nunes
Well-known member
I hope so NG, the costumer deserves an explanation...
M-Stack double dose
- Thread starter nunes
- Start date
Manimalia
Well-known member
That was a 1500 word essay basically saying, "dude, it's cool. we're cool. everything's cool. still trust us."
That might work for the heads of some that are filled with meat which have no firing neurons inside, but not for others. In this world, I'm sure you know, that if you short someone or rip them off, they want an explanation right away, or at least a good part of it.
Have you spoken to the men/women who mix your ingredients? I'm sure you have. WHAT HAVE THEY SAID SO FAR?
You know, this doesn't just affect your company. It affects every customer who ever buys a supplement and ever company that sells one. Our faith is shaken a bit more every time something like this happens, and as a result, we tend to stay away from proprietary blends in cool bottles. I know I've seen enough of these types of things to where I have to be on guard when purchasing my supps. When something comes out, I wait a long time to see how it's working for people (in unsponsored logs) and then, maybe, MAYBE, give it a shot.
nunes
Well-known member
great post X 1000
naturalguy
Universal Nutrition
You guys need to see this:
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You can see the big picture here. We have our info as well however we haven't made it public yet. You can see that the test that our competitor did was set up to fail. We don't take it lightly when someone attacks us so we are just getting all our ducks in a row. You can see that the other company involved tried to blackmail another company.
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You can see the big picture here. We have our info as well however we haven't made it public yet. You can see that the test that our competitor did was set up to fail. We don't take it lightly when someone attacks us so we are just getting all our ducks in a row. You can see that the other company involved tried to blackmail another company.
joeyamma
Member
props to NG for his classy and professional responses.
props to Rich Gaspari for his professional response and for standing up for his company, his rep, and his product.
for the record: i have been 100% satisfied with every Universal Nutrition product that i have ever used (and i've used a lot of them).
also, 2 questions:
1.) how many people have used M-Stak and other Universal products and seen good results?
2.) how many people have used Thermolife products and have they worked for you?
props to Rich Gaspari for his professional response and for standing up for his company, his rep, and his product.
for the record: i have been 100% satisfied with every Universal Nutrition product that i have ever used (and i've used a lot of them).
also, 2 questions:
1.) how many people have used M-Stak and other Universal products and seen good results?
2.) how many people have used Thermolife products and have they worked for you?
xtgear
Member
in my understanding 0,02 mg of turk per 20g and 0 its the same, and I think this all thing don't clean the UN image.
One thing is for sure , Ron may want to gain something with all this but we the costumers saw the truth, turkesterone its a supplement companies fraud, there's no enough turk in any of them to make us put 1 gram of muscle.
And by the way UN should answer by their words , not hide behind others back
One thing is for sure , Ron may want to gain something with all this but we the costumers saw the truth, turkesterone its a supplement companies fraud, there's no enough turk in any of them to make us put 1 gram of muscle.
And by the way UN should answer by their words , not hide behind others back
King Con
Well-known member
I was just about to post this.
naturalguy
Universal Nutrition
We have made a statement and we will have a follow up with our evidence and another statement as well. We are not hiding behind anything. We want to do our due diligence and not rush.
The issue at hand is not the amount of Turk. We were attacked by another company making claims that we lied on our label and do not have ANY in the product.
nunes
Well-known member
C of A from material suppliers are pretty meaningless. Independent lab analysis with a proper standard and chain of custody are what counts, but even so when a company make a test to its products and the result is 0,02 mg /serving and then say , see we have the turk, this is one of the funniest jokes I ever seen in my all life,hilarious
naturalguy
Universal Nutrition
I assume your talking about the Gaspari situation. As far as I can see Gaspari never claimed any specific amount of Turk in Superpump. The attack by the other company was to make Gaspari look like there was zero Turk in the products and questioning their credibility. Gaspari has it in their product.
Now whether or not you feel Turk is effective at that dose is a whole other conversation however Superpump is not a turk product, it's just one ingredient of many.
nunes
Well-known member
yes I´m talking of SP, but c`mon 0,02mg/serving:lol:
first,do you think a label should contain a ingredient with that dosage?
second, was that a Independent lab analysis ?
I hope the UN response is not similar to this cause M-stack had a great commercial advantage in having Turk on the label
naturalguy
Universal Nutrition
I am not a turk expert and I have never taken it at that dose as a standalone to make that determination.
The evidence that Gaspari provided was more than adequate meanwhile the other company only provided a test which they created the standard for then the owner of said company tried to blackmail Gaspari with his info. It was a failed attack by a competing company. I will trust Gaspari over Thermolife any day.
Any time a competitor is testing someone else product, it no longer becomes independent.
Manimalia
Well-known member
enough about gaspari. what's going on with the turkey in your lab?
naturalguy
Universal Nutrition
Our answer will be coming
naturalguy
Universal Nutrition
Our answer is up:
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we have Turk in our product and we had it tested by 2 labs including Chromadex.
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we have Turk in our product and we had it tested by 2 labs including Chromadex.
nunes
Well-known member
thanks for the link, but after all how many mgs of turk do you have on the product?
naturalguy
Universal Nutrition
nunes, it's in a proprietary blend so that information is not going to be disclosed. I realize that many people don't like prop blends however they are a real part of the supplement business, it prevents other companies from copying your exact formula.
The issue here at hand is that we were accused of lying to our consumers and "scamming" people which is simply not true.
nunes
Well-known member
NG don't get me wrong but this all thing of prop blends and dosages hard to detect is really a pain in the ass, PA said and I think you agree that a dosage like the one in superpump and 0 its exactly the same.
I personally don't agree to put an ingredient on the label and then the dosage is too low to be easily detected or ineffective, but that's just me , I can see a lot of guys in bb satisfied with this low dosages so I`m just 1 costumer.
Thanks again for you answers and I hope you understand my point of view on this subject cause I`m really not convinced
naturalguy
Universal Nutrition
nunes, please understand that the first test that was done by RK on M-Stak was suspect for several reasons. There are 30 ingredients in M-Stak, spread out over 8 pills. The lab nor RK did not know where to look for the turk and the lab admitted that it can cause interference. When we had the M-Stak tested by 2 labs (including Chromadex) we were able to tell them which pill the turk was in so the 2nd tests were more accurate.
All I can tell you is this, M-Stak is a very effective product and receives consistently great feedback. Is it from the turk or one of the other 30 ingredients? I can't tell you but the synergy of the formula works. It's a multiple ingredient formula, it does not rely on one ingredient.
If it's turk you want then you should buy a straight turk product.
King Con
Well-known member
I can understand that view point N. Dealing with prop blends, no one is ever sure how much is in any specific ingredient except the company themselves. With that said there is always the counter to your argument as to where to draw the line in whether the exact amount is effective and what isn't. Especially dealing with prop blends as opposed to a regular standard turk product.
It has never been the case dealing with how much of an ingredient is in M Stak, SP250, or any other product for that matter. What has been the main concern is another supplement company posting test results dealing with several different factors unaccounted for (chain of custody, interferences, 30 diff ingredients spread over 8 pills) in attempts to discredit their name, reputation, products, and overall character. As a result, two companies have come forth when they were handed the burden of proof and they delivered. Both companies delivered proof that the exact ingredient not detected in a lab test was in fact detected. What makes one amount effective over the other? What amount is the set specified amount proven to be effective? Aren't consumers the best judge as to the product's effectiveness? Regardless of the product having 100% turk or 0.0000000001% turk, I firmly believe it is in the hands of the consumer to decide if this prop blend works for them in the amount in the dosage. If not, don't buy another can or there is always the iron clad guarantee on the can that tells you who to contact and Universal always upholds their customer service a notch above the average.
All that matters for now is that a company who has tried to discredit another company and possibly blackmail another has been proven wrong as both supplements have been tested to have turk in it. No wool is being pulled over anyone's eyes here, the label states there is turk in there, and based on the tests there is turk enclosed within the prop. blend. The amount was never in question, just the existence of the said ingredient.
I do understand and respect your dismay in regards to everything however and would just like to reiterate what NG said in closing, "M stak does not rely on turk alone, it is a prop blend that relies on 30 different ingredients."
nunes
Well-known member
let me tell that with this I agree completely, Ron lost all the credibility when he did that, a huuuuuge mistake.
In the other point , well , I simply can't argue any more , I don't have the numbers and the science, so if the product works , who am I to say it doesn't?
In this all thing I just think that no one is looking good in the picture:sad:
xtgear
Member
:goodpost::clap2: