CKD and cardio
- 10-28-2008, 08:00 PM
I think if you are above 15% then some people refeed every two weeks, for 2 days I believe, but you still need to make sure you eat the same amount of carbs that you would if you only took 1 day. Someone correct me if I'm wrong or somethin please
Also, some people, when they first start the CKD, they will wait 2 weeks for their first refeed, instead of just doing 1 week. It helps you get into keto faster, and your body adapts faster.
- 10-28-2008, 09:56 PM
It depends. The Ketogenic Diet book by Lyle McDonald suggest a macro breakdown for fat, protein and carb intake. The first 24 hours are 4.5 grams of carbs per a pound of lean body mass, and the second day is half that amount.
The anabolic diet suggests more of a judgment based on how you look, which is easier to do when you have lower body fat.
Some people find it harder to stay out of ketosis for almost two weeks at a time. The carb load does have some beneficial aspects to it, raises in test, gh and insulin simultaneously. But its good to spend more time in ketosis and just incorporate a mid week carb spike, or increased carbs after working out (taking a page out of the TKD style) to combat fatigue.
- 10-29-2008, 04:45 PM
Arg, now I'm running out of my shake, lol.
Any suggestions on what I should grab? I like this 100% Pure Whey and protein, but is there anything better I should try? It also needs to have low-no sugar obviously from the CKD.
10-29-2008, 04:48 PM
There's ON 100 percent gold standard protein, Isopure protein which has no carbs or just one carb.
10-29-2008, 04:54 PM
I def have to check this ckd stuff out, and see if HIIT would be for me, research research!!!
10-29-2008, 04:54 PM
I have ON right now, I'll check out the isopure then.
EDIT: Yup, I did research for a good week before I started to get it all down, lol.
But once you get used to everything, it is seeming easier than a norm diet. The energy that I wasn't getting on a norm one is also sweet
I need to go get my jump rope so I don't have run in the ~40 degree weather tomorrow morning <_<
10-29-2008, 04:58 PM
10-29-2008, 05:03 PM
But I didn't do anything ^_^ Also while you're doing your research, read this whole topic, it should help out a bit
Isopure is lookin awesome, double the protein of ON, and only 1 carb (2 fiber)
I heard All The Whey cinnabun is good, but I can't find a nutrition label :/
10-30-2008, 03:21 AM
I really haven't been using my protein powders. I guess its because im used to savory, salty, spicy now and the strawberry shakes are just too sweet for my taste during keto. Too artificial tasting. They should come out with a bbq flavor.
10-30-2008, 04:22 AM
Dang, I love the taste. It's the only time I have something that tastes sweet, but I stay away from the straw/van/and choc flavors, they always do seem fake to me. I stick with Cookies n cream or something weird, but not fruit punch or any fruit ones.
BBQ protein would taste so weird, lol.
10-30-2008, 04:33 AM
I have the cookies and cream, doesn't taste like it to me.
10-30-2008, 04:51 AM
I honestly don't think it does either, it just tastes good and that's all I know, lol. I don't see how it is cookies 'n cream, but whatever. If anything I taste the creamy part every once in awhile, also, have you tried adding the extra virgin olive oil in? Definately was funky the first time I did it, now it kinda tastes good with the different taste.
Drank less water yesterday, and checked the keto strips, it says I'm between 80/160 again. So I dunno if I should keep drinking less and see if the jello doesn't affect me or what.
I won't be able to do my final workout Friday either, but we have a Midnight Madness thing at school, the first "practice" for bball, so I am just counting that because I'll be running around the whole night, sprinting and normal pace. Is it still fine to do my refeed on Sat? Or should I do a full body today after school? Either way, I don't want to refeed Friday, because I'll be working Sat night through the end of my refeed, and I can usually get carbs easy at work, and I get hungrier than if I were at home or out doing something.
10-30-2008, 05:35 AM
Arg, reading around, some people say dairy products while on CKD are bad, but I thought cheese was perfect, balanced between fat/protein, and has a nice chunk of calcium(which is nowhere else but in my multi)
So is cheese ok or not? I have it in 2-3 of my meals
EDIT: It'd be sweet if someone can answer my working out question, if I'm going to, I need to start soon <_<
10-30-2008, 10:35 PM
Im really not too sure with the time frame and i'm honestly not sure how much sprinting will help in maximum glycogen composition. It should help, but if you really aren't sure then maybe just stay in keto for a few more days and put it off to a day that you can workout. Cheese should be fine, ive never gotten knocked out of keto from cheese.
10-31-2008, 04:02 AM
Ya, keeping cheese for sure, can't find a downside.
I did a normal bis/tris/shoulders, today I am going to be able to do my depletion, but I won't have cardio after it because of the bball tonight. If my workout is done arund 5, I should eat at 7, 9, 11, and 1 right? And all of them should be my simple sugars right?(Gatorade,white bread, white rice, etc..) And then tomorrow should be all starches/complex?
Just wanna make sure, because I have been screwing up with my refeeds <_<
10-31-2008, 04:27 AM
How long are you doing your carb up for? I do a 2 day carb up, concentrating quick digesting carbs the first half and slow digesting carbs the second half. If your doing it one day you would start off with the quicker stuff and taper off to slower digesting stuff. See how you feel and how you look.
10-31-2008, 04:30 AM
I am going to be doing it up until Saturday night. So, for 30 something hours.
I am going to drink a boatload of gatorade, and have white bread with lean meat for tonight's meals, and tomorrow I will have cereal for breakfast, and just have potatos and wheat bread, etc...
10-31-2008, 04:34 AM
Sounds good. Monitor your body, see at what numbers you start to look fuller, feel fuller. If your not lean enough to see definition in your chest, abs, etc, check your forearms.
10-31-2008, 04:36 AM
Alright, thanks. Can't wait for some frikkin carbs, lol.
10-31-2008, 10:30 AM
Hey guys, been lurking for awhile and learning tons from this site. Thanks for all the knowledge. I'm a bit confused on CKD and HIIT as well. I've been on CKD for about 4-5 weeks and doing well, however, I've stuck to my split routine doing legs/abs on Sun, shoulders & tris on Mon, Tue off/cardio, Wed back and bi's, & chest on Thursday. Currently I'm doing low reps//high weight. I feel that I can work each muscle harder this way without spending more than an hour on a workout. After your posts and reading the articles on it, I need to get better at a depletion workout, but since I'm lifting all week, I hate to turn around and work the muscles all over again on Fri. Would a long cardio session on Fri serve to deplete glycogen for me, or should I go to the standard Leg/Ab's on Mon, upper body on Tuesday, and total body on Fri?
10-31-2008, 12:08 PM
Why not do a depletion workout? It's not nearly as physically straining as your other days should be. Depletion days should be high rep, 12-15 reps, high rep, quick movement between exercises. It sets up very positive movements in your body and an efficient carb load.
10-31-2008, 12:39 PM
I guess I just can't get over the fear of overtraining as I am used to working each muscle group to exhaustion once a week. If I've just worked out a muscle group the day before (chest), will I cause problems by hitting it again while circuit training on a depletion workout? I guess I could go easy on the chest for the last workout and focus more on my legs, abs, etc.
Do you think I'd be okay sticking to the split routine with a final total body depletion workout --- Or should I just go with what Llye McDonald recommends?
10-31-2008, 02:48 PM
Depletion is high rep low weight right?
And I do split for my depletion, but I dunno if that's right, sooo, lol.
Speaking of depletion workout, mine starts in an hour :O
10-31-2008, 06:38 PM
Why not move chest to shoulder and tricep day?
On CKD the smaller muscle groups, the biceps, the triceps, calves, shoulders, they don't need as much work as the other muscles do because they hold comparatively less glycogen than the other muscles and are involved with alot of other movements.
If you want to keep your 4 day split do the major groups as close to the start of the week as possible so that your not as worn out for the depletion.
10-31-2008, 07:55 PM
Thanks, I think that's a much better idea. Will also give me another day for some cardio. Appreciate it Thomas!
10-31-2008, 11:58 PM
Dang, tonight was awesome. Had some insane energy with all the gatorade and power bars I stacked up on ^_^
During my carb ups, on Saturdays, should I still take LR?
11-01-2008, 12:26 AM
I honestly have no idea what LR is.
11-01-2008, 12:33 AM
And I am already lookin a bit bloated in my stomach, but my muscles are definately full Should I keep carbing all of tomorrow with my complex, or just stop now? I dunno how bloated to get
Eating my cereal and no fat yogurt now
11-01-2008, 12:17 PM
I wouldn't take the LR on carb up days as it contains yohimbine, which is not very effective when taken with carbs. I was always told save it for low carb days as it works better on low carb diets.
11-01-2008, 12:20 PM
Alright, thanks, guess I wasted 2 pills then ^_^
After our practice last night, I dunno if I am going to want to work my upper body after practices, so I am thinking I will just do 2 days a week of upper body(Friday for depletion, and probably Wednesday) I am also going to go with the Isopure shake, should I take it before practice, or afterwards? I was told beforehand would be good for the BCAAs, but I thought it should have been afterwards, so now I'm confused...AGAIN.
My last meal is at about 1 PM, and practice starts at 3 PM and goes to 5 PM.
11-01-2008, 07:51 PM
You'll get alot of different answers on it. Personally I don't do the whey shakes anymore at all and I haven't seen any noticeable loss in gains or my ability to maintain. I would take it afterwards though and eat a regular meal before hand, or split it up half with a portion of a regular meal before hand and half of the protein after you workout.
On a regular diet you would take a chunk of carbs post workout to stimulate insulin response, amino acid uptake as a result, etc.
11-01-2008, 07:53 PM
How do you guys find the effectiveness of the fat burners? I tend to hold more fat in my chest and stomach than any other body part, which I've always hated. I've considered a fat burner, but I haven't really looked into it.
11-01-2008, 10:25 PM
I'm liking LR for the energy and such, but I have only been using it for a couple days, so I can't really give a definite answer yet. I will update you in a week or so if you want to wait that long.
I took a pic of myself a week and half ago, when I was starting to use the advice I was getting on here, and I took another pic just this Friday(Pics one week apart) and I am definately getting leaner. I think it is partially because I fixed what was screwed up, and the LR. But I have been taking low doses of LR, first full is on Sunday.
I'm going to order my shake right now, and one other thing, I just dunno to do DCP, or a 5 lb of the shake <_< I am thinking I will grab some DCP. I'll take another pic this Friday and compare it to last weeks and see if there's as big of a change.
Carb up ends in 35 mins, and I want some more jello, lol.
EDIT: That's also where I hold my fat, mainly in my stomach. And that's the area that is getting hit, and I am seeing the most difference in, so I'm also glad about that. I plan on being where I want to be in a month or two, then clean bulking while still using CKD.
11-01-2008, 11:11 PM
Well, no DCP is in stock, so I don't know to wait for it or just grab something else :/
Just bought some Poseidon with another 2 lbs of 100% Whey.
I am really interested in how Poseidon will work, it has some great reviews.
11-02-2008, 12:38 AM
Hey this was my back workout on Saturday
First time i've been to the gym in 2 weeks due to a really bad assignment timetable.
Chins 4 x 3 (im using as many sets as needed for 12 reps. Right now its 4, but while I was doing it I felt like I couldve done 3. When I can do it all in one set im going to go weighted)
DL 4 x 8 (First set was a warm up, then 3 sets of pretty moderate weight. DLs really work my lower back which is pretty weak, I get it from my dad. I also recently tore ligaments in my ankle and couldnt walk for 1.5 weeks. I'm thinking that some mdoerate deads will give it some flexibility.)
BB Upright Row 3 x 8 (might take this out, not sure if it really does anything for the traps. I wouldve done shrugs but my grip was feeling pretty weak. Guess typing doesnt train your grip :P)
Bent over DB Row 1 x 8 (Only did 8 for each arm, some guy was using the db i needed so i moved onto something else)
Neutral grip lat pulldown 3 x 8 (Did some lat pulldowns but im going to a new gym these days and the neutral grip attachment was a bit narrow which was sortve annoying)
Straightarm Cable Pulldown 3 x 8 (haha just realised im meant to arch my back doing these. Mustve been told the wrong thing when I first got told about them)
I have a weak back today, and its sore if i try to push my shoulder blades together, flex it etc.
Is this a good workout for CKD?
My back is pretty weak so im just going to have a back day to itself.
11-02-2008, 06:48 AM
You might wanna wait for Thomas, but I think the workout looks good, just make sure you don't do it near your depletion if you are working your back so much that it is that sore.
For your workouts that aren't depletion, I think it is supposed to be about 70%-80% of your max, and 8-9 reps, whereas the depletion is 12-15 reps, at I don't even know what percent of your max, lol.
Sucks about your ankle Are you able to do cardio now? Or is it still screwy?
Also, it's best to do your depletion workout on Friday night, and then take Sat off, or just do cardio, and then Sunday possible do another workout(Although most take off, or do cardio) Giving your body a break on Saturday gives your muscles a little bit more time to fill up with the carbs, and you don't burn off the carbs you would have been using on Monday.
Dang I can't wait for the Poseidon to come in <_<
11-02-2008, 11:10 AM
The workout looks good. What are your warm up ranges?
11-03-2008, 11:43 PM
Well, the our first REAL practice was yesterday. Friday was a screw around/practice time(Mainly scrims)
It was hilarious, I had more energy and endurance on the court than anyone else. Now I love this diet even more ^_^
Poseidon will be in tonight or tomorrow, ugh, I hate waiting
How is your CKD going walugi and Thomas?
And again I'ma put a good word in for Leviathan Reloaded to you Thomas. I take it in the morning, and 2-3 mins later I'm awake and runnin around. Then when I take it around 2 or 3, it's the exact same effect, 2-3 mins later I'm in a better mood/or more energised and ready to run.(Not the jittery type where you HAVE to go do crap, but it will give you the feel of so much energy you want to run/workout)
What supps are you two using?
11-04-2008, 05:02 PM
My CKD is going pretty good. I'm keeping a higher calorie intake than I used to and I'm seeing better results. I have a bad appetite to begin with, I can eat alot, but my appetite just isn't high. Only supplements im taking right now are fish cod oil pills, fiber pills every now and then, multivitamins and thats it.
11-04-2008, 05:31 PM
I am thinking I need to up my intake a bit, since I started practice I don't have much of an appetite, and I keep forgetting to put the olive oil in my shake so I am like 20 or so fat low <_<
Now I dunno what the crap to eat tonight, because I only have stuff high in protein and low-medium in fat :/
Gonna go to walmart and see if I can find something.
I got my Poseidon in today, took it with a shake about 40 mins ago, and no niacene flush I'm gonna take it again right before bed with very little water and see what happens
Are you thinking on adding a stim fat burner still Thomas? Leviathan gives me a great mood and a bit of energy, with no jittery-ness or crash, just to add in another good word for it
How's yours doing walugi?
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