Cant get HCG or HMG anymore. Taking Enclomiphene for fertility. So far no luck

jiu jitsu

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been off TRT for about 4 months now and now taking Enclomiphene again. I got bloodwork but somehow I forgot to include LH an FSH. So Ill have to get it soon

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210420



The testosterone looks decent. But No idea what my LH or FSH are. Does my total testosterone reading suggest that LH and FSH are looking alright too? I will be getting blood drawn for that shortly. I want to take HMG and HCG but I cant get it from my TRT clinic anymore
 
bad rad

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Your number look great but how do you feel? If you feel good I'd stay with Enclomiphene for TRT. Due to your numbers your LH is sufficient since you're making testosterone.

I'd still want to see LH/FSH to help get an idea of testicular function/response. If your LH is super high out of range but testosterone is just OK then that points towards primary hypogonadism.

I wouldn't add hCG or hMG since you likely don't need it based on those blood work results. Get a semen analysis instead. Some guys are infertile for other reasons besides hormones. My friend is due to childhood illness.
 

jiu jitsu

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Your number look great but how do you feel? If you feel good I'd stay with Enclomiphene for TRT. Due to your numbers your LH is sufficient since you're making testosterone.

I'd still want to see LH/FSH to help get an idea of testicular function/response. If your LH is super high out of range but testosterone is just OK then that points towards primary hypogonadism.

I wouldn't add hCG or hMG since you likely don't need it based on those blood work results. Get a semen analysis instead. Some guys are infertile for other reasons besides hormones. My friend is due to childhood illness.
Same. Im kicking myself for somehow forgetting to add it to my hormone panel.

Mind you these are my levels after around 10 years of consistent exogenous hormone use on and off with only using HCG a handful of times. I'm impressed with these numbers myself. prior to TRT my free testosterone and E2 were in the single digits essentially.

I will get an analysis for both LH/FSH and sperm.

is there a good home test I can take for the latter ?
 
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BBiceps

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Same. Im kicking myself for somehow forgetting to add it to my hormone panel.

Mind you these are my levels after around 10 years of consistent exogenous hormone use on and off with only using HCG a handful of times. I'm impressed with these numbers myself. prior to TRT my free testosterone and E2 were in the single digits essentially.

I will get an analysis for both LH/FSH and sperm.

ios there a good home test I can take for the latter ?
No, you have to go to a clinic and why not use regular Clomid?
 
BigGame84

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How long does Clomid generally take to kick-in for help with fertility?
 
cheftepesh1

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I would honestly see a specialist. Better to know what’s really going on.
 

BBiceps

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25mg I felt alright. 50+ I felt awful. But I tapered from 100mg/day down to 25.

Besides Enclomiphene is a part of Clomid
It’s never a reason to go over 50mg and 25mg is a good enough dose, I’m not surprised you got sides from those high doses.

Sure it is but it’s not Clomid, Clomid is prescribed for fertility and have plenty of studies.

enclomiphene is new and trendy but I would recommend to go with what’s proven to work.
 
thebigt

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It’s never a reason to go over 50mg and 25mg is a good enough dose, I’m not surprised you got sides from those high doses.

Sure it is but it’s not Clomid, Clomid is prescribed for fertility and have plenty of studies.

enclomiphene is new and trendy but I would recommend to go with what’s proven to work.
tried and true... :unsure:
 
BigGame84

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Ever try Ubiquinol? 400mg/day was recommended to me for this type of thing.
 
WesleyInman

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Enclomiphene is superior

I actually do this for a living. Besides selling OTC supplements on my store, I do protocols and some medical ventures based on my previous experience working with doctors and endocrinologists in the field.

Anyhoo....long story short, for anyone looking, the protocol I use is HMG, HCG and humanofort. Clomid of course works as well

I have seen dozens of clients of mine impregnate their wives/gfs. The thing is, if you look at pubmed studies, we really don't see full effects on sperm count for several months. This means that it is going to be SUPER expensive to do this the right way.


I authored a thread I will post below: Please do not share this without permission. Enjoy:



What are the top compounds to use to impregnate my wife?
By: Wesley Inman

Clomid
Nolva
HCG
HMG
Humanofort

https://stores.gymntonic.com/humanof...body-recovery/




Reviewed medical treatment of male infertility
SubstanceAdministrationDosage and frequencyCurrent availability
GnRHSubcutaneous infusion pump25-200 ng/kg per pulse every 2 hoursOnly in specialty centers or part of clinical trials
Human chorionic-gonadotropin (hCG)Subcutaneous/intramuscular1,500-3,000 IU
2 times/week
Available, FDA approved for treatment of infertility due to gonadotropin deficiency
Human menopausal gonadotropin (hMG)Subcutaneous/intramuscular75 IU 2-3 times/weekAvailable, FDA approved for treatment of infertility due to gonadotropin deficiency
Highly purified or recombinant human follicle-stimulating hormone (rhFSH)Subcutaneous/intramuscular100-150 IU 2-3 times/weekAvailable, FDA approved for treatment of infertility due to gonadotropin deficiency
Dopamine agonistOralCabergoline (0.5-1 mg twice weekly), bromocriptine
(2.5-5.0 mg twice weekly)
FDA approval for treatment of hyperprolactinaemia
Aromatase inhibitorsOralAnastrozole 1 mg/dayOff label use
Letrozole 2.5 mg/dayOff label use
TestolactoneNot available in the USA
Selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs)OralClomiphene citrate titrate to 50 mg/dayOff label use
Tamoxifen 20 mg/day,
toremifene 60 mg/day,
raloxifene 60 mg/day
Off label use



How long does it take for HMG and HCG to be effective in improving sperm count?

On the average according to multiple studies, it takes about 3 months of consistent administration to see decent results.
15-25million Sperm is the average rate of improvement in men in these studies
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/and.13271

How much does it cost to use one of these protocols?

Depending on what you choose, it is very pricy overall. If you can get things like Clomid, HCG and HMG prescribed to you and your insurance covers it, great. If you have to pay out of pocket it will get very pricy very quick

HMG alone averages on the black market about $50 for 75iu, and the standard dose of HMG is 75-150 per week. So you can see that this alone is going to cost you $2-400 alone per month.


Does a protocol always work?

Of course not. Plenty of variable exist and even if you do improve your sperm count, their may be other reasons that it won't work, and also it must be evaluated whether your wife/gf/partner is able to conceive etc.


Why does infertility happen?

About 15% of couples are infertile and male factor infertility contributes to about 50% of the infertility cases (1). The majority of male infertility is idiopathic, which indicates that the patient has unexplained abnormalities in sperm parameters, or unexplained azoospermia. However, there are multiple known causes of male infertility, and several have a pharmacologic option as the first line of treatment. The medical treatment of known causes of male infertility tend to have targeted and high success rates. In cases of idiopathic or genetic causes of male infertility, the medical management tends to be empirical and is directed for the purposes of optimization.
It is important to appreciate that testicular function involves both the production of testosterone (T) and spermatogenesis, and this function is highly regulated by the hypothalamic-pituitary-gonadal (HPG) axis. Spermatogenesis is dependent on high levels of intratesticular T and follicle-stimulating hormone (FSH) stimulation of the Sertoli cells (2). Despite the requirement for T for spermatogenesis, the administration of T and other androgens have contraceptive properties; they exhibit a negative feedback on HPG and thus inhibit luteinizing hormone (LH) stimulation of intratesticular T production, as well as FSH stimulation of Sertoli cells, and should be avoided. For most known causes of male infertility, the therapeutic goal is the maintenance of the reproductive axis to increase testicular T. However, in certain men with primary testicular failure or idiopathic male infertility, a specific medical therapy has not been identified, and empiric medical treatments are often used. This review article will focus on the non-surgical treatments currently available for male infertility and review the data on the efficacy of those therapies, the list of medications reviewed are summarized in Table 1.


Conclusions

Understanding the HPG axis and the effect of estrogen excess is critical for the assessment and treatment of male infertility. However, the goal of infertility treatment in all these men is to optimize LH levels to stimulate T production from the Leydig cells, FSH levels to stimulate Sertoli cells and spermatogenesis, and eliminate any estrogen excess. Pharmacologic therapy is only effective in a handful of known causes of male infertility where the causes are relatively well-defined and understood. Based on current data, hormonal therapies in general should not be used indiscriminately for the treatment of idiopathic male infertility due to questionable efficacy and restrictive cost.


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4708300/
 
bad rad

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It’s never a reason to go over 50mg and 25mg is a good enough dose, I’m not surprised you got sides from those high doses.

Sure it is but it’s not Clomid, Clomid is prescribed for fertility and have plenty of studies.

enclomiphene is new and trendy but I would recommend to go with what’s proven to work.
Clomifene consists of two stereoisomers in equal proportion: enclomifene and zuclomifene. Zuclomifene has pro-estrogenic properties, whereas enclomiphene is pro-androgenic, i.e. it promotes testosterone production through stimulation of the HPG axis.

Clomid was designed for women and has mixed agonist/antagonist properties. Enclomiphene has been around as long as Clomid has but was never studied previously since it wasn't available on its own.

 

BBiceps

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Clomifene consists of two stereoisomers in equal proportion: enclomifene and zuclomifene. Zuclomifene has pro-estrogenic properties, whereas enclomiphene is pro-androgenic, i.e. it promotes testosterone production through stimulation of the HPG axis.

Clomid was designed for women and has mixed agonist/antagonist properties. Enclomiphene has been around as long as Clomid has but was never studied previously since it wasn't available on its own.

I get it but where do you get this stuff because from what I know Dr’s only prescribed regular Clomid? and if you not getting it from the Dr how sure are you it is what it supposed to be? If it was me and I wanted babies I would take what the Dr prescribes.

Well, I was and I took Clomid so I know that works.
 

jiu jitsu

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I get it but where do you get this stuff because from what I know Dr’s only prescribed regular Clomid? and if you not getting it from the Dr how sure are you it is what it supposed to be? If it was me and I wanted babies I would take what the Dr prescribes.

Well, I was and I took Clomid so I know that works.
My TRT clinic prescribed me Enclomiphene for fertility.
 

jiu jitsu

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This is what a fertility clinic suggested to me. I believe there are some studies of this as well if you search. I use Jarrow brand.
Just bought some. how long did you take it for?
 

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