HIT4ME
Well-known member
Maybe I need to do more research...but I haven't seen anything new coming from Canada. It could be that I'm unaware.
Donald Trump running for president
- Thread starter LiftWithDonuts
- Start date
Maybe I need to do more research...but I haven't seen anything new coming from Canada. It could be that I'm unaware.
Socalmk6gti
Active member
Actually one of the first cured HIV patients I ever read about was from and treated in Canada.
Socalmk6gti
Active member
Like we haven't covered every other damn topic under the sun LOL this thread is universal
youngandfree
Well-known member
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ax1
Legend
Canada has about 35 million people compared to some 300+ along with heavy immigration issues. Gets complicated with population. I wish Canada the best though.
HIT4ME
Well-known member
Come on man. That article is two years old. I'm sure by now the wait times are only twice as long as America. America has gained a lot of ground since Obamacare.
Gutterpump
Banned
Last time I had to wait in an emergency room in Jersey, I had to wait over 2hrs to see someone. Probably close to 3. Was no different as an emergency walk-in patient in Canada. Just my practical experience. I'm sure it's actually much worse in NYC than it is in say Toronto.
Gutterpump
Banned
In my experience, and I've been working in the US for 10 years now, healthcare is not so special here. I don't see any benefit to paying so much more for it here. Perhaps I've had to wait less for an MRI. What y'all have here is a case of greedy insurance companies, and a greedy government. I wish ya'll the best with that. I definitely wouldn't have moved here if it wasn't for a 6 figure salary. I don't see how people making less here can get by comfortably.
herderdude
Well-known member
Nobody has the output of American drug companies because nobody profits so handsomely from drug production. Seems most of the new drugs treat ailments that didn't exist when I was a kid (not that long ago, to be fair)
youngandfree
Well-known member
Because many people don't live in a communist state with the highest taxes in the country. Thats how.
Gutterpump
Banned
I find a lot of the cutting edge drugs are coming from Europe and Russia. I'm a long time lurker over at The Immortality Institute forum. Most of the new (interesting/cutting edge) drugs are being discussed over there.
The US pharma system is in business with keeping people sick.
The US pharma system is in business with keeping people sick.
ax1
Legend
You dont get what you pay for here, its overpriced and those things you talk about it are all game for the ca$$$$h. Alot of those costs are bureaucracies and government ponzi schemes the reason I dont want more of it.
Gutterpump
Banned
I can name any large city in any state and tell you that sub-100K will not be the most comfortable life, comparatively to other countries. I can also quote you several global QOL (quality of life) polls/studies but I honestly don't feel like it. I'm fairly certain it's common knowledge that QOL is lower in the US than most other developed countries.
youngandfree
Well-known member
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Number of patients leaving Canada for non emergency treatments continues to grow. Because the free healthcare in Canada is so awesome and perfect.
Number of patients leaving Canada for non emergency treatments continues to grow. Because the free healthcare in Canada is so awesome and perfect.
Gutterpump
Banned
Why are you baiting me into a Canada vs US debate?
ax1
Legend
Maybe things are a little better in the modern city of Toronto where Gutter is from?
Gutterpump
Banned
youngandree You've gotta be pretty fckin insecure if you're starting to argue that Canada's so ****ty Global stats don't lie how it's QOL is much higher. I'm only stating facts.
Gutterpump
Banned
youngandfree
Well-known member
youngandfree
Well-known member
Last I recall, you were leaving this post because everyone here is a child killing racist back woods hick that doesn't believe like you. You are the one touting the greatness of Canadian healthcare that's free. I'm pointing out facts that don't support your opinion.
youngandfree
Well-known member
HIT4ME
Well-known member
This is the point. The greedy, inefficient gov're in bed with insurance companies and drug companies Jack up prices. The system is not capitalistic, nor socialistic. It is a monopoly created by collusion .
No healthcare is free. Nothing is free. Our healthcare sucks because of govt intervention and insurance scams. And Obama care made it worse.
That is the point ...capitalism and profits create innovation. We have just eliminated the free market by making monopolies.
ax1
Legend
It sounds like a doctor shortage maybe....Ok I just looked and it looks like there is a lack of incentive in the medical field. Also I think having 35 million people in population it may be a factor, dunno. There seems to be alot of foreign immigration in the medical field in the US which is an advantage, but it all comes down to incentives.
One example Ill pull from an article in this link Invalid Link Removed
The average income after expenses, in U.S. dollars, for an orthopedic surgeon in the U.S. was $442,450, compared to $208,000 in Canada, $324,000 in the U.K. and $154,000 in France.
And this may show a contribution to the population and incentive to bring in foreign people in factor
What is more, the U.S. has twice as many orthopedic surgeons per capita, providing about 35% more hip replacements overall.
Here is for private care doctors
Primary-care physicians include family doctors, pediatricians, internal-medicine specialists and obstetrician-gynecologists. Those in the U.S. earned an average after expenses in 2008 of $186,582, versus $125,000 in Canada, $159,000 in Britain and just $92,000 in Australia.
Of course you would consider currency value along with cost of life as well. There there is income tax which off the top of my head I believe is much higher than in the US (paying for socialist healthcare.)
It seems to me its a incentive issue.
If it was me I would eliminate socialist healthcare in Canada and go free market. Also I would eliminate any concept of combining insurance and health care and make sure people know they are two distinct different entities to keep optional insurance costs much lower. Insurance is there just in case, other than that go to the doctor and pay cash or credit. Get rid of government meddling with the affairs of the doctors and patients.
ax1
Legend
Word!
Gutterpump
Banned
I agree with everything you said here and am not claiming healthcare is free. Taxes are much higher in Canada -they definitely pay for it, but overall, standard of living is higher too. I've lived there till 10 years ago, not sure if anyone else here has. I grew up in a town of 45,000, went to college and worked for 10 years in a city of 5M, so Ive lived in a range of various environments up there. There's pluses and minuses to living in both countries, not denying that.
HIT4ME
Well-known member
Gutterpump and I agree on something! /Thread
I don't doubt that some things in Canada are nicer than some things in the US. I mean, Somalia's weather would look good in the middle of a January snow storm in New England.
Part of the BIG issue in the US is that we have this mentality of, "It works there, it is what we should do!" and "What we are doing isn't working. Every other country is doing better. We need to do MORE of what we are already doing" and we think that is the solution. And we have lost sight of what made us a great country to begin with - Freedom and Capitalism (which go hand in hand, sorry).
Taxes are higher in Canada, but I bet the cost structure for living is also different. There are spots in the US that are better than other spots, simply because the cost of living is so much lower. Where I am, you can't find a place to live for under $300,000 and if you don't have that, you'll be paying more to rent every month than if you bought something. Gas and food is super expensive. And when those items drain your wallet to $0 - being forced to pay for health care isn't something anyone is happy about.
No one wants to admit it because we all have this image of the "evil" corporations - but capitalism and those corporations are part of America's greatness. The gov't is the same as any other evil corporation, except they don't have to produce anything in order to stay in business, they just have to establish a budget, under achieve on that budget, and get more next year.
Gutterpump
Banned
Invalid Link Removed
He's still keepin it classy
He's still keepin it classy
Socalmk6gti
Active member
I like this one better Invalid Link Removed
Gutterpump
Banned
Invalid Link Removed
This is a pretty good one too
This is a pretty good one too
Gutterpump
Banned
Socalmk6gti
Active member
Invalid Link Removed
He's still keepin it classy
I get your point but that was dated February...
ax1
Legend
They are sending another 250 sum special forces in Syria.
Also I noticed how they are referring to those syrian rebals as "The Syrian Army."
I say it all the time, outside of local polititions most of them dont give a crap about Americans.
HIT4ME
Well-known member
I like pictures and graphs like this. They are pretty, and I can't read, yet I still understand what they are saying.
Funny thing about those charts. They describe reality perfectly.
HIT4ME
Well-known member
Come on man. You are trying to tell me that there aren't enough doctors because there are not enough incentives!? Whaaa? This was supposed to be healthcare for all!
To a degree. I don't have so, so many issues with taking part in other countries' growth. I don't like the idea of committing troops unnecessarily when we have bombs that can send the message and not cost American lives. I know that conflicts with the civilian mentality, but I worry about Americans first.
I also see it as our responsibility, if we are a leader, to spread freedom and spread the seeds of liberal democracy.
And I sense the disagreements coming....
But, I do believe we go about it all wrong, spend too many resources on the wrong things and a lot of that is simply govt inefficiency. I mean, in the real world if you give me $100 and I get something done for $90, you do more business. In govt, if they get $100 they will make sure they use $100 and then do a crappy job so they can justify increasing the budget next year. The incentives are outta whack.
I have a co-worker that worked for a DPW and at the end of the physical year his boss gave him a truck and a credit card and told him there was money left in the budget, go to *local hardware store* and fill the truck with stuff.
My coworker said, "Home Depot is right here, wouldn't it be cheaper?"
His boss said, "Can you drive two trucks?"
It's a mess.
ax1
Legend
One thing ^^^....we need to be in the business of protecting our own democracy in a time where our liberties are incrementally disintegrating before we even dare spreading it. Usually we try to spread democracy with bombs anyways, then people get pissed off and revenge on us and in order to protect our freedoms the US government takes it away from us after stating they are the ones who want to take it away.
Gutterpump
Banned
I get your point but that was dated February...
I just saw it today and thought it was funny lol
Gutterpump
Banned
I agree with you here as well, to a point.
Targeted, surgical drone strikes I can get on board with. Nuclear weapons, not so much.
youngandfree
Well-known member
Invalid Link Removed
More details that Obamacare is working exactly as planned.
More details that Obamacare is working exactly as planned.
jswain34
Well-known member
I wonder what you'd be without google. You do nothing but post links with little one liners.
youngandfree
Well-known member
I guess I'd be just like you and every other person on this board. Considering everyone is on a computer of some sort, and when evwryone wants to post a link to something to make their point, they are going to have to look it up. You obviously haven't participated in this thread very much so you have no idea what my posts are like.
jswain34
Well-known member
This is just what i imagine you doing:
1. "Hmm...lets see what they are talking about" (sees its about obamacare).
2. Google "obamacare sucks"
-> thousands of links generated
3. picks best sounding link and posts it.
4. "Hey Gutterpump, here! Look at this link i just found on the interwebz from some bull**** website! Ha! You are so wrong you huge troll. Im so smart, i know how to do the google!"
I have been reading this thread. Nearly every post. And your most recent post is very consistent with the majority of your other posts.
I just dont see why you cant actually add something to the thread other than posts including the following:
1. A random link
2. Calling gutterpump a troll for actually contributing to the thread
1. "Hmm...lets see what they are talking about" (sees its about obamacare).
2. Google "obamacare sucks"
-> thousands of links generated
3. picks best sounding link and posts it.
4. "Hey Gutterpump, here! Look at this link i just found on the interwebz from some bull**** website! Ha! You are so wrong you huge troll. Im so smart, i know how to do the google!"
I have been reading this thread. Nearly every post. And your most recent post is very consistent with the majority of your other posts.
I just dont see why you cant actually add something to the thread other than posts including the following:
1. A random link
2. Calling gutterpump a troll for actually contributing to the thread
HIT4ME
Well-known member
Well, yes, of course. There are different levels. Obviously, if technology allows us to target strike and avoid civilian casualties, that's a plus. And nukes are really just the absolute last resort. They have to be. The threat of the nuke should be real though - which makes it a powerful deterrent.
Unfortunately, there are times where civilian casualties are necessary in war. Those types of losses are the most devastating to a government - because it creates pressure from within. I'm not trying to be cold, but it's just a sad fact of conflict.
And quite honestly, if our policy was to conserve boots and waste bombs - more of these leaders would take negotiating with us more seriously. The problem is, they can be the mouse that roared while we are the lion. They know if we do something, everyone will be against us politically because we were the big bad bully picking on a little country. We need to change that.
HIT4ME
Well-known member
Haha, I actually like some of the input. But he's taking the same tactic we take with supplements. If something does X, we all want to see a dozen pubmed links to support it or you're an idiot. So it's not that much different than what the forums look for in other situations.
Love the image you just gave me though.
youngandfree
Well-known member
I guess you've banged your head a few too many times then. I guess you've read every time Gutterpump has called me and half the rest of us dumbass backwoods child killing racists. So calling him a Canadian troll is just speaking the truth. I've added plenty to this thread, it's too bad you think it's only been in the last 2 pages.
jswain34
Well-known member
HIT4ME
I see what you're saying there. Good point.
youngandfree
Bumped my head a few too many times? Who said i bumped my head at all?
I see what you're saying there. Good point.
youngandfree
Bumped my head a few too many times? Who said i bumped my head at all?
youngandfree
Well-known member
Jswain34, You think this is contributing to constructive dialogue. Sounds like you have had trauma to your head to me.Half of Americans also support trumpWhile the rest of the world despise him. I'm not afraid of being honest, half of Americans are illiterate, racist a$$holes with a $hit ton of pride who are full of themselves. Lots of backwards people here.That's why I stick to the big cities for the most part, even though I'm from the country.
On the other hand, there's $hitty people everywhere, and plenty of great people here too.
While the rest of the world despise him. I'm not afraid of being honest, half of Americans are illiterate, racist a$$holes with a $hit ton of pride who are full of themselves. Lots of backwards people here.That's why I stick to the big cities for the most part, even though I'm from the country.
jswain34
Well-known member
Yes. I do. Because he actually stayed his opinion on something vs blindly throwing a link up and trying to have that pass as their contribution.
You may not like his opinion, but that doesn't mean it isnt contributing to the thread. And honestly, maybe not half, but there are a lot of illiterate racist *******s with a **** ton of pride in this country. I dont even see how thats arguable really lol.
You may not like his opinion, but that doesn't mean it isnt contributing to the thread. And honestly, maybe not half, but there are a lot of illiterate racist *******s with a **** ton of pride in this country. I dont even see how thats arguable really lol.
youngandfree
Well-known member
I'm glad there's more than 1 source material cop on here, I thought it was just misfit and gutter. They both require peer reviewed research papers to give you any sort of credibility.
It's funny I posted a link to an article written yesterday by Washington Times, a legit news source, because the topic moved back to obamacare.
It's funny I posted a link to an article written yesterday by Washington Times, a legit news source, because the topic moved back to obamacare.
youngandfree
Well-known member
I'd say proclaiming you are better than 150 million people and calling them racists is pretty prideful. Just like a lib to accuse everyone else of being what they are.