psychosis: cannabis induced or my steroid usage?

Permabulk95

Member
hello everybody.

i would like to see some others opinions on this.
i have no family history of any mental illness. growing up, i had no mental illness. i am rather young and i recently experienced a nonviolent 1 week long psychotic episode which started with euphoria/mania and ended with intense but peaceful audio and visual hallucinations and then /delusional-psychosis which led to hospitalization. about 6 months before this intense but nonviolent psychotic episode, my cannabis use had gone from recreationally mild, then to moderate and then to intense and irresponsible. steroid use was also involved, but it’s a bit complex.

here are some more needed facts.

a year ago i was diagnosed with hypogonadism and was put on trt.
I did play around with the dosage at first. I mean to say that on some given weeks for a short amount of time i did “mini”cycles, I was taking about 250-300mg weekly and only experienced an elevated mood/elevated energy, and nice body recomp. all was well.
i had ever experienced things like irritability or roid rage from exogenous hormone usage. So, all in all, the trt had done good for me.
But the thing is, parrallel to my heaviest and most irresponsible cannabis usage, i started a moderate cycle of mainly testosterone E (600 weekly) and mesterolone (ED.) The cycle ended as i was hospitalized from mania/delusions/psychosis.

i am definitely anti-cannabis as of now. but i would like to know if psychosis is more a result of my test usage and if this has happened to other bodybuilders in the past.
 
its possible the mesterolone caused some kind of imbalance.. but its also known in the literature that cannibus can at least exacerbate existing issues if not cause them.. are there any other drugs you were using ?? as an example i experienced horrible sides from prami that included hallucinations and severe narcolepsy... Point is it could be anything and or a combo of things causing your issues. starting from the top i would rule out test.. i never really here of those kinds of problems with it and there are plenty of guys who run way more than 600 per week.
 
My guess is either it had (basically) nothing to do with any drug (including steroid) usage, or maybe you got some mj that had been laced with something.
 
thanks guys. right before the psychotic break i was taking like 4 mesterolone a day which was pharma grade from bayer schering, but all that is is just dht aka proviron.
 
besides weed and stuff listed, i was just lifting and eating lots of great food the weed btw was in hash form and concentrates(dabs). no alcohol on cycle either btw
 
Permabulk95 said:
besides weed and stuff listed, i was just lifting and eating lots of great food the weed btw was in hash form and concentrates(dabs). no alcohol on cycle either btw
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My best guess is there was something in there that you didn't know about.
But it could have been a totally mental issue.
I don't believe that Test or Proviron had anything to do with it.
 
Permabulk95 said:
hello everybody.

i would like to see some others opinions on this.
i have no family history of any mental illness. growing up, i had no mental illness. i am rather young and i recently experienced a nonviolent 1 week long psychotic episode which started with euphoria/mania and ended with intense but peaceful audio and visual hallucinations and then /delusional-psychosis which led to hospitalization. about 6 months before this intense but nonviolent psychotic episode, my cannabis use had gone from recreationally mild, then to moderate and then to intense and irresponsible. steroid use was also involved, but it’s a bit complex.

here are some more needed facts.

a year ago i was diagnosed with hypogonadism and was put on trt.
I did play around with the dosage at first. I mean to say that on some given weeks for a short amount of time i did “mini”cycles, I was taking about 250-300mg weekly and only experienced an elevated mood/elevated energy, and nice body recomp. all was well.
i had ever experienced things like irritability or roid rage from exogenous hormone usage. So, all in all, the trt had done good for me.
But the thing is, parrallel to my heaviest and most irresponsible cannabis usage, i started a moderate cycle of mainly testosterone E (600 weekly) and mesterolone (ED.) The cycle ended as i was hospitalized from mania/delusions/psychosis.

i am definitely anti-cannabis as of now. but i would like to know if psychosis is more a result of my test usage and if this has happened to other bodybuilders in the past.
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Stay away from cannabis. What you described may be dopamine induced psychosis, caused by an overload of dopamine. Ingesting large smounts of THC can cause dopamine reuptake inhibition, and testosterone can increase domain production. Also, considering your history of hypogonadism, your brain may not be adapted to dealing with large amounts of dopamine.
Alternatively, you may be schizophrenic. Either way, stay away from canabis for a long time.
 
Sorry to hear that brother. I'd have to agree with Renew1 and say it sounds like something was up with that weed...I'm no expert on this subject in any shape. Dont they make dab by running the weed through butane etc? Surely there could have been some chemical(s) mixed in there inadvertently. If it was the gear you'd think you would have heard of this happening before....steroids have been around for a long time. Either way man glad you are out of it. And like you said....stay away from that herb for a long time!
 
People call cannabis anti depressive and I have no doubts it works great for some but I think for others it enhance the bad feelings and I think this is more normal with an experienced user that pretty much is the same person high or sober. Steroids can mentally crash you and there are plenty of people here that are complaining about mild steroids giving them sides and sometimes even sarms. I just think it's so individual that it's almost a waste of time asking others how they felt because I'd assume most will say the same thing. In this case when everyone's saying the same thing it doesn't really tell that you will feel the same.

All steroids can in my opinion cause a mental crash, you have some less androgenic, some less anabolic, you have AI's, caber, you can decide your own dosage, you can restart your hpta faster in some ways than others but you never know how you will feel on anything.
 
I’ve been a regular marijuana smoker since my late teens, so about ten years and I still treat every new strain with respect. I have a history of mental health issues, mostly depression, but I’ve seen my own friend struggle with psychotic episodes like you described after smoking weed (he was a severe bipolar). I actually avoid dabs all together, and if you return to smoking one day then I suggest you do the same. The THC content in dabs is so unnecessarily high, one hit and I feel crazy. So I stick to the buds and I don’t overdo it. I’ve tried many times to smoke the way you describe, but I’ve learned being high constantly never turns into something positive. Altering your reality basically all day everyday, as I assume you were, can even seriously affect a very mentally stable persons emotional and psychological state. I consider marijuana a mild psychedelic as do many others, so treat it accordingly.

Oh, and I’m not trying to start an argument about this because it’d be a waste of time, but the people who say it was laced are definitely mistaken. What keeps a supplier of any product in business is getting return customers and finding new customers, so why would someone who has weed add harsh chemicals to it? Just to be evil? Well being evil doesn’t pay the bills but selling a lot of weed does. And we know THC alone can cause psychotic episodes in people who are predisposed to mental illness. So if just plain old THC can do the trick, why should we jump to the conclusion that something toxic was added?

Now on to steroids. High doses of test, and other androgens can 100% cause a state of overstimulation/euphoria/mania in certain individuals. So I believe it was a combination of everything. I bet if you were only on your trt dose and smoked buds (not dabs) once a night before bed then this whole thing wouldn’t have happened. Everyone knows that going too high with your tren dose can cause a mental breakdown but I believe some people who are sensitive to androgens can experience a mental break from going high with test alone.

Just look at the timeline of how things happened. You were already smoking a ton of weed, you then increased the androgens, then the episode occurred. The weed likely had your mind in a vulnerable state, the androgens induced a pleasant mania, but as mania always does, it eventually spiraled out of control until you finally wound up institutionalized.
 
YoungThor said:
I’ve been a regular marijuana smoker since my late teens, so about ten years and I still treat every new strain with respect. I have a history of mental health issues, mostly depression, but I’ve seen my own friend struggle with psychotic episodes like you described after smoking weed (he was a severe bipolar). I actually avoid dabs all together, and if you return to smoking one day then I suggest you do the same. The THC content in dabs is so unnecessarily high, one hit and I feel crazy. So I stick to the buds and I don’t overdo it. I’ve tried many times to smoke the way you describe, but I’ve learned being high constantly never turns into something positive. Altering your reality basically all day everyday, as I assume you were, can even seriously affect a very mentally stable persons emotional and psychological state. I consider marijuana a mild psychedelic as do many others, so treat it accordingly.

Oh, and I’m not trying to start an argument about this because it’d be a waste of time, but the people who say it was laced are definitely mistaken. What keeps a supplier of any product in business is getting return customers and finding new customers, so why would someone who has weed add harsh chemicals to it? Just to be evil? Well being evil doesn’t pay the bills but selling a lot of weed does. And we know THC alone can cause psychotic episodes in people who are predisposed to mental illness. So if just plain old THC can do the trick, why should we jump to the conclusion that something toxic was added?

Now on to steroids. High doses of test, and other androgens can 100% cause a state of overstimulation/euphoria/mania in certain individuals. So I believe it was a combination of everything. I bet if you were only on your trt dose and smoked buds (not dabs) once a night before bed then this whole thing wouldn’t have happened. Everyone knows that going too high with your tren dose can cause a mental breakdown but I believe some people who are sensitive to androgens can experience a mental break from going high with test alone.

Just look at the timeline of how things happened. You were already smoking a ton of weed, you then increased the androgens, then the episode occurred. The weed likely had your mind in a vulnerable state, the androgens induced a pleasant mania, but as mania always does, it eventually spiraled out of control until you finally wound up institutionalized.
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I like how you mentioned bipolar here cause I've just been having a talk with a friend convinced that he has adhd.. It's quite easy to think one have a diagnose when a lot of symptoms can be seen in vulnerable people with some tough background or traumatic experiences.. Borderline is something they believe is coming from trauma and I have been able to pass any test for that even though I've never been a person showing symptoms to others I know how I felt inside. During this period which i wanna call a deep depression Marijuana made things worse.

Don't get me wrong I'm not stupid enough to diagnose myself but it's easy for anyone to fall in to a depression and sometimes you're not different from people with actual long terms depressions coming from Bipolar disorder etc.

When you hit rock bottom you want to go away from reality and smoke weed and it can help but after a while the weed becomes reality and the thoughts that you could remove with weed now becomes more common than when sober.

The amount of people with diagnoses/depression nowadays is redicilous and we are the cause of it. People are spoiled, they have no goals, anything has to be achieved with money or looks. People say you come out stronger and in a way you do but there's always this underlying feeling knowing what you could have done.
 
Chados yeah, I can’t smoke weed when I’m depressed because rather than helping me escape my depression, I just dive deeper into it. I become hyper-analytical, but often in a nonproductive, negative way. If I’m in a good mood and having a good time then marijuana expands those positive feelings. So for me, and it sounds like for you too, it just exacerbates what you’re going through already. It’s not a tool for escaping problems like alcohol or opiates are. This is one of the reasons I view marijuana as a mild psychedelic. If you take acid, mushrooms, peyote, etc. then you better be ready to confront everything you thought you knew about yourself. The crazy part is that you usually come out a better person, even when the experience feels negative. Unfortunately marijuana is in this middle ground where it’s just powerful enough to help you dive deep into your consciousness, but not powerful enough to allow you to come away with some productive realizations about how you should correct your behavior and adjust your life. So getting extremely stoned, especially when you’re already in a weird mood, wont help you have a good time. That’s why I like getting a little high, but not stoned out of my mind.

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Permabulk95 I just found this report about somebody who had a psychotic episode from taking AAS while using marijuana heavily. Maybe you’d like to check it out. I’ll paste the conclusion below for people who don’t want to read the whole report. It’s basically what I said at the end of my first post in this thread.

Conclusions:

With no known history of mania, the patient met the criteria for a manic episode. Based on the history, the probable inciting factor was the initiation of AAS injections. Given the patient’s history of substance abuse—particularly heavy cannabis use, it is likely the patient had an increased susceptibility to the psychiatric effects of AAS use.
 
YoungThor said:


[B]Invalid Link Removed[/B]
[USER=233660]Permabulk95 I just found this report about somebody who had a psychotic episode from taking AAS while using marijuana heavily. Maybe you’d like to check it out. I’ll paste the conclusion below for people who don’t want to read the whole report. It’s basically what I said at the end of my first post in this thread.

Conclusions:

With no known history of mania, the patient met the criteria for a manic episode. Based on the history, the probable inciting factor was the initiation of AAS injections. Given the patient’s history of substance abuse—particularly heavy cannabis use, it is likely the patient had an increased susceptibility to the psychiatric effects of AAS use.
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Good find Thor...and yea weed is a weird plant at times. Last time I was on a tren like compound (dienolone) I got to the point where I was super anxious and almost paranoid one night...couldn't sleep. Hadn't smoked in forever so I figured a couple puffs and I could chill out but it did the exact opposite. Laid on my couch scared nearly the entire night...felt like I was completely losing it at times. Last time I self medicate with that herb.
 
bigbeaph said:
Good find Thor...and yea weed is a weird plant at times. Last time I was on a tren like compound (dienolone) I got to the point where I was super anxious and almost paranoid one night...couldn't sleep. Hadn't smoked in forever so I figured a couple puffs and I could chill out but it did the exact opposite. Laid on my couch scared nearly the entire night...felt like I was completely losing it at times. Last time I self medicate with that herb.
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Yeah tren and marijuana can be bad I've felt it myself.. It's easy to get paranoid on weed if you're alone especially, tren does the same **** but worse.
 
YoungThor said:
I’ve been a regular marijuana smoker since my late teens, so about ten years and I still treat every new strain with respect. I have a history of mental health issues, mostly depression, but I’ve seen my own friend struggle with psychotic episodes like you described after smoking weed (he was a severe bipolar). I actually avoid dabs all together, and if you return to smoking one day then I suggest you do the same. The THC content in dabs is so unnecessarily high, one hit and I feel crazy. So I stick to the buds and I don’t overdo it. I’ve tried many times to smoke the way you describe, but I’ve learned being high constantly never turns into something positive. Altering your reality basically all day everyday, as I assume you were, can even seriously affect a very mentally stable persons emotional and psychological state. I consider marijuana a mild psychedelic as do many others, so treat it accordingly.

Oh, and I’m not trying to start an argument about this because it’d be a waste of time, but the people who say it was laced are definitely mistaken. What keeps a supplier of any product in business is getting return customers and finding new customers, so why would someone who has weed add harsh chemicals to it? Just to be evil? Well being evil doesn’t pay the bills but selling a lot of weed does. And we know THC alone can cause psychotic episodes in people who are predisposed to mental illness. So if just plain old THC can do the trick, why should we jump to the conclusion that something toxic was added?

Now on to steroids. High doses of test, and other androgens can 100% cause a state of overstimulation/euphoria/mania in certain individuals. So I believe it was a combination of everything. I bet if you were only on your trt dose and smoked buds (not dabs) once a night before bed then this whole thing wouldn’t have happened. Everyone knows that going too high with your tren dose can cause a mental breakdown but I believe some people who are sensitive to androgens can experience a mental break from going high with test alone.

Just look at the timeline of how things happened. You were already smoking a ton of weed, you then increased the androgens, then the episode occurred. The weed likely had your mind in a vulnerable state, the androgens induced a pleasant mania, but as mania always does, it eventually spiraled out of control until you finally wound up institutionalized.
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None of us will ever know if what he had was laced. But I can factually state that sometimes it is. This isn't a guess. And it isn't exactly what you were referring to. People sell drugs to make money. If their customers get high, they will return (sometimes at least). That is why you have people ODing on drugs they didn't know they were buying (think Fentanyl). The people lacing (or substituting) drugs with Fentanyl weren't intending to kill their customers. They were just trying to get them high.

No argument taken, and none intended here.
I appreciate your posts brother.
 
YoungThor said:
Chados yeah, I can’t smoke weed when I’m depressed because rather than helping me escape my depression, I just dive deeper into it. I become hyper-analytical, but often in a nonproductive, negative way. If I’m in a good mood and having a good time then marijuana expands those positive feelings. So for me, and it sounds like for you too, it just exacerbates what you’re going through already. It’s not a tool for escaping problems like alcohol or opiates are. This is one of the reasons I view marijuana as a mild psychedelic. If you take acid, mushrooms, peyote, etc. then you better be ready to confront everything you thought you knew about yourself. The crazy part is that you usually come out a better person, even when the experience feels negative. Unfortunately marijuana is in this middle ground where it’s just powerful enough to help you dive deep into your consciousness, but not powerful enough to allow you to come away with some productive realizations about how you should correct your behavior and adjust your life. So getting extremely stoned, especially when you’re already in a weird mood, wont help you have a good time. That’s why I like getting a little high, but not stoned out of my mind.

Invalid Link Removed
Permabulk95 I just found this report about somebody who had a psychotic episode from taking AAS while using marijuana heavily. Maybe you’d like to check it out. I’ll paste the conclusion below for people who don’t want to read the whole report. It’s basically what I said at the end of my first post in this thread.

Conclusions:

With no known history of mania, the patient met the criteria for a manic episode. Based on the history, the probable inciting factor was the initiation of AAS injections. Given the patient’s history of substance abuse—particularly heavy cannabis use, it is likely the patient had an increased susceptibility to the psychiatric effects of AAS use.
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Yup as I stated above this post, they both can cause paranoia for different reasons and I think neither should be used by an unstable person. Far too many people who are unstable drunk, smoke or take steroids and never does it remove depression. It might make you forget it at best for a few hours but I think one should be careful with distance himself from reality cause it can be shocking going back to normal life after any abuse.

Depression is just really sad to see in people and in this macho society there are few people who has the energy to listen. I'm trying to be different, I try to ask people twice rather than once if I feel something is wrong. It's important we help each other rather than self medicating.
 
Chados said:
Yeah tren and marijuana can be bad I've felt it myself.. It's easy to get paranoid on weed if you're alone especially, tren does the same **** but worse.
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Ive said it a hundred times on here...but i completely lost my mind on tren e at 600 a week. I mean completely. I was a basket case. Delusional. Paranoid. Rage.Sex Crazed...i was like that for over a week..not sleeping either..waiting for that crap to get out of my system. My girl had to take off work to be with me so i wouldnt kill myself or land in jail or the psych ward. Very bad times indeed. And i had been doing gear for over a decade at that point.
 
swimfan65 said:
Ive said it a hundred times on here...but i completely lost my mind on tren e at 600 a week. I mean completely. I was a basket case. Delusional. Paranoid. Rage.Sex Crazed...i was like that for over a week..not sleeping either..waiting for that crap to get out of my system. My girl had to take off work to be with me so i wouldnt kill myself or land in jail or the psych ward. Very bad times indeed. And i had been doing gear for over a decade at that point.
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Same for me except sleep.. I could sleep, just woke up every other night in a lake haha
 
My buddy used tree and he went crazy all the time. Constantly cryin, questioning our friendship, suicidal to the point where I’d have to go to his place because he was scaring me. I will never touch the stuff. Not worth it but that being said was there any blood work done in the midst of this? That can help us rule some things out
 
The Express 42 said:
My buddy used tree and he went crazy all the time. Constantly cryin, questioning our friendship, suicidal to the point where I’d have to go to his place because he was scaring me. I will never touch the stuff. Not worth it but that being said was there any blood work done in the midst of this? That can help us rule some things out
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i’m for sure done with the tree. there was bloodwork but only the doctors looked at it. they found only the obvious i think, liver enzymes and high t levels i’m sure. may have been elevated from oral kickstarter that i used back in june to begin cycle
 
Permabulk95 said:
i’m for sure done with the tree. there was bloodwork but only the doctors looked at it. they found only the obvious i think, liver enzymes and high t levels i’m sure. may have been elevated from oral kickstarter that i used back in june to begin cycle
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i think he meant tren... not tree
 
Without knowing all the details of your situation, it's difficult to say for sure what caused your psychotic episode. However, both cannabis and steroid use can potentially contribute to mental health issues like psychosis, especially when used irresponsibly or in large amounts.
 
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