The Biggest Smont ever! 🤔 Lets find out

[Dustin07]

To make it worse, the shooting pains in the knee at night do wake me up, and my sleep has been atrocious. 4 hours total per night, very broken. I'll fall asleep around midnight or 1:00 a.m. and by 3:30 I'm awake and then I'm just up and down till 6.

Dude I'm sorry thats how mine was from about Dec till first part of Jan. hitting it with the redlight twice a day took down swelling massively and helped a lot with the pain. I wonder if actual fasting would also provide some anti-inflammatory relief, although would be counter productive depending on what you want to see on the scale...

Did manage to get some plants outside, some in the garden, put up a greenhouse that I made the frame out of cow panels and scrap wood around the yard lol

Dude these things are awesome, i've been working up a plan to do the same thing! 2 x 16ft panels is easily a 10 x 8 tunnel/greenhouse!

Also pulled a small harvest indoors from a little trial run I did with some of the plants I will be running outside

LOL your harvest is trimmed up a lot cleaner than my first attempt but those cream & cheese seeds from seedsman have a wild citrus smell, like orange + lemon, its actually really a good smell. I was shocked. I've just been burping it in the mason jar as an experiment to see what happens next.

 

[Smont]

Dude I'm sorry thats how mine was from about Dec till first part of Jan. hitting it with the redlight twice a day took down swelling massively and helped a lot with the pain. I wonder if actual fasting would also provide some anti-inflammatory relief, although would be counter productive depending on what you want to see on the scale...




Dude these things are awesome, i've been working up a plan to do the same thing! 2 x 16ft panels is easily a 10 x 8 tunnel/greenhouse!



LOL your harvest is trimmed up a lot cleaner than my first attempt but those cream & cheese seeds from seedsman have a wild citrus smell, like orange + lemon, its actually really a good smell. I was shocked. I've just been burping it in the mason jar as an experiment to see what happens next.

Ya man, this one I used 2 cattle panels that size, but I left a 2-ft gap in-between them and cut a piece of fencing and used it as like a mesh bandaid to patch the middle. I weaved a couple of spikes through the sides of the cage down into the ground and they stick up about two and a half 3 ft in the air so when the wind blows it won't let the cage flex back and forth very much.

As far as burping and curing goes, if you can keep the humidity in the jar between 58-62 you don't even need to burp them they just cure. If the humidity goes up and when your buds are fresh it usually does rise a little bit that's where burping comes into play to let a little bit of that humidity out. And once the buds moisture level gets below 58 or 56 the curing process has ended. You could potentially keep burping or sharing for a couple of months and it just makes the product get better as long as it doesn't dry out too much.

DM me later on this topic, I got some stuff that might help you with that. There's a couple different ways you can do it but honestly I like the jar method the best. I just keep a little hygrometer inside my jar so I know what the humidity is at

 

[Smont]

Back to the gym yesterday, just did a couple supersets for chest and back and did some adductor/abductor machines and light leg presses. I'm fighting demons to walk into the gym lol. Even as I'm getting out my car something is telling me to go home. I guess my goal is to make it to the gym 4-5 days a week for a while and do something productive

 

[Hyde]

Back to the gym yesterday, just did a couple supersets for chest and back and did some adductor/abductor machines and light leg presses. I'm fighting demons to walk into the gym lol. Even as I'm getting out my car something is telling me to go home. I guess my goal is to make it to the gym 4-5 days a week for a while and do something productive

You sound kind of depressed man. Any chance your test is bunk? I know your knee is knackered, but I still get pissed & fired up about other goals when I’m injured.

 

[Smont]

You sound kind of depressed man. Any chance your test is bunk? I know your knee is knackered, but I still get pissed & fired up about other goals when I’m injured.

No my test definitely isint bunk, Im undoubtedly confident in that. I have been a little depressed, probably more stressed then depressed tho, I got a lot going on. Besides being back on a summer construction schedule with bun knee I got my daughter home from college. She always stirs **** up in the house. She lives in Syracuse and I help pay her rent up there but Next summer I'm paying her full rent and groceries for the 2 summer months IF SHE STAYS THERE! Sons getting ready for college so he's a little more crazy then usual. I feel like kids these days are mentally 5 years behind when I was there age. I was outside my entire life sneaking out the window going out of town to parties but in real world scenarios and these kids live in their bedrooms on their computers and devices. I shouldn't complain too much because he got a full ride for mechanical engineering. But as smart as he is, he's also a complete moron and useless . All the crazy in the house makes my girl crazy and I just become the wallet that everyone yells at during the summer. I used to flip out but I just do my best to keep my cool nowadays. I'm getting beyond the point where I feel like arguing with teenagers.

Beside from all that stuff my dad's Parkinson's is getting really f****** bad. I finally got them to start going back to the class again cuz he's been falling a couple times every day. His speech is getting bad too. It's like listening to a drunk guy who tries to talk too fast tell you a story. Trying to prepare myself for the inevitables coming over the next few years if the next few years come.

Dad's Parkinson's is getting bad too, starting to fall a lot, like almost daily, that amongst a few other things. Trying to prepare for the inevitables.

I think I've hit max capacity and training was the passenger who hopped off the bus.

Worked a crazy ass day today and I needed to get in the gym but I couldn't so I did a little bit of rehab stuff in my backyard we did the garden mowed the lawn for like 45 minutes with a push mower and called that my workout for the day lol.

Literally didn't eat a single bite of food today just ran on coffee and a gallon of water.

Just sitting down at 8:41 p.m. to get my first mail in because that's how the day went lol

 

[akboom87]

No my test definitely isint bunk, Im undoubtedly confident in that. I have been a little depressed, probably more stressed then depressed tho, I got a lot going on. Besides being back on a summer construction schedule with bun knee I got my daughter home from college. She always stirs **** up in the house. She lives in Syracuse and I help pay her rent up there but Next summer I'm paying her full rent and groceries for the 2 summer months IF SHE STAYS THERE! Sons getting ready for college so he's a little more crazy then usual. I feel like kids these days are mentally 5 years behind when I was there age. I was outside my entire life sneaking out the window going out of town to parties but in real world scenarios and these kids live in their bedrooms on their computers and devices. I shouldn't complain too much because he got a full ride for mechanical engineering. But as smart as he is, he's also a complete moron and useless . All the crazy in the house makes my girl crazy and I just become the wallet that everyone yells at during the summer. I used to flip out but I just do my best to keep my cool nowadays. I'm getting beyond the point where I feel like arguing with teenagers.

Beside from all that stuff my dad's Parkinson's is getting really f****** bad. I finally got them to start going back to the class again cuz he's been falling a couple times every day. His speech is getting bad too. It's like listening to a drunk guy who tries to talk too fast tell you a story. Trying to prepare myself for the inevitables coming over the next few years if the next few years come.

Dad's Parkinson's is getting bad too, starting to fall a lot, like almost daily, that amongst a few other things. Trying to prepare for the inevitables.

I think I've hit max capacity and training was the passenger who hopped off the bus.

Worked a crazy ass day today and I needed to get in the gym but I couldn't so I did a little bit of rehab stuff in my backyard we did the garden mowed the lawn for like 45 minutes with a push mower and called that my workout for the day lol.

Literally didn't eat a single bite of food today just ran on coffee and a gallon of water.

Just sitting down at 8:41 p.m. to get my first mail in because that's how the day went lolView attachment 261193

Dude what is that meal? Looks fuggin tasty!!

 

[gphagan1]

Sorry you’re going through so much stress. I feel you on kids staying on their computers and just hanging out in their rooms really doesn’t help prepare them for the real world the way just getting out of the house and experiencing life does. They are exposed to and learn a lot more information quicker than we could obviously just because of technology. But we sharpened our common sense a lot more through actually getting out and doing things and learning from experience. And during their teenage years they tend to not want to listen a lot more than we did because they think they already know. So I feel you on all that brother. Hopefully your knee will start improving and you’ll be able to enjoy the gym again. And this heat hitting so early really has sucked the last few weeks, so man I know it’s got to be rough working outside in it. Hopefully you’ll be able to get some relief from all that. I bet you’re very proud of your kids though for going to college. Your son should do very well in his career. I have a Mechanical and Industrial Engineering degree. The food looks great by the way.

 

[dontfyourlife]

I think more people due to stress or just "f-ing busy" wind up only eating one meal or like myself, drink a protein shake in the am, then realize WTF it's 2:00 pm and only 30g of protein for the day so far.

Hang in there and missing a few g's of protein here or there won't be the end of the world!

Leaving the office at 9:13 pm going to get Chipolte!!!! Your not alone!!

 

[Smont]

Dude what is that meal? Looks fuggin tasty!!

Chicken shish kabobs, pork tenderloin, some rice and protein pasta with olive oil and garlic

 

[Smont]

I think more people due to stress or just "f-ing busy" wind up only eating one meal or like myself, drink a protein shake in the am, then realize WTF it's 2:00 pm and only 30g of protein for the day so far.

Hang in there and missing a few g's of protein here or there won't be the end of the world!

Leaving the office at 9:13 pm going to get Chipolte!!!! Your not alone!!

Ya I just get busy and have a lot on my mind and even tho I do get hungry, it's almost like I'm nauseous and nothing sounds good so I keep working. When I get out of work I know I'm not going to the gym because I've had zero food in me for the day, and by the time I eat it's after 8 . I crammed in 3100 by bed tho. I've even been making the overnight oats protein bowls and I can't get myself to eat it in the morning. Just no motivation, I'm jamming at work, I'm jamming when I'm in the garden but everything else I feel lethargic a lot. Last week I threw three of those oats bowls out because they sat too long

 

[Smont]

No days off in sight, got 2 decks to power wash today and back to the gym for a couple upper body supersets and some knee rehab and light leg work. I'm back under 200lbs again . But it just looks like I've been on a cut. Flat and depleted, kinda lean you know that weird in between stage where you almost look good and you almost look like s*** and you can't quite figure out which one it is . This crispy brown tan definitely helps tho!

 

[jfigliuolo]

Hang in there. When I was in school I never lived home after freshman summer. My mother felt like you (for different reasons. Looking back i was a douhe ) She'll grow up in time. As far as your dad... I now have my mom with Alzheimer's living with us, so i understand kind of what your going through. It sucks, but it's life.
Stay strong,
Joe

 

[Segansational]

Dang brother. You are dealing with a lot right now. Thoughts with you particularly with your dad's condition. Just try to keep your head up and weather the storm best you can, there will be smoother sailing ahead - even if not for a while.

 

[Hyde]

Yeah you know you just have to try to live the best you can, be the best man you can, each and every day - one day at a time. Try to enjoy what you can, control what you can, and don’t worry about anything you can’t - just try to go with the flow and ride the waves. And when it’s pummeling & brutal, just hang on!

 

[Dustin07]

I got my daughter home from college. She always stirs **** up in the house.

I feel that. I love my step kids but when the step daughter comes by for a visit "staying the weekend" and it turns into weeks, once 6 months... I'm like nope. rent is equal to the mortage payment. get a job, and get your own place. my wife has finally come to the reality that better boundaries have to be set with these failure to launch kids lol.

I feel like kids these days are mentally 5 years behind when I was there age.

1000%. I don't even understand the younger generation right now that doesn't seem to have a desire to be independent. I left home as fast as I possibly could, all I wanted to do was pay my own bills, have my own place, and mow my own grass.

 

[Smont]

Time for rehab, yesterday I went to the doctor and then I went to the gym and started my 60 day rehab journey. I'm going to completely stop counting calories and all the little things I normally track and instead I'm just going to focus on eating food that I know is healthy and nutrient rich. The rest of the summer I'm going to focus on being lean, healthy and hopefully fix up some injuries while making myself a little more injury resistant. I have come to the realization that this knee is probably going to need surgery sooner or later. They want me to be able to hold off till I'm 50. But they also understand that the type of stuff I do is probably going to cause me to completely destroy this knee sooner or later anyways so they said let's work on fixing it a little and we're going to do a follow-up on day 30 and again on day 60.

Tonight's also my first night back working at the gym. So I got to use my head and be careful.

Since this log was a total failure I'll probably start an actual rehab log and make it look like I started smoking meth or something to get people to join lol

 

[Jimbabwe]

I feel that. I love my step kids but when the step daughter comes by for a visit "staying the weekend" and it turns into weeks, once 6 months... I'm like nope. rent is equal to the mortage payment. get a job, and get your own place. my wife has finally come to the reality that better boundaries have to be set with these failure to launch kids lol.



1000%. I don't even understand the younger generation right now that doesn't seem to have a desire to be independent. I left home as fast as I possibly could, all I wanted to do was pay my own bills, have my own place, and mow my own grass.

I don't know, I think it's understandable. Situation for young adults these days is sort of fucked compared to when we were coming up.

Inflation has made COL shoot up and salaries have not increased to match and housing costs have increased at even faster rates than inflation. Super challenging for someone to get an entry-level job (even if with a 4-year degree) and be paid enough that they can afford to rent even a studio in lots of places in this country.

Notwithstanding those that have the degree also have to service that debt on top of their regular inflated COL (and that debt can be enormous because of how much the cost for an education has increased compared to inflation or even housing).

 

[Smont]

I don't know, I think it's understandable. Situation for young adults these days is sort of fucked compared to when we were coming up.

Inflation has made COL shoot up and salaries have not increased to match and housing costs have increased at even faster rates than inflation. Super challenging for someone to get an entry-level job (even if with a 4-year degree) and be paid enough that they can afford to rent even a studio in lots of places in this country.

Notwithstanding those that have the degree also have to service that debt on top of their regular inflated COL (and that debt can be enormous because of how much the cost for an education has increased compared to inflation or even housing).

When I had my first kid I was making $9 an hour, my son is 17 years old and makes $18.50 an hour right now. If you compare the cost of living back then versus now my son would have an easier time paying his bills today than I did when I had my daughter.

I used to run out of oil and have to boil water on the stove to fill up the bathtub to give my kids baths.

On a side note, kids today don't really have much interest in having kids. I know so many people in their twenties and thirties with no children who have no interest in having kids. Do you know the type of abuse that has to be done to an animal to make it lose the will to reproduce. The whole world is f***** lol

 

[Smont]

 

[Smont]

Did a little bit of stretching, bodyweight bulgarians and some bands.

Then grabbed some 35's and did a 3 way superset of overhead dumbbell press, bent over dumbbell row and step ups (I only stepped up onto a one foot block), 4 times. After that I did a super set of chin ups and push-ups 15/25, 12/25, 10/25, 9/25. Then I grabbed a set of 60 lb dumbbells and I walk 20 steps squat down turn around pick the dumbbells back up and walk 20 steps I did that 10 times. Over to the hack squat machine I put a 45 on each side and did a limited range of motion set of 10, I went in for a second set and I felt a little bit of knee pain so I stopped. Took a 10-minute break, grabbed some 25lb dumbbells and set up a cable press down and did a couple supersets before I went home. Just powered through that meal and now I'm going to take a shot of 250mcg each bpc and kpv + 1.5 units of GH and throw some ice packs on my knees

The goal was basically to get some exercise with weights. I really am going to avoid lifting heavy all around the board for a while

 

[gphagan1]

Did a little bit of stretching, bodyweight bulgarians and some bands.

Then grabbed some 35's and did a 3 way superset of overhead dumbbell press, bent over dumbbell row and step ups (I only stepped up onto a one foot block), 4 times. After that I did a super set of chin ups and push-ups 15/25, 12/25, 10/25, 9/25. Then I grabbed a set of 60 lb dumbbells and I walk 20 steps squat down turn around pick the dumbbells back up and walk 20 steps I did that 10 times. Over to the hack squat machine I put a 45 on each side and did a limited range of motion set of 10, I went in for a second set and I felt a little bit of knee pain so I stopped. Took a 10-minute break, grabbed some 25lb dumbbells and set up a cable press down and did a couple supersets before I went home. Just powered through that meal and now I'm going to take a shot of 250mcg each bpc and kpv + 1.5 units of GH and throw some ice packs on my knees

The goal was basically to get some exercise with weights. I really am going to avoid lifting heavy all around the board for a while

That was a good functional workout. I think it’s a smart plan to just eat healthy and do some rehab work along with the functional type workout you just did. That should help your knee heal, and keep your body in shape while helping prevent injury until you fully recover100%.

 

[Jimbabwe]

When I had my first kid I was making $9 an hour, my son is 17 years old and makes $18.50 an hour right now. If you compare the cost of living back then versus now my son would have an easier time paying his bills today than I did when I had my daughter.

I used to run out of oil and have to boil water on the stove to fill up the bathtub to give my kids baths.

On a side note, kids today don't really have much interest in having kids. I know so many people in their twenties and thirties with no children who have no interest in having kids. Do you know the type of abuse that has to be done to an animal to make it lose the will to reproduce. The whole world is f***** lol

I would encourage you to look at some of the numbers. This is not even considering that housing has way outpaced inflation nationwide, but just based on pure inflation:

$9/hr back even as recently as 1990 would be the equivalent of $22/hr in 2025 (and inflation in 2025 to 2026 was a crazy high percentage so it would go less far today than it did in Feb. 2025). Not saying you were 18 in 1990 (don't know how old you are, but doubt that old lol), just grabbed a reference range I think we can all remember.

I'm just saying, kids these days got a pretty raw deal because that number above is just buying power for regular goods. Housing increased at even faster rates, so their dollar goes even less far when looking at renting a place of their own.

 

[Smont]

I would encourage you to look at some of the numbers. This is not even considering that housing has way outpaced inflation nationwide, but just based on pure inflation:

View attachment 261280

$9/hr back even as recently as 1990 would be the equivalent of $22/hr in 2025 (and inflation in 2025 to 2026 was a crazy high percentage so it would go less far today than it did in Feb. 2025). Not saying you were 18 in 1990 (don't know how old you are, but doubt that old lol), just grabbed a reference range I think we can all remember.

I'm just saying, kids these days got a pretty raw deal because that number above is just buying power for regular goods. Housing increased at even faster rates, so their dollar goes even less far when looking at renting a place of their own.

Trust me your way off on the timelines, it's only a 20yr gap, I wasn't making 9/hr in 1990, I was 5 years old in 1990 lol. We were babies having babies. I was making $9.75 at furniture moving company in 2005 and then $9.25 at Target working 3rd shift. The buying power for that would be $15.35/hour TODAY!!!! That's 3/hr less then my son makes. Eventually I quit target and started bartending and waiting tables to pick up the slack.

Today in 2026 I make $40/hr on average between painting and the gym stuff, which is like making $23/hr in 2006. If I made 23 when my kids were born we would have been going to Disney every summer, so thank God I was poor lol. I fukin hate that place

 

[Jimbabwe]

Trust me your way off on the timelines, I wasn't making 9/hr in 1990, I was 5 years old in 1990 lol. We were babies having babies. I was making $9.75 at furniture moving company in 2005 and then $9.25 at Target working 3rd shift. The buying power for that would be $15.35/hour TODAY!!!! That's 3/hr less then my son makes. Eventually I quit target and started bartending and waiting tables to pick up the slack

Yeah, I was pretty explicit that I wasn't suggesting you were making $9/hr in 1990?

But to your specific life experience, housing cost has almost doubled since 2005, which way outpaces inflation.

And renting is not much better:

So to your specific example, your son buying or renting a home today while making something like $120 extra bucks a week (before taxes, assuming full-time work and not considering how much more expensive his healthcare coverage is if he's not on yours) requires he pay almost twice as much as you had to.

 

[Jimbabwe]

It's easy for us to think that we were just tougher, smarter, more independent, etc. than kids these days, and in some ways that may be true, but it's also just a fact that the situation for a young adult in America today is significantly worse than it was for us.

 

[Smont]

It's easy for us to think that we were just tougher, smarter, more independent, etc. than kids these days, and in some ways that may be true, but it's also just a fact that the situation for a young adult in America today is significantly worse than it was for us.

It's easy to think we're tougher and more independent because we are significantly tougher and more independent than they are today lol. That's just factual information. The average 16 to 18 year old kid is completely useless and can do nothing on their own

 

[Jimbabwe]

It's easy to think we're tougher and more independent because we are significantly tougher and more independent than they are today lol. That's just factual information. The average 16 to 18 year old kid is completely useless and can do nothing on their own

If that's true, then that's also our fault because we are the generation that raised them.

 

[Smont]

If that's true, then that's also our fault because we are the generation that raised them.

I'm just going to have to agree to disagree on this one, something is different. I work with kids, there all different these days. It's like 1 out of every 3 kids are autistic and severely depressed. Boys are like 5 years behind puberty, my son is graduating highschool tomorrow. These 18 year old boys look like 15 year old girls. Some things are definitely the parents fault. But there's something beyond that

 

[Smont]

Quick subject change, this can't be real

 

[gphagan1]

Quick subject change, this can't be real View attachment 261284

That’s hilarious….code is Bottomsup….sounds like a SNL skit from the late 70s early 80s….unreal.

 

[Jimbabwe]

I'm just going to have to agree to disagree on this one, something is different. I work with kids, there all different these days. It's like 1 out of every 3 kids are autistic and severely depressed. Boys are like 5 years behind puberty, my son is graduating highschool tomorrow. These 18 year old boys look like 15 year old girls. Some things are definitely the parents fault. But there's something beyond that

Again, even if true, wouldn't all of that come from us?

If it's cultural, it's from us not establishing the culture we want in the home.

If it's habits, then same.

If it's diet, then it's us not feeding them the right foods.

If it's genetics, then it's our genes.

Everything that our children are is a product of what we made them. Buck always stops with the generation raising the children.

 

[Dustin07]

I don't know, I think it's understandable. Situation for young adults these days is sort of fucked compared to when we were coming up.

Inflation has made COL shoot up and salaries have not increased to match and housing costs have increased at even faster rates than inflation. Super challenging for someone to get an entry-level job (even if with a 4-year degree) and be paid enough that they can afford to rent even a studio in lots of places in this country.

Notwithstanding those that have the degree also have to service that debt on top of their regular inflated COL (and that debt can be enormous because of how much the cost for an education has increased compared to inflation or even housing).

When I had my first kid I was making $9 an hour, my son is 17 years old and makes $18.50 an hour right now. If you compare the cost of living back then versus now my son would have an easier time paying his bills today than I did when I had my daughter.

I would encourage you to look at some of the numbers. This is not even considering that housing has way outpaced inflation nationwide, but just based on pure inflation:

Yeah, I was pretty explicit that I wasn't suggesting you were making $9/hr in 1990?

But to your specific life experience, housing cost has almost doubled since 2005, which way outpaces inflation.

View attachment 261282

And renting is not much better:

View attachment 261283

So to your specific example, your son buying or renting a home today while making something like $120 extra bucks a week (before taxes, assuming full-time work and not considering how much more expensive his healthcare coverage is if he's not on yours) requires he pay almost twice as much as you had to.

I'm actually with @Smont on this one. I've done the research many times over the years and honestly have always been a student of economics. The Puget Sound region has done the best it can to be come a junior model of the very expensive San Francisco region (I know NYC is horrible for COL as well) and the reality is that todays average wages in our region are closer to starter home prices than when I bought my first home at age 20 in 2002. but our kids all tell me how lucky I had it and how they can't find anything.

The reality is, most of these kids are not interested in starter homes. They think they need the million dollar home they just moved out of. They also think they need $1200 phones + internet + cable + apps + new car etc and they will nickel and dime themselves.

They also have commitment issues and I see many in this generation apartment hop every 6 months instead of putting in roots.

My starter home at $124k was 500sq ft with a garage that I could literally push and watch it bend back and forth (so I rebuilt it) on a post and block foundation which I sold later for $210k, into a house that was $310k in june of 2007 which crashed in value to $185k before my ex wife finally sold it for $500k.


starter homes still exist everywhere but these kids won't settle for a starter home, so they pay double what this mortage would be, on rent instead and then bitch about how unaffordable life is.

 

[Dustin07]

Everything that our children are is a product of what we made them. Buck always stops with the generation raising the children.

definitely some truth to that but every kid is different too and need different raising I suppose and even if you do all the right things you still have free will. I have been given a hard time here and there for financiall rewarding my boy for doing "chores". he pretty much always got his $20 or whatever for weekend work. stacking wood, mowing the lawn, etc. people have told me "you know sometimes kids just have to do work because its a chore, not to be paid". I've thought about that a lot cause I think its correct, but then I look at my son and he has learned that working means making money, and working with a positive attitude (no griping) means more money (tips, I told him many years ago when he does his job without bitchin I'm more inclined to pay him more). and now at 17 he has a lot of people offering him jobs so something must have worked. He wants a small farm of his own some day and is looking at the price of the DIY cabin kits etc. I will continue to push him to find a way to make that happen so that he is self reliant early.

 

[Jimbabwe]

definitely some truth to that but every kid is different too and need different raising I suppose and even if you do all the right things you still have free will. I have been given a hard time here and there for financiall rewarding my boy for doing "chores". he pretty much always got his $20 or whatever for weekend work. stacking wood, mowing the lawn, etc. people have told me "you know sometimes kids just have to do work because its a chore, not to be paid". I've thought about that a lot cause I think its correct, but then I look at my son and he has learned that working means making money, and working with a positive attitude (no griping) means more money (tips, I told him many years ago when he does his job without bitchin I'm more inclined to pay him more). and now at 17 he has a lot of people offering him jobs so something must have worked. He wants a small farm of his own some day and is looking at the price of the DIY cabin kits etc. I will continue to push him to find a way to make that happen so that he is self reliant early.

My mom paid us an allowance for our grades, because in her words "school was our job" and then the chores were just things you had to do as part of a household, and I always thought that was a pretty good way to do it.

But it seemed to work better for me than our siblings because they have made way worse life choices than me, so it's always a bit of a crapshoot.

 

[Dustin07]

But it seemed to work better for me than our siblings because they have made way worse life choices than me, so it's always a bit of a crapshoot.

yeah my dad always says he had to raise us three boys in 3 different ways because we were all three very different. so when people tell me my boy should have just done chores cause thats what kids have to do I agree with them, but at the same time I look at where my boys mindset is now with work and money and I think that he turned out ok. so maybe my approach just worked for the kinda guy he is.

 

[manifesto]

Im back up in this biotch....trying to get caught up

 

[Dustin07]

Im back up in this biotch....trying to get caught up

good luck

 

[Jimbabwe]

I'm actually with @Smont on this one. I've done the research many times over the years and honestly have always been a student of economics. The Puget Sound region has done the best it can to be come a junior model of the very expensive San Francisco region (I know NYC is horrible for COL as well) and the reality is that todays average wages in our region are closer to starter home prices than when I bought my first home at age 20 in 2002. but our kids all tell me how lucky I had it and how they can't find anything.

The reality is, most of these kids are not interested in starter homes. They think they need the million dollar home they just moved out of. They also think they need $1200 phones + internet + cable + apps + new car etc and they will nickel and dime themselves.

They also have commitment issues and I see many in this generation apartment hop every 6 months instead of putting in roots.

My starter home at $124k was 500sq ft with a garage that I could literally push and watch it bend back and forth (so I rebuilt it) on a post and block foundation which I sold later for $210k, into a house that was $310k in june of 2007 which crashed in value to $185k before my ex wife finally sold it for $500k.


starter homes still exist everywhere but these kids won't settle for a starter home, so they pay double what this mortage would be, on rent instead and then bitch about how unaffordable life is.

View attachment 261288

I don't know that that's a fair characterization? You can't just walk up and buy a home, you have to have a down payment (20% to avoid the PMI premium) plus closing costs to pay out of pocket.

For your example, that $240k home would require that they have more than $50k cash lying around to throw at it and whatever they finance for the rest would be at higher interest rates than you or I had to pay on our starter homes.

I bought mine, e.g., in 2015 for about $115k. Sold it as part of the divorce in 2022 for $240k (to Zillow, so accepted a cash offer at $30k below market value just for the faster closing so we could finalize the divorce quicker). If I had tried to buy it in 2022, I wouldn't have been able to even dream of affording the new mortgage payment or the down payment for it, but that's the situation someone trying to buy a house today has to contend with.[/I]

 

[Dustin07]

I don't know that that's a fair characterization? You can't just walk up and buy a home, you have to have a down payment (20% to avoid the PMI premium) plus closing costs to pay out of pocket.

For your example, that $240k home would require that they have more than $50k cash lying around to throw at it and whatever they finance for the rest would be at higher interest rates than you or I had to pay on our starter homes.

First time home buyers can still get 100% and 104% loans to cover the down payment and get them in the market. This is why I always tell our kids to get a credit card the very day they turn 18 to start building credit.

Our kids are basically split 50/50. the boys are more financially literate, the 27 yr old took this advice and is building a good life. my 17yr old is doing what he can (at still too young for his own credit card, but he does hold crypto). the girls would not touch credit cards early on "cause those are bad" and are also the ones that complain about how expensive things are.

That house I used above at a 100% loan and 6.6% (I bumped the rate above todays going 30yr mortgage cause a 100% loan will get a higher rate) would be $1533/month.

Right now she's paying closer to $2k/month for rent.

You can't just walk up and buy a home, you have to have a down payment (20% to avoid the PMI premium) plus closing costs to pay out of pocket.

you're absolutely right and I forgot, I did have PMI on my first home. but that extra $200/month for 5 years of home ownership led a 25 yr old kid to $90k in equity to move up to the next home. you gotta start somewhere...

 

[Dustin07]

I mean you can lead a horse to water.

But also, where there's a will there's a way. I mean our house project is lofty. clearing a full acre of forest to build 3 hoop houses, 105 fence post deer fence, new walk in chicken coop, tool shed, and she shed is a big project to tackle but like I told my wife "do you want it or not".

 

[Smont]

Well, it's about that time of year again

I heard crying in the bushes, reached my hand in and it latched on with its teeth and fucked my hands up. I didn't think it was big enough to do that vicious lol. It's palm sized. Vet and Dr. Appointments in the morning

 

[gphagan1]

Well, it's about that time of year again View attachment 261298

I heard crying in the bushes, reached my hand in and it latched on with its teeth and fucked my hands up. I didn't think it was big enough to do that vicious lol. It's palm sized. Vet and Dr. Appointments in the morning

Looks like it’s got some Siamese or Himalayan in it.

 

[Dustin07]

Well, it's about that time of year again View attachment 261298

I heard crying in the bushes, reached my hand in and it latched on with its teeth and fucked my hands up. I didn't think it was big enough to do that vicious lol. It's palm sized. Vet and Dr. Appointments in the morning

is that yet another stray that flocked to dr monts home for the wayward animals?

 

[Jimbabwe]

First time home buyers can still get 100% and 104% loans to cover the down payment and get them in the market. This is why I always tell our kids to get a credit card the very day they turn 18 to start building credit.

Our kids are basically split 50/50. the boys are more financially literate, the 27 yr old took this advice and is building a good life. my 17yr old is doing what he can (at still too young for his own credit card, but he does hold crypto). the girls would not touch credit cards early on "cause those are bad" and are also the ones that complain about how expensive things are.

That house I used above at a 100% loan and 6.6% (I bumped the rate above todays going 30yr mortgage cause a 100% loan will get a higher rate) would be $1533/month.

Right now she's paying closer to $2k/month for rent.




you're absolutely right and I forgot, I did have PMI on my first home. but that extra $200/month for 5 years of home ownership led a 25 yr old kid to $90k in equity to move up to the next home. you gotta start somewhere...

It'd be $1,533 a month before or after PMI? Because you can get those loans, but they require you make additional monthly PMI payments on top of your mortgage and those payments do not go towards building equity and don't go away until you have 20% equity in the home.

I imagine, once including PMI, that renting is cheaper.

I ran it through Redfins's calculator and it spit out $1950/mo after accounting for PMI and average property tax assessment for Tacoma. Required I put a minimum of $1k down (wouldn't let you do $0), and had interest rate auto-populated at 6.625% (gather that's average market rate today), so if interest rates are higher on these 100 and 104% loans, then your number didn't accurately capture them.

 

[Dustin07]

It'd be $1,533 a month before or after PMI? Because you can get those loans, but they require you make additional monthly PMI payments on top of your mortgage and those payments do not go towards building equity and don't go away until you have 20% equity in the home.

I imagine, once including PMI, that renting is cheaper.

I ran it through Redfins's calculator and it spit out $1950/mo after accounting for PMI and average property tax assessment for Tacoma. Required I put a minimum of $1k down (wouldn't let you do $0), and had interest rate auto-populated at 6.625% (gather that's average market rate today), so if interest rates are higher on these 100 and 104% loans, then your number didn't accurately capture them.

thats all correct. (1500 before PMI). I actually came out to a final estimated price per month of $2034.16/month with PMI and taxes in a town where avg rent is $2003/month for a 2 bedroom.

soooooo I stand by the premise that kids should try harder and complain less. where there is a will there is a way.

rent equity after 5 years = 0
equity with mortgage after 5 years in this hypothetical entry level home = about $75k based upon average real estate growth in the region.

 

[Dustin07]

It'd be $1,533 a month before or after PMI? Because you can get those loans, but they require you make additional monthly PMI payments on top of your mortgage and those payments do not go towards building equity and don't go away until you have 20% equity in the home.

I imagine, once including PMI, that renting is cheaper.

I ran it through Redfins's calculator and it spit out $1950/mo after accounting for PMI and average property tax assessment for Tacoma. Required I put a minimum of $1k down (wouldn't let you do $0), and had interest rate auto-populated at 6.625% (gather that's average market rate today), so if interest rates are higher on these 100 and 104% loans, then your number didn't accurately capture them.

also just to be clear, I don't actually care if someone rents or buys, there are perks to both life styles that I fully respect, I wouldn't put someone down who had a reason for why they wanted to live. especially in youth and retirement. my only arguement is that when I hear 20 somethings tell me they can't afford this or that, its cause they aren't trying hard enough and aren't willing to buy starter homes or commute, and expect to be able to move out of mom and dads house into a Seattle penthouse overlooking the Olympic mountain range.

 

[Hyde]

Yeah inflation isn’t the bank buster for the youth these days - it’s the ridiculous housing/rental market. It’s just harder, and not by a small margin.

That doesn’t excuse all of the lameness, the dependence & anxiety & awkwardness, or entitlement that seems more prevalent in younger culture. There does seem to be this surprise that things take a lot of time & hard work, rarely coming easy to make it.

But all you need to understand is my home bought in 2020 at 3% interest is now valued 50% higher (despite it being older & more worn), and your mortgage to buy it will have more than DOUBLE the interest rate. They will definitely have to make do with less individual home space, whether smaller homes, more roommates or living at home longer while working to save up.

 

[Dustin07]

But all you need to understand is my home bought in 2020 at 3% interest is now valued 50% higher (despite it being older & more worn), and your mortgage to buy it will have more than DOUBLE the interest rate. They will definitely have to make do with less individual home space, whether smaller homes, more roommates or living at home longer while working to save up.

all true things. I got really lucky in our region, I saw the rates getting ready to move up so I sold that Tacoma loft at the peak and as of right now zillow/redfin value it $40k less than what I sold it for. but I was watching the numbers and every .25% interest rate hike was a meaningful impact on the mortgage for sure. Our property taxes spiked a lot from the time I met my wife back in 2017 ish but have luckily stagnated a lot since. (grateful for that).

But I've met plenty of 20 somethings that have made it clear that they would not live in a 500 sq ft home which is what got me started and honestly in many ways its still my favorite home I ever lived in.

(it was white, with a lot more landscaping and a huge pear tree when I owned it. but I rebuilt that little garage with hardiplank back in the day)

 

[Smont]

Looks like it’s got some Siamese or Himalayan in it.

Definitely lol

 

[Smont]

all true things. I got really lucky in our region, I saw the rates getting ready to move up so I sold that Tacoma loft at the peak and as of right now zillow/redfin value it $40k less than what I sold it for. but I was watching the numbers and every .25% interest rate hike was a meaningful impact on the mortgage for sure. Our property taxes spiked a lot from the time I met my wife back in 2017 ish but have luckily stagnated a lot since. (grateful for that).

But I've met plenty of 20 somethings that have made it clear that they would not live in a 500 sq ft home which is what got me started and honestly in many ways its still my favorite home I ever lived in.

(it was white, with a lot more landscaping and a huge pear tree when I owned it. but I rebuilt that little garage with hardiplank back in the day)

View attachment 261301

This generation has had social media to give them wildly unrealistic expectations of what their life should be like.