When the boss is away.......(CONTEST)
- Thread starter Vitruvian
- Start date
- Status
thewilman
Well-known member
:goodpost:
thewilman
Well-known member
...and a pitcher of Margaritas!!!! :cheers:
John Smeton
Legend
and a bottle of tequila. On the rocks haha
EasyEJL
Never enough
I think vice versa. Right now i'm 3ish weeks into a lean bulk, so may as well continue it for another 2-3, then shift into a cut
xjsynx
Member
Last night is the coldest it has been in awhile.
You missed the luvly thunder/lighting storm the other night....
thewilman
Well-known member
Easy's from the "Sunshine State"...we have more lightning than other state by like 500%!!! :jaw:
I do love a good lightning storm!
xjsynx
Member
Ouch. We don't get too many, but this one woke me up at 1am...It was fairly intense compared to the typical lightening storms we see...It was something like War of the Worlds....
xjsynx
Member
From Charles
"Lactic Acid Training for Fat Loss
by Charles Poliquin
Whenever an athlete shows up at my training facility looking like he has spent the better part of the off-season camped in front of Krispy Kreme Donuts, I immediately put him on a program that incorporates short rest intervals.
Short rest intervals lead to an increased production of lactate, and an increase in lactate leads to dramatic increases in Growth Hormone, thus resulting in very significant losses of body fat.
This method is called the "German Body Composition" program, or GBC for short.
While many people in the field–TC included–have professed skepticism that the exercise induced GH release was sufficient enough to cause significant fat burning, my personal experience with scores of athletes confirms the effect."
Christian Thib's
"2. Lactate-inducing training
Coach Poliquin was the first one to bring to light the physiological fact that there's a direct correlation between the amount of lactate produced and the output of growth hormone. This is the basis of his German Body Composition I and II programs as growth hormone is a highly lypolitic (stimulates the release of fatty acids) and anti-catabolic (muscle defender) hormone.
It's also one of the reasons why 200 and 400m runners are so lean: these distances lead to a giant lactate production spanning over the whole body (a maximum 400m race has often been described as hell on earth). Other athletes who do a lot of anaerobic lactic work include basketball and hockey players, who are also quite lean.
In some regards, applying this concept to weight training does have something in common with the preceding "idiotic" approach: it generally relies on slightly higher rep ranges. Why? Because lactate production is at its highest in sets lasting around 50-70 seconds. So if each repetition lasts 4 seconds (let's say a 3 seconds eccentric and 1 second concentric), hitting the ideal time under tension for lactate production requires 12-18 reps per set.
However, the differences between this approach and the first one are that you drastically reduce the rest intervals (shoot for 30 seconds), normally alternate exercises for muscle groups that are "far away" from each other (to increase overall whole-body lactate production), and don't use too much volume per muscle group (in a typical bodybuilding "cutting program" you might do 20+ sets per body part).
The short rest intervals and use of multiple muscles per session jack up lactate levels, which increase GH production. So compared to the traditional "cutting" approach, this second method is more effective at stimulating fat loss and protecting muscle mass."
"Lactic Acid Training for Fat Loss
by Charles Poliquin
Whenever an athlete shows up at my training facility looking like he has spent the better part of the off-season camped in front of Krispy Kreme Donuts, I immediately put him on a program that incorporates short rest intervals.
Short rest intervals lead to an increased production of lactate, and an increase in lactate leads to dramatic increases in Growth Hormone, thus resulting in very significant losses of body fat.
This method is called the "German Body Composition" program, or GBC for short.
While many people in the field–TC included–have professed skepticism that the exercise induced GH release was sufficient enough to cause significant fat burning, my personal experience with scores of athletes confirms the effect."
Christian Thib's
"2. Lactate-inducing training
Coach Poliquin was the first one to bring to light the physiological fact that there's a direct correlation between the amount of lactate produced and the output of growth hormone. This is the basis of his German Body Composition I and II programs as growth hormone is a highly lypolitic (stimulates the release of fatty acids) and anti-catabolic (muscle defender) hormone.
It's also one of the reasons why 200 and 400m runners are so lean: these distances lead to a giant lactate production spanning over the whole body (a maximum 400m race has often been described as hell on earth). Other athletes who do a lot of anaerobic lactic work include basketball and hockey players, who are also quite lean.
In some regards, applying this concept to weight training does have something in common with the preceding "idiotic" approach: it generally relies on slightly higher rep ranges. Why? Because lactate production is at its highest in sets lasting around 50-70 seconds. So if each repetition lasts 4 seconds (let's say a 3 seconds eccentric and 1 second concentric), hitting the ideal time under tension for lactate production requires 12-18 reps per set.
However, the differences between this approach and the first one are that you drastically reduce the rest intervals (shoot for 30 seconds), normally alternate exercises for muscle groups that are "far away" from each other (to increase overall whole-body lactate production), and don't use too much volume per muscle group (in a typical bodybuilding "cutting program" you might do 20+ sets per body part).
The short rest intervals and use of multiple muscles per session jack up lactate levels, which increase GH production. So compared to the traditional "cutting" approach, this second method is more effective at stimulating fat loss and protecting muscle mass."
xjsynx
Member
The Top 5 Supplements to Gain Muscle
In many seminars, I always get asked which supplements are best to gain mass. My answers will surprise many of you.
Here they are:
1. Fish Oil
What? Fish oil? That is not cool, avant-garde, sexy, or exotic. Fish oil?
Yes. Fish oil. You cannot be anabolic with enough Omega 3s. For example, I was once training a first-round pick for the NFL. He put on 29 lbs of lean body mass in one month once I jacked his fish oil intake to 45 grams a day. If you want to put muscle on and lose fat, take at least 30 grams of fish oil a day.
Additional reasons for using fish oil include:
1. It reduces inflammation.
2. It improves insulin sensitivity: makes glucose and amino acids get better in your starved muscle cells.
Taking fish oil in a liquid form is the most economical way of doing it. But taking them every meal works best. I always recommend a combination of liquid and capsules - Liquid for home meals, and capsules for away from home meals.
2. Primal Greens (A Greens Product):
What? Ground veggies? Yes, indeed.
The more alkaline you are, the more anti-catabolic you are. Cortisol puts the body in an acidified status; Primal Greens alkalizes you and reverses that state in no time.
A Primal Green drink with 40 BCAA tablets post-workout will put you immediately in an anabolic state. Primal Greens are rapidly becoming a staple recovery in the U.K. in both football and rugby circles. Some athletes like to alternate between Primal Reds and Primal Greens to get a broader base of micro-nutrients.
3. Whey Stronger (Whey protein):
This product is great for the following reasons:
1. It is low-heat processed. All of the important proteins like immunoglobulins are not denatured. It is the same proteins you would find in organic milk.
2. The milk comes from grass-fed cows. Therefore, it is rich in CLA, another well acknowledged anti-catabolic nutrient.
3. It is rich in BCAAs and glutamine, important anti-catabolic factors.
4. It is a better precursor for glutathione, therefore a more anti-oxidant protein.
In order to maximize the benefits of Whey Stronger, use 0.25 g per pound of bodyweight, first thing in the morning with 1 tablespoon of glutamine. Use it again, 0.25 g per pound of bodyweight, post-workout.
4. Carbohydrate Powder:
My philosophy on any nutrient is that if you want the best results, get the best stuff.
There are a lot of carb powders out there to chose from but my favorite is unflavored Vitargo ultra-soluble powder. It reloads glycogen the fastest.
Vitargo is a better choice because of it leaves the stomach faster, delivering glucose more quickly to the blood, and potentiating insulin release to a greater extent, compared to maltodextrin or maltodextrin + simple sugars.
These three metabolic attributes translate into faster muscle glycogen repletion after intense workouts (or competition), and an increased ability to drive the transport of anabolic/anti-catabolic nutrients like branched chain amino acids, creatine, and even carnitine.
Carnitine does not accumulate or "load" in muscle unless accompanied by high insulin concentrations, explaining why virtually all carnitine studies have NOT shown increases in muscle carnitine after oral or even intravenous dosing in multi-gram doses. Additionally, very recent research indicates that the exceptional potentiating effects of Vitargo on insulin release may "switch off" muscle protein breakdown in human muscle. Together, Vitargo can speed recovery and muscle refueling, drive nutrient transport, and foster an environment in muscle that supports gains in lean mass, both as carbohydrate/glycogen and muscle proteins.
Vitargo is coming out with ready-to-drink bottles, which should make it convenient for those of you who are pressed for time when leaving the gym. Use 1 g per pound of bodyweight, mixed in with the Whey Stronger.
5. Multi-Intense (Multi-Vitamin):
A single nutrient deficiency can halt muscle growth altogether. After running countless Comprehensive Metabolic Profiles, it has become obvious that overcoming deficiencies has often blasted plateaus in strength and muscle mass gains.
For example, many baseball pitchers and track throwers were shown to be deficient in taurine and magnesium, because of all of their high velocity throws. Restoring those two vital nutrients brought about immediate increases in performance in the gym.
In order to maximize the benefits of this nutritional solution, take 2 tablets, 3 times a day, in the middle of meals. That regimen should cover your nutritional bases.
Every person has different nutritional needs, but the above five are the best for everyone based on my experience. Use all of the above on a daily basis and you will have the foundation you need to achieve your goals.
-By Charles Poliquin
In many seminars, I always get asked which supplements are best to gain mass. My answers will surprise many of you.
Here they are:
1. Fish Oil
What? Fish oil? That is not cool, avant-garde, sexy, or exotic. Fish oil?
Yes. Fish oil. You cannot be anabolic with enough Omega 3s. For example, I was once training a first-round pick for the NFL. He put on 29 lbs of lean body mass in one month once I jacked his fish oil intake to 45 grams a day. If you want to put muscle on and lose fat, take at least 30 grams of fish oil a day.
Additional reasons for using fish oil include:
1. It reduces inflammation.
2. It improves insulin sensitivity: makes glucose and amino acids get better in your starved muscle cells.
Taking fish oil in a liquid form is the most economical way of doing it. But taking them every meal works best. I always recommend a combination of liquid and capsules - Liquid for home meals, and capsules for away from home meals.
2. Primal Greens (A Greens Product):
What? Ground veggies? Yes, indeed.
The more alkaline you are, the more anti-catabolic you are. Cortisol puts the body in an acidified status; Primal Greens alkalizes you and reverses that state in no time.
A Primal Green drink with 40 BCAA tablets post-workout will put you immediately in an anabolic state. Primal Greens are rapidly becoming a staple recovery in the U.K. in both football and rugby circles. Some athletes like to alternate between Primal Reds and Primal Greens to get a broader base of micro-nutrients.
3. Whey Stronger (Whey protein):
This product is great for the following reasons:
1. It is low-heat processed. All of the important proteins like immunoglobulins are not denatured. It is the same proteins you would find in organic milk.
2. The milk comes from grass-fed cows. Therefore, it is rich in CLA, another well acknowledged anti-catabolic nutrient.
3. It is rich in BCAAs and glutamine, important anti-catabolic factors.
4. It is a better precursor for glutathione, therefore a more anti-oxidant protein.
In order to maximize the benefits of Whey Stronger, use 0.25 g per pound of bodyweight, first thing in the morning with 1 tablespoon of glutamine. Use it again, 0.25 g per pound of bodyweight, post-workout.
4. Carbohydrate Powder:
My philosophy on any nutrient is that if you want the best results, get the best stuff.
There are a lot of carb powders out there to chose from but my favorite is unflavored Vitargo ultra-soluble powder. It reloads glycogen the fastest.
Vitargo is a better choice because of it leaves the stomach faster, delivering glucose more quickly to the blood, and potentiating insulin release to a greater extent, compared to maltodextrin or maltodextrin + simple sugars.
These three metabolic attributes translate into faster muscle glycogen repletion after intense workouts (or competition), and an increased ability to drive the transport of anabolic/anti-catabolic nutrients like branched chain amino acids, creatine, and even carnitine.
Carnitine does not accumulate or "load" in muscle unless accompanied by high insulin concentrations, explaining why virtually all carnitine studies have NOT shown increases in muscle carnitine after oral or even intravenous dosing in multi-gram doses. Additionally, very recent research indicates that the exceptional potentiating effects of Vitargo on insulin release may "switch off" muscle protein breakdown in human muscle. Together, Vitargo can speed recovery and muscle refueling, drive nutrient transport, and foster an environment in muscle that supports gains in lean mass, both as carbohydrate/glycogen and muscle proteins.
Vitargo is coming out with ready-to-drink bottles, which should make it convenient for those of you who are pressed for time when leaving the gym. Use 1 g per pound of bodyweight, mixed in with the Whey Stronger.
5. Multi-Intense (Multi-Vitamin):
A single nutrient deficiency can halt muscle growth altogether. After running countless Comprehensive Metabolic Profiles, it has become obvious that overcoming deficiencies has often blasted plateaus in strength and muscle mass gains.
For example, many baseball pitchers and track throwers were shown to be deficient in taurine and magnesium, because of all of their high velocity throws. Restoring those two vital nutrients brought about immediate increases in performance in the gym.
In order to maximize the benefits of this nutritional solution, take 2 tablets, 3 times a day, in the middle of meals. That regimen should cover your nutritional bases.
Every person has different nutritional needs, but the above five are the best for everyone based on my experience. Use all of the above on a daily basis and you will have the foundation you need to achieve your goals.
-By Charles Poliquin
xjsynx
Member
the 10x3 for fat loss is similar. However, depending on what version of GBC you are using, it is Supersets with a leg and upper body.
Example
A1)Quads
A2)Back
B1)Hams
B2)Chest
C1)Legs
C2)Upper Body
D1)Arms/Shoulders
D2)Abs
GVT (Volume Training) is for strength and size gain. Maybe you should go for this Easy?
A1)DB Bench Press 10 Sets 10 Reps
A2)Pulldowns 10/10
CT also has a variation called Optimized Volume Training.
thewilman
Well-known member
WOW!!! That a LOT of fish oil! Those burps must be nasssssty!!! Like smelling a walrus burp! :blink:
29lbs of LBM in 1 month??? No way bro...is that physically possble?
xjsynx
Member
Yeah, Chuck has a nice lil writing style. In some debate he made a reference to another trainer having a keg for a belly instead of 6-pack...
bitterplacebo
Well-known member
xjsynx
Member
29lbs in a month is a lot. Wonder if he is talking about David Boston?
Invalid Link Removed
xjsynx
Member
It might be possible with, you know, "fish oil"
Give it a shot and see what happens....
EasyEJL
Never enough
I'm liking the lactic acid idea for the last 4-5 weeks, doing the GVT for the next few would be nice, just want to make sure that the specific exersizes for this segment are different than what i'll do for the last portion
xjsynx
Member
Gvt
1. You do ten sets of a single "most bang for your buck" exercise.
2. You strive to do a pre-determined number of reps on each set, i.e. ten sets of ten reps.
3. You preferably alternate with the antagonist "most bang for your buck" exercise.
4. You only increase the weight once all ten sets are completed with the pre-determined starting weight. The load used is submaximal, you do not try to reach failure on all sets, but only the last three should be hard. Basically you get the training effect from the law of repeated efforts.
1. You do ten sets of a single "most bang for your buck" exercise.
2. You strive to do a pre-determined number of reps on each set, i.e. ten sets of ten reps.
3. You preferably alternate with the antagonist "most bang for your buck" exercise.
4. You only increase the weight once all ten sets are completed with the pre-determined starting weight. The load used is submaximal, you do not try to reach failure on all sets, but only the last three should be hard. Basically you get the training effect from the law of repeated efforts.
xjsynx
Member
Gvt
You want to begin with a weight you could lift for 20 reps to failure if you had to. For most people, on most exercises, that would represent 60% of their 1RM load. Therefore, if you can bench press 300 lbs for 1 rep, you would use 180 lbs for this exercise.
For lifters new to this method, I recommend using the following body-part splits:
Day 1 - Chest & Back
Day 2 - Legs & Abs
Day 3 - Off
Day 4 - Arms & Shoulders
Day 5 - Off
When using this program or any other, you should keep a detailed journal of the exact sets/reps and rest intervals performed, and only count the repetitions completed in strict form. Here are a few more guidelines to ensure optimal progress
You want to begin with a weight you could lift for 20 reps to failure if you had to. For most people, on most exercises, that would represent 60% of their 1RM load. Therefore, if you can bench press 300 lbs for 1 rep, you would use 180 lbs for this exercise.
For lifters new to this method, I recommend using the following body-part splits:
Day 1 - Chest & Back
Day 2 - Legs & Abs
Day 3 - Off
Day 4 - Arms & Shoulders
Day 5 - Off
When using this program or any other, you should keep a detailed journal of the exact sets/reps and rest intervals performed, and only count the repetitions completed in strict form. Here are a few more guidelines to ensure optimal progress
xjsynx
Member
Gvt
Rest Intervals: When bodybuilders start with this method, they often question its value for the first several sets because the weight won't feel heavy enough. However, there is minimal rest between sets (about 60 seconds when performed in sequence and 90-120 seconds when performed as a superset), which incurs cumulative fatigue. (Interestingly enough, you might find you get stronger again during the eighth and ninth sets. This is because of a short-term neural adaptation.) Because of the importance of the rest intervals, you should use a stopwatch to keep the rest intervals constant. This is very important, as it becomes tempting to lengthen the rest time as you fatigue.
Tempo: For long-range movements such as squats, dips, and chins, use a 4-0-2 tempo; this means you would lower the weight in four seconds and immediately change direction and lift for two seconds. For movements such as curls and triceps extensions, use a 3-0-2 tempo.
Number of Exercises: One, and only one, exercise per body part should be performed. Therefore, select exercises that recruit a lot of muscle mass. Triceps kickbacks and leg extensions are definitely out; squats and bench presses are definitely in. For supplementary work for individual body parts (like triceps and biceps), you can do 3 sets of 10-20 reps.
Training Frequency: Because this is such an intense program, it'll take you longer to recover. In fact, if you're familiar with the writings of Peter Sisco and John Little, you'll find that the average "Power Factor Rating" of the 10-sets method is about 8 billion. Consequently, one training session every four to five days per body part is plenty.
Overload Mechanism: Once you're able to do 10 sets of 10 with constant rest intervals, increase the weight on the bar by 4% to 5%, and repeat the process. Refrain from using forced reps, negatives, or burns. The volume of the work will take care of the hypertrophy. Expect to have some deep muscle soreness without having to resort to set prolonging techniques. In fact, after doing a quad and hams session with this method, it takes the average bodybuilder about five days to stop limping.
Rest Intervals: When bodybuilders start with this method, they often question its value for the first several sets because the weight won't feel heavy enough. However, there is minimal rest between sets (about 60 seconds when performed in sequence and 90-120 seconds when performed as a superset), which incurs cumulative fatigue. (Interestingly enough, you might find you get stronger again during the eighth and ninth sets. This is because of a short-term neural adaptation.) Because of the importance of the rest intervals, you should use a stopwatch to keep the rest intervals constant. This is very important, as it becomes tempting to lengthen the rest time as you fatigue.
Tempo: For long-range movements such as squats, dips, and chins, use a 4-0-2 tempo; this means you would lower the weight in four seconds and immediately change direction and lift for two seconds. For movements such as curls and triceps extensions, use a 3-0-2 tempo.
Number of Exercises: One, and only one, exercise per body part should be performed. Therefore, select exercises that recruit a lot of muscle mass. Triceps kickbacks and leg extensions are definitely out; squats and bench presses are definitely in. For supplementary work for individual body parts (like triceps and biceps), you can do 3 sets of 10-20 reps.
Training Frequency: Because this is such an intense program, it'll take you longer to recover. In fact, if you're familiar with the writings of Peter Sisco and John Little, you'll find that the average "Power Factor Rating" of the 10-sets method is about 8 billion. Consequently, one training session every four to five days per body part is plenty.
Overload Mechanism: Once you're able to do 10 sets of 10 with constant rest intervals, increase the weight on the bar by 4% to 5%, and repeat the process. Refrain from using forced reps, negatives, or burns. The volume of the work will take care of the hypertrophy. Expect to have some deep muscle soreness without having to resort to set prolonging techniques. In fact, after doing a quad and hams session with this method, it takes the average bodybuilder about five days to stop limping.
xjsynx
Member
GVT - Day 1
Exercise/Sets/Reps/Tempo/Rest Interval
A-1 Decline Dumbbell Presses, Semi-Supinated Grip(palms facing each other) 10/10/4020 90 sec
A-2 Chin-Ups (palms facing you) 10/10/4020 90 sec
B-1 Incline Dumbbell Flyes 3/10-12/3020 60 sec
B-2 One-Arm Dumbbell Rows 3/10-12/3020 60 sec
Notes: Rest 90 seconds between each "A" exercise and each superset; rest 60 seconds between each "B" exercise and each superset. Incidentally, I only recommend three sets of ten in this program for the "B" exercises. The "B" exercises constitute supplementary work, and doing ten sets of them would result in overtraining.
Exercise/Sets/Reps/Tempo/Rest Interval
A-1 Decline Dumbbell Presses, Semi-Supinated Grip(palms facing each other) 10/10/4020 90 sec
A-2 Chin-Ups (palms facing you) 10/10/4020 90 sec
B-1 Incline Dumbbell Flyes 3/10-12/3020 60 sec
B-2 One-Arm Dumbbell Rows 3/10-12/3020 60 sec
Notes: Rest 90 seconds between each "A" exercise and each superset; rest 60 seconds between each "B" exercise and each superset. Incidentally, I only recommend three sets of ten in this program for the "B" exercises. The "B" exercises constitute supplementary work, and doing ten sets of them would result in overtraining.
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thewilman
Well-known member
It might be possible with, you know, "fish oil"
The "CLEAR" fish oil!
Could you even gain that much on a 1 or 2g of Test per week??? :bb2:
xjsynx
Member
GVT - Day 2
Exercise/Sets/Reps/Tempo/Rest Interval
A-1 Back Squats 10/10/4020 90 sec
A-2 Lying Leg Curls 10/10/4020 90 sec
B-1 Low-Cable Pull-Ins* 3/15 - 20/2020 60 sec
B-2 Seated Calf Raises 3/15 - 20/2020 60 sec
(*Take a weightlifting belt and buckle it. Attach it to the low pulley of a cable crossover machine. Lie down on your back in front of the machine, and hook your feet in the belt. Then pull your knees towards your chest.)
Notes: Rest 90 seconds between each "A" exercise and each superset; rest 60 seconds between each "B" exercise and each superset.
Exercise/Sets/Reps/Tempo/Rest Interval
A-1 Back Squats 10/10/4020 90 sec
A-2 Lying Leg Curls 10/10/4020 90 sec
B-1 Low-Cable Pull-Ins* 3/15 - 20/2020 60 sec
B-2 Seated Calf Raises 3/15 - 20/2020 60 sec
(*Take a weightlifting belt and buckle it. Attach it to the low pulley of a cable crossover machine. Lie down on your back in front of the machine, and hook your feet in the belt. Then pull your knees towards your chest.)
Notes: Rest 90 seconds between each "A" exercise and each superset; rest 60 seconds between each "B" exercise and each superset.
xjsynx
Member
GVT - Day 4
A-1 Parallel Bar Dips 10/10/4020 90 sec
A-2 Incline Hammer Curls 10/10/4020 90 sec
B-1 Bent-Over Dumbbell Lateral Raises* 3/10 - 12/20X0 60 sec
B-2 Seated DumbbellLateral Raises 3/10 - 12/20X0 60 sec
(*While seated on the edge of a bench with your torso bent over, raise the dumbbells out to the side, making sure the top two knuckles (the ones closest to your thumb) are in line with your ears at the top of the movement.)
Notes: Rest 90 seconds between each "A" exercise and each superset; rest 60 seconds between each "B" exercise and each superset. "X" in the tempo means to move as fast as possible, keeping the weight under control.
A-1 Parallel Bar Dips 10/10/4020 90 sec
A-2 Incline Hammer Curls 10/10/4020 90 sec
B-1 Bent-Over Dumbbell Lateral Raises* 3/10 - 12/20X0 60 sec
B-2 Seated DumbbellLateral Raises 3/10 - 12/20X0 60 sec
(*While seated on the edge of a bench with your torso bent over, raise the dumbbells out to the side, making sure the top two knuckles (the ones closest to your thumb) are in line with your ears at the top of the movement.)
Notes: Rest 90 seconds between each "A" exercise and each superset; rest 60 seconds between each "B" exercise and each superset. "X" in the tempo means to move as fast as possible, keeping the weight under control.
xjsynx
Member
The "CLEAR" fish oil!
Could you even gain that much on a 1 or 2g of Test per week??? :bb2:
That is a lot of weight. Maybe he might be wrong using the term LBM. However, Chuck knows his sh1t. Maybe he sneaked some goat semen in his fish oil?
thewilman
Well-known member
whatastud08
Active member
Geez...40 grams a day? From what I remember reading LONG ago when I first started taking fish oil was that beyond a certain point, too much FO negates the positive health benefits from typical doses. Not sure which benegits it was though.
whatastud08
Active member
This is from a David Tolson article:
Possible side effects
Fish oil consumption is generally safe and well tolerated, with less adverse effects than other dietary oils [12]. Doses equivalent to three times the FDA maximum safe dosage (which is 3 g EPA/DHA per day) appear to be safe in rats [39]. The primary reported side effect is "fish burps" or a "fishy taste in the mouth," although this can depend on the product, and it is also commonly reported to only be a problem for the first few weeks of fish oil consumption. However there are a few more serious side effects that may be seen with high dose fish oil consumption which may warrant caution.
The first of these is that high doses of fish oil may decrease immune function (in opposition to lower intakes, which may enhance it) [40-42]. While this is beneficial in some autoimmune diseases it is not always desirable. For example, high amounts of fish oil may impair bacterial resistance [43]. Modest doses, in the range of 1-2 g of EPA/DHA daily, do not appear to have a negative impact on immune function over 6 months [40]. This effect may also be avoided with supplemental vitamin E [42]. A second potential problem is increased lipid peroxidation, resulting in an increase in oxidative stress [44-47]. However, this effect can also be remedied with vitamin E [9, 48].
Another possible side effect is an increase in LDL cholesterol and a decrease in HDL cholesterol [49-50]. The first of these effects can be seen with doses as low as 3.6 g/day in humans [49]. However, LDL increase is generally less than 5% [16], and fish oil on balance has a very positive impact on the cardiovascular system. Since fish oil thins the blood, it may also increase the likelihood of bleeding, but it does not appear to do this at lower doses. 2-5 grams a day, even when combined with other blood thinners such as aspirin, do not appear to increase bleeding time, but intake over 20 grams a day will increase bleeding times [16]. Other possible side effects of high or very high dose fish oil consumption reported in animals are increased liver and spleen weight, adverse effects on iron metabolism, and red blood cell deformities [45, 46, 50], but it is doubtful that these are relevant in moderate doses.
What all of this amounts to is, fish oil consumption in a healthy individual should probably be kept within a reasonable range, and additional supplementation with vitamin E is also a good choice. The amount of fish oil one takes should be dependent on both goals and the amount of EPA/DHA present in the fish oil. The optimal range for both safety and effectiveness in most healthy individuals is 1-4 g of EPA/DHA daily, and this amount shouldn't be exceeded without medical supervision. Most fish oils are standardized to 30% EPA/DHA, so this would be about 3-12 one gram caps daily. If the fish oil is standardized to a different amount the dosage should be changed accordingly, for example 2-8 caps of a 50% EPA/DHA product. Most of the benefits (other than possibly the change in body composition, for which there is presently little functional data) can be seen with 1-2 grams of EPA/DHA daily. Most fish oil capsules also contain vitamin E, but if they don't, a vitamin E supplement should be taken also.
Possible side effects
Fish oil consumption is generally safe and well tolerated, with less adverse effects than other dietary oils [12]. Doses equivalent to three times the FDA maximum safe dosage (which is 3 g EPA/DHA per day) appear to be safe in rats [39]. The primary reported side effect is "fish burps" or a "fishy taste in the mouth," although this can depend on the product, and it is also commonly reported to only be a problem for the first few weeks of fish oil consumption. However there are a few more serious side effects that may be seen with high dose fish oil consumption which may warrant caution.
The first of these is that high doses of fish oil may decrease immune function (in opposition to lower intakes, which may enhance it) [40-42]. While this is beneficial in some autoimmune diseases it is not always desirable. For example, high amounts of fish oil may impair bacterial resistance [43]. Modest doses, in the range of 1-2 g of EPA/DHA daily, do not appear to have a negative impact on immune function over 6 months [40]. This effect may also be avoided with supplemental vitamin E [42]. A second potential problem is increased lipid peroxidation, resulting in an increase in oxidative stress [44-47]. However, this effect can also be remedied with vitamin E [9, 48].
Another possible side effect is an increase in LDL cholesterol and a decrease in HDL cholesterol [49-50]. The first of these effects can be seen with doses as low as 3.6 g/day in humans [49]. However, LDL increase is generally less than 5% [16], and fish oil on balance has a very positive impact on the cardiovascular system. Since fish oil thins the blood, it may also increase the likelihood of bleeding, but it does not appear to do this at lower doses. 2-5 grams a day, even when combined with other blood thinners such as aspirin, do not appear to increase bleeding time, but intake over 20 grams a day will increase bleeding times [16]. Other possible side effects of high or very high dose fish oil consumption reported in animals are increased liver and spleen weight, adverse effects on iron metabolism, and red blood cell deformities [45, 46, 50], but it is doubtful that these are relevant in moderate doses.
What all of this amounts to is, fish oil consumption in a healthy individual should probably be kept within a reasonable range, and additional supplementation with vitamin E is also a good choice. The amount of fish oil one takes should be dependent on both goals and the amount of EPA/DHA present in the fish oil. The optimal range for both safety and effectiveness in most healthy individuals is 1-4 g of EPA/DHA daily, and this amount shouldn't be exceeded without medical supervision. Most fish oils are standardized to 30% EPA/DHA, so this would be about 3-12 one gram caps daily. If the fish oil is standardized to a different amount the dosage should be changed accordingly, for example 2-8 caps of a 50% EPA/DHA product. Most of the benefits (other than possibly the change in body composition, for which there is presently little functional data) can be seen with 1-2 grams of EPA/DHA daily. Most fish oil capsules also contain vitamin E, but if they don't, a vitamin E supplement should be taken also.
rms80
Board Sponsor
10x10 is an awesome workout!! I used to do a bunch of these back in the day- they were in the old Muscle Media (b4 it turned gay)....
xjsynx
Member
There is an arguement for everything.
I will say this though, Charles Poliquin works with elite atheltes who need to stay healthy. If there was a negative other than the taste I am sure he million dollar atheltes and olympic atheletes would hire him. In addition, I presume these atheltes are often tested.
xjsynx
Member
Ah yeah MM2K. CP and Duchaine were the reason why I read it.
whatastud08
Active member
Oh, I don't doubt Poliquin's wisdom one bit...and from the Tolson article it seems to really suggest that addtional Vit E would be the only thing necessary to support mega dosing. I would love to see the results associated with this...I noticed I was getting really oily hair and skin at 12-15g a day, I can only imagine 40!?
bitterplacebo
Well-known member
I'll try out this fish oil megadosing in a couple of months (November), after I finish my current plans. I'll probably be eating real clean then anyway and this will help fill out the fat calories. I'm not expecting the 29 pounds in a month, but I like the idea of anti-inflammatory techniques, I've only used moderate amounts of almonds and vegetables in the past to do this, though.
So it seems like doing 40g a day would end up costing $70 a month with "NOW foods lemon flavored fish oil." That's not too bad, anyone know cheaper, yet still certified or quality assured to be free of contaminants? I don't think megadosing mercury or anything like that would be a good idea.
So it seems like doing 40g a day would end up costing $70 a month with "NOW foods lemon flavored fish oil." That's not too bad, anyone know cheaper, yet still certified or quality assured to be free of contaminants? I don't think megadosing mercury or anything like that would be a good idea.
bitterplacebo
Well-known member
In case you are a werewolf-
There is a full moon today.
There is a full moon today.
EasyEJL
Never enough
EasyEJL
Never enough
John Smeton
Legend
I look forward toi seeing your results
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