Light Doses of HCG (swale) into PCT??

[CEDeoudes59]

I found this interesting
from Deacon....


Lately this topic has become interesting to me. So I decided to pick the brains of a few experts and try my own experiment on myself.

I have concluded three things;

1- HCG is very misunderstood and underused.

2- Most of what has been preached is WRONG!

3- HCG is maybe more important than anything else for PCT purposes.

I will go into this deeper in the future but I seriously think we were all depriving ourselves of a major tool that will be more productive than most every other PCT tool you may have ever heard of.

Okay I know alot of you who are very knowledgable are gonna scream over this post - I just invite you vets to try it sometime and then tell me what you think.

Here is what I have concluded;

YES - run HCG during your cycle BUT at 200-250 IU's 2-3 times per week no more no less.

YES - run HCG while on PCT - yes! while on PCT! 200- 250 IU's 2-3 times per week WHILE on clomid and nolva or one or the other alone ( Myself I now believe that running both is the best way to recover - both drugs do very different things to the human body and running just one is really cheating yourself) and I do believe that running HCG while on PCT is very beneficial to you. There happen to be a lot of studies that suggest this right now - and I feel the old HCG protocol is about to change.

I recently ran HCG with clomid and nolva at the same time (2 weeks HCG 2 weeks clomid/nolva after a short test only cycle) and can only tell you it was the best freaking PCT ever!

I am convinced of one thing - using HCG with your PCT certainly won't harm you - in fact it will give you benefits you have never dreamed of!


I await the criticism to this post with open arms. I think there are more arguments for HCG with PCT than against if you start searching.

I know it worked for me - and I would never waste my time posting this if it didnt.

BTW you should IMO run HCG with several weeks of PCT even if you did not run any HCG during your cycle.

 

[CEDeoudes59]

I will add that, ATD is NO REPLACEMENT for Swale's ON CYCLE Protocol. ATD is effective Post Cycle. Please don't try to run 75mg ED on cycle and expect to maintain your balls....

 

[milwood]

I will add that, ATD is NO REPLACEMENT for Swale's ON CYCLE Protocol. ATD is effective Post Cycle. Please don't try to run 75mg ED on cycle and expect to maintain your balls....

that was my gut feeling, Then ALR came in and said that ATD was an effective HCG alternative. Then ALR disappeared, and in spite of numerous requests, has not responded or explained it further. Referring to THE CORE article. I'd love to hear this debated by people who know the facts, because I am surely not one of them. That said, I've been running 50mg of ATD daily for 4 weeks along with 500mg of Test E weekly, and still have mine. I haven't started the HCG I have on hand as a personal experiment. I still think I'm taking a chance with this, which is why I kept bitching that ALR should get in here and clear it up. I mean, I'm gonna take it kinda personally if this thing goes bad!!! In truth, I plan to kick the HCG in soon, to be safe. But I'm pretty full right now. It is still early, though.

 

[Nate Dawg]

I have actually wondered this for quite awhile, and definately plan on trying it in my upcoming pct. Currently I am running it at 250IU 3x week, mixing it with my oil shots and all is going well. I think HCG/SERM/ATD/Activate is about as good as pct as you could possibly run at the moment, and of course the addition of IGF would be nice, but since I am poor I will probably use P-GH. Actually when coming off my last cycle I ran HCG for a few weeks into postcycle, kept it on the downlow here b/c I figured everyone would tell me it is stupid. I also notice it keeps me in a much better mood while on cycle, especially when on tren. Glad you posted this CED, now lets here the criticism lol....

 

[CEDeoudes59]

thanks guys for your detailed replies.
To be fair, When ARLI said 'ATD=HCG' he probably meant for the 'outdated/normal' HCG protocol 3000,1500,1000. I don't think it quite helps to maintain like [swales] even though a lesser dose of HCG is required.

I feel this way because I discontinued HCG for the past ~2 weeks and replaced it with 50-75mg of ATD. I have no bloodwork for you yet, but I do know when my balls are bigger, or in this case 'not bigger'.

 

[CEDeoudes59]

I doubt ALRI will address that unfortunately. ATD is a new product - and perhaps you could sue him for lousy advice (because he owns a company). It's completely spectulation at this point. ATD, a non-suppressive compound, won't minic LH like HCG will.

I don't know... but someone needs to create an effective HCG-clone. Obviously not an easy task or even worth the money. I doubt we will see will see the day where an there is an oral "HCG" for sale.

 

[Siznoyton]

I agree on the HCG-clone. Someone will come up with something, I hope.

 

[CEDeoudes59]

another question, will HCG prevent a lowered sperm count while on cycle? or prevent the chances of sterility entirely?

 

[Beelzebub]

bump for the smart guys. good question CED.

 

[ABiLiTY]

Bump this, hopfully Dr.D or somebody comes by. Between this and that PCT calc I might need to change the way i handle PCT.

 

[D_town]

another question, will HCG prevent a lowered sperm count while on cycle? or prevent the chances of sterility entirely?

I'm not an expert, but I do believe that HCG will keep the swimmer's swimming. I took HCG prior to PCT last year. I've got a 10 week old to show for it.

 

[ryanbodybuilder]

HCG is the **** man..but I dont know about using it during PCT....

 

[noctorum]

Throughout the entire cycle and the entire PCT?

 

[bioman]

Well, I only know what I've "felt" using these methods and IMO, there are ups and downs to this approach.

The Upside...I think that HCG during cycle, particularly a harsh cycle of methyls like M1T is the way to go to keep the worst of the suppression at bay. My mood was greatly enhanced and I physically felt 80% better than without the HCG.

For PCT it did bring the size back to the boys but there still seemed to be one troubling aspect...once I ceased using HCG several weeks out into PCT, signs of suppression returned..teste size went back down a little, mood got worse, lost some gains and worst of all HCG seemed to thoroughly kill my libido both during use and well after.

Now maybe it's not HCG's fault but this has been my experience with 3 cycles run with Swale's protocol on and after cycle. It definitely has some good qualities..the mood improvement and feeling of well being are great and seem to indicate a test boost, but the libido part is a little troubling for me. It took nearly 5 months to feel 100% normal again after my last cycle.

Part of me feels that althogh HCG eases the immediate effects of suppression, it may simply be putting off the inevitable by effecting some particular nuance of of test or LH output.

All in all, I think it's a good thing, particularly for longer cycles but I don't think it's a cure all. Perhaps in conjunction with ATD it will be improved. I'll find out in 8 weeks.

 

[CEDeoudes59]

bump for the smart guys. good question CED.

thank you, I'm trying to be a productive member again :type:

I'm not an expert, but I do believe that HCG will keep the swimmer's swimming. I took HCG prior to PCT last year. I've got a 10 week old to show for it.

That's certainly evidence, did that happen on cycle, or during PCT, or after everything?
either way... congrats!

 

[D_town]

thank you, I'm trying to be a productive member again :type:




That's certainly evidence, did that happen on cycle, or during PCT, or after everything?
either way... congrats!

Beginning of PCT right after HCG administration and thank you.