Conversion.
- Thread starter Bbcmp
- Start date
Jebrook
Well-known member
It is a 2 step conversion prohormone. It ultimately becomes testosterone.
210LBS
Well-known member
He just told you - testosterone.
210LBS
Well-known member
So you mean you want to know what testosterone is comparable to?
210LBS
Well-known member
I highly doubt it would be comparable to anadrol. I'm running 4-andro right now in addition to Halodrol and 11-OXO. 4-andro is not known for being very anabolic for 2 reasons - 1) the conversion rate to test is probably not too high and would require a significant amount in order to compete with IM test. And 2) testosterone is not that anabolic in comparison to some of the other compounds available out there. Running something like Brutal 4CE solo would not yield much in terms of gains because of those 2 reasons. Plus Brutal 4CE is very low dosed.
210LBS
Well-known member
I don't know what Hardcore Solid is? I'm not sure who recommended this to you but it does not seem like a good idea. Are you planning to take Brutal 4CE on your PCT? Or are you jumping from DMZ to Brutal 4CE and then to PCT? Either way, neither of these are good ideas.
210LBS
Well-known member
OK. Being a bodybuilder doesn't make you a chemist or a doctor so I wouldn't shy away from others opinions. Good luck!
210LBS
Well-known member
I didn't know AAS/PH knowledge was a prerequisite for fitness and nutrition certifications. Just be cautious man.
BBiceps
Well-known member
If you already have this guru why do you ask questions on a public forum? He should know everything you need to know right?
Foxx13
Member
Hahaha my thoughts exactly. This guy has a guru with multiple certs and "education" but comes here to ask the question. Just ask Mr. Guru.
Whisky
Well-known member
To be honest bro you’ve come off terribly. You’ve been told legit info (any of which a cursory search would confirm) and your instantly rejecting it all because of the advice of your guru......the mere fact he’s suggesting you use a 2 step ph instead of im test (if he’s genuinely a decent level bb he won’t be using facking 4-andro) suggests something isn’t quite right.....
irishiron300
Member
Frankly, it’s under-dosed. BSL attempts to compensate through the liposomal delivery system. Either way the conversion rate to test is fairly low. Decent test base, poor standalone.
Bbcmp
New member
I appreciate everyone's input. First of all he's not a guru. But I completely trust him because everything he's told me has been great. Has worked fantastically so I will not dought his advice. I will be coming completely off everything in 6 weeks and going clean up. I am not disputing any of what y'all are saying either but I have had great results with Blackstone products up to now. I don't do anything just by itself. I am stepping down on the dosage with the PCT to help keep my gains while my test levels regulate. I will continue the PCT after I complete the Brutal 4ce. I do understand that the dosage is not as high but that is the purpose of using it to follow up my 4 weeks of DMZ Xtreme stacked with Xreme solid. I do appreciate your I'm put. But there is no guru. Research has been done before hand. Just wanted feedback. THANKS ALOT!!!!
thebigt
Legend
you seem like a decent guy...don't be offended by the bluntness of some replies....the guys on this forum are pretty darned knowledgeable and actually very friendly once you get to know them!!!
210LBS
Well-known member
In all honesty, I'm having a hard time trying to track what exactly you are doing. It seems like you're saying you ran a cycle of DMZ Xtreme and Xtreme Solid (I'm not sure what this is, can you share the profile?), and then started PCT.. but now you're pausing your PCT to start a Brutal 4CE only cycle.. and then you'll pick up your PCT again?
210LBS
Well-known member
I'm trying to help but you're being very short and not providing us with enough information. What exactly do you mean by "next phase?" Can you lay out your whole plan for us? Just put down the weeks and what you'll be running, like
Weeks 1-4: Supplement X and Y
Weeks 5-8: Supplement A and B
Weeks 9-12: Supplement Z
Etc.
210LBS
Well-known member
OK I see what you're doing. You're running the 4-andro with your PCT. In my opinion, I'd take a step back and look at the risk/reward of this. Running 4-andro in PCT can make it harder to get your body to recover from your cycle. Is it worth taking something that might be suppressive in PCT? Also, there will be very little anabolic effect from 130mgs of 4-andro, if any. Ideally, I would have run the 4-andro with your cycle.
Whisky
Well-known member
Yep this ^^^^
The point of pct is to hold onto the gains on cycle while your own natural test/hormone production kicks back in (as the compounds on cycle will surprise it). I can’t see how taking 4-andro (albeit at low doses) will help that goal - it’ll just hinder it.
People trying to help you here bro, read up on how this all works so you can be confident in what you are doing.....
Bbcmp
New member
It's meant to help me keep my gains ( 184lbs- 193lbs with great size and strength increase). And help my body return to it's natural state.
Now I do get and understand what you guys are saying as I have read up on it. But I have also read some data that says that starting your PCT before the end of your cycle has good benefits the kick-starting your natural production. I may re think this and hold off on the PCT a couple of weeks.
Now I do get and understand what you guys are saying as I have read up on it. But I have also read some data that says that starting your PCT before the end of your cycle has good benefits the kick-starting your natural production. I may re think this and hold off on the PCT a couple of weeks.
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210LBS
Well-known member
The problem is that 4-andro (Brutal 4CE) is mildly suppressive, which will make it harder to recover if you run it during PCT. Also, 4-andro is really only mildly anabolic, so running it solo is not going to yield much in terms of gains. So, when you weigh the risk/reward here it's not an attractive addition in my opinion.
BBiceps
Well-known member
Am I the only one that react on 1 cap ed for PCT?! What’s that?
210LBS
Well-known member
I didn't get that far yet.
BBiceps
Well-known member
Pls tell me it’s not Anabolic Technologies PCT that you’re doing 1 cap ed??! Your guru is messing with you if that’s the case
Georgiepecker
Active member
this was very helpful to us all
BlockBuilder
Well-known member
Where’s your SERM for PCT?
Georgiepecker
Active member
An anabolic compound shouldn’t be used In pct my friend
Georgiepecker
Active member
Your blackstone lab sponsored coach PROBABLY just wants to sell you a blackstone lab product. Am I right
BlockBuilder
Well-known member
You’re very very close to completely ****ing your body up. I would stop listening to your friend and start listening to us. What is your SERM for PCT?
Georgiepecker
Active member
Why do you think 4-ad is the final nail in the coffin that will finally f*** his body up? It’s the most minor of things he could run sold today
BlockBuilder
Well-known member
Because he has NO SERM for his PCT after using DMZ and 4 Andro. His PCT is 1 cap of Anabolic Technologies PCT. oh and he’s using hexadrone as well.
Georgiepecker
Active member
yeah and a lot of people I personally know ran no pct when Superdrol was sold for years and recovered with bloodwork to prove it. Is there a chance he can mess his hormones up permanntly? Yes. Is it guaranteed, no. And people seem to love to act like that’s the result 100% of the time. It’s just wrong. Take precautions, yes. But don’t just say “you have now f***** up your hormones permanently BECAUSE: you took some prohormones without a Nolvadex pill after.”
BlockBuilder
Well-known member
Wow you’re really arguing why not having a SERM is ok? Lmao. Very ironic coming from someone who is on TRT lol. Some of us actually have to worry about doing a proper PCT
Georgiepecker
Active member
no I’m arguing that telling someone they are about to f*** up their body permanently no matter what, is not only wrong but flat out retarded.
Besides why can’t people just answer the question in the thread?
It always has to be for example: you suck you are only 20 and you have ruined your body better stop NOW my friend!
To answer your question OP:
I think that product is 4-ad and will convert ultimately to testosterone hence why 4-ad “can” suffice as a test base
BlockBuilder
Well-known member
Why on earth would anyone want to even risk the possibility of not recovering? That aspect will never make sense to me. I don’t think it’s worth taking that risk. SERMs are way too easy to get and cheap
Georgiepecker
Active member
I agree and they are easy to get. However it IS a false notion to say that he has now f***** himself! It’s possible yes, but it is not always the case. Any time you play with hormones and come off of gear you should do a PCT. it is wreckless and stupid not to, but it IS very possible to recover fine without it.
BBiceps
Well-known member
Sure, but OP wanted to “recover and keep his gains” with 4-ad and his OTC PCT at 1 cap a day, can he recover? Maybe. Will he keep his gains? No, he will not.
Stop trying to be a knight in shining armor, this DMZ cycle is not well planned. This kid have no idea what he’s doing and you’re not helping
brofessorx
Well-known member
Yea, I’m super nice! :banana:
brofessorx
Well-known member
You don’t need a serm for pct, you don’t even need to do a pct, you also don’t need to use tp to wipe your ass after taking a dump, you also don’t even need to wipe your ass, but it’s a great idea.
There’s no guarantee a person will recover from using a serm or pct protocol, once the drugs stop, everything could crash and go to shiit. Then you’ll know for sure If you’ve permanently f-ed up your htpga system.
There’s no guarantee a person will recover from using a serm or pct protocol, once the drugs stop, everything could crash and go to shiit. Then you’ll know for sure If you’ve permanently f-ed up your htpga system.
toddmuelheim
Well-known member
Very well put