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Anderson v thalies-5 round snoozfest

Mulletsoldier said:
Silva has phenomenal BJJ as well; certainly good enough to pursue Thales on the ground.
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But then that would be deviating from your Gameplan. If you're a 10 on standup and your opponent is a 4, and he's a 10 on the ground and you're a 7, where would your gameplan be? Would you really give up 9 points of advantage up? If he can't take you down I don't see any reason to just follow him to the ground and give him the advantage on that fight.

I'd rather see TL be more active on trying to FORCE him to the ground rather than just falling on his back and hoping Anderson would willingly follow him.
 
I haven't seen the injury reports, but I can confidently say that the standing side kicks to Leites' knee caused some internal damage that hindered his burst and knee stability.
 
Rodja said:
I haven't seen the injury reports, but I can confidently say that the standing side kicks to Leites' knee caused some internal damage that hindered his burst and knee stability.
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I wouldn't doubt that. Good game plan on Anderson's part to attack the knee to negate the takedown attempts.

Anderson definitely has to be a good fighter, and I do think it's within his right to do whatever he wants in the ring, even if that's just boring, defensive time wasting. Bottom line - he won. He defended his title.

BUT - I would send him a message by putting his next fight on the undercard. There is no way he deserves to be the main event. A win is still a win, whether it be the undercard or the main event, which is all Anderson seems to want now. But not all wins are worthy of the main event.

Perhaps Dana should restructure his payscale. Lower the payment for for winning/losing, but add in extra bonuses for entertainment value, based on different judges. GSP posts wins just like Anderson, but leaves no question on his victory and is extremely entertaining.

BTW - I am no MMA expert by any means, but if Cote hadn't injured his knee and the fight kept going the way it was going, I would have given the victory to Cote. I'm in the minority there, but that's how I saw the fight.
 
bla55 said:
But then that would be deviating from your Gameplan. If you're a 10 on standup and your opponent is a 4, and he's a 10 on the ground and you're a 7, where would your gameplan be? Would you really give up 9 points of advantage up? If he can't take you down I don't see any reason to just follow him to the ground and give him the advantage on that fight.

I'd rather see TL be more active on trying to FORCE him to the ground rather than just falling on his back and hoping Anderson would willingly follow him.
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That is relativizing the situation, and reducing it to merely a combination of the parts; that is not the case.

The point is this: Anderson's BJJ is by far and away competent enough to have assumed a position in Thales' guard to begin a GnP if he chose to; he did not.

Listen, when even Dana White, the most shameless self-promoting, detached from reality, thinking-UFC-fighters-are-the-greatest-ever person on this planet can admit Anderson's performances have been embarrassing, I think we can drop the, "It was his gameplan charade". It was a lackluster performance, which should have been a dominating performance given his last fight.

I am not thinking merely in terms of entertainment, but sheer dominance [or lack thereof]. The best P4P fighter in the world tailors his game to his opponents [see: Fedor and GSP], and wins the fight - not just survives it.
 
Sunder said:
BTW - I am no MMA expert by any means, but if Cote hadn't injured his knee and the fight kept going the way it was going, I would have given the victory to Cote. I'm in the minority there, but that's how I saw the fight.
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I cannot say you are in the complete minority. Cote was more engaging, controlled the Octagon and had effective striking. I had him up in each of the three rounds.
 
I'm always disappointed in the champion when he does not finish the fight, but it's even worse when it happens in this fashion.

This fight was almost as bad as AA/Sylvia III.
 
Was there even any point where TL was bringing his legs up (like BJ did) where it slid off in the fight?
 
I think Thales is much more to blame for the sorry ass fight. He ran away all day, and he threw himself on the floor any time Silva threw a strike regardless of it hitting him or not. I saw Silva dancing, but at the same time I saw him pursuing the entire fight. He's never been a ground and pound type of fighter. And, he's always been big on counter striking.

What do you guys want him to do? Start out with same David Louasiou type of kicks?

It takes two people to fight guys.
 
I do agree that TL is more to blame. His performance was almost as bad as that Kalib Starnes debacle. However, Anderson should have been more assertive and pushed to end the fight.
 
Emerge said:
I think Thales is much more to blame for the sorry ass fight. He ran away all day, and he threw himself on the floor any time Silva threw a strike regardless of it hitting him or not. I saw Silva dancing, but at the same time I saw him pursuing the entire fight. He's never been a ground and pound type of fighter. And, he's always been big on counter striking.

What do you guys want him to do? Start out with same David Louasiou type of kicks?

It takes two people to fight guys.
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Adaptation: heard of it?

–noun
1. the act of adapting.

–verb (used without object)
2. to adjust oneself to different conditions, environment, etc.

I want Anderson to do what every other successful fighter does: adapt to his opponent and press the action. Not every fighter is going to be Leben and Franklin who aimlessly meander into Anderson's strike-range, and I would enjoy him realizing that.
 
Thanks, I really needed that definition. *******.

Comparing Leben to Thales is absurd. Thales didn't want to fight. Period. End of story.
 
Emerge said:
Thanks, I really needed that definition. *******.

Comparing Leben to Thales is absurd. Thales didn't want to fight. Period. End of story.
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Calm down, pumpkin; a bit ridiculous to get so excited over a simple forum post.

Now, despite the fact you have mastered the sacred art of multiple period use [Really. Great. Stuff], that is not the end of the story: Thales did not want to fight, but Anderson passed up a great many opportunities to engage. Period. End of story.

I was also not making a comparison between Thales and Leben, but alluding to Anderson's new found passivity. If you untwisted your panties long enough to read the post you would have seen that.
 
Emerge said:
I think Thales is much more to blame for the sorry ass fight. He ran away all day, and he threw himself on the floor any time Silva threw a strike regardless of it hitting him or not. I saw Silva dancing, but at the same time I saw him pursuing the entire fight. He's never been a ground and pound type of fighter. And, he's always been big on counter striking.

What do you guys want him to do? Start out with same David Louasiou type of kicks?

It takes two people to fight guys.
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agreed.
 
Mulletsoldier said:
Calm down, pumpkin; a bit ridiculous to get so excited over a simple forum post.

Now, despite the fact you have mastered the sacred art of multiple period use [Really. Great. Stuff], that is not the end of the story: Thales did not want to fight, but Anderson passed up a great many opportunities to engage. Period. End of story.

I was also not making a comparison between Thales and Leben, but alluding to Anderson's new found passivity. If you untwisted your panties long enough to read the post you would have seen that.
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I am excitable, and I don't appreciate being disrespected on the internet nor off. I would like to get the same respect I give. I certainly don't want to come here to be disrespected by an immature person regardless of how high they believe their "intellect" to be. You don't impress me. You are not my English professor, and therefore I have no need to proceed with proper grammar usage.

Rather, I use words and punctuation to express what it would sound like coming out of my mouth. Okay? Does. That. Make. ANY. Sense. To. You? I can explain if need be, let me know.

Perhaps if you took the time to reread my original post you would see that I said Thales deserves most of the blame. I took the liberty to underline it so that you wouldn't miss it this time around.

I didn't say Silva fought great or that he didn't share some of the blame. But, he did more to get the fight going than did Thales. According to your last post you agree. So, why not drop the attitude and engage in proper discussion rather than making irrelevant and unneeded post? Okay, pumpkin? Thank you.
 
I dont think you realize his goal was to win the fight, and he did so. He probably feels he has nothign to apologize for and if you only watch MMA for the KOs, you dont appreciate fighting for **** anyways.
 
SamuraiSid said:
I think a lot of you guys *but not all of you) should take a few BJJ lessons.
I completely understand that the fight may not have been flashy and much to look at, but you have to remember that the UFC and MMA in general is a SPORT. Silva did exactly what he had to do to win. Leites is a BJJ world champion (It seems like everyone in the ufc is...) and Anderson "The Spider" Silva, A Muay Thai expert.

When was the last time you heard an NFL fan complain when the QB takes a knee,

when his team is winning, and there is 30 seconds left in the game?

Silva Vs. Leites was a very techincal, although like I said earlier, I agree to the general population it wasnt much to look at. Leites didnt want to get into a brawl, because he knew that Silva would have destroyed him. Silva didnt want to go to the ground because he is a stand up fighter.
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I complain each and every time. I always yell, "go play flag football you pu$$y" even though I realize the strategic wisdom in doing so. Even so, I dont like it when my QB takes the home run slide before contact and it REALLY bugs me when it's the other team.

Earning a non-contact with a juke is one thing, but home run sliding? Though I understand it, I'll NEVER like it. Don't want to get hit, put on some flags.

When the team is winning with 30 seconds left, that I can understand, but 5 rounds of track & field isn't the same as the last 30 seconds.

Back to MMA.
 
Emerge said:
....
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Are you finished? Hopefully you are.

I could care less about your grammar or your mannerisms, and; given the fact you are throwing a tantrum about a simple post, I think it's pretty damn clear who is immature in this situation. By the way, I was making fun of your internet tough-guy manner with the punctuation, not the syntax - good on you for that pick up.

I could also give a flying **** whether or not my "intellect" impresses some twirp in the MMA section of an internet forum. I apologize if your contrived and ridiculous little diatribe here did not have the scathing effect you intended. "Totally owned that guy bro - you called him pumpkin back, whoa bro!".

Now, if you read my posts on this topic - a task I am going to assume is difficult for you in between changing your tampon - I do feel Anderson is as much, or more to blame.

I am not devaluing nor criticizing a fighter's ultimate goal to win; nor am I diminishing Anderson's contributions and achievements to MMA this far, and; just the same, I am not clamoring for knockouts due to an under appreciation of the sport. I am saying - going out on a limb here and hoping you understand this - that a champion should adapt his game-plan to be aggressive and engaging at all times, in all avenues of the fight - i.e.,) Fedor out-striking CroCop, GSP taking Penn to the ground [despite exponentially better JJ] and the other examples we have spoken about.

Given the fact Anderson is being almost universally lauded as the P4P#1, and Thales was not Top Ten at the time, it is most certainly reasonable to expect Anderson to carry on an engaging and aggressive fight. He should and could have destroyed Thales, had he so chosen, and for that reason it is more his fault. Thales does not have droves of fanboys, and he is not being placed above the greatest MMArtist of all time for cleaning out a weak division - Thales fought an embarrassing fight, but; given Andy's status, higher standards are ascribed to him.

You are acting like a spoiled little brat over a simple joke. However, if I offended your delicate sensibilities, I am like, totally sorry...bro. Better, pumpkin?
 
TexasTitan said:
I dont think you realize his goal was to win the fight, and he did so. He probably feels he has nothign to apologize for and if you only watch MMA for the KOs, you dont appreciate fighting for **** anyways.
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Andy had several chances to finish the fight, but he chose not to. Regardless of what anyone says, MMA is about the fans. I'd rather lose every fight in my life by KO/Submission than win every fight by boring decision.
 
Totally. I'd probably pay for a chris leben headliner before another anderson silva. OK not true at all. I'd rather watch Chris leben fight Anderson again then another TL type.
 
both are to blame about this shitty fight they both could have done things. its stupid they through TL at him i think he does not have all the tools and i wish nate got the decision over him even with the illegal strike. he needs some real skill. 185 def is the weakest in UFC.

by the way mullet i want you to help me write essays man hahaha you know your sweet talk. did you get A's in english and public speaking
 
Rodja said:
Andy had several chances to finish the fight, but he chose not to. Regardless of what anyone says, MMA is about the fans. I'd rather lose every fight in my life by KO/Submission than win every fight by boring decision.
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I dont know what to say except for I totally disagree. Fighting, real fighting, is drastically different than what you described.
 
yeah it is for the fans if it wasnt it would be out pointing and just throws or submissions. they made this to be more popular and fun. both fighters didnt contribute to the "fun" part. most masters think MMA is so stupid. I happen to love it and its a lot more fun to do. how come the payouts havnt been posted yet?
 
rule number one dont mess with rodja hes an MMA master and calls it how it is.

rule number 2 dont mess with mullet he will just Effin own you

rule number 3.....Alright are you ready, are you ready, LETS GET IT ON!
 
Rodja said:
Is that coming from firsthand cage experience?
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I used to fight, not MMA though. I have many friends who have done and still do MMA though. Amateur MMA is a joke. Anyone who wants to act tough and feel like a BAMF UFC fighter tries it.
 
TexasTitan said:
I used to fight, not MMA though. I have many friends who have done and still do MMA though. Amateur MMA is a joke. Anyone who wants to act tough and feel like a BAMF UFC fighter tries it.
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Who said anything about ammy? I have had 6 pro fights and I can honestly tell you that I would rather lose every single one of them in exciting fashion than win all of them in boring fashion. It looks nice on paper to have a great record, but the sport is about the fans. They don't come to a show to watch some guy trying to pad his record; they come to be entertained.

Look at Clay Guida: his UFC record is not great, but he is never in danger of being cut because he routinely puts on an exciting show.
 
I gotta disagree here, im working my way toward pro but id rather fight smart and win than stupid and lose.

Ive read the icemans book a few times, he constantly states he'd rather knock someone out than fight safe, as we have seen it simply wont sustain you at a top level, you become too predictable.

Im not saying i will ever reach his level but at the same time the risk Vs reward is different.

That said theres a difference between fighting smart (GSP Vs Fitch) than what we saw here with Anderson, he was making a point, no doubt about it.
 
0-hero said:
I gotta disagree here, im working my way toward pro but id rather fight smart and win than stupid and lose.

Ive read the icemans book a few times, he constantly states he'd rather knock someone out than fight safe, as we have seen it simply wont sustain you at a top level, you become too predictable.

Im not saying i will ever reach his level but at the same time the risk Vs reward is different.

That said theres a difference between fighting smart (GSP Vs Fitch) than what we saw here with Anderson, he was making a point, no doubt about it.
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Put on bad fights and seldom will a promoter invite you back.
 
Rodja said:
Look at Clay Guida: his UFC record is not great, but he is never in danger of being cut because he routinely puts on an exciting show.
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Same thing with Jason MacDonald.. he's 5-5 in the UFC and Dana said he isnt cutting him because he puts on exciting fights win or lose.
 
Thinking about it, AS idolizes Roy Jones, Jr. and Roy used to get alot of the same criticisms. Possible connection?
 
bigwhiteguy29 said:
rule number one dont mess with rodja hes an MMA master and calls it how it is.

rule number 2 dont mess with mullet he will just Effin own you

rule number 3.....Alright are you ready, are you ready, LETS GET IT ON!
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Big John: "Alright are you ready, are you ready, LETS GET IT ON!...COME ON!"

I actually watched some UFC Unleashed just recently where he does the added "come on" and Goldberg says oh so he changed it, he added the come on.
hey does Goldberg have any reason to be commentating on MMA??
 
Jessep76 said:
Big John: "Alright are you ready, are you ready, LETS GET IT ON!...COME ON!"

I actually watched some UFC Unleashed just recently where he does the added "come on" and Goldberg says oh so he changed it, he added the come on.
hey does Goldberg have any reason to be commentating on MMA??
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Goldberg is friends with MMA legend, Kimbo Slice. He's riding the coat tails of Kimbo's acclaim :dance2:


:dunno::dunno::dunno:
 
hahah he just has one of those deep voices and is a good public speaker. thats a hard job and ive acually heard him doing air plane races. i was like wtf i know this voice it cant be! omg air planes really?
 
Rodja said:
Who said anything about ammy? I have had 6 pro fights and I can honestly tell you that I would rather lose every single one of them in exciting fashion than win all of them in boring fashion. It looks nice on paper to have a great record, but the sport is about the fans. They don't come to a show to watch some guy trying to pad his record; they come to be entertained.

Look at Clay Guida: his UFC record is not great, but he is never in danger of being cut because he routinely puts on an exciting show.
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Fighitng is not a show, and it shouldnt be in my opinion. Youre not a damn performer, youre a fighter. Its a competition of fighting skills and impulsive rash fighting may entertain the zombies at events but its fighting, not showing. I respect your accomplishments and desire to put on a good fight but a good fighter isnt always a good performer. Also, you live like 30 minutes from me and my family may buy some land a little SE of San Marcos.
 
Bionic said:
Thinking about it, AS idolizes Roy Jones, Jr. and Roy used to get alot of the same criticisms. Possible connection?
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Dude Roy Jones puts the E in entertainment. I'm not sure how you are making a connection there. Granted I didn't see March Badness but every other fight he's had was gold whether he lost or not. He's got class, he's got style and he's not someone that minges when the opponent does something he doesn't want them to do.
 
TexasTitan said:
Fighitng is not a show, and it shouldnt be in my opinion. Youre not a damn performer, youre a fighter. Its a competition of fighting skills and impulsive rash fighting may entertain the zombies at events but its fighting, not showing. I respect your accomplishments and desire to put on a good fight but a good fighter isnt always a good performer. Also, you live like 30 minutes from me and my family may buy some land a little SE of San Marcos.
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Unfortunatly fighting is a spectator sport it always has been, well prize fighting at least. We all love the art of fighting and the skill involved in martial arts, but jiu jitsu tourneys dont sell out Mandalay Bay. My point is, is that the art of fighting has to be respected but when you are a pro fighter especially a champion it is expected of you to put on a good show. The UFC charges for tickets and ppv and the customers expect and should get some excitment its a buisness brohan. I thought Anderson fought a perfect fight he didnt get a scratch and beat Thales way before they stepped in the cage. However in his profession id say it was a mistake, Anderson doesnt have the draw like GSP or Chuck to begin with, if it were me I would light the fire! I love the art of combat; Jiu jitsu, boxing, Wrestling, Muay Thai, judo. Id watch tourneys of just those all day if I could lol but Most wont and the "most" im talking about make up the majorite buying tix and ppvs, imo.
Props to Rodja and other fighters on here whoo keep on the grind, I hope you all beat some ass and get on some higlight reals.
 
Rodja said:
Put on bad fights and seldom will a promoter invite you back.
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This is also true, my sparring partner won his first 2 pro fights with arm bars after pulling guard on guys he knew only had stand up.

The crowd just saw 2 guys hugging, one pulling the other into a loving embrace inbetween his legs the yanking on his arm.

He cant get booked for that good promotion now, only in tiny shows.

Its a tough line to walk.
 
0-hero said:
This is also true, my sparring partner won his first 2 pro fights with arm bars after pulling guard on guys he knew only had stand up.

The crowd just saw 2 guys hugging, one pulling the other into a loving embrace inbetween his legs the yanking on his arm.

He cant get booked for that good promotion now, only in tiny shows.

Its a tough line to walk.
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to back that up I got knocked out in my first fight andn was invited to a bigger show the next month because I was a "banger" ofcourse this was many many years ago before most people even had an idea about the ground and only wanted slams and overhand rights lol
 
At my friend's pro fight (here in Southern California), the crowd didn't seem to favor an all out fist fight at all. People who won by submission actually got waaaaay more respect, because most of the fights were 1st round, under 60 sec slug outs. Wild swinging, then somebody always got caught and it started to seem more like we were watching school yard fights then any kind of technical skill, so when a submission was executed, THAT'S when the crowd went nuts. At least that's been my experience "as of lately." :dunno:
 
Motox said:
Unfortunatly fighting is a spectator sport it always has been, well prize fighting at least. We all love the art of fighting and the skill involved in martial arts, but jiu jitsu tourneys dont sell out Mandalay Bay. My point is, is that the art of fighting has to be respected but when you are a pro fighter especially a champion it is expected of you to put on a good show. The UFC charges for tickets and ppv and the customers expect and should get some excitment its a buisness brohan. I thought Anderson fought a perfect fight he didnt get a scratch and beat Thales way before they stepped in the cage. However in his profession id say it was a mistake, Anderson doesnt have the draw like GSP or Chuck to begin with, if it were me I would light the fire! I love the art of combat; Jiu jitsu, boxing, Wrestling, Muay Thai, judo. Id watch tourneys of just those all day if I could lol but Most wont and the "most" im talking about make up the majorite buying tix and ppvs, imo.
Props to Rodja and other fighters on here whoo keep on the grind, I hope you all beat some ass and get on some higlight reals.
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Thats why Im lucky to be a boxing guy. MMA took most of the fanboy morons away from us.
 
TexasTitan said:
Thats why Im lucky to be a boxing guy. MMA took most of the fanboy morons away from us.
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Mike Tyson will go down in history as one of the best and most memorable fighters due to his Knock Out factor, not his ability to win by points. He was the most popular fighter because you were paying for a guaranteed KO and people want to see that.

Show boat Roy Jones, Jr. and the little badger Manny Paquio are loved and paid for their entertainment value, not their ability to end up on top by points.

Every sport has the minority of fans who can appreciate the strategery and technicality, but Champion fights or simply elite level fights are normally "shows" for the masses and the masses, whether it be boxing, MMA, football, if contact is any part of the sport, people want to see it done so in a violent manner, because that's entertainment.

Albeit, boxing has more cultured and patient fans then MMA in my opinion, but boxing has a much longer mainstream history to have developed that level of "smart" fan base.
 
VolcomX311 said:
At my friend's pro fight (here in Southern California), the crowd didn't seem to favor an all out fist fight at all. People who won by submission actually got waaaaay more respect, because most of the fights were 1st round, under 60 sec slug outs. Wild swinging, then somebody always got caught and it started to seem more like we were watching school yard fights then any kind of technical skill, so when a submission was executed, THAT'S when the crowd went nuts. At least that's been my experience "as of lately." :dunno:
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You're in the LA area, right? That's the mecca of BJJ in the U.S.
 
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