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Prohormone stack for mass?

SDPonce63

SDPonce63

Member
Hello everyone, I am considering 2 stacks to put on mass and strength. Which stack would be a faster PCT recovery and be less liver toxic

OPTION 1:
Msten 12/22/22/30/30/30
LGD 15/15/15/15/15/15
Oral trest 30/30/30/30/30/30 (pre workout)
DermaTrest 50/50/50/50/50/50
CEL Cycle assist
500mg TUDCA
AI ON CYCLE (st. 6.25 eod or 12.5 e3d)


OPTION 2:

M17 Aplha 25/25/50/50/50
DermaTrest 50/50/50/50/50/50
CEL Cycle assist
500mg TUDCA
AI ON CYCLE (st. 6.25 eod or 12.5 e3d)

PCT:

Xgells
M-TEST
Nolvadex 10/10/10/10
Clomid 50/50/25/25


I have ran Msten awhile back so I’m not a first time user to this compound. However, I have never used M17 Alpha, any suggestions?
 
SDPonce63 said:
Hello everyone, I am considering 2 stacks to put on mass and strength. Which stack would be a faster PCT recovery and be less liver toxic

OPTION 1:
Msten 12/22/22/30/30/30
LGD 15/15/15/15/15/15
Oral trest 30/30/30/30/30/30 (pre workout)
DermaTrest 50/50/50/50/50/50
CEL Cycle assist
500mg TUDCA
AI ON CYCLE (st. 6.25 eod or 12.5 e3d)


OPTION 2:

M17 Aplha 25/25/50/50/50
DermaTrest 50/50/50/50/50/50
CEL Cycle assist
500mg TUDCA
AI ON CYCLE (st. 6.25 eod or 12.5 e3d)

PCT:

Xgells
M-TEST
Nolvadex 10/10/10/10
Clomid 50/50/25/25


I have ran Msten awhile back so I’m not a first time user to this compound. However, I have never used M17 Alpha, any suggestions?
Click to expand...

you're comparing 3 oral and 1 TD to 1 oral and 1 TD... you better know which one is going to be harsher on your body haha.

Msten alone is one of the harsher compounds still available. Obviously TD's will be the least liver toxic, but trest is one of the most brutal out there in terms of suppression (was acutally being tested as a male contraceptive).
 
booneman77 said:
you're comparing 3 oral and 1 TD to 1 oral and 1 TD... you better know which one is going to be harsher on your body haha.

Msten alone is one of the harsher compounds still available. Obviously TD's will be the least liver toxic, but trest is one of the most brutal out there in terms of suppression (was acutally being tested as a male contraceptive).
Click to expand...

Dermacrine be a better option Than trest TD on the m17 alpha?
 
Trest and fast recovery can’t be uttered in the same sentence.



However, if you drop the insane amount of horrific overkill there and simply run:
TD Trest 50——>
Msten 22——>

You’ll get more than your money’s worth right there.
That stack right there has got me thinking honestly.

Nolva or Raloxifene are most likely the only things that will protect you from Trest gyno.
 
Yeah just do trest msten.

Torem to protect from gyno and suppression

Tudca for the liver plus CEL cycle assist

Pct I would do clomid 50/50/25/25/12/12
Torem 60/30/30/30/15/15

Trest is awesome but suppressive. A SERM on cycle is a very good idea. Even if it helped to a small degree it would be worth it because you will be 100% shutdown quick
 
RickyBlobby said:
Yeah just do trest msten.

Torem to protect from gyno and suppression

Tudca for the liver plus CEL cycle assist

Pct I would do clomid 50/50/25/25/12/12
Torem 60/30/30/30/15/15

Trest is awesome but suppressive. A SERM on cycle is a very good idea. Even if it helped to a small degree it would be worth it because you will be 100% shutdown quick
Click to expand...

What if I abandoned the trest and did Dermacrine? Would that be enough to keep up test levels and not cause shut down?
 
Matthersby said:
Trest and fast recovery can’t be uttered in the same sentence.



However, if you drop the insane amount of horrific overkill there and simply run:
TD Trest 50——>
Msten 22——>

You’ll get more than your money’s worth right there.
That stack right there has got me thinking honestly.

Nolva or Raloxifene are most likely the only things that will protect you from Trest gyno.
Click to expand...

Y’all got me worried about TD trest lol I don’t want it to cause shut down. Would 50mg TD for 6 weeks cause shut down?
 
SDPonce63 said:
Y’all got me worried about TD trest lol I don’t want it to cause shut down. Would 50mg TD for 6 weeks cause shut down?
Click to expand...

It may just Be your wording here, but you can't stop shutdown you are causing with artificial hormonals. (Except with the POSSIBLE exception of a SERM on cycle).
 
Renew1 said:
It may just Be your wording here, but you can't stop shutdown you are causing with artificial hormonals. (Except with the POSSIBLE exception of a SERM on cycle).
Click to expand...

An AI on cycle? I have aromasin on hand or are you talking about another serm. Would I get any benefit from using 1/2 Dermacrine along with 1/2 (25mg) trest or is that dumb?
 
SDPonce63 said:
What if I abandoned the trest and did Dermacrine? Would that be enough to keep up test levels and not cause shut down?
Click to expand...

Toremifene > Dermacrine

I wouldn’t even bother with Torem if you go with Trest. You are committing to a fast and decisive shutdown on Trest. That compound is more for the TRT crowd.
 
Hyde said:
Toremifene > Dermacrine

I wouldn’t even bother with Torem if you go with Trest. You are committing to a fast and decisive shutdown on Trest. That compound is more for the TRT crowd.
Click to expand...

So what would be an option of a test base in replacement of trest?
 
SDPonce63 said:
An AI on cycle? I have aromasin on hand or are you talking about another serm. Would I get any benefit from using 1/2 Dermacrine along with 1/2 (25mg) trest or is that dumb?
Click to expand...

An AI won't help with shutdown. It only helps with Estrogenic sides.
A Test base doesn't stop or lessen shutdown, it just helps you to feel batter as you are getting shutdown on cycle.
As Hyde was eluding to... Trest will cause (at least some, usually a pretty strong shutdown).
For some middle of the road cycles, some of us have had some success using Dermacrine to lesson the sides from shutdown during a cycle.
 
Renew1 said:
Here's a decent read from a couple of years ago on this site (read the whole thing):

Invalid Link Removed
Click to expand...

That was very useful. On the Trest section there isn’t a mention of shut down. However, estrogen is a big deal with it. I plan to use Aromasin which I can dose quite high 12.5mg E.D. if I have to. Seeing my test base dose would be 50mg spaced out 25mg AM and 25mg PM. I don’t think it’s that much of an issue.
 
SDPonce63 said:
That was very useful. On the Trest section there isn’t a mention of shut down. However, estrogen is a big deal with it. I plan to use Aromasin which I can dose quite high 12.5mg E.D. if I have to. Seeing my test base dose would be 50mg spaced out 25mg AM and 25mg PM. I don’t think it’s that much of an issue.
Click to expand...

There may not have been a mention of it by the users in that post 2 years ago, but the users here today certainly mentioned it to you. Now you have to make your own informed decions.
Take care brother.
 
Just an idea of how strong Trest is.... some people believe that 10mg - 15mg a day may be enough for a "Test base", if you can figure out how to dose it properly.
A little more Trest convo, if you're up for more reading:

Invalid Link Removed
 
SDPonce63 said:
So what would be an option of a test base in replacement of trest?
Click to expand...

If only going 6 weeks, just use Toremifene starting a week or so prior to cycle and cruise your own (declining) natural test and let the SERM keep your LH & FSH levels stimulated some (slowing shutdown & speeding PCT recovery) while you grow on LGD & Msten or M1A. You could add Dermacrine to this for a bit better feel without meaningfully increasing suppression but adding some energy & well-being.

If you go with Trest, you will have better gains but no amount of SERM is going to stop that contraceptive from doing what it does - and that means a much harder PCT & potentially more HPTA damage. Plus you will need both Nolva or Ralox & Caber or Prami to control gyno possibly. I wouldn’t bother with all of that for a 6wk oral cycle.
 
SDPonce63 said:
That was very useful. On the Trest section there isn’t a mention of shut down. However, estrogen is a big deal with it. I plan to use Aromasin which I can dose quite high 12.5mg E.D. if I have to. Seeing my test base dose would be 50mg spaced out 25mg AM and 25mg PM. I don’t think it’s that much of an issue.
Click to expand...

I didn’t read it, but when regarding shutdown, one can be referring to shutdown lethargy and shutdown: the process of your body shutting down test production. Trest acts like a super test as far as a base goes and there’s virtually no lethargy with it. However when we are speaking of shutdown in regards to Trest, we only mean test shutdown. 6 weeks of td Trest you’ll recover from. I have always liked the idea of a serm on cycle such as clomid or torem. If you’re really concerned with recovery skip the Trest and use Dermacrine. but 6 weeks or less you should be fine with aggressive serm therapy.
Personally, I waited for TRT to use my Trest. But not everyone necessarily has to.
 
SDPonce63 said:
Dermacrine be a better option Than trest TD on the m17 alpha?
Click to expand...

deramcrine will only be there as a very mild test base type... but yes, in terms of limiting suppression and sides its 208572094852084650 times better than trest ha
 
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