Ursolic acid

[u_e_s_i]

Extract from a thread on HH6 about ursolic acid​

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25352765

Commenting on the paper above
One question that concerns me though, is whether or not UA can increase muscle growth or leave users with increased strength post-cessation.
The paper says that whilst participents on UA’s strength was significantly increased during the experiment and ‘body fat percentage was significantly decreased (p<0.001) in the RT+UA group’, ‘body weight, body mass index, lean body mass, glucose, and insulin levels remained unchanged’.
I’m a little confused as to how their body fat percentage could’ve decreased if their body weight and lean body mass were unchanged.

If the participents’ lean body mass didn’t change then did UA induce enhanced muscle growth?
Additionally, I’m disappointed that the researchers didn’t monitor the subjects after the experiment as I’d like to whether or not their strength returned to baseline after they stopped taking UA

There’s a Russian ecdysteroid that I was researching earlier this year called rhanderol / rhaponticum. The articles cited by examine.com and the individual accounts that people on AM gave all said that rhanderol supplementation leads to significant increases in strength and MPS. The issue however, is that none of the papers cited followed the participants after the experiments ended, whilst the AM folks broadly said that their strength slowly returned to their pre-supplementation level or at best, decreased significantly. It needs to be said that less than half a dozen people on AM posted saying that they’d tried rhanderol.

Rhanderol is a plant-derived ecdysteroid extracted from maral root.
Ursolic acid is a plant-derived ecdysteroid commonly extracted from rosemary.

Ursolic acid is starting to sound rather similar to rhanderol to me


What have you guys noticed whilst on ursolic acid and what did you notice after you came off?
Did you manage to maintain your strength?
Did you manage to maintain your muscle mass?
Etc

 

[cheftepesh1]

I ran ursolic acid and unfortunately did not notice much of anything,

 

[BlockBuilder]

I’ve run it transdermal and I’ll tell you the transdermal works. I know that much. Major difference when I stop using it

 

[Jeremyk1]

The reason body fat can decrease with no change in body weigh or lean body mass is statistical significance. You’d have to check the actual numbers to get a more accurate picture. Lean mass probably increased, but not enough for the researchers to consider it statistically significant. No statistically significant difference means no change to a scientist.

 

[Anabaholic]

I’ve run it transdermal and I’ll tell you the transdermal works. I know that much. Major difference when I stop using it

I've heard good things about UR spray but it's just so dang expensive. What kind of results did you get?

 

[banjobounce]

The reason body fat can decrease with no change in body weigh or lean body mass is statistical significance. You’d have to check the actual numbers to get a more accurate picture. Lean mass probably increased, but not enough for the researchers to consider it statistically significant. No statistically significant difference means no change to a scientist.

I don't believe that significance is based on how much change occurs but rather the confidence as to which the change can be correlated or attributed to the variable in question (ursolic acid in this case)

 

[Jeremyk1]

I don't believe that significance is based on how much change occurs but rather the confidence as to which the change can be correlated or attributed to the variable in question (ursolic acid in this case)

Yeah it’s based on statistical power. There’s a method to it, but I’m not a fan of statistics and what all goes into it. Basically to be considered statistically significant, they’re saying they’re pretty sure it’s not a coincidence. Generally a larger effect size leads to that. Having a larger scale study also helps the statistical power and smaller changes are often considered significant. But yeah, you aren’t wrong.

 

[Canuckguy]

I ran E-pharm's Ursolic acid product Ursobolic at 18 caps per day. I didn't gain a lot of muscle, but it worked for me for fat loss. I have also used their transdermal, and it was good for fat loss. Will use again. I just came off a bottle of the transdermal, and have kept up my strength.

 

[Rockzilla]

So summary:
1. Strength increased
2. Fat decreased
3. No change in body weight, BMI, and LBM, glucose, and insulin

1 is amazing and doesn’t really need any question, but I guess your wondering whether strength stayed, since the study didn’t cover after you have to rely on anecdotal reports.
2 and 3 though fat decreased, but there was no change in body weight, BMI, and LBM. BMI we can address, without weight change and height change(lol) BMI won’t change. But LBM didn’t change so the users gained no muscle.

Some how the participants retained their bodyweight while losing fat and gaining no muscle. So...what weight did they gain? Water? It could have or couldn’t have, there’s studies that show UA being good at controlling blood glucose, which means more glucose in the muscles, hence more water in the muscles. At high doses, it can even be an insulin mimetic. Which is cool, cause insulin remain unchanged which practically means this stuff won’t shut down your insulin production.

Could it have been bone/other tissue growth or regeneration?

UA also causes endocelial cell death and artheroserosis.
Plaques from artherosclerosis cause 3 different cardiovascular diseases.

 

[Brutefit]

From, what i have heard UA is effective for fat loss few of my friends have used it and is been recommending it to me.
Although correlation is not causation, the articles suggest that the control group on UA has improved their strength which can be equated to increased skeletal muscle fiber density. In other words UA can give you gains.

 

[JakeAntaeus]

Jeremyk1, above, is exactly right.

The UA group gained, on average, 1.2kg lean body mass and lost 3% bodyfat. The clean group lost .3kg LBM and gained .8% bodyfat.

So the average UA-taker just underwent a very dramatic 8-week process of body recomposition, whereas the average clean test-subject actually went backwards. (And got weaker, to boot.)

But the operative word above is "on average." The sample sizes were too low, and the error bars far too large, for any of it to reach statistical significance, save for the readily apparent, across-the-board reduction in bodyfat in the UA group.

This doesn't mean that nothing happened. I think that one could say, as is commonly done in the scientific literature, that there is a possible trend toward significance in lean body mass gains, and that a larger study may be able to confirm or disprove it.

And indeed the paper's authors write: "we did not observe substantial gains in lean body mass (Table 1), although a slight, non-significant upward trend was noted." Fertile ground for a follow-up study.

 

[Ricky10]

In for more info/discussion

 

[u_e_s_i]

I ran ursolic acid and unfortunately did not notice much of anything,

How long did you run it for?

 

[u_e_s_i]

Jeremyk1, above, is exactly right.

View attachment 171505

The UA group gained, on average, 1.2kg lean body mass and lost 3% bodyfat. The clean group lost .3kg LBM and gained .8% bodyfat.

So the average UA-taker just underwent a very dramatic 8-week process of body recomposition, whereas the average clean test-subject actually went backwards. (And got weaker, to boot.)

But the operative word above is "on average." The sample sizes were too low, and the error bars far too large, for any of it to reach statistical significance, save for the readily apparent, across-the-board reduction in bodyfat in the UA group.

This doesn't mean that nothing happened. I think that one could say, as is commonly done in the scientific literature, that there is a possible trend toward significance in lean body mass gains, and that a larger study may be able to confirm or disprove it.

And indeed the paper's authors write: "we did not observe substantial gains in lean body mass (Table 1), although a slight, non-significant upward trend was noted." Fertile ground for a follow-up study.

As Ricky10 noted, the UA used in the experiment wasn’t used in conjunction with anything that would boost absorption. So with just 0.6%(?) being absorbed, the difference it made compared to the control group is significant imo.
I’d still like to know whether the subjects kept their gains or not tho as rhaponticum users don’t seem to retain theirs post-cessation.

I concluded a three month run of UR spray + some oral caps a few days ago and I’ll keep you guys up to date

 

[u_e_s_i]

I've heard good things about UR spray but it's just so dang expensive. What kind of results did you get?

BlockBuilder
And what did you notice after you stopped taking it?

 

[u_e_s_i]

I ran E-pharm's Ursolic acid product Ursobolic at 18 caps per day. I didn't gain a lot of muscle, but it worked for me for fat loss. I have also used their transdermal, and it was good for fat loss. Will use again. I just came off a bottle of the transdermal, and have kept up my strength.

How long were you on it for and how long have you been off it?

 

[Canuckguy]

How long were you on it for and how long have you been off it?

When it first came out about 6 years ago I would buy 6 bottles at a time which would last me about 40 days. I did this about twice with a short break between. I had the best results then, as I got compliments at work. Haven't done it recently because of the cost, but just used the transdermal and was happy about that as my bodyfat has kept low.