Getting rid of gyno n getting bigger than IC.....if thats even possible.

bioman said:
I get no gyno reduction from either Havoc or Epistane. Initially, there is some reduction but then it tends to get worse. Formestane TD aggravates it as well. Had good reduction with 6-bromo and Toremifene.
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Total opposite for me. All that stuff helped my gyno with the exception of 6-bromo, which worsened it. :dunno:
 
yup, definately aggravated with aPCT for me too. That's why there's no protocol that works for everyone. We just have to experiment IMO.

Dw,
rock it at 50 brotha :head: should kick in quick IMO
 
celc5 said:
Dw,
rock it at 50 brotha :head: should kick in quick IMO
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I've gained 13lbs and gyno is gone!!!!!!!



















Not so much, ha. I bump'd the dose and feel....well normal. I did some cardio today and feel leaner :) always feel leaner after cardio. I think i've hit ketosis, my breathe is awful and my mouth tastes awful. Can't really get rid of it.
 
Distilled Water said:
I've gained 13lbs and gyno is gone!!!!!!!
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Dude... you couldn't have gained 13lbs in a day...

You'd have to be on a muscletech product for that!
I've heard you'll look just like Jay Cutler in 2 weeks.

;) I should be a rep
 
More cardio today. Weight is still sitting between 197-199ish. I look really flat but getting a little vascular, kind of odd.

It's starting to appear that I gained more abdominal fat than originally thought, unless im just that bloated in my stomach from creatine. I say this because my waist is sitting just under 33" now and abbs aren't really there like I thought they'd be.

O'well....only good advice my dad ever gave me was "You dont need a six-pack to hit a 90mph fastball"
 
Irish Cannon said:
Haha! That's the truth. I see plenty of baseball players with lil' guts on 'em. I wouldn't want that, but there's no reason to be Mr. Ripped all the time either.
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Yea actually most do, well the good ones anyways. I think it's because every ball player drinks....heavily, lol.

I pick'd up some USPowders DominATP....I'll be switching to the Palumbo (TKD) Here soon and thought it'd work well with my Intra-Workout shake. What do you guys think.

*Start stipping 30min pre-workout
500mg P-Slin
120gr WMS
3 scoops DominATP
Serving Size: 3 scoops (17 grams)
-Dicreatine Malate 4500 mg
-Beta Alanine 3000 mg
-Leucine 5000 mg
-Citrulline Malate 3500 mg
-Agmatine Sulfate 500 mg

I can still throw in another 6gr of somthing in there to get the quick absortion benifits from WMS weight in there? Any suggestions?
 
celc5 said:
120g WMS??? I'm NOT a believer
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I was taking a dump, thinking over this concoction, and I came to this same conclusion. The fact that you even mention you're not too happy with your belly/waist (or so it seems) makes me believe that you're crazy to even consider this.

I say 60g WMS...MAX! - Make up the rest in dry, ground, steel cut oats. - Look into LG's new Perfect Carb. I haven't used it yet due to my diet constraints, but the blend of WMS/Dextro/Malto is perfect.
 
Distilled Water said:
Really guy's? Even tho it's a TKD?

IC, that perfect carb sounds like you may need someone to test it? Hmmm, I think I know a guy :lol:
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Just because it's TKD doesn't mean you want a ton of WMS. Post-workout carbs, yes, but I'd recommend more quality carbs and only a little WMS.

That USP Mass Monster Shake thing is a crock. Nobody needs that much WMS unless you're on the Tour De France.
 
Irish Cannon said:
Just because it's TKD doesn't mean you want a ton of WMS. Post-workout carbs, yes, but I'd recommend more quality carbs and only a little WMS.

That USP Mass Monster Shake thing is a crock. Nobody needs that much WMS unless you're on the Tour De France.
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Speaking of which; did you notic Lance Armstrong is in the sponsored ad box a lot in this thread

I used the P-Slin shake last winter with Hydro-Isolate and WMS....I think it worked pretty well for me. Now I never went to the 200gr of carbs they were suggesting, 120 was tops for me. Usually closer to 80gr
 
Im packing my stuff up and getting ready to head back to school. I have some stuff here we had in storage for the past 3 years or so and I found some interesting stuff.

It was my measurements and workouts from 06'. Even a picture. I was a Fvkcin machine. I was in the middle of a contest prep when my training had some serious health issues. I was 4 weeks out so I scrapped the show and started bulking. From what I have writtin here I was 186lbs with a 31" (7%BF) waist and had 16 1/4" biceps and 13" forarms (other measurements are slightly smaller). Man those were the days, craziest thing was I was working 2 jobs at the time. Kind of depressing

Oh wait I know what I was doing right....I didn't have a girl friend :lol:
 
Sometimes looking back is just painful. I've made so many ups and downs, bro. It happens to all of us.

I used to Squat 315x15, and now I've got a busted back and can hardly put up 225x8. I used to bench 225x12, now I'm getting it for 3...I didn't have gyno for a year, now I do, and the only thing I've found to work is being taken off the market.

Yep, things are getting worse.
 
Distilled Water said:
I'm going to carb up some tonight. Probably like 500gr of carbs or so, probably going to be slightly more like a "**** load" but my diet has been on point for weeks on end and no real carbs in the past 8 or 9 days.
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Sounds like you need it! Don't want to lose muscle:147: I am carbing up today as well!
 
I can't even imagine 9 days without carbs, but I'll find out soon enough. I was supposed to start CKD on Monday, but I'm considering another week of TKD.
 
Irish Cannon said:
I can't even imagine 9 days without carbs, but I'll find out soon enough. I was supposed to start CKD on Monday, but I'm considering another week of TKD.
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If you trying to add lean mass I think TKD is the way to go. CKD are great for recomping, IMO.

After much debating I think CKD are too hard for dieting. They may work but mentally tough. Having no carbs and looking flat all the time is no easy go.
 
Distilled Water said:
If you trying to add lean mass I think TKD is the way to go. CKD are great for recomping, IMO.

After much debating I think CKD are too hard for dieting. They may work but mentally tough. Having no carbs and looking flat all the time is no easy go.
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Maybe I'll take this advice and stay TKD for a while. Do you still do re-feeds on TKD? I was considering on having a couple extra carb-meals today and possibly tomorrow.
 
Irish Cannon said:
Maybe I'll take this advice and stay TKD for a while. Do you still do re-feeds on TKD? I was considering on having a couple extra carb-meals today and possibly tomorrow.
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Yea I did, they were just smaller tho. I'd usually do them on wednsday and saturday. Like 300gr of carbs or so from oatmeal, borwn rice and sweet potatos and a cheat meal (but nothing to crazy).
 
I have to meat some friends at Whataburger for some group project (they have wifi there). I was going to get a couple chicken sandwiches. They actually serve them on whole wheat, so ya. :)
 
I'd like to do cardio tomorrow, but I'm not going to force myself. If I get up in time then I will. I'm not going to set my alarm for it, I'll put it that way. :D

Hey, did you see my 355lb deadlift? I know that's not a big deal, but I've got a busted back, and it felt freaking awesome to me. :lol:
 
Irish Cannon said:
I'd like to do cardio tomorrow, but I'm not going to force myself. If I get up in time then I will. I'm not going to set my alarm for it, I'll put it that way. :D

Hey, did you see my 355lb deadlift? I know that's not a big deal, but I've got a busted back, and it felt freaking awesome to me. :lol:
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No I havent, i'll just search my way over to your thread. 355 is legit tho busted back or not.

How you are about 2maro is kinda how I was today.

Oh side note. I woke up pretty vascular today, but if I would lose some BF my veins would pop out. Right not it's just some blue veins that peak out a little if I flex but thats all. I have no idea how or when I got these veins
 
Well I am all finished with Epistane and I am not at all impressed. Im am really disapointed. It had zero effects on me. Over the course of 8 weeks I made the same gains as I have before of diet and supps.

Measurements are all up about 1/4-1/2" and waist is down slightly but I cut back carbs and bloat has lessend a lot. Strength is up maybe 10-15lbs. Again, nothing earth shattering.

2maro I am going to start "cutting". I am having my diet done by a professional, Im not realy sure how they feel about me posting it on here. I worked with this same person years ago when I was in the best shape of my life so I know I am in good hands.

Here's a new link to me next log. Im looking at VAT Attack and Refresh

Invalid Link Removed
 
Irish Cannon said:
What was your dosing on it again? I didn't see anything until I hit 40mg and beyond (I've gone up to 60mg).
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It went like so....
20/20/30/30/40/40/50/50

If I have to dose 60mg on the stuff then it's just not worth it. Know what I mean? I could run anavar at 50mg/day for that price.
 
Distilled Water said:
I'd like to note, I saw much greater results form Prime and GHRP-6...oh and DT2010

My doses were all very mild. 6 Prime/day 5 on 2 off for 4 weeks, then bumped to 6/day ED. DT2010 I took 2-3caps/day and 100mcg GHRP-6 am/pm 5 on 2 off.
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That's cool to see better results off of natural (mostly) products. I'm excited for LG's GHRP product.

I'm currently using PRIME and liking the results. Dosing 6 on off days (2/2/2), 9 on training days (6/2/1)...training days I take 6 pre-workout. :twisted: - Still don't know if it's worth $50/btl though.

I'm about to add in 9g of HMB daily. I've still got a couple hundred grams left, so I figure I may as well use them...Hmm, or maybe I'll wait for PCT from my Epi/SD cycle. :dunno: - I start that Sept. 19th.

So when do our pictures go up? :D
 
Irish Cannon said:
So when do our pictures go up? :D
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Hows next weekend sound? Im just getting moved in right now but I should be good to go by next weekend. I orginally thought I'd be moved in last week but wasn't so lucky.

PS. HMB at higher doses, ~6gr/day, gave me the runs....good luck my man.
 
Distilled Water said:
Hows next weekend sound? Im just getting moved in right now but I should be good to go by next weekend. I orginally thought I'd be moved in last week but wasn't so lucky.

PS. HMB at higher doses, ~6gr/day, gave me the runs....good luck my man.
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Sounds good. I'll take them during my carb up. I'll probably be UTI at the time. :lol:

Ya, I was hitting 10g of HMB last time, but the doses were split. We'll see what happens.
 
IC,
I bridged from Havoc to SD. I went the whole way through the epithio with only lethargy. About 7 or 10 days into the SD bridge, I completely tanked in terms of motivation, drive, huge lethargy, non existant libido. Recovery was miserable with about a 3 week period before libido came back. HDL was still low a good 6 weeks post pct too. Just a warning from someone who's ran your stack.
 
celc5 said:
IC,
I bridged from Havoc to SD. I went the whole way through the epithio with only lethargy. About 7 or 10 days into the SD bridge, I completely tanked in terms of motivation, drive, huge lethargy, non existant libido. Recovery was miserable with about a 3 week period before libido came back. HDL was still low a good 6 weeks post pct too. Just a warning from someone who's ran your stack.
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What was your exact dosing? This is what I'll be running from Sept 19th thru Oct 30th:

Weeks 1-2: Epi @ 40mg, SD @ 2.5mg
Weeks 3-6: Epi @ 50mg, SD @ 2.5mg

Edit: I just did some calculations. 2.5mg of SD over 6 weeks comes out to 105mg. 30mg over 3 weeks comes out to 630mg, which is somewhat close to a normal cycle (I often see 20/30/30 or 30/30/30). That's a HUGE difference. Sheesh.

I think the low dose of SD should really keep the sides away. I guess we'll wait and see. Thanks for the input on the cycle. I still wish I would have asked you about HGW first! I'm still dealing with this nasty gyno from it. :(
 
I have no idea with your proposed dosing though. I suspect that you could "get away with" a little higher dosage without noticing any sides. But you think you'll still have any gains? I dunno, my opinion is that experimentation is for rats in labs, not for me :laugh:

I ran:
havoc 30/30/40/40
SD 0/0/0/10/20 then --->:toothache: SD is the most explosive compound I've ever touched, but it was NOT worth it to me. I suggest taking a look at epithio/19nor (aka spawn) stacks that are popular on just about every board as an alternative.
 
Irish Cannon said:
What was your exact dosing? This is what I'll be running from Sept 19th thru Oct 30th:

Weeks 1-2: Epi @ 40mg, SD @ 2.5mg
Weeks 3-6: Epi @ 50mg, SD @ 2.5mg

Edit: I just did some calculations. 2.5mg of SD over 6 weeks comes out to 105mg. 30mg over 3 weeks comes out to 630mg, which is somewhat close to a normal cycle (I often see 20/30/30 or 30/30/30). That's a HUGE difference. Sheesh.

I think the low dose of SD should really keep the sides away. I guess we'll wait and see. Thanks for the input on the cycle. I still wish I would have asked you about HGW first! I'm still dealing with this nasty gyno from it. :(
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f*ck superdrol. Its poison that makes you bigger. People forget the point that we are bodybuilding to be healthy. I took 10mg/day of m-drol for 1.5 weeks and had a liver ALT of 600, which later dropped back to 25 upon cessation.
 
monsterbox said:
f*ck superdrol. Its poison that makes you bigger. People forget the point that we are bodybuilding to be healthy. I took 10mg/day of m-drol for 1.5 weeks and had a liver ALT of 600, which later dropped back to 25 upon cessation.
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I think u may be a crazy case. I know of others who had their ranges peak to high 30's low 40's while on it and dropped down to mid 20's after a 4 week run. They were also taking cycle support, which they started before cycle.
 
monsterbox said:
f*ck superdrol. Its poison that makes you bigger. People forget the point that we are bodybuilding to be healthy. I took 10mg/day of m-drol for 1.5 weeks and had a liver ALT of 600, which later dropped back to 25 upon cessation.
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really? Maybe a lab mistake? Wouldn't your eyes and fingers be yellow before you hit anywhere close to that number :think:
 
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