NoAddedHmones
Well-known member
how long did you run at 15mg for?
SARM's, MK, & GW : A User's Guide
- Thread starter The Press
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how long did you run at 15mg for?
cheeky1
Active member
I think it was only for a week or 2, at the end of about a 10 week cycle.
Pretty sure I did 3 weeks at 6mg, 2+ weeks at 9mg then switched brands, 3 weeks at 10mg & a week & half at 15mg to finish. Something like that.
I felt nothing at 6mg, better at 9/10mg & really took off at 15mg. Size more than strength though, I must say.
I'm off cycle now, been about 9 - 10 weeks since finishing.
westcoast001
New member
Did you end up keeping most of your gains?
xhrr
Well-known member
I may have to do this
cheeky1
Active member
I wouldn't say most, no, but certainly some fullness remained. It's not something I would run solo again, I seem to need more input & get better (strength & muscle) results from PH's like Trenavar. Osta is also more effective than LGD in that regard, for me.
I also didn't pay enough attention to diet, I really needed to be more consistent & aim for extra calories + protein to make the most of the LGD. The days I made the extra effort with food intake I was noticeably bigger come days end. I would say LGD is quite calorie dependant for size gains.
Toren
Well-known member
My cycle for next winter will be LGD with a Rad-140 kicker. My planned layout is ...
Rad: 12-12-12-12-0-0-0-0
LGD: 8-8-8-8-12-12-12-12 (I may attempt 16mg for the last 2 weeks depending on how things go)
Dermacrine: 3-3-3-3-1-1-1-1
4-DHEA: 220-220-220-220-330-330-330-330
This WILL be a very successful cycle!
BamBam0319
Well-known member
This sounds awesome!
Toren
Well-known member
I expect to add 15+ lbs of dry 'keepable' gains with minimal sides. I loved my just recent run of LGD and it gave me zero noticeable negative sides with only Derma (1-2 doses ED) as a base. I'm also hoping that the combo of Dermacrine/4-DHEA will keep away any potential lethargy from the Rad. I don't usually suffer lethargy on cycle though so hopefully I'm good.
BamBam0319
Well-known member
I think that keeping RAD to 4 weeks will give you all the benefits without the lethargy. Plus the dermacrine and 4-andro on top of it, you're going to be having one hell of a good run!
JonesLifts
New member
Wish i could try 15mg, but my caps are 10mg/each,,, almost into week 6 with 10mg daily with no noticeable results yet.
westcoast001
New member
What brand are u using? Sounds like you got some bunk lgd or maybe some people just don't respond to it? Also it's easy to take 15 mg if u have 10mg pills, just break the pills open, divide the powder into 2 similar size piles and then put that into empty gel caps or just put it right under your tongue along with a whole pill, bam 15mg. Did you notice anything in the first few weeks, even any side effects?
BamBam0319
Well-known member
That's not a very accurate way to do things.. Would not recommend
smith_69
Well-known member
HUH? im sorry but dont do this
smith_69
Well-known member
sektelsnor
New member
Do I just take my AI throughout my cycle or only when I suspect lowered test? What dosages should I take?
westcoast001
New member
Just curious why you think this would be so bad? Sure you probably aren't going to get exactly 5mg in each but it would be close.
BamBam0319
Well-known member
SARM's, MK, & GW : A User's Guide
Not lowered test - take it when you are experiencing symptoms of elevated estrogen levels. Gyno, bloating, crying during chick flicks, etc.
Dosage depends on what AI you have and how quickly you get the symptoms back under control. The idea is to take the smallest effective amount.
Not lowered test - take it when you are experiencing symptoms of elevated estrogen levels. Gyno, bloating, crying during chick flicks, etc.
Dosage depends on what AI you have and how quickly you get the symptoms back under control. The idea is to take the smallest effective amount.
bobi593
Active member
Did you started your first lgd cycle also from 8 mg?
smith_69
Well-known member
bump
Toren
Well-known member
Yes, I started right @ 8mg. My run was only a short one as I bridged into PMag/Trest. The LGD portion lasted 37 days and I ran it like so...
LGD: 8-8-8-12-12
Dermacrine: 1-2 pumps ED.
The gains were great with no visible sides to speak of. In hindsight, I wish I had just stayed on LGD for 10 weeks but that's another story altogether. I gained ~ 10lbs on the LGD portion of my run and I leaned out as well. I saw great muscle fullness, vascularity and a solid strength increase. A longer run would allow for a better assessment on my part.
If you are planning on a shorter cycle, I would suggest starting @ 8mg ED. If you are planning on a long cycle, say 10-12 weeks, you might want to start @ 4mg for a couple of weeks but I myself would still start a long run @ 8mg as I am not a beginner with this compound or in general. If you are a novice and have not run anything hormonal before, I would recommend starting @ 4mg for a couple of weeks to see how you feel on the compound.
For me, I thought 8mg was nice but 12mg was the dose I thoroughly enjoyed. Over a longer run, I would advise sticking to 8mg until you feel the gains have stalled a bit, At that point, 12mg will be a nice boost.
JonesLifts
New member
I'm using Elite LGD by focused nutrition. From the start, the only thing i noticed was that i had become a little more hungry, and thirsty all the time, that's it. And those effects seem to have gone away slowly.
DonnieM
Active member
SARM's, MK, & GW : A User's Guide
Good read+info Toren! Im running similar myself, finished 8w of LGD/Stanodrol, not so impressed, maybe my diet wasnt on point Im not sure. Now bridged into Hdrol/Stano/soon Ment (oral) added on top. 1 week on Hdrol now and noticing strength gain. Lethargy/tiredness is bad though, have been through whole cycle.
Did you log your run here on AM?
Good read+info Toren! Im running similar myself, finished 8w of LGD/Stanodrol, not so impressed, maybe my diet wasnt on point Im not sure. Now bridged into Hdrol/Stano/soon Ment (oral) added on top. 1 week on Hdrol now and noticing strength gain. Lethargy/tiredness is bad though, have been through whole cycle.
Did you log your run here on AM?
yates84
Well-known member
That ment should help offset some of the lethargy. You going to dose it all pwo or try to space it out to use as a base?
Toren
Well-known member
It's hard to say for sure why you didn't get the results you were hoping for with LGD. Maybe your expectations were too high or maybe it was the diet or training aspect of your cycle. I'm more inclined to believe that we as individuals just respond differently to specific compounds and it is all a part of the journey of discovering what works best for us. We may all be humans but our bodies definitely have a way of doing things differently. For whatever reason, I happen to respond well to SARMs. I firmly believe there is a physiological reason for that. There is a lot we don't know about SARMs.
How were your joints on LGD/Stano? That's a pretty dry cycle with nothing that aromatizes. My joints were a bit dry and clicky on LGD. It may be a situation were you body needed a bit of estro to compete with the LGD/DHT (Stano). You may have seen better results with the addition of dermacrine or 4-DHEA. Lethargy does make it harder to push for those gains.
I agree with Yates, that Ment should give you a boost in agression, sense of well-being, and some estro as well. Having Stano in the mix will probably also negate the need for an AI/SERM on cycle as well. It should be enough competition for a low dose of Ment.
Unfortunately no log for that cycle. One of these days I'll do a log.
sanmarino
Member
Had the same stack, LGD regularly at 7mg but for two weeks on 10mg and S-4 up to 70mg. A quite potent stack.
Just keep the Prami on hands. I kept it as a plan B, if something bad happens with the prolactine. It will increase a bit, but will stay in range. As long as it's not necessary, you don't have to take it.
If so, make a kickstart with 1mg on day one and lower the dosage to e2d. The funny part of prami is, that it increases the GH in higher dosages, too. But don't aim for taking high dosages of prami, the MK-677 is far more effective.
Nightmares and bad sleeps could be part of psychological stress, regarding to "I'm taking something". I had that on my first cycle too, but it never came back in the following cycles.
Nevertheless, SARM are not that studies well, yet. Therefore the impact on the psychological part is still unknown.
Just keep the Prami on hands. I kept it as a plan B, if something bad happens with the prolactine. It will increase a bit, but will stay in range. As long as it's not necessary, you don't have to take it.
If so, make a kickstart with 1mg on day one and lower the dosage to e2d. The funny part of prami is, that it increases the GH in higher dosages, too. But don't aim for taking high dosages of prami, the MK-677 is far more effective.
Nightmares and bad sleeps could be part of psychological stress, regarding to "I'm taking something". I had that on my first cycle too, but it never came back in the following cycles.
Nevertheless, SARM are not that studies well, yet. Therefore the impact on the psychological part is still unknown.
yates84
Well-known member
Prolactin issues are very uncommon while on sarms. Honestly, if estrogen is under control then prolactin is rarely an issue. Your nips leaking fluid is an indication of high prolactin. You are more likely to see high estrogen sides than prolactin sides, an ai like exemestane should be kept on hand at all times for this situation. High estrogen is usually first noticed with your nipples being puffy and/or sensitive. If left untreated, a nice set of lumpy man boobs is very possible. These side effects are not common on sarms but there is still a possibility so it's good to be prepared.
clown007
Well-known member
I believe this has been discussed in this thread. San Marino has discussed the fertility issues with the use of Ostarine.
There is a lot of pertinent information regarding fertility effects for both male and female users in this thread.
DonnieM
Active member
That sounds reasonable. Maybe I respond better next time I try LGD, with a different diet and training approach. Now I recall that I just quit creatine in the beginning of cycle, maybe I lost a few pound of water weight when at the same time gaining from the LGD? Because strength was up. Also the Stano dries you out, making me a wee bit lighter aswell?
Anywhoo. My joints is a bit clicky as yours. Think the Stano also contributed to that. A wetter base would have been more suitable. Excited about adding the Ment to my Halo
Not sure about how I want to dose it due to the short half life. I have 90x10mg which needs to last me at least 4 weeks. What would be best to combat lethargy? Dose 3 times/day? Or like 10mg am, 20mg pwo? (Usually work out in the afternoon/evening). My Stano is soon out (10x300mg left). But I have Aromasin if needed.
johnl1800
Member
For your PCT you might want to add a SERM in there (Nolva or Clomid) or at the very least BLR Rebirth. The LGD will definitely shut you down. Personally I would feel safer adding a SERM as I wouldn't trust the PCT 5, Growth and Apex Male to get the job done on their own.
yates84
Well-known member
That sounds reasonable. Maybe I respond better next time I try LGD, with a different diet and training approach. Now I recall that I just quit creatine in the beginning of cycle, maybe I lost a few pound of water weight when at the same time gaining from the LGD? Because strength was up. Also the Stano dries you out, making me a wee bit lighter aswell?
Anywhoo. My joints is a bit clicky as yours. Think the Stano also contributed to that. A wetter base would have been more suitable. Excited about adding the Ment to my Halo
I'd just dose all 30mg pwo. You don't quite have enough on hand for "test base" doses
Toren
Well-known member
That sounds reasonable. Maybe I respond better next time I try LGD, with a different diet and training approach. Now I recall that I just quit creatine in the beginning of cycle, maybe I lost a few pound of water weight when at the same time gaining from the LGD? Because strength was up. Also the Stano dries you out, making me a wee bit lighter aswell?
Anywhoo. My joints is a bit clicky as yours. Think the Stano also contributed to that. A wetter base would have been more suitable. Excited about adding the Ment to my Halo
I agree with Yates, 30mg is a low dose. If you want the best "bang" for your buck, you might try all 30mg pwo. I don't think 20mg will do a whole lot for you in that regard. 25mg Trest oral was a nice pwo boost for me but the effect for me wore off quickly and I could have easily gone to 50mg. if you're not looking for a pwo boost, you might consider just dosing 10mg with breakfast/lunch/dinner. This would allow for the most stable blood levels and may be just enough for a mild base. I always find that Halo increases my libido/energy/mood with no visible signs of shutdown, so the 30mg may just be enough for a little boost in aggression/energy.
As a side note, I would add the Ment into the last 30 days of your Halo run as opposed to the first 30 days. When I dropped Trest from my current run (still going), I definitely saw a dip in energy and an increase in lethargy. It's nothing crazy but it is noticeable.
DonnieM
Active member
Alright guys, thank for your detailed input (as allways)! In the perfect of worlds I would dose 3/times day with 30mg pwo. Maybe I get another bottle if my wallet allows. Will def add this last 4 weeks. Just to make sure, Trest/Mentabolan is interchangable right? So mixing it up shouldnt make a (noticable) difference mg wise? Thaanks
foofighter
New member
Bit off topic but have just got some OL trest was wanting some advice on how to run it i have aromasin....on pct at minute just finished 4 weeks of epistane which i thought was very good amazing pumps but not much going on in trouser dept but have clomid and OL super pct...wont do the trest for couple of months
yates84
Well-known member
You going to run trest solo? Or stack with something like epistane?
TucanD
New member
A little three week update on my Ostarine cycle, just to add to some information here. Dosing has been one cap of Ostashred (12.5mg Osta, 25mg arimistane). Will be upping dose to two caps split 12hrs apart starting today.
As imagined, I am upping the dose going forward to see a bit more results going forward. So far I have noticed slight increases in strength, while being in a deficit, nothing drastic but a definite increase has been noticed this past week. Body composition showing not much difference then it would during past cuts at this point, except muscle fullness seems to be more prominent throughout the day. I have noticed, just recently because someone mentioned it...my skin looks clearer then it has ever been before! Very significant difference on my face, and nothing cleaning wise has changed over the past 3 weeks. May low dose run this in the future to gauge this effect, really awesome. No lethargy, no change in pumps, no change in endurance.
Side effects
-Don't know how much to contribute this to the osta, but my libido is down significantly. Now it was already on the down slope before these three weeks, due to some other life circumstances. Also it always get worse as I cut down, so not very surprised but should be noted. May throw in some dermacrine later for the feels.
-Slighty itchy nipples? This may be a huge placebo, because it only happens when I think about it/reading about other peoples issues. Very worried about tits, so mostly mental at this point. No sensitivity really, and no difference in feel or look.
- Slighty more anxious throughout the day, like I have to be doing something. Thought this may be due to BP but I check it consistently and it has been fine (110/70). Not sure if this is due to osta or something else, but it is definitely there.
Notes Going Forward
Muscle Maintenance will definitely be tested the next couple weeks, still deciding if I will throw some dermacrine in, and possibly more arimistane. I don't have pre-bloods but I am looking into getting them for after, and after pct. Have Rebirth and some RC nolva on hand...but not happy taking RC honestly so it will be Rebirth until I can find pharma grade, which I am currently struggling to find. Also have super pct, and will probably be throwing in another goodie. Not doing a log because of lack of time, but will keep you guys updated on anything new and please ask or suggest anything if interest is there!
As imagined, I am upping the dose going forward to see a bit more results going forward. So far I have noticed slight increases in strength, while being in a deficit, nothing drastic but a definite increase has been noticed this past week. Body composition showing not much difference then it would during past cuts at this point, except muscle fullness seems to be more prominent throughout the day. I have noticed, just recently because someone mentioned it...my skin looks clearer then it has ever been before! Very significant difference on my face, and nothing cleaning wise has changed over the past 3 weeks. May low dose run this in the future to gauge this effect, really awesome. No lethargy, no change in pumps, no change in endurance.
Side effects
-Don't know how much to contribute this to the osta, but my libido is down significantly. Now it was already on the down slope before these three weeks, due to some other life circumstances. Also it always get worse as I cut down, so not very surprised but should be noted. May throw in some dermacrine later for the feels.
-Slighty itchy nipples? This may be a huge placebo, because it only happens when I think about it/reading about other peoples issues. Very worried about tits, so mostly mental at this point. No sensitivity really, and no difference in feel or look.
- Slighty more anxious throughout the day, like I have to be doing something. Thought this may be due to BP but I check it consistently and it has been fine (110/70). Not sure if this is due to osta or something else, but it is definitely there.
Notes Going Forward
Muscle Maintenance will definitely be tested the next couple weeks, still deciding if I will throw some dermacrine in, and possibly more arimistane. I don't have pre-bloods but I am looking into getting them for after, and after pct. Have Rebirth and some RC nolva on hand...but not happy taking RC honestly so it will be Rebirth until I can find pharma grade, which I am currently struggling to find. Also have super pct, and will probably be throwing in another goodie. Not doing a log because of lack of time, but will keep you guys updated on anything new and please ask or suggest anything if interest is there!
foofighter
New member
Just solo ...still a novice with these compounds ....only done 2 solo cycles LGD and epistane should of run epistane longer but only got 1 bottle but was impressed with it
foofighter
New member
Just solo ....still new to this carry on dont want to complicate things and this stuff sounds a bit scary with the estro sides
yates84
Well-known member
Yes, estro sides can be interesting but epistane will actually help mitigate some of the trest estrogen sides. If you had a successful epistane run then Stacking epi/trest is not a bad idea.
foofighter
New member
Yeah felt great in the gym on epi but not in the bedroom ....the trest added in next time would help that
yates84
Well-known member
Trest is solid solo too, strength and gains are definitely there but epistane wouldn't hurt your situation. Just something to consider. Will help you set up either one just let me know!
Toren
Well-known member
I've never used Mentabolan but being as though it is a PH to Trestolone, I would think they are similar in action and dosing.
Toren
Well-known member
If the combo of Epistane/Trest is still leaving you with symptoms of having elevated estrogen, Formestane would help to alleviate these symptoms. It will not act as quickly or be as strong as Exemestane, for instance. I have always found Formestane to have a nice anabolic action as well, even at doses lower than what is suggested to see anabolic benefits.
Toren
Well-known member
I've used it in PCT 3 times and it works great for me. It's said to help with IGF-1 production, as well a being an AI. I don't normally go over 50-75mg ED when using it in PCT as it can be minimally supressive. I believe the reported anabolic (and supressive) effects are said to take place @ 200mg and up, but I like to play it safe during PCT. I have used it past my SERM on one ocassion and still recovered just fine. For PCT I usually add it into the first 3 weeks and then switch over to Arimistane for the last 3 weeks or so. I've used it on cycle before @ 100+ mg and it seems to add to the fullness/pump and vascularity.
clown007
Well-known member
So many options!
I was also thinking of running it when I run some of the Andros.
Trying to piece together my next several cycles over the next while
Always like to plan ahead and make sure I have everything in line.
Thanks for the advice!