Another stupid gyno thread

[SquatsAndOats]

Hey guys. I hate to do this but I'm having some trouble. I'm 1 week into my Cycle and despite having everything on hand I'm having problems. Currently on:
100mg test prop EOD
SDMZ 2.0 2 caps ED split AM/PM
Tr3N 6 caps ED split AM/PM
Research Prami tapered up to 1mg ED
Pharma letro .625 tab EOD, then ED then 1.25mg yesterday
Research Adex 1mg starting today

I'm getting all the classic gyno signs, as I'm gyno prone. Idk if I should have started my AI higher but I'm barely above the natty limit on test (4 100mg prop injects sofar). I'm gonna try Adex for a couple days then switch to pharma aromasin. What dose should I start if 1mg adex ED doesn't do it?
I don't think it's prolactin, not really leaking and I'm getting all the prami sides. I would order a blood test but private MD labs is ****ing expensive. Last time I got all my Test levels, estro and prolactin for $50. Those would run me $300 now, unless I'm missing something?

I appreciate all the help. Really don't want to have to abandon this cycle.

 

[MTPMJM]

uhhh, you're running 180mg of TR3N? I'd say its gotta be prolactin man...

 

[SquatsAndOats]

uhhh, you're running 180mg of TR3N? I'd say its gotta be prolactin man...

Even on 1mg of prami? That's why I want a blood test but idk who to go to now. Should I keep prami at 1mg and just get some OTC **** like prolactrone or inhibit P or up it to 2mg and buy another bottle?

 

[SquatsAndOats]

I just went and bought some prami. How how do you think I should dose it? Without bloods it's kinda hard to tell. I'm searching around for a place like privatemdlabs that doesn't charge 2 weeks pay. I'm at .7ml which is about 1.3mg tonight.

 

[SquatsAndOats]

I just realized I was misreading privatemdlabs. Got bloods ordered. I'll post the results here. I think you might be right MTPMJM. I was laying with my girlfriend and her head was on my chest. I went up to go to the bathroom and there was a wet spot close to my nipple. I got enough prami to taper up to 3mg ED. I should assume that's enough. I think my mistake was assuming the low conversion rate of Trendione to Trenbolone, when Trendione itself is a 19nor. No adex today gonna see how 1mg EOD is on bloods then adjust from there.

 

[booneman77]

I just realized I was misreading privatemdlabs. Got bloods ordered. I'll post the results here. I think you might be right MTPMJM. I was laying with my girlfriend and her head was on my chest. I went up to go to the bathroom and there was a wet spot close to my nipple. I got enough prami to taper up to 3mg ED. I should assume that's enough. I think my mistake was assuming the low conversion rate of Trendione to Trenbolone, when Trendione itself is a 19nor. No adex today gonna see how 1mg EOD is on bloods then adjust from there.

Haha I've had the gf on the chest thing happen before too... And then realized she had just drooled on me. Woke up in the middle of the night freaked the f out (I was on trest and having pretty heavy estro sides anyways)... Spent like 10min playing with my nips in the bathroom before it dawned on me.

 

[SquatsAndOats]

On my way to bloods thismorning. A couple things:
I took my test dose as well as my adex, SDMZ and tr3n doses that I would normally take in the morning. I also took my Prami last night. I'm still getting some soreness, but it's really hard to tell if my nipples are swollen and bigger, or if it's just because I'm getting leaner. I will update with bloods when I get the results in

 

[SquatsAndOats]

So I got my bloods back and needless to say I'm pissed. My prolactin is right where I want it to be, but my estrogen is way too ****ing high. So I'm assuming my Research Adex is bunk, and I'm gonna start 25mg natxo Xtane ED until this subsides and go from there. Really mad cause I ordered more prami too. It's not letting me upload my labs due to size, but prolactin is low end of the normal range.
Testosterone came back 2415ng/dl
Estradiol came back 198.2pg/ml on a scale from 7-42. May hop on nolva 20mg until I can get estro lowered.

 

[booneman77]

at least you know the test is good ha.

 

[SquatsAndOats]

Yea, doesn't do much good when it's all going to estrogen haha. I'm not sure if I should drop some letro for a week then just do exemestane? I have about 10 letro tabs and 90 natco exemestane tabs as well.

Also my ALT and AST came back at 51 and 83 IU/L respectively. I've started TUDCA since at 250mg twice daily. Will that be enough or should I bump it up to a gram a day?

 

[booneman77]

Yea, doesn't do much good when it's all going to estrogen haha. I'm not sure if I should drop some letro for a week then just do exemestane? I have about 10 letro tabs and 90 natco exemestane tabs as well.

Also my ALT and AST came back at 51 and 83 IU/L respectively. I've started TUDCA since at 250mg twice daily. Will that be enough or should I bump it up to a gram a day?

I wouldn't bother with the letro unless you really think you need it. When will work fast so it shouldn't be an issue.

I might bump the TUDCA up to 750-1g for the first week or so just to get things moving

 

[SquatsAndOats]

You mean exemestane will work fast?

 

[booneman77]

You mean exemestane will work fast?

Yep. Autocorrected.

 

[StanleyG]

What did your blood work say?
You may well be one that needs to manage your e2 with an ai (i prefer stane) and possibly add in a serm (preferable ralox) to prevent/treat gyno.
IMO letro is an awful option for gyno. Why systemically crash your e2 with all the unhealthy and uncomfortable things that go along with doing that when you could simply manage your e2 and handle the gyno right at the source, the e2 receptor in breast tissue.
Post your blood work and then you can go from there making intelligent decisions based on that info.

 

[DavidR79]

StanleyG, I have a quick question that may help someone else and myself..

If my estrogen levels are always at "X" let's say...

While I'm on let's say 500mg a Test do I want my estrogen to remain at "X" or can we let it go up a bit with Test..

I was always curious and wondered at what levels gyno occurs or is created..

 

[SquatsAndOats]

The file size is too big but I basically said all of this in an early post what my numbers were
Testosterone: 2415ng/del
Estradiol: 198pg/ml on a scale of 7-42
This is 8 days on cycle. First 3 days were .625mg letro EOD, days 4-6 were 1.25mg Leto EOD and days 6-8 were 1mg adex EOD. Adex was taken before the blood test.

 

[DavidR79]

That's odd... That's a quick jump early on.. Especially while dosing your AI..

You buy from a reliable source?

Either that or your just estrogen sensitive.. Test levels aren't bad for early on though..

 

[SquatsAndOats]

That's odd... That's a quick jump early on.. Especially while dosing your AI..

You buy from a reliable source?

Either that or your just estrogen sensitive..
Test levels aren't bad for early on though..

Letro is femera from cipla pharma, adex is research adex. I should have dosed my letro higher In the beginning. Ostarine gave me a flare up 2 weeks in at 20mg. I think I'm gonna give that letro gyno reversal a try. Ralox never worked when I used it. I have cialis for libido so I think I'll be okay. Will keep you guys updated

 

[DavidR79]

Were you just breaking those tabs by hand or what?

 

[StanleyG]

StanleyG, I have a quick question that may help someone else and myself..

If my estrogen levels are always at "X" let's say...

While I'm on let's say 500mg a Test do I want my estrogen to remain at "X" or can we let it go up a bit with Test..

I was always curious and wondered at what levels gyno occurs or is created..

There are 2 causes for gyno. Elevated estrogen (obviously) or and androgen/estrogen imbalance. The first one is obvious. e2 is just way too high so gyno develops. The second more tricky. Tricky in the sense that your e2 could be with the clinically acceptable range but if your androgen levels are abnormally low this also set the stage for gyno to form.
My goal when on cycle is to keep estrogen within clinically normal range (close to what my e2 is off cycle). This gives me the benefits of estrogen without the adverse, unhealthy sides. Many of which occur way before gyno and in reality can be more serious.
The level where gyno forms shouldn't be your mark. If gyno is forming your e2 is way too high and you are getting the other bad effects of estrogen. You dont want to push the limit and keep e2 at a level say right before gyno will form. You want to manage it, keep it at where it is off cycle.
Hope that answers your question.

 

[DavidR79]

There are 2 causes for gyno. Elevated estrogen (obviously) or and androgen/estrogen imbalance. The first one is obvious. e2 is just way too high so gyno develops. The second more tricky. Tricky in the sense that your e2 could be with the clinically acceptable range but if your androgen levels are abnormally low this also set the stage for gyno to form.
My goal when on cycle is to keep estrogen within clinically normal range (close to what my e2 is off cycle). This gives me the benefits of estrogen without the adverse, unhealthy sides. Many of which occur way before gyno and in reality can be more serious.
The level where gyno forms shouldn't be your mark. If gyno is forming your e2 is way too high and you are getting the other bad effects of estrogen. You dont want to push the limit and keep e2 at a level say right before gyno will form. You want to manage it, keep it at where it is off cycle.
Hope that answers your question.

Perfect Brother, Thanks..

I knew about the 2 ways they form, the E2 one always plagued me simply because I've seen guys get labs and E2 is sky high, no gyno.. So thanks...

 

[SquatsAndOats]

What did your blood work say?
You may well be one that needs to manage your e2 with an ai (i prefer stane) and possibly add in a serm (preferable ralox) to prevent/treat gyno.
IMO letro is an awful option for gyno. Why systemically crash your e2 with all the unhealthy and uncomfortable things that go along with doing that when you could simply manage your e2 and handle the gyno right at the source, the e2 receptor in breast tissue.
Post your blood work and then you can go from there making intelligent decisions based on that info.

Because I've crashed me E2 with letro off cycle and the sides sucked but they were manageable, I don't mind doing it on cycle if it means I can reduce this flare up.

I doubt the letro is fake. I got it from a reliable place in India if you guys catch my drift. All the tabs were sealed as well as the package. It would seem it would be more expensive for them to fake it than give me a real priduct. Can't use ralox. I have some from the same place and for whatever reason ralox and nolva both aggravate the ER and make my nipples swell and painful. It is apparently a known side effect of both drugs, albeit a very rare one. After a week or so of letro and based on how I'm feeling about it I'm gonna taper off and start exemestane 25mg EOD then get bloods again in a couple weeks.

 

[SquatsAndOats]

So I may be wrong and maybe this letro is fake, that or my Tr3n is actually Tr3st... I'm still getting symptoms after 5 days at 2.5mg ED and 25mg exemestane the first couple days. Getting a blood test on Tuesday. Really pissed if it is cause cipla is supposed to be a trusted brand for these types of products.

 

[smithstetics]

In on Gyno thread, whered you get your prami? I'm looking at Ag guys letro and ADC tamox

 

[SquatsAndOats]

Blue sky peptides. I've never had problems with research prami. A friend of mine who's been helping me out said not to take Anything on Monday the day before my test no shot of prop, no letro or orals since I'm getting tested Tuesday morning. Gonna see what it says. My last shot was yesterday and last orals were tonight.

 

[JeremyNG25]

mod edit: rules

 

[booneman77]

You do realize that Iron Mag Labs makes RC's right? I mean come on guys you're worried about bunk RC's when IML is available?

Yeeeaaahhhhh I'm pretty skeptical of IML at the moment... Check out my epi/tren thread if you want more info ha

 

[StanleyG]

Yeeeaaahhhhh I'm pretty skeptical of IML at the moment... Check out my epi/tren thread if you want more info ha

Rightly so IMO ......

 

[SquatsAndOats]

mod edit: rules

 

[Blergs]

Hey guys. I hate to do this but I'm having some trouble. I'm 1 week into my Cycle and despite having everything on hand I'm having problems. Currently on:
100mg test prop EOD
SDMZ 2.0 2 caps ED split AM/PM
Tr3N 6 caps ED split AM/PM
Research Prami tapered up to 1mg ED
Pharma letro .625 tab EOD, then ED then 1.25mg yesterday
Research Adex 1mg starting today

I'm getting all the classic gyno signs, as I'm gyno prone. Idk if I should have started my AI higher but I'm barely above the natty limit on test (4 100mg prop injects sofar). I'm gonna try Adex for a couple days then switch to pharma aromasin. What dose should I start if 1mg adex ED doesn't do it?
I don't think it's prolactin, not really leaking and I'm getting all the prami sides. I would order a blood test but private MD labs is ****ing expensive. Last time I got all my Test levels, estro and prolactin for $50. Those would run me $300 now, unless I'm missing something?

I appreciate all the help. Really don't want to have to abandon this cycle.

give the AI a couple weeks to have effect.... use low dose SERM like tamox during this time if need be. stop using this ai and that AI or multipal AI's. 0,6mg eod-e3d letro and leave it at that IMO.
keep prami on hand if needed, i doubt its need at this point.
at 1 weeks its fluctuations in body.. some sensitivity does not necessarily mean its gyno or gonna be gyno.
GIVE AI A COUPLE WEEKS TO WORK BEFORE UPPING DOSAGES OR SWAPPING THINGS UP AND DOWN


ps; letro 0.25mg eod- 3ed is enough for most

 

[rtmilburn]

mod edit: read rules.

 

[booneman77]

Any chance you can link me the thread. I can't find it for some reason. Using my phone btw

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/showthread.php?t=268953

 

[smithstetics]

You mean CS and lab walk through for their grey market products... Yeah that's a good way to get the Feds up your arse and shut down before you can sell enough to pay off your fancy equipment ha.

Ah alright so there are some flaws haha, maybe do it in Canada or something. I don't know man im 17!

 

[booneman77]

I can try, I'm looking for a new doc that isn't stupid. and dont you need a referral to go see an endo?

Depends on insurance usually. Some do, some don't. Def look around for a good doc. Read some reviews and such and try to find someone who has some experience in the matter.

 

[smithstetics]

I think it might depend on your insurance

ill check into it man, thanks for all the advice guys

 

[rtmilburn]

It's definitely not illegal, doesn't mean your using an illegal substance, just asking a question

I think he is referring that as to against the rules. I do think it is against the rules because they aren't a board sponsor and research chem place. I'm sorry if i did brake the board rulez

 

[Godstrength]

I think he is referring that as to against the rules. I do think it is against the rules because they aren't a board sponsor and research chem place. I'm sorry if i did brake the board rulez

mod edit: if you read the sticky where it states, rules..you would have your answer.


http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/205-anabolic-forum-rules.html#post2651279