Experience with Torabolic Fenugreek Seed Extract

[Madevilz]

Was browsing through a clearance section and saw a massively discounted iSatori Maxon product.
Didn't expect much from them, but looked on the back and saw a fenugreek extract that is new to me, eventhough the product has been out for over 10 years.

It has 500mg of Torabolic® Fenugreek Seed Extract (Std. to 70% Oligosaccharides), which supposedly is better for strength and power output? Tried to google it, and didn't find much discussion on it. Has anyone used the extract before?

 

[sns8778]

I wrote something awhile back and detailed the different study information on various Fenugreek ingredients and Indus has one that was unnamed in a study, but did not perform well comparatively.

The search function here hates me, but if you can find that, it'll tell you some info.

On the statement about Oligosaccharides being better for strength and power, I don't agree with that and I don't think hardly any other companies do either being how little that ingredient has been used and its been around for a long time.

Fenugreek can be standardized for different things and the most effective studies have always been on the ones std. for protodioscin content for men. It's important to remember it can be standardized for blood sugar constituents, testosterone constituents, or constituents that help females with lactation, menopause, and PMS via estrogenic aspects - so standardization is very important.

 

[sns8778]

TestoSurge is top rated

You can find meta analysis comparing different Fenugreek studies that showed that Furosap performed quite a bit better than TestoSurge did. I've posted the links to them in the past, but search function is not wanting to cooperate at the moment.

That's not opinion, it was researchers analyzing and comparing studies of various branded fenugreek extracts.

 

[sns8778]

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J Int Soc Sports Nutr
. 2009 Jul 31;6(Suppl 1)12. doi: 10.1186/1550-2783-6-S1-P12

Effects of TESTOSURGE supplementation on strength, body composition and hormonal profiles during an 8-week resistance training program​

Chris Poole 1, Brandon Bushey 1, Earnest Pena 1, Eric Constancio 1, Tyler Jones 1, Fanny Dufour 1, Natalie Ervin 1, Brittany Clemens 1, Darryn Willoughby 2, Richard Kreider 3, Cliffa Foster 1, Lem Taylor 1, Colin Wilborn 1,✉

• Author information
• Article notes
• Copyright and License information

PMCID: PMC3313155
TESTOSURGE is a novel, proprietary substance extracted from Fenugreek (Trigonella Foenun greacum) seeds and is patent pending by INDUS BIOTECH. The purpose of this study was to determine the effects of TESTOSURGE supplementation on strength, body composition and hormonal profiles.

30 resistance trained males completed all phases of the study. Subjects were matched according to total body weight and randomly assigned in a double-blind manner to ingest either 500 mg of a placebo (N = 13, 21 ± 3 yrs, 180 ± 6.4 cm, 84 ± 15 kg, 18.3 ± 6.8 BF%) or TESTOSURGE (N = 17, 21 ± 2.8 yrs, 178 ± 5.8 cm, 85 ± 9.6 kg, 18.8 ± 4.8 BF%) once per day for eight weeks. Subjects participated in a supervised, 4-day per week periodized resistance training program consisting of two upper extremity and two lower extremity workouts per week for a total of 8 weeks. At weeks 0, 4 and 8, hydrodensiometry body composition, 1 RM bench press and leg press, muscular endurance, anaerobic power and hormonal profiles were assessed. Statistical analyses utilized a two-way ANOVA with repeated measures for all criterion variables (p ≤ 0.05). Data are presented as mean ± SD changes from baseline values.

Significant group × time interaction effects occurred over the eight week period for body fat percentage (TES: -1.77 ± 1.52%, PL: -0.55 ± 1.72%; p = 0.048), total testosterone (TES: 0.97 ± 2.67 ng/ml, PL: -2.10 ± 3.75 ng/ml; p = 0.018) and bioavailable testosterone (TES: 1.32 ± 3.45 ng/ml, PL: -1.69 ± 3.94 ng/ml; p = 0.049). A significant main effect for time (p ≤ 0.05) was noted for bench press 1 RM, leg press 1 RM and lean body mass.

It is concluded that 500 mg of daily TESTOSURGE supplementation significantly impacted body fat percentage, total testosterone and bioavailable testosterone when compared to a placebo in a double-blind fashion. These changes were attained without any clinical side effects. We conclude that combined with a structured resistance training program, TESTOSURGE can significantly improve body composition and increase the anabolic hormonal status in resistance trained males over an 8 week period.

You can post all the studies from 2009 sponsored by the company that makes the ingredient that you want to - it doesn't change the fact that Furosap was shown in a comparative meta-analysis to show better results.

Since you want to be a dick and do the sticking your tongue out emoji, let me help you out and post a screen shot of the part you conveniently left out of the study you posted and a link where people could see if for themselves: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3313155/

It's not that its bad that they sponsored it - but it shows that you intentionally copied and pasted all but that part of it in an effort to make it look independent.

Save your trolling for someone else.

 

[Madevilz]

I think the smiley was unintentional hehe

 

[sns8778]

Here's 3 studies on Furosap for anyone interested.

Furosap - Study 1:

• Study: Safety and Efficacy of Furosap®, a Patented Trigonella foenum-graecum Seed Extract, in Boosting Testosterone Level, Reproductive Health and Mood Alleviation in Male Volunteers
• Authors: S N Sankhwar, Pawan Kumar, et el.
• Results: Free and bound testosterone levels improved significantly at 12 weeks of treatment. Sperm motility significantly increased at 8- and 12-weeks of treatment, while abnormal sperm morphology significantly decreased at 12-weeks of treatment. Mental alertness, mood, and reflex erection score significantly alleviated. An age-induced increasing effect was observed. Furthermore, cardiovascular health and libido significantly improved. Blood chemistry analyses exhibited broad spectrum safety. A decreasing trend was observed in total cholesterol, triglycerides, and VLDL levels, while an increasing trend was observed in HDL level at 12 weeks of treatment. LDL level decreased significantly at 12-weeks of treatment. No adverse events were observed.
• Conclusion: Results demonstrate that Furosap® is safe and effective in improving testosterone levels, cardiovascular health, healthy sperm profile, mental alertness in human male volunteers.

Furosap - Study 2:

• Study: Furosap, a novel Fenugreek seed extract improves lean body mass and serum testosterone in a randomized, placebo-controlled, double-blind clinical investigation
• Authors: Rui Guo1, Qiurong Wang
• Results: Furosap supplementation significantly increased mean lean body mass and fat-free mass compared to subjects receiving placebo. Additionally, Furosap-treated subjects elevated serum testosterone levels. Furosap supplemented subjects also exhibited a tendency towards lowering blood pressure during exhaustion. No adverse reports were reported.
• Conclusions: Given improvement of lean body mass and serum total testosterone following intervention with Furosap, Furosap likely has benefits for exercise endurance and sports medicine.

Furosap - Study 3:

• Study: Efficacy of FurosapTM, a novel Trigonella foenum-graecum seed extract, in Enhancing Testosterone Level and Improving Sperm Profile in Male Volunteers
• Authors: Anuj Maheshwari, Narsingh Verma
• Results: Free testosterone levels were improved up to 46% in 90% of the study population. 85.4% of the study population showed improvements in sperm counts. Sperm morphology improved in 14.6% of volunteers. Majority of the subjects enrolled in the study demonstrated improvements in mental alertness and mood. Furthermore, cardiovascular health and libido were significantly improved. Extensive safety parameters were evaluated which included blood chemistry data. No significant changes were observed in serum lipid function, cholesterol, triglyceride, HDL and LDL levels, hemogram (CBC), hepatotoxicity and nephrotoxicity.
• Conclusion: Overall, the results demonstrate that FS, enriched in 20% protodioscin, is safe and effective in attenuating testosterone levels, healthy sperm profile, mental alertness, cardiovascular health and overall performance in human subjects.

 

[sns8778]

I think the smiley was unintentional hehe

I thought about that, but its the same guy that has been banned dozens of times for trolling, the one that always trolls about old supplements like tribulus and things like that, so posting a 2009 study is right up his alley. He's got another thread going now arguing with people about how tribulus is better than supplements today

 

[K21]

Here's 3 studies on Furosap for anyone interested.

Furosap - Study 1:

• Study: Safety and Efficacy of Furosap®, a Patented Trigonella foenum-graecum Seed Extract, in Boosting Testosterone Level, Reproductive Health and Mood Alleviation in Male Volunteers
• Authors: S N Sankhwar, Pawan Kumar, et el.
• Results: Free and bound testosterone levels improved significantly at 12 weeks of treatment. Sperm motility significantly increased at 8- and 12-weeks of treatment, while abnormal sperm morphology significantly decreased at 12-weeks of treatment. Mental alertness, mood, and reflex erection score significantly alleviated. An age-induced increasing effect was observed. Furthermore, cardiovascular health and libido significantly improved. Blood chemistry analyses exhibited broad spectrum safety. A decreasing trend was observed in total cholesterol, triglycerides, and VLDL levels, while an increasing trend was observed in HDL level at 12 weeks of treatment. LDL level decreased significantly at 12-weeks of treatment. No adverse events were observed.
• Conclusion: Results demonstrate that Furosap® is safe and effective in improving testosterone levels, cardiovascular health, healthy sperm profile, mental alertness in human male volunteers.

Furosap - Study 2:

• Study: Furosap, a novel Fenugreek seed extract improves lean body mass and serum testosterone in a randomized, placebo-controlled, double-blind clinical investigation
• Authors: Rui Guo1, Qiurong Wang
• Results: Furosap supplementation significantly increased mean lean body mass and fat-free mass compared to subjects receiving placebo. Additionally, Furosap-treated subjects elevated serum testosterone levels. Furosap supplemented subjects also exhibited a tendency towards lowering blood pressure during exhaustion. No adverse reports were reported.
• Conclusions: Given improvement of lean body mass and serum total testosterone following intervention with Furosap, Furosap likely has benefits for exercise endurance and sports medicine.

Furosap - Study 3:

• Study: Efficacy of FurosapTM, a novel Trigonella foenum-graecum seed extract, in Enhancing Testosterone Level and Improving Sperm Profile in Male Volunteers
• Authors: Anuj Maheshwari, Narsingh Verma
• Results: Free testosterone levels were improved up to 46% in 90% of the study population. 85.4% of the study population showed improvements in sperm counts. Sperm morphology improved in 14.6% of volunteers. Majority of the subjects enrolled in the study demonstrated improvements in mental alertness and mood. Furthermore, cardiovascular health and libido were significantly improved. Extensive safety parameters were evaluated which included blood chemistry data. No significant changes were observed in serum lipid function, cholesterol, triglyceride, HDL and LDL levels, hemogram (CBC), hepatotoxicity and nephrotoxicity.
• Conclusion: Overall, the results demonstrate that FS, enriched in 20% protodioscin, is safe and effective in attenuating testosterone levels, healthy sperm profile, mental alertness, cardiovascular health and overall performance in human subjects.

Hi is it true that furosap still contains all the same phytochemicals that you would find in plain furngreek like diosgenin and trigonelline , except furosap is specifically standardized to 20% protodioscin?

 

[sns8778]

Hi is it true that furosap still contains all the same phytochemicals that you would find in plain furngreek like diosgenin and trigonelline , except furosap is specifically standardized to 20% protodioscin?

Fenugreek contains different constituents and can be standardized different ways. Furosap is standardized for protodioscin. The other constituents of Fenugreek may still be present to minor degrees.

If you're asking specifically regarding the Trigonelline content, Trigonelline is only present in very small amounts in Fenugreek.

 

[alsameesh]

Fenugreek polysaccharide extract is still available as "Physicor". Combining with a protodioscin extract wouldn't be redundant, I should think.