Hematocrit doc says to relax!

[Punkrocker]

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Check out this video. Doctor basically says that secondary erythrocytosis from testosterone is harmless and has nothing to do with polycythemia vera which affects platelets and other clotting mechanisms where as testosterone induced erythrocytosis does not. He then cited studies about people who live high altitude with hematocrits of 60% and don't even have a higher risk of stroke with studies to back it. Very cool video check it out

 

[Beau]

I am going to continue to donate (Double Red aka Power Red) because of the value it provides to others. Also, with my family history, I choose to treat blood values rather conservatively. That being said, thank you for posting this and I am fascinated by what the MD had to say. For me, I don't see a downside to donating, but I understand that others may have reasons they prefer not to.

 

[Punkrocker]

I am going to continue to donate (Double Red aka Power Red) because of the value it provides to others. Also, with my family history, I choose to treat blood values rather conservatively. That being said, thank you for posting this and I am fascinated by what the MD had to say. For me, I don't see a downside to donating, but I understand that others may have reasons they prefer not to.

I donate as well but to be completely honest, I do it because I was terrified thinking that if my hematocrit got too high I would die. After seeing this video it's put a whole new outlook on it for me. I'll still donate blood maybe 1-2 times a year because it's healthy to do that anyway. They say it's like getting an oil change for the cardiovascular system. But I don't think I'm gonna be so obsessed with it anymore

 

[Beau]

Understood - I am in the habit of doing a Power Red (twice the red blood cells as a regular donation) every 112 days, which is the required time between these types of donations (normal donations are every 56 days). So, its easier on my schedule.

Yesterday I received a notice from the Red Cross telling me how many gallons I have donated. It adds up quickly.

 

[sns8778]

I've researched this subject a lot and its normally the pro-TRT doctors that say not to worry about it, but then most cardiologists and blood specialists say that you should be worried about it.

I think that its one of those things where the truth lies in the middle and that people still need to be aware of it and cautious about it bc the levels being abnormally high isn't a good thing, regardless of how one looks at it.

(And for context, this is coming from someone (me) that is comically skiddish of needles and hates needles and especially IV's and blood draws haha)

 

[Punkrocker]

I've researched this subject a lot and its normally the pro-TRT doctors that say not to worry about it, but then most cardiologists and blood specialists say that you should be worried about it.

I think that its one of those things where the truth lies in the middle and that people still need to be aware of it and cautious about it bc the levels being abnormally high isn't a good thing, regardless of how one looks at it.

(And for context, this is coming from someone (me) that is comically skiddish of needles and hates needles and especially IV's and blood draws haha)

Well if you live in a high altitude city, a hematocrit of 60% would be considered normal. If you have COPD or emphysema and refuse oxygen, your body will compensate by producing more red blood cells and bringing your crit into the 60s. High altitude, lung problems etc people aren't being phlebotomised and they aren't at any higher risks of a cardiac event either (studies support this). I think we good fellas. JUICE UPPPPPP

 

[sns8778]

Well if you live in a high altitude city, a hematocrit of 60% would be considered normal. If you have COPD or emphysema and refuse oxygen, your body will compensate by producing more red blood cells and bringing your crit into the 60s. High altitude, lung problems etc people aren't being phlebotomised and they aren't at any higher risks of a cardiac event either (studies support this). I think we good fellas. JUICE UPPPPPP

If a person lives in a high altitude environment, their body does quite a few things to adapt.

As someone who has recently lost a loved one to COPD, I can tell you that your analogy between this subject and COPD is not representative of the situation as a whole. High hematocrit is very much a concern and very much life threatening for someone with COPD and has to be monitored extensively. It is estimated that 1/3 of people with COPD have heart failure.

I’m not sure what you took offense or defensively to I said in my post. I pointed out facts - that some pro TRT docs say it’s no big deal, but most cardiologists and blood specialists still say to be careful with it. That’s a fact, not my opinion.

My opinion was that it’s best for anyone to still have their levels monitored and be careful and cautious and listen to their doctor on this subject.

At the end of the day, it’s personal choice. It’s a persons own health and their own consequences; so I think that they should look at the facts for themselves and make their own decisions. I don’t care what anyone else does - I just care about helping provide them with the appropriate information to make educated choices.

 

[Uncle_E]

Well if you live in a high altitude city, a hematocrit of 60% would be considered normal. If you have COPD or emphysema and refuse oxygen, your body will compensate by producing more red blood cells and bringing your crit into the 60s. High altitude, lung problems etc people aren't being phlebotomised and they aren't at any higher risks of a cardiac event either (studies support this). I think we good fellas. JUICE UPPPPPP

I’m on TRT, an asthmatic with mild hypertension and H&H numbers at the top of the range. I live at sea level and took a trip to Colorado where it’s 9,000 ft + above sea level - I felt like a 90 year old emphysema patient walking up and down the stairs. My uncle tried to warn me and I thought he was just being a pu$$y, but the effects were that dramatic.

It was an outdoors trip so there was no opportunity to train, but I’m curious how I would have handled a heavy squat session out there. I’d really like to spend a few weeks/months there training at altitude to see how the body would compensate. I think it would make training at lower elevations a lot easier.

 

[Smont]

I've researched this subject a lot and its normally the pro-TRT doctors that say not to worry about it, but then most cardiologists and blood specialists say that you should be worried about it.

I think that its one of those things where the truth lies in the middle and that people still need to be aware of it and cautious about it bc the levels being abnormally high isn't a good thing, regardless of how one looks at it.

(And for context, this is coming from someone (me) that is comically skiddish of needles and hates needles and especially IV's and blood draws haha)

That's weird because I've seen the exact opposite, the trt docs seem to be the ones telling ppl they need to donate.

From the few docs I've had a chance to dig into this with they made it sound like there's a few factors to consider. 55% might be a red flag for sedentary Joe, but Bob who's doing a hour of hiit cardio and lifting weights 5x week might be healthy, safe and have a significant higher ability to tolerate or thrive on it being 55. The higher altitude debate is kinda 50/50 because we do not live at that higher altitude, we haven't lived there for years and made the adjustments, but we're all capable of moving to a high altitude place and not dieing so the adjustments can be made.

I just think the whole topic is too all over the place for gurentees so I'm definitely not taking sides and I don't donate very often nor do I care too. But if I walk in the office @58 or 60 ect I'm dumping blood lol

Just like everything else, to each there own and everyone responds differently. I don't believe there's any absolutes that apply to everyone.

 

[sns8778]

That's weird because I've seen the exact opposite, the trt docs seem to be the ones telling ppl they need to donate.

From the few docs I've had a chance to dig into this with they made it sound like there's a few factors to consider. 55% might be a red flag for sedentary Joe, but Bob who's doing a hour of hiit cardio and lifting weights 5x week might be healthy, safe and have a significant higher ability to tolerate or thrive on it being 55. The higher altitude debate is kinda 50/50 because we do not live at that higher altitude, we haven't lived there for years and made the adjustments, but we're all capable of moving to a high altitude place and not dieing so the adjustments can be made.

I just think the whole topic is too all over the place for gurentees so I'm definitely not taking sides and I don't donate very often nor do I care too. But if I walk in the office @58 or 60 ect I'm dumping blood lol

Just like everything else, to each there own and everyone responds differently. I don't believe there's any absolutes that apply to everyone.

Some of the TRT doctors do tell people to donate; but then some seem to minimize it like its not a big deal.

Whereas most Cardiologists and blood specialists go by the numbers and simply say if your bloodwork shows it to be too high, donate. And then if bloodwork shows it too high regularly, donate regularly.

I think that people tend to overcomplicate this subject and sometimes I think its people that don't like to donate blood just try to justify to themselves that they don't need to because they don't want to; when the reality is, I don't think someone needs to for the hell of it if they don't want to, but if their bloodwork shows their numbers high, then yes, they do need to, and lying to themselves based on what some internet 'guru' says isn't going to change the fact of what their bloodwork is.

 

[Smont]

Some of the TRT doctors do tell people to donate; but then some seem to minimize it like its not a big deal.

Whereas most Cardiologists and blood specialists go by the numbers and simply say if your bloodwork shows it to be too high, donate. And then if bloodwork shows it too high regularly, done regularly.

I think that people tend to overcomplicate this subject and sometimes I think its people that don't like to donate blood just try to justify to themselves that they don't need to because they don't want to; when the reality is, I don't think someone needs to for the hell of it if they don't want to, but if their bloodwork shows their numbers high, then yes, they do need to, and lying to themselves based on what some internet 'guru' says isn't going to change the fact of what their bloodwork is.

Anytime someone goes to a random internet person with questions like this they forget that there getting opinions based on what that individual has learned or not learned. I know at the end of the day I'm not using a random guy on the internet to make my decisions.

 

[Smont]

Some of the TRT doctors do tell people to donate; but then some seem to minimize it like its not a big deal.

Whereas most Cardiologists and blood specialists go by the numbers and simply say if your bloodwork shows it to be too high, donate. And then if bloodwork shows it too high regularly, done regularly.

I think that people tend to overcomplicate this subject and sometimes I think its people that don't like to donate blood just try to justify to themselves that they don't need to because they don't want to; when the reality is, I don't think someone needs to for the hell of it if they don't want to, but if their bloodwork shows their numbers high, then yes, they do need to, and lying to themselves based on what some internet 'guru' says isn't going to change the fact of what their bloodwork is.

Also, I'm gonna get in touch with you later tonight or tomorrow. Wanted to pick your brain on something and I came across some cool stuff I wanted to show you

 

[sns8778]

Anytime someone goes to a random internet person with questions like this they forget that there getting opinions based on what that individual has learned or not learned. I know at the end of the day I'm not using a random guy on the internet to make my decisions.

Absolutely agreed. That's why I had mentioned in my post above that I always would suggest people to speak to their doctor about this, or anything that shows up problematic in their bloodwork.

Also, I'm gonna get in touch with you later tonight or tomorrow. Wanted to pick your brain on something and I came across some cool stuff I wanted to show you

Sounds great. I'm looking forward to it.

 

[kisaj]

I live in Colorado at 6000' and often am in elevations 10,000'+, on TRT and stay hydrated. I've yet to meet a single doctor or specialist that has any concern with HCT <56. For some reason, that is the line in the sand even at elevation and anything over is recommended to lower or drop test and donate. Hemoglobin is also a factor and the number seems to be about 18, though blood donation centers salivate over that as long as it is under 21.

I started donating for the hell of it last year and can honestly say that I feel no different with HCT at 55 or 50- which is to say I feel good either way. It's always interesting when I see people mention feeling "lighter" or more energy.

I will say that anyone that lives at altitude like me and travels to sea level- we feel invincible. I can sprint 5 miles and not even breath heavy.