First cycle in 10+ years

[ThePeoplesPal]

Lads I need some help with my cycle. This will be my 3rd cycle, but my first in 10+ years. 1st cycle was an all oral when I was 18(I know,I know), 2nd was around the age of 26 pinning for the first time. I'm now 38, 6'3" 205lbs about 20% bf with ok lifts
Bench 120kg
Deadlift 205kg
Pendulum Squat 200kg
OHP 90kg

Waiting on bloods coming back but libido has always been low. So looking to perk that up and fill out a bit more.

I have 4 x vials ofTest 400 - I know it gets a lot of hate, but that's all I have.
Anavar 10mg (100 tabs)
Aromasin 20mg for AI if needed and
Nolvadex 20mg for PCT

Week 1-8
Anavar 20mg

Week 1-16
Test 400 400mg a week (split over 2 injections)

Week 19-23
Nolvadex 20mg

Goal is lean mass/recomp. I know there are better options but this is what I got. All help is appreciated

 

[Smont]

Start with 400 test, and save the anavar for the last 8 weeks, not the first.

Everyone gets it backwards. You want your cycle to get stronger as it goes on, not weaker. If you start with 400 test and anavar and you finish with only 400 test you on less gear at the end of your cycle, that's ass backwards.

Also, 20mg is pretty low for var, I'm pretty confident that since you got test 400 then the var is from a UGL and not pharmacy so it's a strong possibility that it's underdosed. Lots of guys need 80-100mg of ugl var, I would start at 40 and make assessments. But I would start the var at the second half of the cycle. Your goals are determined by your diet, not your steroids.

 

[Smont]

If you really want to minimize side effects and maximize muscle gains then you should diet before your cycle and drop to a good lean 10-12 or 12-15.
You will get way, way way better results if you start your cycle with already low bodyfat levels, 100% gurenteed.

 

[FloridaMan]

If it's real var and not under dosed stuff 20mg is ok, it's on the low end but ok.

I agree with @Smont about swapping it to the end of your cycle... While it is nice to have an immediate rush of steroids in your system, it will be much more enjoyable at the end.

 

[Hyde]

If you really want to minimize side effects and maximize muscle gains then you should diet before your cycle and drop to a good lean 10-12 or 12-15.
You will get way, way way better results if you start your cycle with already low bodyfat levels, 100% gurenteed.

Completely disagree.

Yes he will grow more lean tissue being way more insulin sensitive & leaner, but at 38 with lower test he’s going to genuinely lose all the lean mass he worked for to get down to 10%. He would need to get down to under 160 probably to be 10% bodyfat and cough up 20lbs of muscle to do it. Imagine how terribly small he would be at 160 and 6’3”! He’s small now! (No offense, OP)

OP, start a diet, drop 15-20lbs sustainably over a few months and get your nutrition locked into a routine - because of the reasons @Smont said, which are very valid. THEN do the proposed 400mg with Var at the end and do not bulk, aim for recomp. But getting down to 10% at your age & size naturally is just too far down in too short a time with the wrong hormonal environment to be optimal.

One other housekeeping point - if you aren’t ready for TRT, you shouldn’t do this. Steroids near 40 is a lot more likely to leave you very low test than when you were early twenties. I know you may not have access to that in Europe, but you should be prepared to cruise on replacement doses if your PCT doesn’t suffice.

 

[Smont]

Completely disagree.

Yes he will grow more lean tissue being way more insulin sensitive & leaner, but at 38 with lower test he’s going to genuinely lose all the lean mass he worked for to get down to 10%. He would need to get down to under 160 probably to be 10% bodyfat and cough up 20lbs of muscle to do it. Imagine how terribly small he would be at 160 and 6’3”! He’s small now! (No offense, OP)

OP, start a diet, drop 15-20lbs sustainably over a few months and get your nutrition locked into a routine - because of the reasons @Smont said, which are very valid. THEN do the proposed 400mg with Var at the end and do not bulk, aim for recomp. But getting down to 10% at your age & size naturally is just too far down in too short a time with the wrong hormonal environment to be optimal.

One other housekeeping point - if you aren’t ready for TRT, you shouldn’t do this. Steroids near 40 is a lot more likely to leave you very low test than when you were early twenties. I know you may not have access to that in Europe, but you should be prepared to cruise on replacement doses if your PCT doesn’t suffice.

You make some good points, I'm kinda conflicted in how I feel about it on both sides of the fence. I didn't take his height or age into the equation, and I don't know if I would even attempt pct at 38.

One of the main reasons I had a 5 year gap between cycles was because I knew ahead of time that when I went back on I was staying on a replacement dose forever.

 

[JoePaul39]

Good thread.

 

[Smont]

Another point I should make is when I'm telling ppl they should get down to 10% I don't ever expect them to. I automatically assume everyone is 5-10% higher bf then they say because, well, they almost always are. So when I tell ppl to get to 10-12 I'm just hoping they diet till there abs become visible. It doesn't take extreme dieting to have visible abs or even a watery midsection where the abs are just a few lbs away. Being at a healthy bf% isint going to tank your testosterone and if your bf is really high and you drop to a healthy number it will probably improve your testosterone levels.

 

[Hyde]

Another point I should make is when I'm telling ppl they should get down to 10% I don't ever expect them to. I automatically assume everyone is 5-10% higher bf then they say because, well, they almost always are. So when I tell ppl to get to 10-12 I'm just hoping they diet till there abs become visible. It doesn't take extreme dieting to have visible abs or even a watery midsection where the abs are just a few lbs away. Being at a healthy bf% isint going to tank your testosterone and if your bf is really high and you drop to a healthy number it will probably improve your testosterone levels.

Yeah that’s like 15% actual bodyfat on a male to have visible abs showing through typically.

 

[Smont]

Yeah that’s like 15% actual bodyfat on a male to have visible abs showing through typically.

100%

A lot of the times on the forums here though someone will stay there 12 or 15% or whatever it may be and then they'll show their picture and they're barely under 20. So in my mind telling someone to get down to 10 to 12 they'll probably get down to 15 to 17. Especially if there over 20 when they started.

I can only think of four or five people on this entire forum that have said their body fat percentage and showed a picture and was pretty on point, and 3 of them compete.

But a true 15% I think is a good even ground for the majority of ppl unless they're specific goal is requiring them to be as heavy as possible, or just heavier in general.

Another point revelent to this thread is even if the op has been training for 10 years or whatever, going by his stats I'd be willing to bet a lot of that 10 years has just been going to the gym, not actually working on progress that much because at 6'3 and that body fat percentage there's a ton of room to grow muscle naturally still. So doing things right he could probably drop a good 20 lb without losing any muscle he might even be able to improve some of his numbers in the gym.

I've definitely seen people who are out of shape drop 20 or 30 lb while getting stronger on the compound lifts

 

[ThePeoplesPal]

Gents.
Thanks so much for taking the time to respond and the informative feedback, it's given me a lot to think about.
Yes it's true, my entire lifting life I've flip flopped from one program to another chasing physique goals without any proper progression.
The past couple of years I've been training consistently with a mate who is an excellent PT and have made some great progress in terms of PR's. Unfortunately work-related/Covid stress (I worked in the aerospace industry) have resulted in some major IBS issues which I still struggle with. The past couple of months I have been trying IF with some succes in that my lifts have increased for reps while my body weight has dropped by about a lb a week, and my guts have never been better. However anytime I cut I seem to lose a lot of mass in my upper body and face which I hate. I think the goal now is just to bulk on the cycle (the wife tells me she prefers this look on me, and tbh I like the way my clothes fit when I'm that bit fuller, I just hate having a soft middle). Hopefully any sides at my current BF should be manageable with AI and I can just enjoy the gainz. Thanks again for your feedback

 

[Hyde]

Fair warning, AAS can exacerbate or flare up IBS worse sometimes. 3-400mg test isn’t anything crazy, but many orals or bigger doses or certain compounds like Tren could make for a bad time potentially.