CKD and cardio

Page 1 of 6 123 ... Last
  1. Registered User
    ShadowFury's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  180 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Age
    24
    Posts
    646
    Rep Power
    408

    CKD and cardio


    Hey people, I started doing CKD about 3 weeks ago, getting more used to it and having higher energy now, so that's a plus. I was wondering if doing HIIT or just medium-intensity cardio for about an hour is OK while doing CKD. And also what a good fat burner would be while on CKD, other than the ECA stack. I'm 150 lbs, 14%-15% BF

  2. Registered User
    GXbcmFTO's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  194 lbs.
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    96
    Rep Power
    120

    HIIT in the morning on an empty stomach + the CKD diet is great, altho I for one would not do an hour, I think 20-30mins is enough. Are you lifting weights at all?

    What kind of fat burner did you have in mind a stim or a non stim? I like to use albuterol as my stim and use lean xtreme for its cortisol control and fat burning properties. I have yet to try DCP, but I have only heard great things about it, it is a non stim fat burner as well.

    ~GX
  3. Registered User
    ThomasRivera's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  217 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    814
    Rep Power
    481

    Quote Originally Posted by GXbcmFTO View Post
    HIIT in the morning on an empty stomach + the CKD diet is great, altho I for one would not do an hour, I think 20-30mins is enough. Are you lifting weights at all?

    What kind of fat burner did you have in mind a stim or a non stim? I like to use albuterol as my stim and use lean xtreme for its cortisol control and fat burning properties. I have yet to try DCP, but I have only heard great things about it, it is a non stim fat burner as well.

    ~GX
    Agree with the HIIT.

    Just wondering why you would suggest it on an empty stomach, anytime I hear the argument for empty stomach cardio its in favor because the body would burn more fat rather than anything else, essentially this is what we attain in keto.
    •   
       

  4. All Traps - No Tris
    tribaltek's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  246.4 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    807
    Rep Power
    533

    This is terrible advice, in my opinion.
    Quote Originally Posted by GXbcmFTO View Post
    HIIT in the morning on an empty stomach + the CKD diet is great
  5. Registered User
    ShadowFury's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  180 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Age
    24
    Posts
    646
    Rep Power
    408

    That's what I'm looking for as far as supps, thanks

    About the HIIT on empty stomach, like Thomas said, why empty stomach? I would just end up needing to eat more fat that day to make up for it right?
  6. All Traps - No Tris
    tribaltek's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  246.4 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    807
    Rep Power
    533

    The main issue is the fact that you said you are on CKD. Low-carb diets and high-intensity cardio lead to muscle wasting. Whenever I am doing low-carb, I stick to medium-intensity treadmill work. 3mph @ 5-10% incline.
  7. All Traps - No Tris
    tribaltek's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  246.4 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    807
    Rep Power
    533

    And to answer your supplement question, I prefer PAL Leviathan (though USP ReCreate was good as well). I am one of the very few people (maybe the only one?) that hasn't seen any added benefit from DCP, but it appears to be very solid from reviews. I used to use ECA stacks in the past, but I prefer the two mentioned above to ECA now.
  8. Registered User
    SureShot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    478
    Rep Power
    362

    Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    The main issue is the fact that you said you are on CKD. Low-carb diets and high-intensity cardio lead to muscle wasting. Whenever I am doing low-carb, I stick to medium-intensity treadmill work. 3mph @ 5-10% incline.
    I tend to disagree slightly. Your endurance might suffer from ckd but I do not think 20min of intense cardio is going to cause muscle wasting on an empty stomach.
  9. All Traps - No Tris
    tribaltek's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  246.4 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    807
    Rep Power
    533

    Regardless of our varying opinions, please make sure you have some BCAA's in you at the very least if you are doing any kind of "empty stomach" cardio.
  10. Registered User
    GXbcmFTO's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  194 lbs.
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    96
    Rep Power
    120

    Quote Originally Posted by SureShot View Post
    I tend to disagree slightly. Your endurance might suffer from ckd but I do not think 20min of intense cardio is going to cause muscle wasting on an empty stomach.
    I agree with this, endurance will most likely suffer, however 20-30mins of 400m sprints is not going to lead to much muscle loss if any, especially if you eat shortly there after. I would recommend BCAA's tho as tribaltek suggested.

    ~GX
  11. Registered User
    SureShot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    478
    Rep Power
    362

    Quote Originally Posted by GXbcmFTO View Post
    I agree with this, endurance will most likely suffer, however 20-30mins of 400m sprints is not going to lead to much muscle loss if any, especially if you eat shortly there after. I would recommend BCAA's tho as tribaltek suggested.

    ~GX
    Agreed completely. However, I am sure there were not bcaas around in bulk back when hunter gatherers had to probably do HIIT to kill their food for the day...and they were ripped.
  12. All Traps - No Tris
    tribaltek's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  246.4 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    807
    Rep Power
    533

    Being "ripped" like a caveman (I assume you mean scrawny and starving?) and retaining a high percentage of LBM are two totally different ball games, bro.
  13. Registered User
    SureShot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    478
    Rep Power
    362

    Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    Being "ripped" like a caveman (I assume you mean scrawny and starving?) and retaining a high percentage of LBM are two totally different ball games, bro.
    Point taken but I really do not think that using bcaas before/during 20min of total activity is going to make much of a difference. Are we talking performance or appearance here? I agree that for performance/endurance that bcaas as well as a carbo source will definitely help. I have done HIIT while drinking xtend for a month and done it for 2-3months 4-5x per week while drinking crystal light and have not noticed any difference.
  14. All Traps - No Tris
    tribaltek's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  246.4 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    807
    Rep Power
    533

    I'm speaking purely about anti-catabolism.
  15. Registered User
    ShadowFury's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  180 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Age
    24
    Posts
    646
    Rep Power
    408

    Hmmmm, so BCAAs beforehand and how long afterwards should I eat? I'd be waking up around 5 or 5:30, then need to be at school which is a half hour away, at 8. I'd wanna eat around 6:40, would that be OK?

    And thanks for the supp info again, I will prolly go with either DCP or Leviathan.

    Some days I may do the medium-intensity cardio, then prolly 2-3 times a week do fasted HIIT. I do also do weights by the way, so the medium intensity will be on workout days, and the fasted HIIT will be in the mornings of my break days.

    Would it be good for me to do HIIT on Fridays, after the final workout, but before my carb-up begins?(Goes till midnight sat)
  16. Registered User
    ThomasRivera's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  217 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    814
    Rep Power
    481

    Quote Originally Posted by SureShot View Post
    I tend to disagree slightly. Your endurance might suffer from ckd but I do not think 20min of intense cardio is going to cause muscle wasting on an empty stomach.

    I don't think CKD will cause any lapse in cardiovascular capability, endurance wise anyway. From all the CKD stuff i've read, endurance isn't effected.
  17. Registered User
    SureShot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    478
    Rep Power
    362

    Quote Originally Posted by ThomasRivera View Post
    I don't think CKD will cause any lapse in cardiovascular capability, endurance wise anyway. From all the CKD stuff i've read, endurance isn't effected.
    in a twenty minute HIIT session endurance is not a factor regardless.
  18. Registered User
    SureShot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    478
    Rep Power
    362

    Quote Originally Posted by tribaltek View Post
    I'm speaking purely about anti-catabolism.
    As am I. I do not see 20min of HIIT being catabolic.
  19. Registered User
    ShadowFury's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  180 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Age
    24
    Posts
    646
    Rep Power
    408

    Alright, so it's not catabolic, I still need the BCAA's right? And I put some questions in my last post ^^^^^^
  20. Registered User
    SureShot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    478
    Rep Power
    362

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadowFury View Post
    Hmmmm, so BCAAs beforehand and how long afterwards should I eat? I'd be waking up around 5 or 5:30, then need to be at school which is a half hour away, at 8. I'd wanna eat around 6:40, would that be OK?

    And thanks for the supp info again, I will prolly go with either DCP or Leviathan.

    Some days I may do the medium-intensity cardio, then prolly 2-3 times a week do fasted HIIT. I do also do weights by the way, so the medium intensity will be on workout days, and the fasted HIIT will be in the mornings of my break days.

    Would it be good for me to do HIIT on Fridays, after the final workout, but before my carb-up begins?(Goes till midnight sat)
    Yes to all.
  21. Registered User
    ShadowFury's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  180 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Age
    24
    Posts
    646
    Rep Power
    408

    Alright, thanks.

    Should I have my post-workout shake(100% Gold Pure Whey, or something like that) after I do HIIT? I'm thinking the food will be good enough, but just checking.
  22. All Traps - No Tris
    tribaltek's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  246.4 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    807
    Rep Power
    533

    I still believe high intensity cardio on a low carb diet (on an empty stomach even) is not the way to go. You can tell me all day that it isn't catabolic, but I just can't agree.

    Now if we were talking about a diet with "regular" 40/40/20 type macros, then I would totally agree with you. But seeing as he is going to be in a glycogen depleted state, catabolism is going to occur.
  23. Registered User
    ShadowFury's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  180 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Age
    24
    Posts
    646
    Rep Power
    408

    Well, I'm going to do it for 10-12 mins for a week or so and see what happens, or until we can get a definite answer on the " is it catabolic" question
  24. All Traps - No Tris
    tribaltek's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  246.4 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    807
    Rep Power
    533

    I don't have a degree in the field or anything, I'm just telling you from personal experience.

    Maybe Bobo or someone in that caliber can post and school us all.
  25. Registered User
    avenue Red's Avatar
    Stats
    5'7"  160 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    California
    Posts
    223
    Rep Power
    196

    I agree with trib. I have been doing CKD for 2.5months now and have lost 30lbs of fat and have gotten the strongest I have ever been. I would suggest doing 30-45min of elliptical or stairmaster after heavy weights.
  26. Registered User
    ThomasRivera's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  217 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    814
    Rep Power
    481

    Quote Originally Posted by SureShot View Post
    in a twenty minute HIIT session endurance is not a factor regardless.
    Endurance is always a factor, if someone is in poor cardiovascular shape, not necessarily overweight, just not in good condition, completing a 15 minute run might be hard, let alone putting sprints in there.


    I don't see why HIIT would be catabolic, if diet and macro intake during CKD are spot on I can't really see why it would eat muscle. Especially if your eating right and have protein and fat available for digestion during the session. HIIT sessions are usually shorter than LI sessions, and would probably have either lower or similar calorie requirements.

    HIIT increases beneficial hormones, increases how effectively glycogen is stored and increases EPOC for many hours after a session is completed, low intensity cardio just doesn't do that. Increased EPOC on top of the fat burning nature of CKD is a bonus, sure, weighlifting which is essentially the same concept periods of high intensity work with breaks in between action, raises EPOC as well, but performing HIIT on days where you haven't worked out, or haven't worked out too intensely can be a great asset.
  27. Registered User
    jester87's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  191 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    77

    i dont think your muscle will drop if you do HIIT before/after lifting on ckd. but if you are cutting on ckd and doing HIIT before/after lifting, its a nobrainer there will be catabolic effects. lifting is a HIIT pass in itself. and basically, if you want to lose bodyfat, that means you are cutting. so i vote for the low intensity 6-12% incline walk at 3-4mph.

    edit: btw, if anyone disagrees that lifting isnt a HIIT. then you are lifting like a *****
  28. Registered User
    ShadowFury's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  180 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Age
    24
    Posts
    646
    Rep Power
    408

    To Jester, I'm not going to do HIIT before/after my workout, but on my days off in the morning(So there would be around 10 hours from workout to HIIT)

    I am not thinking doing HIIT is going to be catabolic in itself(Not done around lifting). I think the question now is if I should do it fasted or not. If HIIT was catabolic while on CKD, then wouldn't lifting be? Because if it is HIIT(A good, hard workout is, like you said, HIIT,in my oppinion). That's just what I'm kinda gettin from this whole thing.
  29. E J
    E J is offline
    Registered User
    E J's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    392
    Rep Power
    279

    Wouldn't using BCAA's before morning "fasted" cardio (and only BCAA's) make the body burn the BCAA's up for energy, resulting in a waste of money? Wouldn't it be just like consuming carbs?
  30. Registered User
    ShadowFury's Avatar
    Stats
    5'8"  180 lbs.
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Age
    24
    Posts
    646
    Rep Power
    408

    Alright, just ordered PAL Levi, that should help out. I was eating too many peanuts a few days ago, and carbs were prolly around 40, so that was kinda bleh. I cut them out and swapped some stuff up, now I'm down to about 5-12 carbs. Keto test is somewhere between 80 and 160 for the ketostix now.

    Back to the HIIT, if I did it an hour after I ate in the morning, then drank a protein shake on the way to school, would that be better than fasted? I'm also doing the 30-45 low-medium intensity after workout.
  •   

      
     

Similar Forum Threads

  1. Replies: 22
    Last Post: 11-26-2012, 09:22 PM
  2. Cardio after leg day
    By Strygwyr in forum Training Forum
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: 07-10-2010, 09:00 PM
  3. Interval Cardio & Steady State Cardio
    By baz350 in forum Training Forum
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-22-2009, 06:58 PM
  4. when to do cardio
    By qwerty33 in forum Training Forum
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 11-04-2009, 06:50 PM
  5. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 01-30-2009, 08:35 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Log in

Log in

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.