Anyone here have optimal (>5-700 ng/dl) test levels after multiple steroid cycles?

I wish that would work but I can't self medicate as AAS is illegal where I am and would have serious repercussions professionally due to the field I'm in if I were caught ordering.

However, the upshot though is I know I won't be going back to the way things were before getting clomid (trying all these herbs that don't really do much, still feeling crappy, ED, anxiety etc.) It'll have to be clomid cycles or TRT, we'll just have to see in the next few months.
 
Justlooking5 said:
I wish that would work but I can't self medicate as AAS is illegal where I am and would have serious repercussions professionally due to the field I'm in if I were caught ordering.

However, the upshot though is I know I won't be going back to the way things were before getting clomid (trying all these herbs that don't really do much, still feeling crappy, ED, anxiety etc.) It'll have to be clomid cycles or TRT, we'll just have to see in the next few months.
Click to expand...

Try dhea/prenenolone 25mg each daily. Great for energy, mood, anxiety, libido.
 
brofessorx said:
I'd just self medicate. That's the cheapest option.
A 10ml vial of test c is about 30$.
1/2ml 2x per week (200mg/week) and that'll last you 9.5 weeks or so.
7 vials for 210 and you've got over a years worth of test c
Click to expand...

Gotta find it first :/
 
btur2915 said:
Try dhea/prenenolone 25mg each daily. Great for energy, mood, anxiety, libido.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I actually just started DHEA at 50mg 1x/week based on some stuff I read about it increasing free test etc. I may look into taking a daily dose, I've just read things about aromitzation with DHEA and minimal test increase in males longer term.

Also, something I'm coming to understand... if you have low testosterone and associated symptoms, you can try X, Y, and Z supp to help with the symptoms (X for energy, Y for mood, etc.), but it just works better if you simply get your testosterone levels back, because it fixes the root problem and other associated symptoms like ED, joints, etc. And sometimes only prescription drugs may be able to do that.
I can already tell the clomid is working better than any of the herbs/zinc etc. I was using and I've tried a LOT of OTC supps.

And, you get better gains with higher test levels.
 
Justlooking5 said:
Thanks, I actually just started DHEA at 50mg 1x/week based on some stuff I read about it increasing free test etc. I may look into taking a daily dose, I've just read things about aromitzation with DHEA and minimal test increase in males longer term.

Also, something I'm coming to understand... if you have low testosterone and associated symptoms, you can try X, Y, and Z supp to help with the symptoms (X for energy, Y for mood, etc.), but it just works better if you simply get your testosterone levels back, because it fixes the root problem and other associated symptoms like ED, joints, etc. And sometimes only prescription drugs may be able to do that.
I can already tell the clomid is working better than any of the herbs/zinc etc. I was using and I've tried a LOT of OTC supps.

And, you get better gains with higher test levels.
Click to expand...

50mg at one time will just cause an estrogen spike. A good dose would be 25mg once daily. Clomid will certainly work at elevating tests but comes with its own mental sides for many people. The goal of the dhea is not to increase t but rather give your body the hormones it needs to function properly while supplementing with something else like clomid or test.

Dr. Crisler (very popular trt specialist) refers to it as "backfilling the pathways". Amazing how something so simple could have such a big impact.
 
btur2915 said:
50mg at one time will just cause an estrogen spike. A good dose would be 25mg once daily. Clomid will certainly work at elevating tests but comes with its own mental sides for many people. The goal of the dhea is not to increase t but rather give your body the hormones it needs to function properly while supplementing with something else like clomid or test.

Dr. Crisler (very popular trt specialist) refers to it as "backfilling the pathways". Amazing how something so simple could have such a big impact.
Click to expand...

Thanks I'll look into it more. Rational for 50mg 1x/week is a study that showed when men took it 12 hours before HIIT session their free T increased by 90% which didn't happen in control groups. So prior to starting clomid I was taking it the night before an a.m. cardio session
 
Also isn't 200-250mg per week a little higher than TRT dose, what range would that out you at after around 2-3 months.
 
paul56778 said:
Also isn't 200-250mg per week a little higher than TRT dose, what range would that out you at after around 2-3 months.
Click to expand...

Yea I think 100mg is closer to trt, but that's the extra you pay for, monitoring, etc,
It'd be tough, but I'd be happy with 200/week.
 
brofessorx said:
And not get some crappy UG lab stuff but pharmaceutical quality if possible.
Click to expand...

Lulz.
Click to expand...

You think so? When I first cycled I bought pharma grade amps for my first two cycles (sust/test E, deca, etc.) and had good results and though I started to have some low test symptoms in between after coming off, nothing too noticeable or significant.

My last cycle I got some UGL test E from a buddy of mine who ordered it online. It was after this cycle that I really had major problems. I basically got pretty sick with serious water retention, severe excema I had to get medicine for, joint pain, depression. I never had excema period prior to that or since about a year after coming off that cycle. And it was after this cycle that I had persistent problems and low test.

Sure, I also came off using an OTC supp (ATD), and I think that was part of it, but I also am inclined to think that sh*tty and perhaps contaminated UG lab test I used also had something to do with how badly my body reacted. I never had any of those problems coming off gear before.

Personally I would not ever buy UG lab gear if at all possible. I know it's cheaper and more available.

Read this article about the conditions of some UG labs: Invalid Link Removed

Do you really think the people making that crap give a sh*t about your health (especially when they are criminal cartels manufacturing other stuff like meth etc.)?

Unless you're making it yourself you have no idea about the conditions, raw material (from China) quality, or even what contaminants might be in your vial.

Personally I think it is always better to try to get sealed pharma ampules where you can verify the batch number as we used to do. I never had issues doing that, it wasn't until using a UG lab product that I had multiple persistent health issues.
 
Justlooking5 said:
You think so? When I first cycled I bought pharma grade amps for my first two cycles (sust/test E, deca, etc.) and had good results and though I started to have some low test symptoms in between after coming off, nothing too noticeable or significant.

My last cycle I got some UGL test E from a buddy of mine who ordered it online. It was after this cycle that I really had major problems. I basically got pretty sick with serious water retention, severe excema I had to get medicine for, joint pain, depression. I never had excema period prior to that or since about a year after coming off that cycle. And it was after this cycle that I had persistent problems and low test.

Sure, I also came off using an OTC supp (ATD), and I think that was part of it, but I also am inclined to think that sh*tty and perhaps contaminated UG lab test I used also had something to do with how badly my body reacted. I never had any of those problems coming off gear before.

Personally I would not ever buy UG lab gear if at all possible. I know it's cheaper and more available.

Read this article about the conditions of some UG labs: Invalid Link Removed

Do you really think the people making that crap give a sh*t about your health (especially when they are criminal cartels manufacturing other stuff like meth etc.)?

Unless you're making it yourself you have no idea about the conditions, raw material (from China) quality, or even what contaminants might be in your vial.

Personally I think it is always better to try to get sealed pharma ampules where you can verify the batch number as we used to do. I never had issues doing that, it wasn't until using a UG lab product that I had multiple persistent health issues.
Click to expand...

All I'd ask was did your buddy have problems too?
All I've used is ug stuff and had my pops use as well. Never any issues.
If both y'all had problems, that sucks for getting shtty gear.

I'll keep paying my 25-30 bucks for 10ml of test p, e, & c
Just like ordering supps, you gotta research the company, read a number of reviews, and talk to others using the products.
You wouldn't just buy supps from some random, unknown company would you?
 
brofessorx said:
All I'd ask was did your buddy have problems too?
All I've used is ug stuff and had my pops use as well. Never any issues.
If both y'all had problems, that sucks for getting shtty gear.

I'll keep paying my 25-30 bucks for 10ml of test p, e, & c
Just like ordering supps, you gotta research the company, read a number of reviews, and talk to others using the products.
You wouldn't just buy supps from some random, unknown company would you?
Click to expand...

I lost contact with him and never had the chance to ask him, but when I did check with him on facebook I did notice he has to use a sleep apnea machine and actually did not look all that healthy psychologically from his pics, but who knows what the causes are. He's still on gear I can tell.

You get what you pay for right? I'm not trying to convince you not to use UG gear, but I would suggest generally that people try to get pharma grade sealed ampules with batch #s you can verify from trusted sources if possible. I did not have the same type of issues even remotely when that is what I used.

The fact is, with UG gear, you have no idea what the conditions of the lab are, who is making it, what's really in it (+ what contaminants), or whether the quality will be consistent. And I don't think you can assume scrupulous, careful, sterile, "health of the consumer in mind," practices from people running illegal drug labs. It's a gamble for sure. At least with sealed amps it's more likely these are pharma grade products.

Has anyone ever seen a COA from an independent lab for any UG product? How about for each batch? Do the labs run a COA on the chinese powders they get to make sure they are clean and free of contaminants even if the UG labs themselves are sterile?

And no, I don't buy supps from random unknown companies either.
 
well, nothing you're saying is untrue. I've never had an issue, and numerous others use ug gear with no issues everyday. Some do.
You have a lot of worry, I wonder if your reasoning for caution also applies to other things in life. Like, You don't go outside because it's dangerous an a number of possible threats to your health and safety could happen.
It's illegal, it's risky, but if you're lucky, you can find a good source, and enjoy.
Good luck, hopefully things get squared away for you.
I'll post this in case you're interested in aromatase inhibitors for your treatment.
Invalid Link Removed
 
rtmilburn said:
This is not true for it technically to be legal you have to be a licensed researcher(may I used the wrong term but it something along this line)
Click to expand...

That's what I said, for research purposes only. Then I alluded to what would happen if ordering for personal reason when ordering a small amount and when ordering several K. I didnt type it clear enough I suppose.
 
hardknock said:
That's what I said, for research purposes only. Then I alluded to what would happen if ordering for personal reason when ordering a small amount and when ordering several K. I didnt type it clear enough I suppose.
Click to expand...

Well saying how none of are are licensed researchers your point is mute.
 
I tend to buy UGL from brewers who use the very same gear they sell me. So, Im assuming their sterility protocols are common between us (ie they dont have sh1tty practices for the gear they sell, and then the gear they keep for themselves is brewed seperately using high standards).

I also obviously assume that they have some sterility protocols in the first place.

Thanks for reading my anecdote.
 
Justlooking5 said:
I wish that would work but I can't self medicate as AAS is illegal where I am and would have serious repercussions professionally due to the field I'm in if I were caught ordering.

However, the upshot though is I know I won't be going back to the way things were before getting clomid (trying all these herbs that don't really do much, still feeling crappy, ED, anxiety etc.) It'll have to be clomid cycles or TRT, we'll just have to see in the next few months.
Click to expand...

Ive come to the conclusion via reactionary episodes and bloodwork, the past 10 years, that OTC formulas just do not give satisfactory results. There are awesome companies that make great products but in terms of testosterone, personally, no strong results.
 
brofessorx said:
All I'd ask was did your buddy have problems too?
All I've used is ug stuff and had my pops use as well. Never any issues.
If both y'all had problems, that sucks for getting shtty gear.

I'll keep paying my 25-30 bucks for 10ml of test p, e, & c
Just like ordering supps, you gotta research the company, read a number of reviews, and talk to others using the products.
You wouldn't just buy supps from some random, unknown company would you?
Click to expand...

Major issue I had with most UGLs was not contamination but lack of quality as in under dosed as hell. Some are good to deal with but they are few and far between.
 
rtmilburn said:
Well saying how none of are are licensed researchers your point is mute.
Click to expand...

Im not sure what you typed but what do you mean none are researchers? There's a lot of people whom sell them legally with legal research "facilities" even though they are not selling it for research. They lie, but im not sure what you're talking about.

He asked is it illegal I said if you're a researcher no. Then i was on to ANOTHER topic and I said if you order a small amount no one is going to give any care but if you're ordering Ks of powder from china you will end up in serious trouble.

Thats all I was saying. I wasnt saying some random person can get caught selling and just claim "for research" and get out of trouble. Thats it. Sorry for the confusion.
 
hardknock said:
Ive come to the conclusion via reactionary episodes and bloodwork, the past 10 years, that OTC formulas just do not give satisfactory results. There are awesome companies that make great products but in terms of testosterone, personally, no strong results.
Click to expand...

I agree. Since 2015 I have been actively trying to raise my testosterone levels, knowing I had the AAS induced low test. I've tried among the following for the past 2 years:

-Longjack 100:1 (multiple brands), D-Aspartic Acid, ZMA, KSM-66, Tocotrienols (i.e., Toco-8 like product), probiotics, high fat diet, high dose vitamin D, Shilajit, intermittent fasting, etc.

I've been on clomid 25mg/day for 3 days and I already feel way better than I did on any of the stuff above. I think in some cases, especially when you have low test caused by medication (i.e., AAS), only medication is sufficient to really get you feeling better.

I do know already though that I'm not going back to the way it was before (trying without results to get my levels up via OTC only products and still having constant issues). From now on I'll either be doing clomid or TRT... and of course the eventual thing will be TRT as I won't be taking clomid for the next 40 years, but for now clomid seems to be working very well, better than I was expecting actually.
 
Well I can provide an update on my own experience.

I saw my urologist 4 weeks ago this week (5/31) and have been on clomid 25mg/day since 5/03. Thus far, I've experienced an almost total remission of my chronic fatigue and anxiety, as well as a major improvement in overall mood and mood stability (i.e., don't get down really easily like before).

I also, after literally not having ANY morning wood even one day for as long as I can remember, am now getting a.m. erections about once every other day.

-I can also say that I never got anywhere near this level of improvement from ANY OTC test boosters/combinations I tried. Not even like 1/4th the degree of improvement compare to clomid.

That said, I have also noticed some issues with blurred vision, some "weepy" feelings, and my sex drive while decent still feels blunted.

In the next few weeks I'm going to be working on starting TRT and seeing how that compares with clomid monotherapy, as well as how it affects my overall wellbeing and blood work (hematocrit/hemo, lipids etc.).

I feel clomid is certainly much better than nothing, or anything OTC, but given I have realized I'll be on some kind of treatment for testosterone (TRT or clomid) forever now, I'm thinking there isn't necessarily a clear reason to stay on clomid when I'll inevitably have to switch to TRT at some point, and why risk the vision issues and deal with the other negatives of clomid.

I'll be 35 in a few weeks also, about 12 years since my last AAS cycle.
 
Justlooking5 said:
Well I can provide an update on my own experience.

I saw my urologist 4 weeks ago this week (5/31) and have been on clomid 25mg/day since 5/03. Thus far, I've experienced an almost total remission of my chronic fatigue and anxiety, as well as a major improvement in overall mood and mood stability (i.e., don't get down really easily like before).

I also, after literally not having ANY morning wood even one day for as long as I can remember, am now getting a.m. erections about once every other day.

-I can also say that I never got anywhere near this level of improvement from ANY OTC test boosters/combinations I tried. Not even like 1/4th the degree of improvement compare to clomid.

That said, I have also noticed some issues with blurred vision, some "weepy" feelings, and my sex drive while decent still feels blunted.

In the next few weeks I'm going to be working on starting TRT and seeing how that compares with clomid monotherapy, as well as how it affects my overall wellbeing and blood work (hematocrit/hemo, lipids etc.).

I feel clomid is certainly much better than nothing, or anything OTC, but given I have realized I'll be on some kind of treatment for testosterone (TRT or clomid) forever now, I'm thinking there isn't necessarily a clear reason to stay on clomid when I'll inevitably have to switch to TRT at some point, and why risk the vision issues and deal with the other negatives of clomid.

I'll be 35 in a few weeks also, about 12 years since my last AAS cycle.
Click to expand...

I once knew a guy that use 12.5 mg clomid every 3 days w/.25mg letrozole every 3 days for over 2 years. His test levels adjusted from lower 400 to upper 850's. I cant exactly remember but I think his estro stayed in the lower range as well.

But the main thing is his vision stabilized about 10 days after he quit. I don't remember why he finally stoppped? He got accepted into the fbi cyber division or something like that. That may have had something to do with it. Its been several years since I spoke with him.
 
Justlooking5 said:
Well I can provide an update on my own experience.

I saw my urologist 4 weeks ago this week (5/31) and have been on clomid 25mg/day since 5/03. Thus far, I've experienced an almost total remission of my chronic fatigue and anxiety, as well as a major improvement in overall mood and mood stability (i.e., don't get down really easily like before).

I also, after literally not having ANY morning wood even one day for as long as I can remember, am now getting a.m. erections about once every other day.

-I can also say that I never got anywhere near this level of improvement from ANY OTC test boosters/combinations I tried. Not even like 1/4th the degree of improvement compare to clomid.

That said, I have also noticed some issues with blurred vision, some "weepy" feelings, and my sex drive while decent still feels blunted.

In the next few weeks I'm going to be working on starting TRT and seeing how that compares with clomid monotherapy, as well as how it affects my overall wellbeing and blood work (hematocrit/hemo, lipids etc.).

I feel clomid is certainly much better than nothing, or anything OTC, but given I have realized I'll be on some kind of treatment for testosterone (TRT or clomid) forever now, I'm thinking there isn't necessarily a clear reason to stay on clomid when I'll inevitably have to switch to TRT at some point, and why risk the vision issues and deal with the other negatives of clomid.

I'll be 35 in a few weeks also, about 12 years since my last AAS cycle.
Click to expand...

That sucks to hear the vision blur is that problematic. I was really hoping to see a big turn around. And honestly was wishing a permanent rehab after long time. I get the vision crap at 25mg and up but it's more of a delay in focus that takes few seconds to change focus instead of instant. under 25mg still there but barely noticeable. I also see the logic if you really now that you'll be taking something for HRT forever. I hope TRT does the trick. I know guys that it changed their life for the better in a big way just don't let TRT doc low ball you on Test mg no pun intended.
 
Have you given thought to Nolvadex as an alternative to Clomid? MG for MG more potent than clomid. You may get away with as little as 5-10mg ED. I know Nolvadex has been shown to cause fatty liver in women when used continuously at doses of 20mg or more for several years. The point being they were running at high doses. I agree that OTC test boosters don't compare to serms.
 
Justlooking5 said:
Well I can provide an update on my own experience.

I saw my urologist 4 weeks ago this week (5/31) and have been on clomid 25mg/day since 5/03. Thus far, I've experienced an almost total remission of my chronic fatigue and anxiety, as well as a major improvement in overall mood and mood stability (i.e., don't get down really easily like before).

I also, after literally not having ANY morning wood even one day for as long as I can remember, am now getting a.m. erections about once every other day.

-I can also say that I never got anywhere near this level of improvement from ANY OTC test boosters/combinations I tried. Not even like 1/4th the degree of improvement compare to clomid.

That said, I have also noticed some issues with blurred vision, some "weepy" feelings, and my sex drive while decent still feels blunted.

In the next few weeks I'm going to be working on starting TRT and seeing how that compares with clomid monotherapy, as well as how it affects my overall wellbeing and blood work (hematocrit/hemo, lipids etc.).

I feel clomid is certainly much better than nothing, or anything OTC, but given I have realized I'll be on some kind of treatment for testosterone (TRT or clomid) forever now, I'm thinking there isn't necessarily a clear reason to stay on clomid when I'll inevitably have to switch to TRT at some point, and why risk the vision issues and deal with the other negatives of clomid.

I'll be 35 in a few weeks also, about 12 years since my last AAS cycle.
Click to expand...

Give enclomid a try, no estro isomer sides. At all. I think there are a number of research places stocking it in the us these days
 
ericos_bob said:
Have you given thought to Nolvadex as an alternative to Clomid? MG for MG more potent than clomid. You may get away with as little as 5-10mg ED. I know Nolvadex has been shown to cause fatty liver in women when used continuously at doses of 20mg or more for several years. The point being they were running at high doses. I agree that OTC test boosters don't compare to serms.
Click to expand...

Many of men have used as little as 12.5 every 3 days/clomid and have equally raised their testosterone verses 25mg/day.

I dont know if an equal ratio of Nolvadex will result in the same outcome. Are there any studies?
 
What is the highest levels of natty T you could achieve that is attainable using Clomid or Nolvadex when in between cycles to use as a bridge to prevent ever dropping below the normal test ranges and without being on TRT or Blast and Cruising.
 
hardknock said:
Many of men have used as little as 12.5 every 3 days/clomid and have equally raised their testosterone verses 25mg/day.

I dont know if an equal ratio of Nolvadex will result in the same outcome. Are there any studies?
Click to expand...

I have so many Clomid tabs leftover that I may try this. I always got terrible headaches at 25mg a day, so I am a little worried about using it at all. Plus, I am already having high estrogen issues so I would need to pick up more Aromasin.

I may just save this for my next trip to the doctor in a couple months. Lol
 
rascal14 said:
I have so many Clomid tabs leftover that I may try this. I always got terrible headaches at 25mg a day, so I am a little worried about using it at all. Plus, I am already having high estrogen issues so I would need to pick up more Aromasin.

I may just save this for my next trip to the doctor in a couple months. Lol
Click to expand...

This might not work the same for you, and there was a thread discussing why my BW had these results; TT 1170, FT 87 on 6-25 scale, E2 was the exact lowest number in norm 14, LH in low 20's think but just higher than norm, SBHG, 6.5 on 8-20 scale but here is my protocol:

clomid 12.5 e3d, Nettle extract 50:1 2g ed, (nettle has low AI and also lowers SHBG) That's all hormonal stuff. I would like another person to have similar positive results so it can be confirmed as a good mix so I'll just throw out what else I took Adam Munlti vite ed, D-3 50,000iu 2x week, guarana 4g ed, Liver detox 2 caps ed, Omega 3, Tramadol, Baclofen, Effexor,

I will do this as a prepcycle for a month before next cycle. NAC might think of a mathematical way to compare this to Natty training so I might actually do it for longer. It's such an interesting topic that I'm up for experimenting to find out more.
 
FRITZBLITZ said:
This might not work the same for you, and there was a thread discussing why my BW had these results; TT 1170, FT 87 on 6-25 scale, E2 was the exact lowest number in norm 14, LH in low 20's think but just higher than norm, SBHG, 6.5 on 8-20 scale but here is my protocol:

clomid 12.5 e3d, Nettle extract 50:1 2g ed, (nettle has low AI and also lowers SHBG) That's all hormonal stuff. I would like another person to have similar positive results so it can be confirmed as a good mix so I'll just throw out what else I took Adam Munlti vite ed, D-3 50,000iu 2x week, guarana 4g ed, Liver detox 2 caps ed, Omega 3, Tramadol, Baclofen, Effexor,

I will do this as a prepcycle for a month before next cycle. NAC might think of a mathematical way to compare this to Natty training so I might actually do it for longer. It's such an interesting topic that I'm up for experimenting to find out more.
Click to expand...

Were you using the tramadol for depression or spinal issues?

I was thinking of using ENclomid which shows little to no estro aggravation, well using it 12.5 every 3 days w/letrozole .25 e3d. Run it probably 6-8 weeks just to see where things land. Currently im not motivated to do anything now with two tragic situations im experiencing right now for a couple of friends.
 
hardknock said:
Were you using the tramadol for depression or spinal issues?

I was thinking of using ENclomid which shows little to no estro aggravation, well using it 12.5 every 3 days w/letrozole .25 e3d. Run it probably 6-8 weeks just to see where things land. Currently im not motivated to do anything now with two tragic situations im experiencing right now for a couple of friends.
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Tramadol and Baclofen cuz I had a major reconstruction of my right leg. Effexor for deppression.

Dont' take the wrong way but. Your traumatic experience can fukk up your T levels. I have a few bros that have PTSD bad from their TODs and I suggested to a few to get T levels checked and they were low. Along with your Enclomid dosing try researching mental stress effects on T levels, to fully treat the whole problem. Also I wish someone would buy some bulk nettle extract to see if they get crazy FT levels like I did.
 
paul56778 said:
1170 is past high normal, how did you feel whilst at that level.
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Not really a large change even though from 690 TT base to 1170 is almost 100% increase. Felt more positive but that's about all. Maybe if I kept the run going it would have had more effect.
 
FRITZBLITZ said:
Not really a large change even though from 690 TT base to 1170 is almost 100% increase. Felt more positive but that's about all. Maybe if I kept the run going it would have had more effect.
Click to expand...

I am definitely starting to look into stress as a huge factor as well as depression (even when we are unaware of an acute case). Reason being, if higher testosterone was the main problem solver more people would have a magnitude of benefits when they are able to raise their levels above or near 1000. But what I have seen over the years is that many do not really feel that much better or ill say its less significant.
 
Just had my blood work done, 4 months post cycle, after using Clomid and Nolva, 2 months OL k1ngsblood and 2 months OL Test1fy, and using BLR letrone, results were not good, i have been dieting for past 14 weeks, first 6 were keto during the PCT window to support test levels by having large amounts of saturated fats, also i have only had 3 re-feeds in past 14 weeks and they have only possibly gone over maintenance caloric levels by a max of 1000 calories and fat has been kept under 50 grams for each of them.

past 8 weeks have been PSMF, which has been harsh but has worked well and strength loss and overall muscle mass appears to be minimal which has been great considering my low caloric intake of around 1k calories per day for past 8 weeks. nearly 9th is finished this Sunday.

I have been feeling quite down lately and sex drive and libido have been shot as well as suffering from lack of morning wood and slightED, general disinterest in sex, the confusing part is my reading came back at 200.

200 from my understanding is low as **** and not good at all, so how come i have been able to maintain intensity in workouts and not appear to have lost mass amounts of muscle, this has me confused.
 
paul56778 said:
Just had my blood work done, 4 months post cycle, after using Clomid and Nolva, 2 months OL k1ngsblood and 2 months OL Test1fy, and using BLR letrone, results were not good, i have been dieting for past 14 weeks, first 6 were keto during the PCT window to support test levels by having large amounts of saturated fats, also i have only had 3 re-feeds in past 14 weeks and they have only possibly gone over maintenance caloric levels by a max of 1000 calories and fat has been kept under 50 grams for each of them.

past 8 weeks have been PSMF, which has been harsh but has worked well and strength loss and overall muscle mass appears to be minimal which has been great considering my low caloric intake of around 1k calories per day for past 8 weeks. nearly 9th is finished this Sunday.

I have been feeling quite down lately and sex drive and libido have been shot as well as suffering from lack of morning wood and slightED, general disinterest in sex, the confusing part is my reading came back at 200.

200 from my understanding is low as **** and not good at all, so how come i have been able to maintain intensity in workouts and not appear to have lost mass amounts of muscle, this has me confused.
Click to expand...
I wonder if your serms were fake as those numbers are low. Do you have any numbers to compare that with?
 
rtmilburn said:
Hummm that is weird. What was the cycle? Have you been sick at all?
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Cycle was mix of Test Tren, and Tr3st, i have not been sick and have felt fine gym wise, just low on sex drive and function is only noticeable effects and depression and poor mood / brain fog.
 
paul56778 said:
Cycle was mix of Test Tren, and Tr3st, i have not been sick and have felt fine gym wise, just low on sex drive and function is only noticeable effects and depression and poor mood / brain fog.
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Oh trest and tren that's a rough cycle. I would give yourself 2 months break, from anything hormonal even otc tboosters, and try another PCT. And see how your doing then
 
paul56778 said:
Cycle was mix of Test Tren, and Tr3st, i have not been sick and have felt fine gym wise, just low on sex drive and function is only noticeable effects and depression and poor mood / brain fog.
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Im sure there are other contributing factors specific to you going on here but I also know that some guys take upwards of 6 months to properly recover from trest. I remember that guy criticalbench experiencing this.
 
Has anyone here tried opioid modulation in conjunction with either an AI or better yet SERM on cycle to prevent HPTA suppression while utilizing non-19nor compounds? The idea has been around for years so I'd expect someone to have experimented with a protocol. Found this to be a good read to those unfamiliar
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paul56778 said:
Just had my blood work done, 4 months post cycle, after using Clomid and Nolva, 2 months OL k1ngsblood and 2 months OL Test1fy, and using BLR letrone, results were not good, i have been dieting for past 14 weeks, first 6 were keto during the PCT window to support test levels by having large amounts of saturated fats, also i have only had 3 re-feeds in past 14 weeks and they have only possibly gone over maintenance caloric levels by a max of 1000 calories and fat has been kept under 50 grams for each of them.

past 8 weeks have been PSMF, which has been harsh but has worked well and strength loss and overall muscle mass appears to be minimal which has been great considering my low caloric intake of around 1k calories per day for past 8 weeks. nearly 9th is finished this Sunday.

I have been feeling quite down lately and sex drive and libido have been shot as well as suffering from lack of morning wood and slightED, general disinterest in sex, the confusing part is my reading came back at 200.

200 from my understanding is low as **** and not good at all, so how come i have been able to maintain intensity in workouts and not appear to have lost mass amounts of muscle, this has me confused.
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I am going to through some ideas that might be silly but can work. I think the major culprit might be the Trest. Not to scare you but I would read into the studies for using Trest as chemical castration would more inform you how it effects the testes. If the clomid is legit than it may be a waiting game for how suppressive trest can be. A lot of endos reference testes like deisel locomotive engine, so if they were so suppressed the first 4-6 weeks of SARMs might have been sending a start signal to an ice cold engine. This might be worse if you used HCG in high dose, cuz HCG can over stimulate leydigs. I would put all the bad thoughts about BW out of your head and just start from today. For labido I would force yourself to rub it out everyday. The less you use it the more you lose it. I have had to do this in PCT and it works. If you can get some insight on the effect of trest on testes and add to your plan of attack great. I would take 2 weeks off everything except 150mg of Zinc, 5000iu of D-3, and max RDA of vite A, E, C, mangnesium , calcium, chromium, selenium. I would log all your stuff for 2 weeks [right now I'm logging to find out HB level post meals] then prepare a 6 week PCT as if youre just about to end cycle. DON'T LET NEGATIVE IDEAS flood in. I bet with a better understanding of Trest you can PCT more effectivly. BTW I'm 33 so morning wood is half mast when I get it so just focus on sex drive and function.
 
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