UG PHARMA SAVAGE CYCLE HELP

rayy188

New member
Good morning,

quick question, its been a while since i did a cycle, however is was only one compound. (5years) I'm 23 now.

with this stuff i just picked up at a local nutrition shop



UG PHARMA SAVAGE INGREDIENTS
______________________________ _______________________
Halodrol. 4-chloro-17a-methyl-andro-4-ene-3, 17b-diol 15mg

Max-LMG. 13-ethyl-3-methoxy-gona-2,5(10)dien-17-one 30mg

DMZ. 17b-hydroxy-2a,17b-dimethyl-5a-androstan-3,3'-azine 15mg

1,4,6-Androstatrien 3-17-dione 10mg
______________________________ _______________________


I did my research on the ingredients... how ever i want to get your opinion!

I'm also going to be taking



UG SAVAGE
2PILLS AM / 1PILL PM

ELEXIR RX LIVER SUPPORT
1PILLS AM / 1PILL PM (WITH PRO HORMONE)

MUSCLE TECH MULTIVITAMIN
1PILL AM / 1PILL NOON / 1PILL PM



however i am concerned with the dosage, UG SAVAGE seems to be very powerful, 3 pills a day for 4 weeks, doesn't that seem like ALOT?



ALSO FOR MY PCT I HAVE SOTO RED LABEL A-D-T 300mg (2pills AM/ 1 pill PM)

Is the PCT strong enough? should i take anything else during my cycle to avoid gyno?

i've got some feedback in another forum -

"to take TUDCA instead of the liver support i was going to use"


"to take nolvadex and DAA instead of the red label ADD because it will only further suppress you natural test since it contains 1 andr"



if you need anymore info please dont hesitate to ask.

thank you!
 
Additional info.

That's a stack of strong compounds. Ensure that you line up a pharma AI for on cycle and a SERM for PCT clomid/nolva combo is tried and true, or I and a few others have been liking toremifene as of late.

Definitely don't take anything else suppressive in PCT. I would take the DAA after your PCT if ever because the SERM will be boosting your test during PCT via negative feedback mechanism. The body is like a mechanical watch; one lever always most at least one other.

I'd suggest to do more research as well. Even though you said you did, if you had a 1andro product planned as part of your PCT and no SERM or AI lined up, you needed to do way more research.
 
saywutrly said:
That's a stack of strong compounds. Ensure that you line up a pharma AI for on cycle and a SERM for PCT clomid/nolva combo is tried and true, or I and a few others have been liking toremifene as of late.

Definitely don't take anything else suppressive in PCT. I would take the DAA after your PCT if ever because the SERM will be boosting your test during PCT via negative feedback mechanism. The body is like a mechanical watch; one lever always most at least one other.

I'd suggest to do more research as well. Even though you said you did, if you had a 1andro product planned as part of your PCT and no SERM or AI lined up, you needed to do way more research.
Click to expand...

Roger that.

thank you, going to look into finding some nolvadex and Al's

would Estrovade( Androst-3,5-dien-7,17-dione) be strong enough for a good PCT?

do you have any reliable sources?

2nd question: I have this other stuff i just found in storage called Double dragon SOS 500 + Double dragon 350 PCT , however it expired November of 2016.

Should i have any serious concerns taking it?
 
rayy188 said:
Roger that.

thank you, going to look into finding some nolvadex and Al's

would Estrovade( Androst-3,5-dien-7,17-dione) be strong enough for a good PCT?

do you have any reliable sources?

2nd question: I have this other stuff i just found in storage called Double dragon SOS 500 + Double dragon 350 PCT , however it expired November of 2016.

Should i have any serious concerns taking it?
Click to expand...

The nomenclature you posted for Estrovade is just Arimistane. It is an OTC AI that is not very effective. You need a real AI like Exemestane or Arimidex and a real SERM like Clomid or Nolva.

As far as a source, we can't post that here. Look around on the internet for a reliable overseas pharmacy or research chemical site.

The Double Dragon stuff should be fine. Just store it in a cool, dry place. Save it for another cycle though.
 
4 compounds, 3 of which are methyls, & 1 of which is a dimethyl, and you were planning on using an OTC PCT? I'm not familiar with the product even, but if it's another hormonal product that's not a SERM or AI, leave it out of PCT. You don't want any suppressive compounds in PCT. That defeats the purpose. Also, you'll want a lot of TUDCA on that cycle.
 
jathan_howe said:
4 compounds, 3 of which are methyls, & 1 of which is a dimethyl, and you were planning on using an OTC PCT? I'm not familiar with the product even, but if it's another hormonal product that's not a SERM or AI, leave it out of PCT. You don't want any suppressive compounds in PCT. That defeats the purpose. Also, you'll want a lot of TUDCA on that cycle.
Click to expand...

yeah man. that's what the guy at the nutrition shop with "30 years of experience" told me. He sold me all that stuff and said that's what he gives all his other customers. took his word for it.

thank god for the internet!

merry christmas everybody!
 
rayy188 said:
yeah man. that's what the guy at the nutrition shop with "30 years of experience" told me. He sold me all that stuff and said that's what he gives all his other customers. took his word for it.

thank god for the internet!

merry christmas everybody!
Click to expand...

No shame in getting fooled. When I was a mere 13, I ran intoa GNC and forked over a ton for Animal M-Stak, MuscleTech Clear Muscle, MHP Up Your Mass, expecting to be 20lbs heavier and shredded within a month
 
jathan_howe said:
No shame in getting fooled. When I was a mere 13, I ran intoa GNC and forked over a ton for Animal M-Stak, MuscleTech Clear Muscle, MHP Up Your Mass, expecting to be 20lbs heavier and shredded within a month
Click to expand...

So you're saying you weren't 20lbs heavier and ripped to shreds with that stack?
 
If you want to start with something more beginner-level, you can take that double dragon 500 with the other 1andro (looks like it shows as 1-DHEA on their label, which is a synonym) product, a cycle for which you could get by using the arimistane as your on-cycle (of course keeping a pharma AI on hand for unforeseen issues) and a test base such as 4 andro or transdermal DHEA. OL, BPS, and Alpha Gainz all have formidable TD DHEA products. No matter what, always use a SERM for PCT. I recommend toremifene, especially for the beginners or more basic cycles. It's much nicer to the body than clomid or nolva (some combine clomid [clomiphene] and nolva [tamoxifen] and run at lower dosing to avoid some side effects - this may be cheaper than torem, which requires quite high dosing.

You could get your feet wet on an andro cycle and then jump into that death stack. If you work and it works, you could have some great results. If you don't, at least your liver will be shredded from all the methyls. I can't believe that companies do these kitchen sink formulas like its the magic ticket. "okay so let's just throw in all the strongest, harshest, most dangerous non-compliant yet still technically legal compounds together and call it the stack to end all stacks; and your liver.

This is why our industry gets a bad name. The guy might be a protein powder expert for 30 years, but old hat has no clue about selling real steroids, which most of these are. Just not illegal. Around here they at least say stuff like "you'll want to search that on the internet for more advice" or "Oh yeah that's hardcore I haven't even tried it, so be sure you get online and do your research.

The problem is the store can't outright recommend that you order a SERM sold not for human consumption and consume it. Some hint hint hint that you need to put the rest of the puzzle together yourself, some choose to just push push push whatever **** their distributors handed them that month.

I have to say I'm happy you came here BEFORE getting halfway into this cycle and posting like "my urine is brown and it feels like a horse kicked me in the side, should I go to hospital? Here's the **** I took."

I second the TUDCA or UDCA. Search vigilantly as you will likely find a much better price with a little work. We can't source anyone who isn't a board sponsor even for real supps such as cycle support. On top of the TUDCA, for a stack of harsh methyls, I'd say to also run Liver Support XT by SNS, and the herbal prostate support and hawthorn berry for blood pressure from the well known S vitamin company.

These high methyl stacks seem cheaper per amount of "gainz" but you'll see the cost increases rapidly with all the support supps (TUDCA is the most expensive by far) needed to take them safely. This is why I started pinning.
 
starting for scratch:

During cycle

pharma savage 2pills am/ 1 pill pm
Liquid Letro 30mL 2.5mg/mL (.5ml a day)
Chloro-Heal (TUDCA 250mg) 1 pm/1 am

Post Cycle

Liquid Tamox 50mL 20mg/mL

week1 20ml
week2 20ml
week3 10ml
week4 10ml

after my PCT, what do i have to do to keep my estrogen from
rising ? i read that there's a big chance of it shooting up right after, is that true?


am i getting somewhere here? i appreciate all the help advice you guys have given me so far, keep it coming!!

there's obviously a lot more i have to learn...
 
rayy188 said:
starting for scratch:

During cycle

pharma savage 2pills am/ 1 pill pm
Liquid Letro 30mL 2.5mg/mL (.5ml a day)
Chloro-Heal (TUDCA 250mg) 1 pm/1 am

Post Cycle

Liquid Tamox 50mL 20mg/mL

week1 20ml
week2 20ml
week3 10ml
week4 10ml

after my PCT, what do i have to do to keep my estrogen from
rising ? i read that there's a big chance of it shooting up right after, is that true?


am i getting somewhere here? i appreciate all the help advice you guys have given me so far, keep it coming!!

there's obviously a lot more i have to learn...
Click to expand...

It's beginning to look a lot better. With that many methyls, some may suggest upping the TUDCA dose to 750mg or 1g
 
With those strong compounds, it is possible to have rebound estrogen issues. Most bros combat this by switching their letro or adex to a steroidal AI for the duration of PCT such as exemestane (Aromasin). I personally run the exem the whole way through.

That said, Letro is quite potent. You may consider keeping that on hand for any flareups of gyno or other estro symptoms and use something like adex or exemestane on cycle. That is, unless you are looking for the dryest possible Photoshop look. Letro will help you dry out to an extreme by almost eliminating estrogen. This comes with its own variable set of side effects, though.
 
Aside from that, looks quite good now if you're already stuck with that stack component. I'd be a proponent of keeping TUDCA where it is and then adding another highly dosed liver support twice a day such as Liver Assist XT (my personal favorite for the value), or just get some NAC to add on if you want to keep it even more economical.

Also ensure to be eating tons of green, preferably cruciferous vegetables, a couple gallons of water a day, and a generally clean diet with this. It wouldn't hurt to add a multivitamin and fish oil. Proper micronutrient support will be the best thing you can do for your body with harsh compounds.

Train like a beast and let us know about the gains or if you have any other questions. Good luck, brother.
 
rayy188 said:
would you recommend taking TUDCA. throughout my PCT, or would you say it's overkill?
Click to expand...

Best practice is to preload all your support supps by at least a couple weeks and then continue them for the duration of PCT.

Oh yeah, and with those compounds I would also grab hawthorn berries for blood pressure. Forgot that one.
 
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