Orig1n and FD2 for a cut or recomp?

JPARKS42 said:
br1ck_Sh1thouse I can definitely keep you updated. So far I'm quite pleased, I'm going to start eating a bit cleaner as well, I've just been enjoying those new big cup Reeses with the Reeses pieces in them and a Donuts a bit more than I should :) guessing I'm at maybe 15 or 16% body fat. Usually I'm around 12 or 13. I don't plan on cutting until April though, I just need to stop enjoying myself so much haha
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Damn now I need to live through you, donuts.....

Or if xtyler would hurry up and make that sup3r-donut that GNO keeps promising!
 
Oh, heyyy. What did I miss? Was there a p1ssing match and it's just too late? I brought protein brownies. :D
 
justhere4comm said:
Oh, heyyy. What did I miss? Was there a p1ssing match and it's just too late? I brought protein brownies. :D
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The "oh heyy" and your avatar have me cracking up over here... but you take your protein brownies outta here, the storm just settled, I can't take another. Unless those brownies have some other "natural ingredients" in which we can all use to promote love, happiness and good vibes ;)
 
muscleupcrohn said:
I don't think that these drugs, legal or not, are too good for anyone's health, haha.
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Hahaha! Well, a young human body is pretty resilient - especially if you train and eat/supplement right. 30 years ago I smoked the State of North Carolina and drank the state of Kentucky - every month. If I tried that now, I'd be dead :D
 
jt75 said:
Wasting your time with or1gin, 8 week run yielded nothing for me.
No strength gain, no body recomping effects, no improved sleep, nothing.
Poor extracts of some rikkun****o herbs that's all, then reps try to justify it by questioning my training and diet etc.
I'm sorry but that's insulting, I've said it doesn't work for me so just accept that.
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Or1gin did absolutely nothing for me either.
 
Br1ck_Sh1thouse said:
So for anyone that's tried BOTH orig1n and mk, how do they compare in both pros and cons? Does orig1n have the same sides?
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Legit MK-677 (a drug) absolutely raises serum GH and IGF-1, as measured in studies, and blood work by users that have had it measured (10 and 310 in one mid-forties user).

Reading the original Origin thread, you can see that they are relying on something to happen at the receptor *irrespective* of serum levels of IGF-1. See:

"A brief yet extremely important note.

A substantial increase in serum IGF-1 is certainly useful and welcome, but I'd like you all to consider Or1gin's main strength:

-Increased IGF-1 signalling at its receptors (this is why we use a very large dose of Atractlylodin). Stronger anabolic stimulus by IGF-1 even without any variation in -serum- IGF-1 level"

"I assume not, but I guess it doesn't hurt to ask the source. Any bloodwork?"

"No, because as XTyler alluded to in his post it is not a useful measure of the pathways that Or1gin targets."
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Here is some info on the GH/IGF-1 relationship:

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The Relationship between IGF-1 and Growth Hormone

As we further explore what is IGF, the relationship between Insulin Growth Factor 1 and growth hormone become quite clear:

IGF-1 is produced in the body’s different tissues and liver based on the level of growth hormone that is secreted into the bloodstream
The measurements of IGF-1 are related to the measurements of GH
IGF-1 regulates the effects of growth hormone in the body

The testing that is used by doctors specializing in hormone replacement therapy is a measurement of IGF-1 levels, because this essential chemical messenger remains in the bloodstream throughout the day, whereas GH enters in rapid bursts and leaves as quickly as it can deliver its crucial signals."
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"Growth hormone is made in the anterior pituitary gland, is released into the blood stream, and then stimulates the liver to produce IGF-1. IGF-1 then stimulates systemic body growth, and has growth-promoting effects on almost every cell in the body, especially skeletal muscle, cartilage, bone, liver, kidney, nerves, skin, hematopoietic cell, and lungs. In addition to the insulin-like effects, IGF-1 can also regulate cell growth and development, especially in nerve cells, as well as cellular DNA synthesis."
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Now, ask yourself how can it raise GH to any practical degree, without raising IGF-1? They are directly related, and IGF-1 is used as surrogate marker for GH production (See Dr. Rand McClain's recent GH/IGF-1 discussion on Muscle Insider's YouTube channel).

To get a "side" related to GH (water retention, etc...) it would have to raise GH, which would then increase IGF-1, and those increases would show up on a blood test.

Just like a GDA "mimic's" Insulin, I don't have a problem with a claim that the natural ingredients "mimic" IGF-1 and act on the receptor - but it's pretty clear, reading between the lines, that it doesn't increase serum levels of GH and IGF-1 to any degree that could be measured - therefore there is *NO* relation to the drug MK-677.
 
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