Could do with views on bloods

[Whisky]

Hey fellas, pre blast bloods back today and whilst there were no major surprises there are a couple of bits I’ve not really seen before.......

in particular my creatine kinase is miles higher than it’s ever been and although I now that is normally elevated if you have more lean mass I’m hardly about to step on a stage so this level concerned me - anyone seen this in lifters before and now how worried I should be? Also, can it be caused by supplements?

the other take away was that even at 160mg a week I sit above range on test levels. Need to drop to 125mg next cruise. Estrogen I’m not fussed about, I use asin at low doses to control that and these were taken just before a dose so that’s the highest point.

my ALT was also near the top of range, given no orals and the fact I don’t drink (plus the copious supplements I take year round for liver health that’s one I need to keep an eye on (ex alcoholic with previous liver issue means I really do keep an eye on it - been perfect to this point in my gear useage)

ive minimised the numbers for those in range to shorten the post but obviously I have the full detail on everything below - green means in range

 

[Hyde]

These LIVER levels aren’t a problem. You have jaundice when billirubin is like 4x the top of normal, and even higher multiplier yet for the AST & ALT. You are all good. I am not blowing smoke; a gastroenterologist explained this stuff to me when we realized I have Gilbert’s Syndrome (my enzymes are naturally high normal, since I was little and had jaundice as a baby).

How long before this draw did you train, and what did you train?

 

[Whisky]

These levels aren’t a problem. You have jaundice when billirubin is like 4x the top of normal, and even higher multiplier yet for the AST & ALT. You are all good. I am not blowing smoke; a gastroenterologist explained this stuff to me when we realized I have Gilbert’s Syndrome (my enzymes are naturally high normal, since I was little and had jaundice as a baby).

How long before this draw did you train, and what did you train?

thanks bro. Appreciate the insight as there’s some conflicting stuff on CK levels out there (earlier this year I was 308 and start of 2019 it was 48).

I hadn’t trained that morning (draw was 8am Monday). Previous day I’d done an hour HIIT session with a couple of elite rugby players in the morning then trained chest and arms in the afternoon but nothing crazy heavy. Saturday I’d run 12km in the morning and then trained back in the afternoon (moderate heavy)

I feel generally decent, I’m still carrying a slight glute injury but that’s improving. My hands have been feeling beat up lately which I put down to the boxing training I’ve been doing.

strength is solid though, no obvious drop off in performance at all. I also would have expected my inflammation marker to be higher ?

 

[Rebuild]

Hey fellas, pre blast bloods back today and whilst there were no major surprises there are a couple of bits I’ve not really seen before.......

in particular my creatine kinase is miles higher than it’s ever been and although I now that is normally elevated if you have more lean mass I’m hardly about to step on a stage so this level concerned me - anyone seen this in lifters before and now how worried I should be? Also, can it be caused by supplements?

the other take away was that even at 160mg a week I sit above range on test levels. Need to drop to 125mg next cruise. Estrogen I’m not fussed about, I use asin at low doses to control that and these were taken just before a dose so that’s the highest point.

my ALT was also near the top of range, given no orals and the fact I don’t drink (plus the copious supplements I take year round for liver health that’s one I need to keep an eye on (ex alcoholic with previous liver issue means I really do keep an eye on it - been perfect to this point in my gear useage)

ive minimised the numbers for those in range to shorten the post but obviously I have the full detail on everything below - green means in range

How high is your ALT? I dont see it in the attached pics. Aromasin can elevate AST and ALT, but I would bet lifting is the culprit. Your CRP is normal, which is what actually matters.

 

[Hyde]

thanks bro. Appreciate the insight as there’s some conflicting stuff on CK levels out there (earlier this year I was 308 and start of 2019 it was 48).

I hadn’t trained that morning (draw was 8am Monday). Previous day I’d done an hour HIIT session with a couple of elite rugby players in the morning then trained chest and arms in the afternoon but nothing crazy heavy. Saturday I’d run 12km in the morning and then trained back in the afternoon (moderate heavy)

I feel generally decent, I’m still carrying a slight glute injury but that’s improving. My hands have been feeling beat up lately which I put down to the boxing training I’ve been doing.

strength is solid though, no obvious drop off in performance at all. I also would have expected my inflammation marker to be higher ?

I’m sorry, I just edited my post for clarity - I specifically was talking about your liver numbers being top of the ranges as just fine. I can speak with confidence on that.

As for the CK and Urea, I do not know, but I do absolutely know you are a messing up training the days prior to bloods if you don’t want kidney and liver values thrown off. Training normally elevates these temporarily quite a bit, so it’s best to take about 72 hours off all training before a draw if you don’t want training effects to mask underlying signs of potential problems. Bloodwork means I am deloading lol.

If your values are fine while not resting from training, you are definitely not having problems with liver!

 

[Whisky]

How high is your ALT? I dont see it in the attached pics. Aromasin can elevate AST and ALT, but I would bet lifting is the culprit. Your CRP is normal, which is what actually matters.

ALT was 49.2 against an upper range of 50.....

CK was my only real concern from these tbh

 

[Whisky]

I’m sorry, I just edited my post for clarity - I specifically was talking about your liver numbers being top of the ranges as just fine. I can speak with confidence on that.

As for the CK and Urea, I do not know, but I do absolutely know you are a messing up training the days prior to bloods if you don’t want kidney and liver values thrown off. Training normally elevates these temporarily quite a bit, so it’s best to take about 72 hours off all training before a draw if you don’t want training effects to mask underlying signs of potential problems. Bloodwork means I am deloading lol.

If your values are fine while not resting from training, you are definitely not having problems with liver!

yeah I was ok with the others tbh. Whilst I know that Training definitely elevates CK mine is high even accounting for that, over 1,000 and they start looking at rabdo apparently (but the variables seem massive, over 5,000 is concerns about renal failure yet iron men etc will often be at 15-20,000 after an event.

I expected it to be high, maybe just not that high especially as I haven’t been balls to the wall by a long stretch (for me) and my highest previously was 308

 

[Hyde]

yeah I was ok with the others tbh. Whilst I know that Training definitely elevates CK mine is high even accounting for that, over 1,000 and they start looking at rabdo apparently (but the variables seem massive, over 5,000 is concerns about renal failure yet iron men etc will often be at 15-20,000 after an event.

I expected it to be high, maybe just not that high especially as I haven’t been balls to the wall by a long stretch (for me) and my highest previously was 308

Keep in mind it’s not the level that is the problem - it’s why it’s elevated. So the Ironmen being so high isn’t an issue the way our training raising it isn’t an issue. But if you take a few days of only LISS cardio prior and they are high, that’s a red flag.

If you are worried, you need to rest and re-test to know the truth. And obviously be well-hydrated like any blood draw.

 

[Whisky]

Keep in mind it’s not the level that is the problem - it’s why it’s elevated. So the Ironmen being so high isn’t an issue the way our training raising it isn’t an issue. But if you take a few days of only LISS cardio prior and they are high, that’s a red flag.

If you are worried, you need to rest and re-test to know the truth. And obviously be well-hydrated like any blood draw.

my main issue is that it’s one of those things that can have many different causes (I.e severe muscle damage, heart attack etc) but could also be as a result of training (although in studies on trained athletes I’d be right at the highest end of what was seen). Below a 1,000 and it’s no concern but I think it’s one to keep an eye on for sure.

I’ll retest in a month and see what direction of travel it’s taking