COMPOUND 20 SOLO Log - Clemenza

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  1. Compound 20 Before Pics (5/3/12) (3 Days In):

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    My main goals this month with Compound 20 and continuing my cut is to continue losing the lower ab fat as well as the sides and really tone it up. As well as maintain and add muscle if possible. Also looking to bring up traps and delts as these have been weak points for me lately due to neck injury.


  2. Doing good so far. Just loading I think. A lot of detailed here. Keep it up man !
    I started a new log at:
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  3. Looking beast bro! After leaning up with c20 you will be sick as all hell man!
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  4. Quote Originally Posted by LiveToLift
    Looking beast bro! After leaning up with c20 you will be sick as all hell man!
    Agreed. You're at a good starting point (bf%) to really make an impact on appearance.
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  5. Nice, pumped to see how C20 solo goes
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by Clemenza
    Compound 20 Before Pics (5/3/12) (3 Days In):

    <img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachment****57 128"/><img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachment****57 129"/><img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachment****57 130"/><img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachment****57 131"/><img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachment****57 132"/><img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachment****57 133"/><img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachment****57 134"/>

    My main goals this month with Compound 20 and continuing my cut is to continue losing the lower ab fat as well as the sides and really tone it up. As well as maintain and add muscle if possible. Also looking to bring up traps and delts as these have been weak points for me lately due to neck injury.
    Do it bro!

  7. GL man

    ive been on c20 for 1.5 months now and its great, recovery is much faster and i dont even need a preworkout. get an awesome pump with it.
    when i started i was at 170lbs and 15% BF. on a 2300cal/day diet, a month in i was 174lbs and 14% bf.
    i decided to cut and started a second cycle on a low carb diet 1800cal/day. bout 50/50 cals from fats and protein. 1 carb loadin day.
    helped me shed so much water weight too and my vascularity is more visible. ive retained a lot more muscle than my last years cut.
    2.5 weeks in, im now at 167lbs and 12.5%bf

  8. Strong 1st post.....here we go again (where's that emoticon that rolls his eyes)

    Yo Clem, Looking solid buddy. Shred up and you'll look wicked! Good luck buddy
    A-Minds HYPE-SLAYER! All posts & feedback are guaranteed to be unsolicited and legit
    "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. Fools despise wisdom & instruction"
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  9. Quote Originally Posted by Whacked View Post
    Strong 1st post.....here we go again (whee's that emoticon that rolls his eyes)

    Yo Clem, Looking solid buddy. Shred up and you'll look wicked! Good luck buddy
    Word...lol
    This message was paid for by the Russians

  10. Thank you guys for the support!! It definitely helps keep the motivation. Still got a good amount of tightening up to do until I'm happy. With my diet, cardio, intense training, Compound 20 this month, and Erase Pro/DAA for June/July (which I'm really pumped for), I should be good. If not, I'll be really disappointed with myself.

  11. Day 4:

    Woke up at 6:00 AM. My apartment building has a small but really nice gym on the top floor. So no need to hit the gym today, just went upstairs and did 30 minutes on the eliptical. Threw down 2 scoops of Modern BCAA Fruit Punch during cardio. Stuff tastes great!

    Took the day off from lifting. Going to start a new routine next week, still just not 100% on what type. Any suggestions feel free to throw them at me.

    Low carb day today. Ended the day at 120g carbs and 350g protein. Trying to get it up to 400g protein, but tough as hell.

  12. Quote Originally Posted by Clemenza View Post
    Low carb day today. Ended the day at 120g carbs and 350g protein. Trying to get it up to 400g protein, but tough as hell.
    Damn, 400 grams at 195? Thats a ton of protein.


    If your cutting why you trying to eat so much?
    This message was paid for by the Russians

  13. Quote Originally Posted by ax1

    Damn, 400 grams at 195? Thats a ton of protein.

    If your cutting why you trying to eat so much?
    Trying to keep calories slightly under maintenance. That way I can gauge how effective compound 20 is. also not in a position where I need to lose too much fat in a short period of time. I drop my protein on higher carb days. But you may be right, 2x per lb may be excessive.

  14. Sup Clem, with all due respect, I agree with Ax1

    "Excess" protein not only converts to sugars (thereby negating some of your low carb activity), but it can be toxic, cause a lot of stress and inflammation in the body (again, at significantly excessive doses) along with other issues. The acidity alone is problematic IMHO.

    I speak from experience. I used to be a disciple of the bro-logic high protein diet (~75% of my k/cal at one point).

    I was determiend to get peeled and gain lean mass at the same time, etc

    I ended up a chubby bloated unhealthy mess with kidney stones (the chronic acidicty was to blame IMO).

    I'm approaching 220 these days and very lean and get in 175-200 grams of protein (excluding BCAAs)

    Everyone is different
    ; just giving you some things to chew on

    Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    Damn, 400 grams at 195? Thats a ton of protein.


    If your cutting why you trying to eat so much?
    A-Minds HYPE-SLAYER! All posts & feedback are guaranteed to be unsolicited and legit
    "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. Fools despise wisdom & instruction"
    Proverbs 1:7

  15. Quote Originally Posted by Whacked View Post
    Sup Clem, with all due respect, I agree with Ax1

    "Excess" protein not only converts to sugars (thereby negating some of your low carb activity), but it can be toxic, cause a lot of stress and inflammation in the body (again, at significantly excessive doses) along with other issues. The acidity alone is problematic IMHO.

    I speak from experience. I used to be a disciple of the bro-logic high protein diet (~75% of my k/cal at one point).

    I was determiend to get peeled and gain lean mass at the same time, etc

    I ended up a chubby bloated unhealthy mess with kidney stones (the chronic acidicty was to blame IMO).

    I'm approaching 220 these days and very lean and get in 175-200 grams of protein (excluding BCAAs)

    Everyone is different
    ; just giving you some things to chew on
    Whacked, I really appreciate the advice.

    That's unreal! Never really knew about the acidity and inflammatory issue with high protein.

    It's funny you say that though, because toward the end of two straight low carb/high protein days, I notice I become flatter (from the low carb), but also BLOATED! I'm guessing this is from the excess protein.

    I am aware of protein converting to sugars and gluconeogenesis. I've just been afraid to go too low on calories. On low carb days I end up with around 100g carbs, and 350-400g protein. That's 1850-2000 kcal, which leaves me needing around 70g fat to bring it up to 2630 kcal. Didn't really want to get lower than that.

    But do you recommend I up my carbs or my fat on those low days, if I'm going to drop protein down to around 200g?

  16. Clem

    Some responses from MY lessons in life only. These may not pertain to you.

    1) The bloat you are experiencing "could" simply be due to a simple digestive issue (lack of necessary enzymes/proteases to deal with such high volume protein intake). That's an easy fix w/the addition of digestive enzymes (and maybe some betain HCL-debateable) and perhaps some probiotics (more comprehensive/ancillary suppport)

    That said, it could also be what I already mentioned as well (acidity/inflammation). Google acid/alkaline diets/lifestyles and you will find a plehtora of research to support my position on the negative cascade of effects from a chronically acidic (high MEAT) diet. Disclaimer: If you also eat a variety of very alkaline foods with each meal like most greens are, you might be able to better balance the acidic environment.

    With respect to you going al the way down to 200 overnight - perhaps you should start at 250-275 and see how your body responds? Some do "ok" with higher levels (however, I am not convinced they arent causing other issues internally).

    2) With respect to the macro's. That's more of a personal trial and error thingy that Im not sure anyone can advise for your unique situation and needs. Lowering carbs doesnt work for everyone and Im a low carb disciple who has fostered this lifestyle for 10_ years so Im prejudice based on my experiences. Also, macro needs (protein), is one thing I think the individual should assesss as well. Again, I used to eat liek you (thanks to all the wonderful "GURU" advice) and wrecked myself int he process. Live and learn.

    Im in my 40's so an old fart now and only do about 2500 k/cal a day on average. Again, 200 grams of protein MAX (lots of BCAA's).

    I train 6 days a week in the AM and 6 cardio sessions in the PM (I have a very sedentary desk job so the "cardio" doesnt really count per se as it would for the normal joe).

    3) I concur with your sentiment/position regarding going too low in carbs. Two options IMO. Up the BCAA's (pre/peri/post training) as these are effective anticatabolic/muscle-sparing supps. Increase your healthy fats. Some days, I get 250 grams of fats in my diet and stay lean. It's a brain game though because we have been so brainwashed into believing fats make you fat. These days, I get a copious dose of coconut, almonds and macedemia nut oil in my diet. I actually feel "energized" (probably more so from the coconut/MCT's)

    I hope some others chime in and offer other/alternative insight as I dont want to see you replicate my regimen as it may/may not not be ideal for you.

    Good luck manggg


    Quote Originally Posted by Clemenza View Post
    Whacked, I really appreciate the advice.

    That's unreal! Never really knew about the acidity and inflammatory issue with high protein.

    It's funny you say that though, because toward the end of two straight low carb/high protein days, I notice I become flatter (from the low carb), but also BLOATED! I'm guessing this is from the excess protein.

    I am aware of protein converting to sugars and gluconeogenesis. I've just been afraid to go too low on calories. On low carb days I end up with around 100g carbs, and 350-400g protein. That's 1850-2000 kcal, which leaves me needing around 70g fat to bring it up to 2630 kcal. Didn't really want to get lower than that.

    But do you recommend I up my carbs or my fat on those low days, if I'm going to drop protein down to around 200g?
    A-Minds HYPE-SLAYER! All posts & feedback are guaranteed to be unsolicited and legit
    "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. Fools despise wisdom & instruction"
    Proverbs 1:7

  17. Quote Originally Posted by Whacked View Post
    Clem

    Some responses from MY lessons in life only. These may not pertain to you.

    1) The bloat you are experiencing "could" simply be due to a simple digestive issue (lack of necessary enzymes/proteases to deal with such high volume protein intake). That's an easy fix w/the addition of digestive enzymes (and maybe some betain HCL-debateable) and perhaps some probiotics (more comprehensive/ancillary suppport)

    That said, it could also be what I already mentioned as well (acidity/inflammation). Google acid/alkaline diets/lifestyles and you will find a plehtora of research to support my position on the negative cascade of effects from a chronically acidic (high MEAT) diet. Disclaimer: If you also eat a variety of very alkaline foods with each meal like most greens are, you might be able to better balance the acidic environment.

    With respect to you going al the way down to 200 overnight - perhaps you should start at 250-275 and see how your body responds? Some do "ok" with higher levels (however, I am not convinced they arent causing other issues internally).

    2) With respect to the macro's. That's more of a personal trial and error thingy that Im not sure anyone can advise for your unique situation and needs. Lowering carbs doesnt work for everyone and Im a low carb disciple who has fostered this lifestyle for 10_ years so Im prejudice based on my experiences. Also, macro needs (protein), is one thing I think the individual should assesss as well. Again, I used to eat liek you (thanks to all the wonderful "GURU" advice) and wrecked myself int he process. Live and learn.

    Im in my 40's so an old fart now and only do about 2500 k/cal a day on average. Again, 200 grams of protein MAX (lots of BCAA's).

    I train 6 days a week in the AM and 6 cardio sessions in the PM (I have a very sedentary desk job so the "cardio" doesnt really count per se as it would for the normal joe).

    3) I concur with your sentiment/position regarding going too low in carbs. Two options IMO. Up the BCAA's (pre/peri/post training) as these are effective anticatabolic/muscle-sparing supps. Increase your healthy fats. Some days, I get 250 grams of fats in my diet and stay lean. It's a brain game though because we have been so brainwashed into believing fats make you fat. These days, I get a copious dose of coconut, almonds and macedemia nut oil in my diet. I actually feel "energized" (probably more so from the coconut/MCT's)

    I hope some others chime in and offer other/alternative insight as I dont want to see you replicate my regimen as it may/may not not be ideal for you.

    Good luck manggg
    Very interesting. Two years ago I did the Scivation Lean Mass diet, not sure if you're familiar with it. It was the most effective diet I've ever done. Effective in the sense that I dropped fat, retained muscle, my skin looked fantastic, and I had consistant energy.

    The diet focused on a moderate protein (about 1g per pound) and much higher fat. Proteins coming mainly from whole food sources, fats coming from avacado, almonds, almond butter. High fiber. Two pieces of fruit and green beans/spinach/brocolli were the only carbs. As well as a re-feed every 4th night I believe, consisting of oats, honey, raisins and sweet potato. Plus high BCAA's. And the funny thing is I was never really "flat" because the refeed would hold me over for 3 days. And my muscles would suck the carbs right up.

    Basically, I looked great and felt great. But it's SOOOOOO hard to follow. But I was consistant with it for a few months and it was amazing.
    The idea behind the spinach and greens was to keep the an alkaline PH I believe.

    I'm going to try and few different things, like slowly bringing my protein down. I currently use 10g BCAA during my workout. I will up it and include extras pre and post along with my whey.

    Just picked up a huge bag of green beans from Costco.

    Amazing you can maintain at a solid 210 lbs on 2500 kcals.

  18. I didn't choose to advise on your diet as you seem set in your ways but I personally don't see a point in a TCD. Eat 1.4-1.8 g/kg protein daily, 1 g/kg ish fat, and the rest for your maintenance/deficit in carbs daily. Azotemia, I believe, is the term for acidic blood due to excessive protein intake. Realistically, anything over 1.2g/lbs is highly unnecessary according to repeated studies (notice kg vs lbs throughout this post) in terms of protein intake. Protein will AT BEST account for 10-12% of total energy expenditure for a day and that's during extreme cases (which yours may be).

    Do a refeed once you're two weeks deep into a cut; however, you aren't necessarily cutting hard so I wouldn't even recommend one -- maybe once every second/third week at best and see how your body responds.

  19. Quote Originally Posted by neddo
    I didn't choose to advise on your diet as you seem set in your ways but I personally don't see a point in a TCD. Eat 1.4-1.8 g/kg protein daily, 1 g/kg ish fat, and the rest for your maintenance/deficit in carbs daily. Azotemia, I believe, is the term for acidic blood due to excessive protein intake. Realistically, anything over 1.2g/lbs is highly unnecessary according to repeated studies (notice kg vs lbs throughout this post) in terms of protein intake. Protein will AT BEST account for 10-12% of total energy expenditure for a day and that's during extreme cases (which yours may be).

    Do a refeed once you're two weeks deep into a cut; however, you aren't necessarily cutting hard so I wouldn't even recommend one -- maybe once every second/third week at best and see how your body responds.
    +/- Correct on the azotemia, it is kidney insufficiency/failure in the face of high nitrogen rich compounds in the blood (not to be confused with rhabdomyolysis). You would have decreased and funky colored urine with it. I can see where ridiculous protein intake would cause this, but you would have to have a lot o digestive enzymes to break down all that meat so the byproducts would then wind up in the bloodstream. Just my.02. Otherwise this post is spot on Neddo, the 1.2gm/lbs is what I have read too
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  20. Neddo and Sae: good stuff, thanks for sharing!

    Clem: That diet sounds almost identical to what I run!!

    You said you felt great on it. I think you answered your own questions
    A-Minds HYPE-SLAYER! All posts & feedback are guaranteed to be unsolicited and legit
    "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. Fools despise wisdom & instruction"
    Proverbs 1:7

  21. Quote Originally Posted by sae2110

    +/- Correct on the azotemia, it is kidney insufficiency/failure in the face of high nitrogen rich compounds in the blood (not to be confused with rhabdomyolysis). You would have decreased and funky colored urine with it. I can see where ridiculous protein intake would cause this, but you would have to have a lot o digestive enzymes to break down all that meat so the byproducts would then wind up in the bloodstream. Just my.02. Otherwise this post is spot on Neddo, the 1.2gm/lbs is what I have read too
    I've heard the extreme circumstances encasing azotemia and the extreme rarity of it but figured it'd still be worth a mention.
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  22. Great insight guys. I've already started making some changes today. I'm going to be including more greens, lowering overall protein intake, and upping the BCAA's.

  23. Day 5:

    Did a high rep, low weight, short rest interval upper body lift today. I mentioned earlier I'm gonna shake my routine up this coming week. So just ending this week with a little blood flow. Will do a light lower body tomorrow.

    Also did 30 minute walk on a 9 incline at 3.3 mph.

    After all the good input I got from you guys, I decided to go lower on the protein and change a few things with the diet.

    Here's exactly what I ate today:

    Meal 1 (Pre workout): 8 oz. OJ / 25g Dymatize Elite (30g C / 25g P)
    (2 Caps C20)

    Intra Workout: 20g Carbs Gatorade powder w/BCAA (20g C)

    Meal 2 (Post workout): 50g carb from Malto/Gatorade powder / 50g Dymatize Elite (50g C / 50g P)

    Meal 3 (1 Hour Follow PWO meal): 1 Cup Oats w/Cinnamon / 5 Eggs (55g C / 35g P / 25g F)

    Meal 4: 1/2 cup Brown Rice / 7 oz. Grilled Chicken (60g C / 40g P)
    (2 Caps C20)

    Meal 5: 1 cup Green Beans / 6 oz. Turkey Burger (35g P / 8g F)

    Meal 6: 1 cup Green Beans / 1/2 cup Brown Rice / 7 oz. Grilled Chicken / 1/4 cup Almonds (60g C / 40g P / 16g F)

    Totals: (275g C / 230g P / 49g F) = 2461 Cals.

    Fat was low today. Usually have 1/4 cup almonds with at least 2-3 meals daily.

    How do you guys feel about including fats with protein/carb meals? I've heard so much back and forth about this over the years. I've never had a problem combining carbs with fat. Interested in your opinions though.

  24. Quote Originally Posted by neddo View Post
    To each their own I have studies performed to argue otherwise; but you listen to your body and mold your diet and intake around it, and I can respect that.



    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=5728391&page= 1

    I'd opt for Genomyx Slin sane or SLINTropin, personally. Possibly even MAN's new GDA.

    I use SS before high carb meals UNLESS post-workout (as I do IF, so most of the time my biggest intake is post-lift and SS is largely a waste in this state) and every night before bed.
    Not sure about this but SLINTropins write up for berberine looks stikingly similar to mine without citations and a few big words...

    ill be following your log

  25. Tear it up mangg

    PS: With the modifications to your diet, you WILL lose bodyfat so be sure to appropriately credit THIS as part of any recomp/fat reduction results when you give your summary on C-20

    Quote Originally Posted by Clemenza View Post
    Great insight guys. I've already started making some changes today. I'm going to be including more greens, lowering overall protein intake, and upping the BCAA's.
    A-Minds HYPE-SLAYER! All posts & feedback are guaranteed to be unsolicited and legit
    "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge. Fools despise wisdom & instruction"
    Proverbs 1:7
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