1st PH Cycle H-DROL Need HELP

[Tone]

I would definitely use a SERM if I had the resources, but right now I have no idea how to get my hands on anything. Plus I have read, not sure its true, that you can't trust the quality of a SERM. Either way I am trying to get a good SERM source, because when I run things a little more harsh I will need it...just don't know where to look right now.

I was hoping bumping to 75 would make it kick in faster, since it won't i might just go ahead and go 50/50/75/75/75/100 make it a 5 week instead of a 6 week..... would bumping it to 100 week 5 and not having a 6 week make any difference?????

EDIT: 50/50/75/75/100

Instead of 50/50/75/75/75/75

 

[Tone]

DAY 9

Its day 9 already and so far not much change yet. I have bumped up to 75mg going to spread it out evenly 3 times a day. No noticable strength gains or size gains yet. My body weight is up about 2lbs so far. Still haven't lost much fat in my stomach althought my arms/shoulders are looking more lean.

Had some trouble sleeping the past few nights, kinda tossing and turning, might just be that it is getting warmer here in iowa now harder to fall asleep when its hot. I am really looking for some changes here in the next week or so!

Libido has been WAY up... and headahces are gone so right now there are no negative sides that I have seen.

 

[LAGear]

PCT:

Formex 50/50/25/25
Lean FX ... dosage?
PCT Assist ...dosage ?
THe PCT is what I am questioning there is so many combinations out there im not sure exactly what will work best...... Confused, need some advice...

I am going to use LX starting week 3.

Hey guys, cort control (Lean FX/Lean Xtreme) should be started on day one of PCT. I've been trying to get a straight answer about this because people recommend starting everywhere from day one to day 15. But I am confident that for almost any oral cort control should start on day one. Here is some very helpful information about this subject - Invalid Link Removed

Tone - I'm pretty sure that PCT Assist should be taken according to the directions on the bottle.

I'm doing my own log if anyone wants to follow. At this point there's not much more to my log than what I've already shared in this the thread but if anyone's interested here's my log - Invalid Link Removed

 

[Tone]

New Diet

I am going to do a new diet I think. I really want to cut out this body fat of mine, basically the reason I am taking this PH is because I want to cut and keep my muscle. My new diet will consist of this.

5:30 Apple, protein shake w/ oatmeal, 4 strips turkey bacon

9:00 Protein Shake/ turkey roll

10:30 1/2 Turkey on wheat
PB on wheat
Apple
2:00 3 cans tuna mix (boiled eggs, onions, pickles, 1tbs mayo)
3:00 Handful Almonds
6:00 Protein Shake
7:00 Dinner - Usually chicken or Lean Beef and vegetables.

Just around 2,000 cals
200g protein
150g carb
80g Fat

my maintenance cals is 2,800

 

[GMG760]

I am going to do a new diet I think. I really want to cut out this body fat of mine, basically the reason I am taking this PH is because I want to cut and keep my muscle. My new diet will consist of this.

5:30 Apple, protein shake w/ oatmeal, 4 strips turkey bacon

9:00 Protein Shake/ turkey roll

10:30 1/2 Turkey on wheat
PB on wheat
Apple
2:00 3 cans tuna mix (boiled eggs, onions, pickles, 1tbs mayo)
3:00 Handful Almonds
6:00 Protein Shake
7:00 Dinner - Usually chicken or Lean Beef and vegetables.

Just around 2,000 cals
200g protein
150g carb
80g Fat

my maintenance cals is 2,800

Start closer to maintenance and gradually lower 100-200 calories a week. Dropping 800 right away is gonna be a pretty big shock to the system and your metabolism may not react the way that you are expecting it to.

 

[mathis50262]

^^^^^^X2^^^^^^

 

[LAGear]

Start closer to maintenance and gradually lower 100-200 calories a week. Dropping 800 right away is gonna be a pretty big shock to the system and your metabolism may not react the way that you are expecting it to.

Good advice.

Also think about upping your cardio to burn more cals.

I'm not sure it's ever a good idea to be 30% below maintenance while you're using steroids and weight training.

 

[Tone]

Day14

Ok, so here are some updates fellas,

Today is day 14, and honestly the last two days i have been on edge like i never have before. I am having the worst mood swings ever, i feel like a chick. It is either my hormones changing or im just pissed off for no reason. Either way I feel like I am invincible, Its like I am getting ready for a football game all day long..... last night i slept for 13 hours.... woke up ready to just kill somebody, and i don't know why. I did take saturday off from working out.

I don't think I have been this horny since i was about 16.... no strength gains yet though... weight has gone up a few lbs, and i think i have lost some bf.

Tomorrow is the start of week 3 and I honestly think it just started kicking in yesterday! we'll see how things go this week, hope my attitude calms down a little though, cuz me and my fiance aren't talking right now since everything she does is pissing me off...... any advice for that???? lol j/k i can handle that.. i hope....

 

[GMG760]

Ok, so here are some updates fellas,

Today is day 14, and honestly the last two days i have been on edge like i never have before. I am having the worst mood swings ever, i feel like a chick. It is either my hormones changing or im just pissed off for no reason. Either way I feel like I am invincible, Its like I am getting ready for a football game all day long..... last night i slept for 13 hours.... woke up ready to just kill somebody, and i don't know why. I did take saturday off from working out.

I don't think I have been this horny since i was about 16.... no strength gains yet though... weight has gone up a few lbs, and i think i have lost some bf.

Tomorrow is the start of week 3 and I honestly think it just started kicking in yesterday! we'll see how things go this week, hope my attitude calms down a little though, cuz me and my fiance aren't talking right now since everything she does is pissing me off...... any advice for that???? lol j/k i can handle that.. i hope....

Just take a few deep breaths and remind yourself that you are on cycle... people get more agitated on cycle. It's pretty easy to control once you remember why you are getting angry.

 

[LAGear]

Hey guys, cort control (Lean FX/Lean Xtreme) should be started on day one of PCT. I've been trying to get a straight answer about this because people recommend starting everywhere from day one to day 15. But I am confident that for almost any oral cort control should start on day one. Here is some very helpful information about this subject - Invalid Link Removed

This is so damn confusing.

So maybe cort control should be started in the third week after all. Check out this post - Invalid Link Removed

So now there are good arguments for starting cort control on day one and in week three.

I don't know what to do. Just wanted to post this update since I gave one side of the argument, I wanted to give the other view for anyone who is researching this subject.

 

[GMG760]

I always have thought to start during week 3. This week 1 stuff is new to me.

 

[Tone]

UPDATE!

Ok, so my first workout on the first day of week 3 and I have an update:

I broke through my 3 week plateau and set a PR on bench today - went up 15lbs in my workout since last week, and i can tell you it felt GREAT! I coudln't even believe it, I had a spotter and everytihg, didn't even need it till my final set... .I am feeling on top of the world today fellas... just thought i'd share that with ya..

 

[LAGear]

Good job bro!

Hey, I noticed in your first post that you weren't sure about LX dosing. I had the same question when I started my log. It should be taken three caps ED. The advice I was given is "Cortisol spikes in the morning and again around noon so these are good times for the first 2 doses. Take your 3rd daily dose post workout." It was discussed in my log in case you missed it.

HTH

 

[Tone]

Good job bro!

Hey, I noticed in your first post that you weren't sure about LX dosing. I had the same question when I started my log. It should be taken three caps ED. The advice I was given is "Cortisol spikes in the morning and again around noon so these are good times for the first 2 doses. Take your 3rd daily dose post workout." It was discussed in my log in case you missed it.

HTH

Thanks man, I really appreciate you giving me the heads up. Are you using Lean Xtreme or Lean FX? Do you know what the difference is, they are both cort blockers aren't they?

 

[Gym4Life]

hey tone how is your cycle going ???? your taking h drol right ???? are you looking bigger ??? and have you lost any bodyfat ??? good luck my man !!!

 

[LAGear]

Thanks man, I really appreciate you giving me the heads up. Are you using Lean Xtreme or Lean FX? Do you know what the difference is, they are both cort blockers aren't they?

I'm using LX.

I think they are both good but more people seem to recommend and use LX. That's impressive because unlike EVERY other friggin supplement there aren't any DS reps pushing their product on AM. So the fact that there are so many people recommending LX without the influence of reps is quite impressive.

Sometimes it can be really hard to get straight information on this site because of the prevalence of product reps.

 

[Gym4Life]

hey tone by the way just to let you know i have decided to run a six weeks of H-drol with 4 or maybe 6 weeks of furazadrol along with a tropical fat loss spray from PP.

I will pm you with a link to my log when i start !!! my aim is to get as cut as possible also.

 

[LAGear]

Hey, I noticed in your first post that you weren't sure about LX dosing. I had the same question when I started my log. It should be taken three caps ED. The advice I was given is "Cortisol spikes in the morning and again around noon so these are good times for the first 2 doses. Take your 3rd daily dose post workout." It was discussed in my log in case you missed it.

HTH

Scratch that.

I'm still undecided. Dr.D who is very reputable gives much different advice. Frustrating because his advice is very very different.

I shouldn't have posted the above but I'm having a hard time keeping everything straight.

 

[Tone]

hey tone how is your cycle going ???? your taking h drol right ???? are you looking bigger ??? and have you lost any bodyfat ??? good luck my man !!!

whats up, thanks for checking in on me. my cycle is going good, im about mid way through my 3rd week and i am looking pumped brother. Haven't lost much BF yet, and haven't gained any weight. my muscles look way leaner and stay pumped all day long. Its a great feeling man, it really does kick in about 3rd week.... now i am gonna go another 2 weeks i can't wait, i think week 5 im gonna kick it up to 100mg a day

 

[Gym4Life]

whats up, thanks for checking in on me. my cycle is going good, im about mid way through my 3rd week and i am looking pumped brother. Haven't lost much BF yet, and haven't gained any weight. my muscles look way leaner and stay pumped all day long. Its a great feeling man, it really does kick in about 3rd week.... now i am gonna go another 2 weeks i can't wait, i think week 5 im gonna kick it up to 100mg a day

wow nice one i dont expect to gain much from hdrol but hoping to lower bodyfat and see some real good workouts.

the fact your pumped all day shows its working you must be getting vascular.

Have you had any kinds of sides while on it ???? or when you bump it up anymore sides or just a better feeling.

great log btw cant wait to hear your end results.

 

[Tone]

wow nice one i dont expect to gain much from hdrol but hoping to lower bodyfat and see some real good workouts.

the fact your pumped all day shows its working you must be getting vascular.

Have you had any kinds of sides while on it ???? or when you bump it up anymore sides or just a better feeling.

great log btw cant wait to hear your end results.

Only sides I have had are a little on edge, but only somedays, other days it doesn't seem like that at all. Headaches when i upped the dose, but that is from not drinking enough water. so make sure you are getting enough water....Had some breakouts, but that has been taken care of.

I have been really really sore the day after my workouts, I haven't been this sore in awhile, i think i am realizing why they call it "dry" been experiencing some dull pain in my scapula/biceps/knees... some lethargy but all of these sides are very minor and i wouldn't notice them if i wasn't so concious about logging stuff like this....

but yeah the pumps are great man my shoulders/traps/arms have gotten noticably larger... back has been feeling exteremely wide that past few days, and i can't stop flexing every muscle in my body hahahaha... just feeling very lean. I love hdrol so far,- strength gains in bench was a breakthrough, had been at a plateau and just busted through that this week... so yeah, only good things to say about it really.

About to go kill my legs in a few hours, this should be fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Ubiyca]

Only sides I have had are a little on edge, but only somedays, other days it doesn't seem like that at all. Headaches when i upped the dose, but that is from not drinking enough water. so make sure you are getting enough water....Had some breakouts, but that has been taken care of.

I have been really really sore the day after my workouts, I haven't been this sore in awhile, i think i am realizing why they call it "dry" been experiencing some dull pain in my scapula/biceps/knees... some lethargy but all of these sides are very minor and i wouldn't notice them if i wasn't so concious about logging stuff like this....

but yeah the pumps are great man my shoulders/traps/arms have gotten noticably larger... back has been feeling exteremely wide that past few days, and i can't stop flexing every muscle in my body hahahaha... just feeling very lean. I love hdrol so far,- strength gains in bench was a breakthrough, had been at a plateau and just busted through that this week... so yeah, only good things to say about it really.

About to go kill my legs in a few hours, this should be fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

what dosage u running bro?

how are erections? enhanced or worse?

 

[Tone]

what dosage u running bro?

how are erections? enhanced or worse?

Im midway through week 3 im dosing 50/75/75/75/100

erections and libido dramatically enhanced for the first 3 weeks, , increase starting to tapper off now, but its still up from the beginning.

 

[Ubiyca]

Im midway through week 3 im dosing 50/75/75/75/100

erections and libido dramatically enhanced for the first 3 weeks, , increase starting to tapper off now, but its still up from the beginning.

HELL YEAH BABY



SWEET!

thx dude

anything else u wanna say plz feel free, even tiny little details..

:thanks::wave2:

 

[Gym4Life]

Only sides I have had are a little on edge, but only somedays, other days it doesn't seem like that at all. Headaches when i upped the dose, but that is from not drinking enough water. so make sure you are getting enough water....Had some breakouts, but that has been taken care of.

I have been really really sore the day after my workouts, I haven't been this sore in awhile, i think i am realizing why they call it "dry" been experiencing some dull pain in my scapula/biceps/knees... some lethargy but all of these sides are very minor and i wouldn't notice them if i wasn't so concious about logging stuff like this....

but yeah the pumps are great man my shoulders/traps/arms have gotten noticably larger... back has been feeling exteremely wide that past few days, and i can't stop flexing every muscle in my body hahahaha... just feeling very lean. I love hdrol so far,- strength gains in bench was a breakthrough, had been at a plateau and just busted through that this week... so yeah, only good things to say about it really.

About to go kill my legs in a few hours, this should be fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

nice one man !!! 1 last question for you will their be any before or after pics ????

Even if you cant get before pics some after ones would be great

 

[Tone]

nice one man !!! 1 last question for you will their be any before or after pics ????

Even if you cant get before pics some after ones would be great

Yeah man, I have before pics, so i will definitely post them with the afters!!!

 

[Tone]

Start of week 4

Today is the start of week 4 and I have to say that the most noticable thing is how lean my muscles are and how hard they stay all day long. Im loving it, I wish I could be on hdrol the rest of my life

one other note is that my weight is up 5lbs since week 1, and im guessing its not fat! I will have some pictures up tonight or possibly tomorrow!

 

[Tone]

by the way i am bumping up to 100mg starting today.. so weeks 4 and 5 will be 100 now i have done 50/75/75/100/100

 

[Gym4Life]

Today is the start of week 4 and I have to say that the most noticable thing is how lean my muscles are and how hard they stay all day long. Im loving it, I wish I could be on hdrol the rest of my life

one other note is that my weight is up 5lbs since week 1, and im guessing its not fat! I will have some pictures up tonight or possibly tomorrow!

wow five pounds thats great news mate and it must be lean muscle if you feel leaner and harder good work man. ad look forward to the pictures.

by the way i am bumping up to 100mg starting today.. so weeks 4 and 5 will be 100 now i have done 50/75/75/100/100

nice keep us posted on this let us know if you feel any sides now you bumped it up or let us know if you feeling like superman lol.

good luck mate.

 

[LAGear]

by the way i am bumping up to 100mg starting today.. so weeks 4 and 5 will be 100 now i have done 50/75/75/100/100

Hey bro, what was your reason for bumping up to 100?

I haven't found anything that says you get better gains by going over 75. At 100 ED you're going to burn through a lot of caps that you can use on another cycle.

Unless you've found convincing evidence that 100 is better. I've got a week left and I'm open to bumping my cycle up if I can find a good reason to do it.

 

[Gym4Life]

Hey bro, what was your reason for bumping up to 100?

I haven't found anything that says you get better gains by going over 75. At 100 ED you're going to burn through a lot of caps that you can use on another cycle.

Unless you've found convincing evidence that 100 is better. I've got a week left and I'm open to bumping my cycle up if I can find a good reason to do it.

actually i have read quite a few logs where people say when they have bumped it up to 100mgs they have got alot better gains ..... some even went to 125 or 150 not first time users though....

I guess if you can tolerate the sides or get no sides and your not gaining much on 50 or 75 no more i see no reason not to try 100mg

i think i would deff try 100mg on my last week but i guess the fifth week would be tempting aswell.

 

[LAGear]

actually i have read quite a few logs where people say when they have bumped it up to 100mgs they have got alot better gains ..... some even went to 125 or 150 not first time users though....

I guess if you can tolerate the sides or get no sides and your not gaining much on 50 or 75 no more i see no reason not to try 100mg

i think i would deff try 100mg on my last week but i guess the fifth week would be tempting aswell.

I'd like to see these logs.

The only way for someone to accurately make this assessment is if they ran a cycle without going over 75 and then ran another cycle going to 100 or 125. If someone is basing their opinion on the results of one cycle they have no idea if the changes are from the increased dosage.

I had no results for three weeks of my cycle. I got results in week four. After three weeks I was frustrated and I was tempted to bump up my dosage; if I had done that it'd be easy to say my gains were a result of the higher dosage when in fact that would have had nothing to do with it.

Here's something to chew on - Invalid Link Removed. Two different CEL reps advise against going over 75. Don't you think if it was a good idea to go over 75 CEL's own reps would encourage it to get people to use more product.

 

[Tone]

Hey bro, what was your reason for bumping up to 100?

I haven't found anything that says you get better gains by going over 75. At 100 ED you're going to burn through a lot of caps that you can use on another cycle.

Unless you've found convincing evidence that 100 is better. I've got a week left and I'm open to bumping my cycle up if I can find a good reason to do it.

I like to live on the edge, so I want to hit 100 just to see what it feels like, maybe i will tell a difference maybe i won't - but i still want to know. but i know that some people have gone over 100, so i know that it isn't going to kill me. I hope!

I just opened my second bottle and saw all of those pills, i just wanted to eat them all at once. I figure since i am cutting my cycle down to just 5 weeks as opposed to the 6 weeks i wanted to do, i figured i would just bump it up this week and have a little fun for the last 2 weeks.

I will let you guys know for sure if i think it was a good idea or not

 

[LAGear]

I like to live on the edge, so I want to hit 100 just to see what it feels like, maybe i will tell a difference maybe i won't - but i still want to know. but i know that some people have gone over 100, so i know that it isn't going to kill me. I hope!

I just opened my second bottle and saw all of those pills, i just wanted to eat them all at once. I figure since i am cutting my cycle down to just 5 weeks as opposed to the 6 weeks i wanted to do, i figured i would just bump it up this week and have a little fun for the last 2 weeks.

I will let you guys know for sure if i think it was a good idea or not

Just make sure you read what the CEL reps said. Doesn't sound like there's any benefit over 75. And since you've never done week 4-5 @ 75 there is no way for you to know if there is any difference between 75 or 100. So then next time you do a cycle you'll do 100 again (or more) even if you can't say for sure that it made a difference.

You're messing with hormones and your endocrine system here, this is serious stuff. You should play it safe, this isn't like living on the edge by using an extra scoop of N.O.-Xplode. My .02.

 

[Tone]

Just make sure you read what the CEL reps said. Doesn't sound like there's any benefit over 75. And since you've never done week 4-5 @ 75 there is no way for you to know if there is any difference between 75 or 100. So then next time you do a cycle you'll do 100 again (or more) even if you can't say for sure that it made a difference.

You're messing with hormones and your endocrine system here, this is serious stuff. You should play it safe, this isn't like living on the edge by using an extra scoop of N.O.-Xplode. My .02.

More like doing 4-6 grams of cocaine in a night, that type of living on the edge??? how about staying up 7 days doing meth??? how about taking 5 pills of ecstacy the first time I ever rolled...

I understand what you are saying, but thats not me, i don't like to play it safe, if i didn't bump it up to 100 i would be pissed at myself for not trying, i did it at 75 for 2 weeks, now im gonna try 100.

I appreciate your input, and i know you are trying to look out for me here, I should listen to your advice and just stay at 75 but what the hell, ya only live once, right???? you might be kicking yourself wondering why you DIDN'T go to 100 when your cycle is done. I don't want to be in that position.

 

[Tone]

HELL YEAH BABY



SWEET!

thx dude

anything else u wanna say plz feel free, even tiny little details..

:thanks::wave2:

Im 3rd day of week 4 and have now noticed that my libido has gone down a tad. No more morning wood, no more feeling like a horny 17 year old all day.. I used to sit around and look at every chick and be like "man, I want to **** her" well i guess i still do that.... but not the ugly ones anymore like i was for the first few weeks.... maybe its just cause im tired, or cause i just bumped up my dosage... BUT im hoping this is just a rut im in and my libido picks back up like it was before.....

sex is pretty amazing still, i feel like i cum about a gallon - thats awsesome, still having rock hard erections, but takes some work getting it up now.

 

[mathis50262]

More like doing 4-6 grams of cocaine in a night, that type of living on the edge??? how about staying up 7 days doing meth??? how about taking 5 pills of ecstacy the first time I ever rolled...

I understand what you are saying, but thats not me, i don't like to play it safe, if i didn't bump it up to 100 i would be pissed at myself for not trying, i did it at 75 for 2 weeks, now im gonna try 100.

I appreciate your input, and i know you are trying to look out for me here, I should listen to your advice and just stay at 75 but what the hell, ya only live once, right???? you might be kicking yourself wondering why you DIDN'T go to 100 when your cycle is done. I don't want to be in that position.

5 on your first roll... Nice.. That shyt is wicked! One night i dropped 13, not to mention it was my last night!!!! It was like my finger was in a light socket all night.

 

[morbo]

Hey dude since you have change your cycle quite a few times now....How is your PCT is it still the same?

 

[Tone]

5 on your first roll... Nice.. That shyt is wicked! One night i dropped 13, not to mention it was my last night!!!! It was like my finger was in a light socket all night.

hell yeah man, i haven't done that **** for a long time.....

Hey dude since you have change your cycle quite a few times now....How is your PCT is it still the same?

same PCT

Formex
PCT assist
Lean Fx

also throwing in some:
Fenugreek
Creatine

 

[GMG760]

I personally don't think there is anything wrong with going up to 100mg if you have done a cycle before and you weigh 190+ lbs. Reps for companies like that can't give advice and then go and get you hurt... it's way to much of a liability.

That being said, you probably don't NEED the 100mg. But if you do go to 100mg please do yourself a favor and use a SERM for PCT. PM me if you need advice on that.

5 rolls on your first time? Holy sh*t... that brings back bad memories from college... my brain quivers just thinking about it.

 

[Tone]

Day 27 is today -- Since I have bumped up to 100mgs been feeling awesome, probably not because of bumping up have had great workouts this week, feeling a pump all day long. One thing to note is that whenever I do shoulders, and this has happened the last 2 weeks... I will get like a super dull pain in my left scapula area, it hurts pretty bad it just feels dry like and dull, but hurts pretty bad only for a few mintues after each set. Not sure why just figured I'd note that.

Also, my diet has not been very clean so im pretty sure my bf% hasn't gone down much if any, but i know i am getting more vascular and my muscles are getting very lean.

Another note is that i believe i am developing gyno. I am pretty sure I had a slight case of it before, and now it is just starting to get worse. Either it is gyno or just the fact that i am fat in my chest area, but im pretty sure it is gyno but really only in my left nipple, and it is just kind of puffy, not sensitive at all and there are no hard lumps or anything under it, just really puffy and almost feel like boobs.... so I am definitely going to get a serm for PCT now. just wonderng if this will help my "gyno case" if you can even call it that.... disappear?????? Im not too worried about it right now because it doesn't really look all that bad except when I sit kind of hunched up i can tell but again it might just be that i am fat in that area, but i honestly don't know. and its only in my left one!!!!

other than my possible gyno flair up everything is going smooth..

 

[LAGear]

Day 27 is today -- Since I have bumped up to 100mgs been feeling awesome, probably not because of bumping up have had great workouts this week, feeling a pump all day long. One thing to note is that whenever I do shoulders, and this has happened the last 2 weeks... I will get like a super dull pain in my left scapula area, it hurts pretty bad it just feels dry like and dull, but hurts pretty bad only for a few mintues after each set. Not sure why just figured I'd note that.

Also, my diet has not been very clean so im pretty sure my bf% hasn't gone down much if any, but i know i am getting more vascular and my muscles are getting very lean.

Another note is that i believe i am developing gyno. I am pretty sure I had a slight case of it before, and now it is just starting to get worse. Either it is gyno or just the fact that i am fat in my chest area, but im pretty sure it is gyno but really only in my left nipple, and it is just kind of puffy, not sensitive at all and there are no hard lumps or anything under it, just really puffy and almost feel like boobs.... so I am definitely going to get a serm for PCT now. just wonderng if this will help my "gyno case" if you can even call it that.... disappear?????? Im not too worried about it right now because it doesn't really look all that bad except when I sit kind of hunched up i can tell but again it might just be that i am fat in that area, but i honestly don't know. and its only in my left one!!!!

other than my possible gyno flair up everything is going smooth..

If you think you are getting gyno and you have less than a week left on your cycle I'd consider ending it right away.

Despite some of the things you read here gyno is irreversible without surgery. And if you don't think it looks bad now it will when you get lean, it will be more pronounced.

That's my take because I'm super paranoid about gyno. There's a gyno stickie, you should give it a read.

 

[KgTomCat]

just a pick, we'll know if its gyno or not

 

[Ubiyca]

If you weren't getting gyno I would say get some Clomid for PCT but you would have to get some Nolva now IMO if you wanna be safe as far as doing your best to get rid of that gyno

 

[KgTomCat]

If you weren't getting gyno I would say get some Clomid for PCT but you would have to get some Nolva now IMO if you wanna be safe as far as doing your best to get rid of that gyno

what is the difference between Nolva and Clomid?

 

[Ubiyca]

what is the difference between Nolva and Clomid?

Nolva is stronger at fixing gyno because of it's more potent effects in breast tissue but both are good to bring natural test levels back up.

Clomid is better overall IMO because it's less toxic.

 

[KgTomCat]

Nolva is stronger at fixing gyno because of it's more potent effects in breast tissue but both are good to bring natural test levels back up.

Clomid is better overall IMO because it's less toxic.

o ok, I've only used Nolva for my PCT with my cycles, but may try Clomid this time, thanks man

 

[LAGear]

o ok, I've only used Nolva for my PCT with my cycles, but may try Clomid this time, thanks man

Tom - Unless you really know and trust someone, don't take anyone's advice without getting it backed up.

Nolva is not stronger at preventing gyno. Nolva can actually make you more susceptible to gyno with with progestin gear. And if you're getting gyno symptoms from a progestin then taking Nolva can make it worse. So Nolva has to be selectively used. OTOH one of the potential side effects of Clomid is visual impairment and I believe it's more toxic than Nolva (not sure about toxicity). That's why I will never touch Clomid.

If you can get Torem and are willing to spend a few more bucks it really seems like the way to go. If anyone wants to discuss this further it should be moved to another thread because we're thread jacking Tone's log.

 

[Ubiyca]

Tom - Unless you really know and trust someone, don't take anyone's advice without getting it backed up.

Nolva is not stronger at preventing gyno. Nolva can actually make you more susceptible to gyno with with progestin gear. And if you're getting gyno symptoms from a progestin then taking Nolva can make it worse. So Nolva has to be selectively used. OTOH one of the potential side effects of Clomid is visual impairment and I believe it's more toxic than Nolva (not sure about toxicity). That's why I will never touch Clomid.

If you can get Torem and are willing to spend a few more bucks it really seems like the way to go. If anyone wants to discuss this further it should be moved to another thread because we're thread jacking Tone's log.

He can google it and see for himself, or just go on M&M forums, very knowledgeable guys on there.

Nolva IS stronger and is recommended OVER clomid if any gyno flares up on cycle/PCT followed by use of an AI, this is one of the reasons people prefer it over clomid, for this reason alone, so I dunno what you're smoking.

One of the RARE side effects of clomid is visual impairment (which if you get it, goes away after stopping use, it's not irrevesible like some think, and again, this is a rare side effect)

How can you even believe Nolva is less toxic than Clomid? That's not even up for debate at this point.. Nolva is more toxic, however clomid isn't the healthiest compound, it is surely less toxic than Nolva, I've done enough reading to know that for certain 100%.

 

[KgTomCat]

I've used Nolva, never had any problems...