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Fat burner for someone @ 20%bf??

georgetown said:
Yohimbine is cheap, is it worth it in your opinion?
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Along with Caffeine and Ephedrine, it's the most studied and proven effective aid out there. Just assess tolerance (ESPECIALLY if combining with Ephedrine), work up to 0.2mg/KG, and take it ~30 minutes before fasted training.
 
The_Old_Guy said:
Along with Caffeine and Ephedrine, it's the most studied and proven effective aid out there. Just assess tolerance (ESPECIALLY if combining with Ephedrine), work up to 0.2mg/KG, and take it ~30 minutes before fasted training.
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What is the recommended dosage for alpha yohimbine, and do you recommend it over plain yohimbine hcl (I have so problems with y hcl)
 
Disagree with the statement that alpha y is a higher quality version of y-hcl. I've used both and never noticed any better results with alpha. Nothing wrong with good ole yohimbine hcl especially considering cost.
 
bashar said:
What is the recommended dosage for alpha yohimbine, and do you recommend it over plain yohimbine hcl (I have so problems with y hcl)
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If you're taking y-hcl, my recommendation would be to start with half the dose you're used to for alpha-y. Its much stronger and harder hitting than y-hcl, so start on the lower side and work your way up with the dosing. I'm not sure that there is a specific protocol for alpha-y as there is for y-hcl (0.2mg/kg body weight), so start with a low dose and work your way up as desired.
 
bashar said:
What is the recommended dosage for alpha yohimbine, and do you recommend it over plain yohimbine hcl (I have so problems with y hcl)
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I would start at 3mg TOTAL, then try 6, then MAYBE try 9mg. I can't recall the exact details now (but I think I wrote about it somewhere) - but I had a "let me do cardio with my cellphone in my hand just in case I die" moment, when I took 9mg of a-Yohimbine. NOW, I probably also took regular Yohimbine (aamf, I'm almost positive I did - I subtracted the a-Y dose from 20mg and filled in the rest with regular Y) and Ephedrine that day too.

Bottom line is always start at the smallest dose and work up each time - it'll only take about a week of experimentation - your health is worth the wait. Bonus points if you go out and by a good Blood Pressure Monitor.

There's also the cost issue of a-Y. You do generally take less, so it may be a wash, but there are no studies showing exactly how much better it is, unlike the Soccer Player study for regular Yohimbine.
 
Chefdeez said:
Disagree with the statement that alpha y is a higher quality version of y-hcl. I've used both and never noticed any better results with alpha. Nothing wrong with good ole yohimbine hcl especially considering cost.
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Some people don't feel a noticable difference between the two. I notice a smoother energy and better appetite suppression with alpha-y, and less of the side effects I get from y-hcl. I also feel that I sweat a lot more when using alpha-y with fasted cardio. Alpha-y is more expensive per mg, but when you factor in the amount you use per serving the prices are very similar.
 
john.patterson said:
Some people don't feel a noticable difference between the two. I notice a smoother energy and better appetite suppression with alpha-y, and less of the side effects I get from y-hcl. I also feel that I sweat a lot more when using alpha-y with fasted cardio. Alpha-y is more expensive per mg, but when you factor in the amount you use per serving the prices are very similar.
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Yeah it's hit or miss. Honestly I get worse sides with alpha-y than hcl not sure why.
 
Chefdeez said:
Yeah it's hit or miss. Honestly I get worse sides with alpha-y than hcl not sure why.
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I can down 17.5mg Yohimbine HCL at ONCE pre cardio and be fine, but 6mg or more Alpha-Y gives me negative sides. It's weird stuff. Still can't figure it out till this day, so I just stick with Yohimbine.

But as for "higher quality", I don't know about that. I'm pretty sure Alpha-Y and Y-HCL effect slightly different sets of receptors.
 
I have done 3 scoops of alphamine without a problem, not sure what yohimbine PES is using there.
 
ma70 said:
I can down 17.5mg Yohimbine HCL at ONCE pre cardio and be fine, but 6mg or more Alpha-Y gives me negative sides. It's weird stuff. Still can't figure it out till this day, so I just stick with Yohimbine.

But as for "higher quality", I don't know about that. I'm pretty sure Alpha-Y and Y-HCL effect slightly different sets of receptors.
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I'm the same way
 
For future ref (for myself)...how would yohimbine stack with F95? Would it be a worthwhile stack?


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he-man said:
For future ref (for myself)...how would yohimbine stack with F95? Would it be a worthwhile stack?


Sent from my iPhone using AnabolicMinds mobile app
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It's fine if Forskolin works for you. But you don't need "F95". 20% of 250mg nets you more Forskolin than 95% of 50mg anyway. You can find 120 caps for about $15. Some say the teeny-tiny 250mg will cause you to sh%t your brains out, but I'd say the majority will be fine. 5 grams of Creatine Mono, ok... 250mg of Coleus extract????
 
The_Old_Guy said:
It's fine if Forskolin works for you. But you don't need "F95". 20% of 250mg nets you more Forskolin than 95% of 50mg anyway. You can find 120 caps for about $15. Some say the teeny-tiny 250mg will cause you to sh%t your brains out, but I'd say the majority will be fine. 5 grams of Creatine Mono, ok... 250mg of Coleus extract????
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Some people, myself included, experience GI issues with the lower percentage extracts of forskolin. I prefer to take it with food regardless, but I always have trouble with the 20% extract, even at just 250mg. Everyone is different though, and many people don't have any issues.
 
Actually GI upset/discomfort from lower percent Forskolin extracts is quite common, if it wasent there would be no reason to buy an exceedingly higher price for the manufacture to use F95, however a large group of individuals really cant handle lower percent extracts. It tears me up personally.
 
he-man said:
What makes you say that? :)
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Epitome was designed for people 20% and over while Ammo helps suppress excess Cortisol levels, helps to reduce Visceral Fat, and controls adipocyte inflammatory cytokines (signalling molecules that exacerbate fat gain). Even faster results can be seen if adding in Brite and or Thermogenic Fat Burner.


Epitome
Fat Loss Amplifier

Epitome is a brand new, cutting edge development in fat loss. It works in ways we've only previously been able to fantasize about. Epitome helps control appetite and accelerate fat burning by manipulation of the Leptin pathway. By increasing Leptin sensitivity and keeping Leptin levels within normal range, the brain and body self-adjust to drive your physique where it should be: Lean. Leptin signals will tell your body that it's not hungry while at the same time telling your brain to burn that fat!

With the addition of *****************, a component of ********, we boost AMPk signals, literally causing the body to react as if you are smack dab in the middle of a heavy demanding workout, causing addition acceleration of fat loss. Epitome is exactly what it promises - the epitome of fat loss.


This is designed, when slightly to morbidly obese, to bring you back within spitting distance of your natural setpoint with reduced effort. It will fit in perfectly with the upcoming release of Metabolic Rebirth.

Unlike Rebirth, however, Epitome keeps Leptin levels, and resistance, completely normalized - so even as you starting heading rapidly towards single digits, your fat loss rate will not wane
 
megadeth, I probably misinterpreted some of the info on Epitome product page, as I thought it was aimed at people who consume a fair amount of carbs :/ my bad


Sent from my iPhone using AnabolicMinds mobile app
 
You should check out Invictus by Iron Legion. Should be impressive for cortisol control.
 
Ashwagnda is great to cortisol control, I am going to try myokem thyrovate, looks really promising:)
 
Thanks for all the input so far...keep it coming :thumbsup:

I have gone with Evomuse's Ammo and OL's Ignit3 :)
I may log this is anyone would be interested?
 
Adizzle1 said:
Actually GI upset/discomfort from lower percent Forskolin extracts is quite common, if it wasn't there would be no reason to buy an exceedingly higher price for the manufacture to use F95...
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Well, yes there is - it can be marked up even more :D Just like all the fancy Creatines over and above Mono - have to find a way to maximize the profits over the cheaper "base" product. You know the deal: "Creatine Mono doesn't absorb! Buy our Creatine Aminoglobulin Perchlorate forumula! Maximize your GAINZZZZZ!" :D But if you and JP get the runs, fair enough - I'd still recommend any new user try out a quality 10 or 20% first.
 
I am one of those who get the bloat with creatine mono...maybe some people suffer from 10-20% forskline...not everyone can digest everything, just saying...
 
bashar said:
I am one of those who get the bloat with creatine mono...maybe some people suffer from 10-20% forskline...not everyone can digest everything, just saying...
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Cool man, not saying nobody gets bad side effects from stuff. If you do, then you have to find alternatives (or suffer through like I do with 35g of Baking Soda + 3Tbs of Instant Coffee :D). But the thing that gets me about Forskolin is that the only studies by the defacto "go-to" supplier - Sabinsa, only *ever* used 10%. And I couldn't find any mention of GI distress in the literature. Yet, 10 and 20% seems to get "poo-poo'd" a lot and there seems to be a mantra of "F95, F95, F95!". All I'm saying is that for a first timer, give your wallet a break and try out some quality 10 or 20% first. You can be... smart... with your Googling and find quality 20% for ~$15 per 120 caps.
 
The_Old_Guy said:
Well, yes there is - it can be marked up even more :D Just like all the fancy Creatines over and above Mono - have to find a way to maximize the profits over the cheaper "base" product. You know the deal: "Creatine Mono doesn't absorb! Buy our Creatine Aminoglobulin Perchlorate forumula! Maximize your GAINZZZZZ!" :D But if you and JP get the runs, fair enough - I'd still recommend any new user try out a quality 10 or 20% first.
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Not really, atleast not for Performax, check the prices of our products that contain F95, still great pricing for there categories and what they provide and we would rather not take the chance of GI upset and driving a large crowd that cant handle it away from those products, additionally takes up significantly less capsule space so allows for more workable room on a per serving basis.

Even for others I highly doubt companies are spending an exceedingly more on a per kg basis in an attempt to try and charge more and make more profit? its kinda backwards, generally companies trying to maximize profits would use the cheapest materials and charge just a bit more for a higher profit. Really dont see this is some conspiracy, I think f95 is just a more tolerable solution for the masses.

Sure if your just talking standalone, give the 10-20% a try, most people will have a negative experience but atleast they wouldnt have wasted much money on trying it.
 
There's no difference between the extract, I'm convinced. I have the weakest stomach on the planet and never noticed a difference in higher vs lower. I'm convinced it's 100% marketing.
 
I have negative experience with too much F95, so I'd be screwed!!!
Couldn't wait to have a first dose of Alphamax shortly after lunch...tummy been funny all afternoon!
Slightly worried how I'll get on in the morning dosing ignit3, Alphamax and Ammo together pre workout!?
 
he-man said:
I have negative experience with too much F95, so I'd be screwed!!!
Couldn't wait to have a first dose of Alphamax shortly after lunch...tummy been funny all afternoon!
Slightly worried how I'll get on in the morning dosing ignit3, Alphamax and Ammo together pre workout!?
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If you don't feel good don't take anything and hold off until you're ready to go. Just my opinion!
 
Chefdeez said:
There's no difference between the extract, I'm convinced. I have the weakest stomach on the planet and never noticed a difference in higher vs lower. I'm convinced it's 100% marketing.
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Look at user reviews or even just google Forskolin and Diarrhea, its not some marketing ploy that companies just made up, its common knowledge.

"Diarrhea is the most common side effects and the most commonly experienced by users of diet pills Forskolin. This is due to increased levels of cAMP in the digestive tract smooth muscle. Contraction becomes larger and digestive activity is increased. Other side effects of Forskolin relatively light, such as coughing, anxiety, nausea, heartburn, indigestion, and insomnia."

he-man said:
I have negative experience with too much F95, so I'd be screwed!!!
Couldn't wait to have a first dose of Alphamax shortly after lunch...tummy been funny all afternoon!
Slightly worried how I'll get on in the morning dosing ignit3, Alphamax and Ammo together pre workout!?
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I would simply take your Alphamax with a large meal, generally dosing with meals helps curb this effect.
 
Adizzle1 said:
Look at user reviews or even just google Forskolin and Diarrhea, its not some marketing ploy that companies just made up, its common knowledge.

"Diarrhea is the most common side effects and the most commonly experienced by users of diet pills Forskolin. This is due to increased levels of cAMP in the digestive tract smooth muscle. Contraction becomes larger and digestive activity is increased. Other side effects of Forskolin relatively light, such as coughing, anxiety, nausea, heartburn, indigestion, and insomnia."
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Right. But what does f95 do? It increases cAMP. Sooooo...... You showing me a paragraph about forskolin side effects that doesn't say anything about % is meaningless.
 
Chefdeez said:
Right. But what does f95 do? It increases cAMP. Sooooo...... You showing me a paragraph about forskolin side effects that doesn't say anything about % is meaningless.
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I thought you meant that the whole diarrhea thing was marketing since you have a very weak stomach and never noticed it so I was just stating that diarrhea/GI upset is very common, thats all.

Yea cAMP obvioulsy plays a role but I dont think its the complete picture. Anecdotal feedback has shown that users experience less with the higher % extracts however that may not be your experience but it is fairly well documented by a lot of users. For companies like Performax were simply eating that excess cost, were not jacking up prices based on the ingredient so its really trivial at this point.

If your talking standalone then sure as I said, someone can simply try the 10-20% and see how it works, if it causes GI discomfort etc atleast they didnt spend a lot on trying it.
 
If the diarrhea comes from cAMP, then whatever activates cAMP the most'est/best'est would be worse. Since the trend in posts is that a 95% Extract is the most 'powerful', then it stands to reason that it would be worse for GI distress, it seems to me. Then again, 95% of 50mg is actually less Forskolin than 20% of 250mg... so maybe that's why the lower extracts cause distress... they work better :D

Now if you can link me to data showing that the other 80-90% of 'stuff' in a 10-20% capsule is responsible for the diarrhea, now we may have something.

But like I said, who am I to say you don't get the sh&ts from 10-20%, if you do, there is an option. I just hate seeing "10-20% is bunk garbage, F95! bro!".
 
the MOA of forksolin triggers GI distress regardless of extract %. Sure, impurities in the 20% may add more distress, but its in forskolins MOA to impact the GI.

Also, oxymax XT is strong just as much as Ignit3 is. They are both stim heavy. I like both personally but to say one is more calming than the other is not true
 
BRUstrong said:
How is the Ignit3 treating you?
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Hey BRUstrong, it's very strong (for me)! I've not managed a full dose yet!

In terms of effectiveness...I can feel my body heating up after 5mins of dosing. The energy comes very quickly, and being quite stim sensitive it has made me on the jittery side - but I will battle on with it!

Took it pre football today, not sure it helped! Seemed to tire quickly, heart racing with the heat and sprints!!

I'll try 2 and 2 on Monday and see how I cope :)
 
he-man said:
Hey BRUstrong, it's very strong (for me)! I've not managed a full dose yet!

In terms of effectiveness...I can feel my body heating up after 5mins of dosing. The energy comes very quickly, and being quite stim sensitive it has made me on the jittery side - but I will battle on with it!

Took it pre football today, not sure it helped! Seemed to tire quickly, heart racing with the heat and sprints!!

I'll try 2 and 2 on Monday and see how I cope :)
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Yea, I think you had posted about taking before athletic events in another thread that I literally just read and you got the green light from other members. While what they said was true (caffeine and stims in the right amounts can aid athletic performance) they should have thrown in the caveat that too many stims will make working out hell!!

Glad you're liking it so far. I have a bottle on the way but am very stim tolerant. When I use Alphamine I dose 2.5 - 3 scoops and when I use OxyMax I take 2 caps at once with no problems. Still, I'm not going to mess around with Ignit3, so I'll start at 3 caps
 
BRUstrong said:
Yea, I think you had posted about taking before athletic events in another thread that I literally just read and you got the green light from other members. While what they said was true (caffeine and stims in the right amounts can aid athletic performance) they should have thrown in the caveat that too many stims will make working out hell!!

Glad you're liking it so far. I have a bottle on the way but am very stim tolerant. When I use Alphamine I dose 2.5 - 3 scoops and when I use OxyMax I take 2 caps at once with no problems. Still, I'm not going to mess around with Ignit3, so I'll start at 3 caps
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Yeah, I still put caution to the wind by only dosing 1 cap along with one Ammo this morning...dosed approx 30mins before my proats, and after breakfast my stomach was in knots for he following hour :/ I'm wondering if I'm taking them with enough liquid?! Sometimes only drinking 250ml when taking.

When I was on Alphamine I stuck to 1-1.5scoops, that was plenty for me!
 
Rand0m said:
Since we're talking about yohimbine, is it something you want to only dose on fasted training days?
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You'll get people with a few different opinions, but yohimbine only works to mobilize fat in stubborn areas while insulin levels are low (aka fasted training). I don't see any benefit of adding it in at other times, I really only use it for fasted cardio or training, or at least 3-4 hours after a meal
 
Is yohimbine timing more flexible on a keto diet due to more stable insulin levels? Say i just had a protein shake, how long after that could I dose yhcl?
 
Wondering what you guys think of either Phenadrine by aps or hydroxyelite by hitech?
Surprised no one has mentioned either.. Both have 1,3 and look similar to og oep with the slight advantage to phenadrine imo..
 
rosemont83 said:
Wondering what you guys think of either Phenadrine by aps or hydroxyelite by hitech?
Surprised no one has mentioned either.. Both have 1,3 and look similar to og oep with the slight advantage to phenadrine imo..
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I think High Tech Lipodrene is even better. I will use it in a month
 
Would Epitome stack well with Ammo/Ignit3 & Alphamax...thinking of adding it in for my last 2wks before honeymoon.

:/
 
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