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NATURAL ANABOLICS - DETOX - RAW VEGAN

Whey said:
So only eating grass fed beef would obtain better results? Cool thanks ill look into it after my detox.
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A lot of people on YouTube raving of their personal experiences. Getting healed of many illnesses, leaning out, building muscle, having clarity, stronger, etc..
 
Whey said:
Bro obviously I came here for bodybuilding advice in preference of asking a doctor or naturopath.

This is why I asked to stick to body building. Come on man its a basic food list.
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And your recommended “bodybuilding” protocol will depend greatly on your diet. You can’t tell me what your daily protein and calorie consumption will be? Then you have an objectively s**t diet. Go add up the fruits you’ll eat if it’s so simple. If you’re at maintaince calories and 40g protein it’s different than if you’re 600 calories under maintenance and at 20g protein.

Anyone who will give you training advice without without knowing calories and protein consumption in such a limiting diet is a fool.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
And your recommended “bodybuilding” protocol will depend greatly on your diet. You can’t tell me what your daily protein and calorie consumption will be? Then you have an objectively s**t diet. Go add up the fruits you’ll eat if it’s so simple. If you’re at maintaince calories and 40g protein it’s different than if you’re 600 calories under maintenance and at 20g protein.

Anyone who will give you training advice without without knowing calories and protein consumption in such a limiting diet is a fool.
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Yes a protein deficiency, 5x5 if possible or less volume. Hypertrophy - not possible. Yea thanks man we covered this... I doubt doing nothing is better then the tiniest bit of volume.


The only question I have left is would a natural anabolic or even a natural cutting supplement help in a catabolic state with muscle loss and strength under such horrible conditions?


F*** I hope this detox wont last longer then 3 months :(
 
HICA could help, but it’s an amino acid. You’ve never said if they’re allowed. EAAs would help, but they’re also amino acids, and I don’t know if they’re allowed. Creatine would help too, as would carnitine, but they’re also amino acids found predominantly in meat, so are they allowed on your vegan detox?

You claim your layout is simple, yet I still don’t have answers to these questions.
 
And a protein deficiency at 60g/day is massively different than at 20g/day. Have you figured out calories? You should try to be as close to maintainence as possible, or you’ll lose even more muscle if you’re in a huge protein and caloric deficit.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
And a protein deficiency at 60g/day is massively different than at 20g/day. Have you figured out calories? You should try to be as close to maintainence as possible, or you’ll lose even more muscle if you’re in a huge protein and caloric deficit.
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He right.

And at that point, if you lose too much muscle, you will be very unhealthy overall.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
HICA could help, but it’s an amino acid. You’ve never said if they’re allowed. EAAs would help, but they’re also amino acids, and I don’t know if they’re allowed. Creatine would help too, as would carnitine, but they’re also amino acids found predominantly in meat, so are they allowed on your vegan detox?

You claim your layout is simple, yet I still don’t have answers to these questions.
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Ok ill try and answer the best I can. So amino acids are in fruit and vegetables so it should be good. I don't feel comfortable taking amino acids from meat(creatine) since its not on the raw vegan food list. EAAs are in fruits. BCAAs I have no clue, I can only find meat sources. I would have to ask a naturopath if BCAAs are available in fruit and leafy greens.

I would also really like to know if a natural anabolic or natural cutting supplement would help?
 
Whey said:
Ok ill try and answer the best I can. So amino acids are in fruit and vegetables so it should be good. I don't feel comfortable taking amino acids from meat(creatine) since its not on the raw vegan food list. EAAs are in fruits. BCAAs I have no clue, I can only find meat sources. I would have to ask a naturopath if BCAAs are available in fruit and leafy greens.

I would also really like to know if a natural anabolic or natural cutting supplement would help?
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Do a Google search to find out what combinations form a complete protein.
 
Spinach and brocolli relatively high in protein. Your trick is going to have to find the right combinations each meal to make sure at each meal you get a complete protein.
 
Also, think about buying bulk leucine powder. If you add it to each meal, you will spark muscle protein synthesis.
 
ValiantThor08 said:
Spinach and brocolli relatively high in protein. Your trick is going to have to find the right combinations each meal to make sure at each meal you get a complete protein.
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Spinach is on the food list, brocolli is not so bad it will just slow things a bit.

Basically my diet consists of...*

Fruit, Berries & Melons - Being Number 1.
Herbs, Green Leafy Veggies and Alfalfa Sprouts- Assisting detox.
Other Vegetables - Slowing down detox.
Nuts, Seeds and Legumes - Ending detox.
Proteins, Dairy and Grains - Reversing detox.
Cooked foods - Terminating detox.

For sure im going to get a bunch of fruit and vegatables and juice them so i can consume high amounts. Of course ill be eatting too, raw.
 
Whey said:
Spinach is on the food list, brocolli is not so bad it will just slow things a bit.

Basically my diet consists of...*

Fruit, Berries & Melons - Being Number 1.
Herbs, Green Leafy Veggies and Alfalfa Sprouts- Assisting detox.
Other Vegetables - Slowing down detox.
Nuts, Seeds and Legumes - Ending detox.
Proteins, Dairy and Grains - Reversing detox.
Cooked foods - Terminating detox.

For sure im going to get a bunch of fruit and vegatables and juice them so i can consume high amounts. Of course ill be eatting too, raw.
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I wouldn't juice them. You will want the fiber/pulp/skin of the produce.
 
ValiantThor08 said:
Also, think about buying bulk leucine powder. If you add it to each meal, you will spark muscle protein synthesis.
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Bulk leucine is good, i can mess with that :)

Would you know if a natural anabolic or a natural cutting supplement would help retain muscle and strenght in a catabolic state? Herbs are allowed. Maybe i should just roll the dice and take my Vector i have stashed away.
 
Whey said:
Bulk leucine is good, i can mess with that :)

Would you know if a natural anabolic or a natural cutting supplement would help retain muscle and strenght in a catabolic state? Herbs are allowed. Maybe i should just roll the dice and take my Vector i have stashed away.
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Cissus supplement will be good. KSM66 you may like. The leucine will help spare your muscle better than anything though. Add a few grams per meal.
 
Whey said:
Ok ill try and answer the best I can. So amino acids are in fruit and vegetables so it should be good. I don't feel comfortable taking amino acids from meat(creatine) since its not on the raw vegan food list. EAAs are in fruits. BCAAs I have no clue, I can only find meat sources. I would have to ask a naturopath if BCAAs are available in fruit and leafy greens.

I would also really like to know if a natural anabolic or natural cutting supplement would help?
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Ok, so don’t take this the wrong way, but you have no idea what you’re talking about. BCAAs ARE EAAs. If you have EAAs, you have BCAAs. But if you can take EAAs, then you can “artificially” spike the amino acid content of your suboptimal diet up to normal levels and it won’t be nearly as bad as it seems like it is now. You’ll still stimulate MPS well by adding leucine and other EAAs to your meals.
 
Whey said:
True, honestly tho... i dont think i can stomach all that food. Ive always had to supplement with whey. Especially raw - brutal.
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So not only are you going on a VERY limiting diet that is almost guaranteed to leave you in a heavy protein and caloric deficit, but you’re planning on juicing it all? At the least blend it in something like a Vitamix/Nutrabullet/Ninja/etc. I refuse to believe any self-respecting MD would sign off on this plan.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
So not only are you going on a VERY limiting diet that is almost guaranteed to leave you in a heavy protein and caloric deficit, but you’re planning on juicing it all? At the least blend it in something like a Vitamix/Nutrabullet/Ninja/etc. I refuse to believe any self-respecting MD would sign off on this plan.
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I didnt say i was juicing it all.
 
Thor said:
ValiantThor08 said:
I wouldn't juice them. You will want the fiber/pulp/skin of the produce.
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Then you said:
Whey said:
True, honestly tho... i dont think i can stomach all that food. Ive always had to supplement with whey. Especially raw - brutal.
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The logical conclusion is that you plan on not actually “eating” them. So either it’s juicing or blending. I’m saying it really needs to be blending, not juicing.

And if you struggled getting sufficient nutrients on a normal diet, this sounds like a recipe for disaster.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
Ok, so don’t take this the wrong way, but you have no idea what you’re talking about. BCAAs ARE EAAs. If you have EAAs, you have BCAAs. But if you can take EAAs, then you can “artificially” spike the amino acid content of your suboptimal diet up to normal levels and it won’t be nearly as bad as it seems like it is now. You’ll still stimulate MPS well by adding leucine and other EAAs to your meals.
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Non taken. I guess i was wrong about the EAA. Do you know if EAAs and BCAAs are present in fruits and leafy greens?

If present i can use them.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
Thor said:


Then you said:


The logical conclusion is that you plan on not actually “eating” them. So either it’s juicing or blending. I’m saying it really needs to be blending, not juicing.

And if you struggled getting sufficient nutrients on a normal diet, this sounds like a recipe for disaster.
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There nothing in there where i said i would juice everything. Also look at post #67
 
Whey said:
Non taken. I guess i was wrong about the EAA. Do you know if EAAs and BCAAs are present in fruits and leafy greens?

If present i can use them.
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Amino acids are present in any fruit or veggie that has protein in it, so yes.
 
Whey said:
Non taken. I guess i was wrong about the EAA. Do you know if EAAs and BCAAs are present in fruits and leafy greens?

If present i can use them.
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If a food has even a gram of protein, it has EAAs. They’re Essental Amino Acids. Add a scoop of NOW Amino-9 powder and another 2-3g of leucine powder to your meals. The powders taste terrible alone and mix horribly, but they’ll make a world of difference in your diet. They should mix well in a blender with a smoothie though, and fruits/vegetables will help mask the taste. Do this with 3 meals a day.
 
But since fruits and veggies by themselves are not complete proteins, they each have different amino acids.
 
ValiantThor08 said:
But since fruits and veggies by themselves are not complete proteins, they each have different amino acids.
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Yes, but having even a few will net some amount of all the EAAs. So you can/should get EAAs in every meal, be it from plants, animals, or both. They are all occurring in at least some fruits and vegetables, so they’d meet this very arbitrary rule lol.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
Yes, but having even a few will net some amount of all the EAAs. So you can/should get EAAs in every meal, be it from plants, animals, or both. They are all occurring in at least some fruits and vegetables, so they’d meet this very arbitrary rule lol.
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I know. Was a continuation response to my other post lol. Trying to help him understand.
 
ValiantThor08 said:
I know. Was a continuation response to my other post lol. Trying to help him understand.
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He understands my situation off and on, which i still appreciate. Arbitrary? I can live with this disease for the rest of my life, or i can follow my naturopath with medical lab reports of people being cured.
 
I would appreciate if we keep my thread in regards to just body building. I do have doctor and naturopath to cover the medical side.
 
Whey said:
He understands my situation off and on, which i still appreciate. Arbitrary? I can live with this disease for the rest of my life, or i can follow my naturopath with medical lab reports of people being cured.
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No, I was saying that I was wanting you to understand that since plant sourced protein is spread out, each plant has different amino acids. So you could use amino acid supplementation, and add extra leucine.
 
Whey said:
I would appreciate if we keep my thread in regards to just body building. I do have doctor and naturopath to cover the medical side.
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And yet you don’t know if EAAs are allowable. You don’t know your caloric intake, or your protein intake.

I’m telling you now, just using EAAs will make a bigger difference than any training you do or don’t do. It’s that major. It’d be irresponsible not to discuss it.

From what you’re saying, your ACTUAL doctor (MD) just pawned you off to this naturopath and told you there’s nothing he can do to help you. This new doctor sounds like a quack. If he doesn’t at the minimum help you set up a baseline caloric intake, and set you up with some vitamins and minerals to take to prevent some glaring nutrient deficiencies you’re setting yourself up for, then he should have his license revoked, if he even has one.

And don’t use the word bodybuilding. This entire premise spits in the face of bodybuilding if I’m being frank.
 
Now EAAs and BCAAs supplements where do they get thier sources from? Meat or fruits and leafy greens?
 
Whey said:
He understands my situation off and on, which i still appreciate. Arbitrary? I can live with this disease for the rest of my life, or i can follow my naturopath with medical lab reports of people being cured.
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The rules of this “diet” are arbitrary, not your condition. Which we still don’t know.

What is your condition? How can anyone help you without information? Your specific training protocol is peanuts compared to your diet and medical condition.
 
Whey said:
Now EAAs and BCAAs supplements where do they get thier sources from? Meat or fruits and leafy greens?
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Regardless, they’re absolutely identical in the body. Ethical reasons are the only factor at play in opting for vegan sourced amino acids, and your medical condition doesn’t give two s**ts about ethics.
 
This will do more for you than any natural anabolic given your massive protein deficit.

And can you eat coconuts and/or avocados and/or olive oil?
 
muscleupcrohn said:
And yet you don’t know if EAAs are allowable. You don’t know your caloric intake, or your protein intake.

I’m telling you now, just using EAAs will make a bigger difference than any training you do or don’t do. It’s that major. It’d be irresponsible not to discuss it.

From what you’re saying, your ACTUAL doctor (MD) just pawned you off to this naturopath and told you there’s nothing he can do to help you. This new doctor sounds like a quack. If he doesn’t at the minimum help you set up a baseline caloric intake, and set you up with some vitamins and minerals to take to prevent some glaring nutrient deficiencies you’re setting yourself up for, then he should have his license revoked, if he even has one.

And don’t use the word bodybuilding. This entire premise spits in the face of bodybuilding if I’m being frank.
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I dont know if EAAs supplements are allowed. I guess i have to find out the source. Maybe check ask my naturopath?

Just to be clear again. Bro there is no medical cure... My Doctor told me. Ive mention this.

My naturopath has a cure with medical lab results of people being cured.

F!@#$ i dont why there is no medical cure or i would do it and make my life easy.



For bodybuilding I AM F@#KED I KNOW THAT. It's pretty obvious isnt it? What are you arguing about!?!?

Im trying to minimize all this B.S. im going threw so i CURE my self. I also want to minimize all the LOSSES i will obviously experience while im catabolic AF. So all the efforts, time and money ive put into BODYBUILDING wont go to s***!
 
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