Phosphatidic acid in new Cutler supp?
- Thread starter Grayson
- Start date
raz_kaz248
Member
it's called King by Cutler Nutrition. Looks very interesting....
Grayson
Well-known member
It really isn't.
I haven't looked into the other ingredients, but figuring that it's cutler and I believe cutler nutrition to be a sub of BPI, I'm not putting much faith into these other supposed "ergogenics."
MultiVitamin
Active member
Yeah, I'm very surprised by this inclusion of PA. I was expecting a very mediocre line tbh
Jiigzz
Legend
The inclusion of the L aspartic acid in their T booster is a little odd. Its the D isomer you want.
Havent looked into their other products yet but I surely will.
Grayson
Well-known member
I also think it's in their creatine sell as well.
The question is, is anyone willing to use this just for the PA? I highly doubt their herbal extracts do anything. This is basically BPI after all...
jjblacksheep
Member
Clear Muscle logs should start in a week, can't wait.
rome32
Board Sponsor
Exactly. The L isomer needs to be flipped to the D to get the desired effect.
Which shows why its a BPI product. They love using L-Aspartic Acid as a "testosterone booster" for some odd reason.
aaronuconn
Well-known member
Looks like BPI will be lowering the cost for many with with this formula.
jamesm11
Well-known member
Exclusive licensing isn't nearly as lucrative. Probably realized it and changed his/her mind
amarula
Member
Wasn't there already a Cutler something brand?
aaronuconn
Well-known member
Not that I recall. Cutler used to be with MT I believe but he didn't have his own brand.
rome32
Board Sponsor
Yeah there was. EXT was the original one "made for Jay" but then he came out with his own line under BPI which was white and black then they regarded it again under the black and purple.
He did own/ possibly still owns Alpha Helix. They make a preworkout but that's it. I bet due to a noncompete contract he cant move forward with it.
kissdadookie
Well-known member
I'm receiving a bottle from BPI to run (thanks Fugitive if you're reading this). I'm almost done with my second bottle of Micro-PA and about to start on my third bottle. I will run King after I finish my next bottle of Micro-PA.
Obviously I will see if there's any noticeable drop offs (if there is then there may either be a dosing difference that the label would not be reflecting or maybe Biotest's emulsifying whatever adds something to the bioavailibility of PA). I'm suspecting that there will not be any drop offs as both products provides the 750 mg's of Mediator PA. Would be interesting if the herbs and Niagen in King will bring anything noticeable to the table. Also, not logging the product (I opted out of logging) but will give my impressions on the King product.
In general though, I'm a fan of PA and currently, King is the best value for PA available on the market. I'll break down the costs here:
Micro-PA by Biotest - 20 days supply for $50
MaxxxTOR by Max Muscle (never heard of them) - 21 day supply for $85 (this product also contains leucine and HMB, but I doubt that there's all that much HMB in the product so the 3.3 gram proprietary blend is going to be the 750 mg's of Mediator PA + mostly leucine)
King by BPI - 30 day supply for $40 and it contains Niagen and some other curious herbs (apart from PA, we don't know how everything else is dosed, plus I don't think anybody know if 1) Niagen does anything or 2) what the efficacious dose of Niagen should be).
bb.com just temp banned me
Supposedly I was making steroid talk (I really wasn't, someone was trying to compare HMB data with AAS data, I was just pointing out how this was nonsensical since training protocols, etc. needs to be the same for both types of studies in order to be able to properly meta-analyze the studies). Can't start posting in my log until the 21st. Smh. Oh well.
Probably some sort of timed exclusive deal would be my guess.
Obviously I will see if there's any noticeable drop offs (if there is then there may either be a dosing difference that the label would not be reflecting or maybe Biotest's emulsifying whatever adds something to the bioavailibility of PA). I'm suspecting that there will not be any drop offs as both products provides the 750 mg's of Mediator PA. Would be interesting if the herbs and Niagen in King will bring anything noticeable to the table. Also, not logging the product (I opted out of logging) but will give my impressions on the King product.
In general though, I'm a fan of PA and currently, King is the best value for PA available on the market. I'll break down the costs here:
Micro-PA by Biotest - 20 days supply for $50
MaxxxTOR by Max Muscle (never heard of them) - 21 day supply for $85 (this product also contains leucine and HMB, but I doubt that there's all that much HMB in the product so the 3.3 gram proprietary blend is going to be the 750 mg's of Mediator PA + mostly leucine)
King by BPI - 30 day supply for $40 and it contains Niagen and some other curious herbs (apart from PA, we don't know how everything else is dosed, plus I don't think anybody know if 1) Niagen does anything or 2) what the efficacious dose of Niagen should be).
bb.com just temp banned me
Supposedly I was making steroid talk (I really wasn't, someone was trying to compare HMB data with AAS data, I was just pointing out how this was nonsensical since training protocols, etc. needs to be the same for both types of studies in order to be able to properly meta-analyze the studies). Can't start posting in my log until the 21st. Smh. Oh well. Probably some sort of timed exclusive deal would be my guess.
raz_kaz248
Member
bb.com just temp banned me
There you are lol. King is definitely stirring the pot and getting the discussion started. Looking forward to more feedback on this
kissdadookie
Well-known member
I was really surprised how BPI more or less didn't try to push King harder prior to me finding the darn product listed as coming soon over on the other site and then posting about it. Out of the entire Cutler series and even the entire BPI line currently, King is arguably the most noteworthy.
Quads_of_Stee
Well-known member
kiss, so is PA an anti-inflammatory properties by mediating inflammation or is it very negligible?
kissdadookie
Well-known member
Dug into this PA and inflammation thing. Looks like PA is an important regulator for systemic inflammation. Though I don't think that this is directly why one would supplement it preworkout for the purpose of muscle building though.
Along with that, also dug around for ArA and mTOR, so it does appear that the inflammation response from ArA also triggers mTOR. Though it appears that ArA and PA are working through different mechanisms (PA works via PI3-K I think intracellularly, extracellular PA triggers ERK which apparently triggers mTOR).
kissdadookie
Well-known member
Yeah buddy! Would be interesting to see if ArA compliments the PA or if there's a ceiling to mTOR activation. Next gen crazy natty stacks, lol.Have some on the way to run after MysoSynergy!!
SwolenONE
Board Sponsor
Absolutely. running ArA and Myo right now and am so sore it's unbelievable haha. This year is really shaping up to be a big one for the supplement industry.
Our new ArA study will be published in July, and right around the time it hits you'll see ArA products exploding onto the scene left and right
kissdadookie
Well-known member
Absolutely. running ArA and Myo right now and am so sore it's unbelievable haha. This year is really shaping up to be a big one for the supplement industry.
Our new ArA study will be published in July, and right around the time it hits you'll see ArA products exploding onto the scene left and right
I like it
I also like the new ArA price points raz_kaz248
Member
Anyone experience running ArA with PA vs ArA or PA alone? Benefits?
Jiigzz
Legend
I'm receiving a bottle from BPI to run (thanks Fugitive if you're reading this). I'm almost done with my second bottle of Micro-PA and about to start on my third bottle. I will run King after I finish my next bottle of Micro-PA.
Obviously I will see if there's any noticeable drop offs (if there is then there may either be a dosing difference that the label would not be reflecting or maybe Biotest's emulsifying whatever adds something to the bioavailibility of PA). I'm suspecting that there will not be any drop offs as both products provides the 750 mg's of Mediator PA. Would be interesting if the herbs and Niagen in King will bring anything noticeable to the table. Also, not logging the product (I opted out of logging) but will give my impressions on the King product.
In general though, I'm a fan of PA and currently, King is the best value for PA available on the market. I'll break down the costs here:
Micro-PA by Biotest - 20 days supply for $50
MaxxxTOR by Max Muscle (never heard of them) - 21 day supply for $85 (this product also contains leucine and HMB, but I doubt that there's all that much HMB in the product so the 3.3 gram proprietary blend is going to be the 750 mg's of Mediator PA + mostly leucine)
King by BPI - 30 day supply for $40 and it contains Niagen and some other curious herbs (apart from PA, we don't know how everything else is dosed, plus I don't think anybody know if 1) Niagen does anything or 2) what the efficacious dose of Niagen should be).
bb.com just temp banned me
Probably some sort of timed exclusive deal would be my guess.
BB.com is strict on AAS talk. It cant be discussed no matter what side of the fence you sit on.
kissdadookie
Well-known member
Seeing how I've been unbanned, it would appear to have been a mistake on their part
They basically banned everyone on that thread but later lifted the bans.If you followed that thread before half the posts were removed, it would have been blatantly obvious that we were not discussing the use of AAS. It's basically as if someone just searched for the word steroid or AAS and deleted/banned people based on the word appearing regardless of context/content.
Jiigzz
Legend
Seeing how I've been unbanned, it would appear to have been a mistake on their part
I think even comparing supps to AAS is rather touchy. I was infracting just for quoting someone who mentioned AAS lol
amarula
Member
So BPI owns BPI, Cutler and EXT brands?
rome32
Board Sponsor
As well as image sports, pro nutra & king
GreenMachineX
Well-known member
I'm running both right now. Too early to tell if there's a synergistic effect.
kissdadookie
Well-known member
I'd agree with this, or if you're adding it to a current stack, at minimum have a good feel for the stack one is already on before adding the PA, just so you can have a better idea of what changes, if any, there are.
cbsharpe
Well-known member
Perfectly said dook!
cbsharpe
Well-known member
I would venture to say ARA. Too many positive logs and results with this compared to PA at this point in time.
raz_kaz248
Member
Invalid Link Removed
cbsharpe
Well-known member
Valid question but for a first time user, I think it's best to use one supplement to see how well, if any, your body responds to it.
ARA for me was awesome! Since I am a seasoned vet because I ran two cycles, I will combine it with another product like PA or HMB-FA and the likes.
kissdadookie
Well-known member
Tough question to answer TBH.
My PA experience thus far puts it at least on par with my first run of ArA but has been overall better than my second run of ArA. The difference between the first time I used ArA and the second time I used ArA really is that the first time I just took 1 gram ArA every day and I was on a 3 days lift 1 day no lift schedule. The second time I used ArA I was on a 5 days lift 1 day no lift schedule but I took it only on workout days @ 1.5 grams + LCLT (2-3 grams depending on the preworkout I was using) + GMS.
kissdadookie
Well-known member
Well, as you may have caught in my earlier post, I've given the whole LCLT + GMS with my ArA preworkout only protocol a good solid run and did not think highly of it and instead found daily dosing of 1 gram to work out better for myself, I might be an outlier
With that said, PA 30-60 minutes preworkout has worked great for me. I do this daily and on non-lift days, I still dose it before I go in to do my HIIT. I don't see anything that would inhibit it or make it more effective and there's also not much literature available pointing to what might potentiate it better. What I do know is that Dr. Wilson has done research with PA using sedentary people and have found that PA in the absence of strength training does not net any gains. Does this mean that one can use PA preworkout only? Perhaps, myself nor any current PA users have tried this yet that I'm aware of
SwolenONE
Board Sponsor
Great advice, use them all separately and see which works best for you!