr. Jeffrey Dach MD he is right up there with Dr. John when it comes to hormones.
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Wow he said he dose not treat low T and you live in FL. Yes in MI it's Dr. John in Pennsylvania I am guessing it's Dr. O and Matrix aka Hardasnails.
I will send you a PM on contact info for Dr. O.
juanchonutz said:
Contacted the dr and was told they don't treat my condition but they could reccomend me to someone in Michigan or Pennsylvania. I'm guessing MI is dr John. Any other suggestions?
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Ya, I don't know what the deal is with dr. Dach, but he made it clear he can't help me. So Dr O. is the penn guy? I looked up some info and he seems legit, is he better than Dr John? I honestly think if I was going to travel it would be to Mi, I lived in Lansing for a year and have a few friends there, so when I finally give in to traveling for this need, that's where I will probably end up. I doubt it, but do you think either of these guys would treat long distance?

pmgamer18 said:
Wow he said he dose not treat low T and you live in FL. Yes in MI it's Dr. John in Pennsylvania I am guessing it's Dr. O and Matrix aka Hardasnails.
I will send you a PM on contact info for Dr. O.
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.
 
You need to make up your own mind I live in MI and I don't see Dr. John because he does not take any kind if Health Care Plain my Dr. is dam good on hormones we both learned about this together. Dr. O takes heath care pains both Dr. John and Matrix are good web friends of mine.
juanchonutz said:
Ya, I don't know what the deal is with dr. Dach, but he made it clear he can't help me. So Dr O. is the penn guy? I looked up some info and he seems legit, is he better than Dr John? I honestly think if I was going to travel it would be to Mi, I lived in Lansing for a year and have a few friends there, so when I finally give in to traveling for this need, that's where I will probably end up. I doubt it, but do you think either of these guys would treat long distance?

.
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pmgamer18 said:
You need to make up your own mind I live in MI and I don't see Dr. John because he does not take any kind if Health Care Plain my Dr. is dam good on hormones we both learned about this together. Dr. O takes heath care pains both Dr. John and Matrix are good web friends of mine.
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Actually he was probably refering to Dr shippen which is great with HRT, but only treats hormones. It is now being found out that it goes a lot deeper then just treating hormones in order to get a person well. Some times treating hormones will make the person feel better, but as that the under lying cause in the beginning. Over the next few years HRT drs will have to get up to speed with the program other wise the new generation of health professionals which are specialzing in the endo, neurological, and immune system will be taking over the scene. There will be a place in medicine for them but people are going to what a comprehensive integrative approach instead. Dr john would be a good place to start since you have friends in that area.
 
The Matrix said:
It is now being found out that it goes a lot deeper then just treating hormones in order to get a person well. Some times treating hormones will make the person feel better, but as that the under lying cause in the beginning.
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I agree with this thought process which is why I never even went to the pharmacy to get this prescription for androgel. So I guess my inevitable question then is: What are the possible ailments that could be preventing my testosterone from being made at "normal" levels? Having a list and being able to check them off as I go would then give me something to bring to an endo or internist down here and establish a list of possible treatable ailments. I really appreciate you guys taking the time out of your lifes to help me, it means the world to me to know that there are individuals that would help someone out that they've never met before. Thanks
 
juanchonutz said:
I agree with this thought process which is why I never even went to the pharmacy to get this prescription for androgel. So I guess my inevitable question then is: What are the possible ailments that could be preventing my testosterone from being made at "normal" levels? Having a list and being able to check them off as I go would then give me something to bring to an endo or internist down here and establish a list of possible treatable ailments. I really appreciate you guys taking the time out of your lifes to help me, it means the world to me to know that there are individuals that would help someone out that they've never met before. Thanks
Click to expand...

One needs to look at the pathology of the issue. This is done through high patient/client profiling looking for the imbalances in multiple areas . Some times it several months to get balanced up. Dr john is great with hormones. Other people want to take a more comprehensive approach by looking at more integrative approach. I tell people you need to find the practioner which is suited for your individual case. As a medical consultant for ND, DO, MD's I have contacts with several health professionals across the country. I am looking for a connection for an open minded health practioner in florida where we can work together to get the best possible treatment for the patient. When medical professionals work with me they are not just working with one person, but a team of specialist across the country. If I do not know something, I will find out the answer from some of the most intelligent professionals in the country.
 
just some updated info, I got some results sent to me from my first endo visit: free psa .26 ng/ml.. % free psa 27 (25-100%).. Psa .958 (0.000-4.000 ng/ml).. Prolactin 6.36 (2.5-17 ng/ml).. Testosterone 157 ng/ml (lower than previous one).. FSH 3.1 (0.7-11.1).. LH 3.7 (0.8-7.6)
If you see anything here let me know
 
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