Anyone tried M1,4add + epistane/havoc together?

[EasyEJL]

Was just thinking that it would be a nice combo to keep the estrogen down from the m1,4, keep the gains a bit dryer.

 

[celc5]

Was just thinking that it would be a nice combo to keep the estrogen down from the m1,4, keep the gains a bit dryer.

What brand M14 do you have?

 

[dkkon1]

Your a lucky b@st@rd if you have legit m1,4add, I want some

 

[celc5]

Your a lucky b@st@rd if you have legit m1,4add, I want some

I think you caught on to what I was insinuating :cheers:

 

[EasyEJL]

lets say mostly designer supplements, with some of another brand I can't recally offhand, also old bottle tho, not CEL

EDIT: Wait, who said I had any and this wasn't just a theoretical question?

 

[boney]

hey looking for some help have read post on gyno an looking to finish it off i did my fist cycle of epistane for 4 weeks an then took my pct (tamox) then had a estrogen rebound shortly after sore nips an build up be hind the nipple.I bought some arimidex then but fck up an spilled half the bottle.It broke it up a bit an an took away the sore ness but half then build up is still there they stick out a little i guess puffy,i was hoping if i bought letro if it would zap it the rest of the way or will i have to buy more arimidex or tamoxifen to take after the letro?

 

[motiv8er]

lets say mostly designer supplements, with some of another brand I can't recally offhand, also old bottle tho, not CEL

EDIT: Wait, who said I had any and this wasn't just a theoretical question?

I would just give you the normal advice of stacking two methyls together. I did it when I was younger, but not proud of it; even with two milder compounds like that. Then again, I had powder m1,4 diol and dosed it in the 250 mgs range with 20 mgs of powder superdrol. Was awesome, sure my body hated me though.

If I was you, I would either run 30-50 mgs of epistane, a compound that I love-
Or Run the M1,4 diol at a nice high rate, 90-150mgs per day, with something like 200 mgs of 6-oxo at night. Should help give you a dryer boost, and make recovery easier. While giving you two different compounds of growth/ anabolism.

Best of luck.

 

[EasyEJL]

my thought was around 120 m1,4 with 30 epi

 

[dkkon1]

I'd do it

 

[isoc]

90-120 of the m1,4add and 30 or so of epi will give nice gains, and should have little estro effects. M1,4add I think is a little misunderstood, this is not dbol, the conversion is not super-high, I have heard as high as 30% but I have also heard 15%. In some reviews that I have read this actually sounded like a cross of dbol and eq, nice gains, not super explosive in weight, not tons of bloat, good strength. I think it has some activity on its own and is not as toxic as some of the other methyls. Of course if you go overboard you will get some negative sides, I would suggest starting at 90-100 of the m14add for a few weeks, and move up if need to. If it is legit, I dont think you will have to. With epi, if it is good epi product, being stacked, 30 mgs should be plenty. I just finished an epi and halo combo product and took 30mg of epi and 50mg of halo, Mon-Fri only, and had great time in visible physique changes. Not tons of weight, but surprising strength and noticeable hardening, vascularity. That is a fairly moderate dose and I am not big, but at 210-215, with almost 15 years of prior experience I am not a newbie. Get your moneys worth Easy, increase dose if you need to, but 5-6 wks at 100m14add and 30mgs of epi should net nice gains, a little water, but very much maintainable. No reason to bloat 12-15 pounds, take on the extra health risks and net 4-7 after pct, when you can just get the 5-6 lbs with a little patience. Easy, this was not meant for you as I know you are a vet and do your homework, this was meant more for in general. Best of luck, I think you will have some fun.

 

[EasyEJL]

i'm sort of thinking doing it starting just before thanksgiving so I can bulk thru the holidays

 

[celc5]

my thought was around 120 m1,4 with 30 epi

If you're straight bulking, just start with the M14. If you're happy with your gains, stick to the M14 and add an ON cycle AI at about the day 15 or 20 point. I think a previous poster suggested 6oxo but I think feedback suggests that it's not as good on cycle as ATD or Formestane.

If you feel like things are getting too sloppy for you, bridge the M14 into epi to finish it off nice and clean. At that point, you can decide whether or not you want to keep your AI going.

 

[jcp2]

I am going to be running the EQ-T2 5 weeks out from my meet OCT 10. I curious to here some more reviews of the M14

 

[isoc]

This is a copy and paste of an M1,4add stand alone review by DatBtrue (posts here at AM) from another board:

"Here is my brief review of M1,4ADDiol p****r from * dosed 80mg once per day taken a few hours before workout.

I have just finished 6 days so far and am happy to report that the effects & side effects mirror those reported by users of Designer Supplements M1,4ADDiol when they sold it way back in 2004. I am an experienced user of many compounds (20+ years) and I am able to make the proper distinctions. This powder is not methyl-test and it is not the ineffective product Cel sold & had to recall a while back. Everything indicates that this powder is what it is purported to be.

Within the first 3 days increased vasularity especially in the arms was noted (my bodyfat is around 10% now). This was further brought out w/ a single dose of L-Arginine prior to my arm workout on the 4th day. The veins were so prominent w/ that combo that MoFos stopped and stared at me as my forearms looked pretty freaky when I was doing curls.

By the 4th day and especially by the 5th day I was noticably bigger everywhere from increased glycogen (I am not restricting carbs at the moment & M1,4ADDiol is making the most of it). This REALLY comes in handy as I do a lot of pump, extreme stretch & pose till I cramp Parillo style fascia stretching everyday.

On the 3rd day I had a slight headache which I attribute to glycogen loading...it left and hasn't returned. No other side effects (possible slight bit of extra water but no real bloat). Weight is up a couple of pounds (I am in a calorie surplus) but I attribute that to glycogen.

Endurance strength is up ...not absolute strength but the kind that makes you want to do another rep or two and then just add another triple drop set... in other words it is subtle...but during my workout I'll feel that I want to do more work ...more volume and most importantly increase the intensity.

Unlike Pheraplex, Superdrol & tren precursors my testicles have not shrunk after 6 days. With those other prohormones they would have been noticably effected by now.

Mood is happy and slightly euphoric at times ...not of the same magnitude as Dbol but similar.

My appetite is up as well ...not of the same magnitude as EQ but similar. Red blood cell count may be up a little as I seem to clot right away BUT no noticable increase in blood pressure.

My guess is that this prohormone will produce minimal sides with fairly easy recovery ...gains will be noticable and increase in linear fashion (both strength & mass) rather than the exponential gains we see w/ some prohormones ...gains will be smaller week to week but consistent and most importantly this compound should remain effective for many weeks whereas something like SD wouldn't.

It would be a great prohormone to add to an injectable test cycle (not as an oral kick start) during the time test is really kicking in because I think there would be some anabolism & strength synergy. "

There are a couple of reviews of EQ/T2 in this forum as well. I will be doing stand alone M1,4add this fall/early winter and am pretty pumped about it, sounds like a lot of fun. Notice the dosage guys 80mgs per day, I think 120+ especially with additional compounds could be overkill, but we all do have different goals.

 

[EasyEJL]

If you're straight bulking, just start with the M14. If you're happy with your gains, stick to the M14 and add an ON cycle AI at about the day 15 or 20 point. I think a previous poster suggested 6oxo but I think feedback suggests that it's not as good on cycle as ATD or Formestane.

If you feel like things are getting too sloppy for you, bridge the M14 into epi to finish it off nice and clean. At that point, you can decide whether or not you want to keep your AI going.

i got 20g of formestane, and around 15 of atg just sitting here yeah, that does make some sense to do it that way. so you think the estrogen surplus won't be that bad for a couple weeks? keep in mind i'm a relatively high estrogen level to begin with too.... in the 30s on the scale last test, previous tests were over top of scale...

 

[EasyEJL]

There are a couple of reviews of EQ/T2 in this forum as well. I will be doing stand alone M1,4add this fall/early winter and am pretty pumped about it, sounds like a lot of fun. Notice the dosage guys 80mgs per day, I think 120+ especially with additional compounds could be overkill, but we all do have different goals.

on the eq/t2, i'm not sure i really get the idea of m1,4 and halo. granted halo is somewhat of a hardener, but it sort of seems superfluous on top of the m1,4. At least the idea with the epi is to keep the estrogen down to reduce bloating. but I do think formestane (maybe magnaform will be out by then?) with just the m1,4 would make for a great feeling combo

 

[isoc]

form and anything is a great combo, it will help keep estro at bay, but not completely kill it and will definitely add hardness and vascularity as part of a stack. I have heard that at higher dosages it gives some primo like effects, which I think is just a fancy way of saying will give some mild strength and nice visual appearance with some suppression. Form+m1,4add would be a great combo, use about 150-200 td a day of the form to get more of the anabolic effect with it and then just taper it down into your pct to get more of the ai effect. i understand the concept of the halo+m1,4ad combo, a bulker with a hardener, but I do think epi may do better than halo. I will say epi+halo, and I did add the td form was a great summer combo!

 

[celc5]

so you think the estrogen surplus won't be that bad for a couple weeks? keep in mind i'm a relatively high estrogen level to begin with too.

Well, I'm thinking you'll know RIGHT AWAY if you are having some nipple action or puffing up from bloat. In which case, you start your AI immediately with the option to bridge as well. OR you could jump right into pct if it's scary estrogen.

My experience with phera was that the water retention was very subtle. I didn't even realize it was there until about a week into pct when I leaned out quickly. I think with M14, if you're having estrogen issues, it will be more obvious if you're one of the unlucky ones.

Have you seen any reports of gyno from M14? If so, you could find out if it snuck up on them slowly or just slammed in all of the sudden.

Edit: I agree with most of what the previous poster said. Just no need to taper form prior to pct. I've never heard of any rebound-like effects with form (and there technically shouldn't be either). Planning a taper during cycle is also a difficult task when you sometimes have to play it by ear.

 

[EasyEJL]

mostly the gyno reports i've seen on it were with heavy heavy doses. 180mg and up. I was considering picking up some of that eq/t2 since its cheap

 

[milwood]

i'm sort of thinking doing it starting just before thanksgiving so I can bulk thru the holidays

Its mid-June, Friday the 13th no less, and Easy's already planning his Thanksgiving bulk! that it just awesome!!! Props for planning and foresight skills!!!

 

[warnerve]

i'll let you know if i do it easy, this is actually exactly what I was planning to run next, prob 80-90 mg m1,4 and 20 mg havoc for 6 weeks. Prob in a month or so

 

[Ziquor]

This cycle sounds like an excellent match :clap2: You gotta log it if you run! As for the conversion since M1,4AD is a diol and it uses the 3-beta enzyme it would convert to Dbol at just under 16% (15.76%). Purity, etc don't effect this number. As with all 3,17b-diol's it will bind to the androgen receptor pre-conversion and have a little activity on its own. But that still wouldn't effect the conversion rate to its parent. Its own activity makes its profile a little different than Dbol just as Halo is different than OT, 4AD to Test, etc. One nice thing being a diol is pre-conversion it cannot convert to estrogen. Compared to diones which can aromatise before they convert to the parent.