Suggestions for PH cycle?

[Trento]

Hey all. I apologize if I'm breaking protocol by starting a new thread with this topic; I've tried reading all the rules but am still unsure.

I'm looking for advice on a PH cycle. I'm 34 y/o, have been lifting since I was 31, and interested in making some gains. I'm 6'3", 194 lbs (looking to go to 220 cut...eventually), about 8% BF (just finished the cut). I've done Torque PH before, but with little results. I'm a rampant ectomorph, with high metabolism.

Other than the Torque (yes, I used a PCT), I've never used PH before, but am interested in the concept. I've seen a lot of hype out there, but very little info from experienced users on what works. I'd like advice on what PH or PHs would be good to cycle/stack, and what PCT would be best (the idea of gyno appeals to me even less than losing gains).

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

[OnTheRoadTo]

Epistane 4 week standalone, hands down. 30/30/40/40, nolvadex PCT, standalone support stack during (I prefer anabolic innovations "cycle support") and maybe a T booster or PCT product in PCT as well.

 

[GeekPoop]

i say m14add + something else depending on experience to help ya gain some mass

 

[schwellington]

Epistane 4 week standalone, hands down. 30/30/40/40, nolvadex PCT, standalone support stack during (I prefer anabolic innovations "cycle support") and maybe a T booster or PCT product in PCT as well.

No


First problem here(in my opinion of course) epistane CUTS estrogen- therefore nolvadex is not the serm he needs and it could be harmful(estrogen IS usefull for hormonal balance in controlled amounts in men)- I reccomend clomid- much better at reversing the shut down


epistane at 30/30/40/40? That hardly leaves him enough time to make gains on the epithio compound- epistane is GREAT but mild in side effects- and not the best bulker- it would work- but not the best if you do run epistane run this

40/40/50/50/50/50

you'll be fine


But like geek poop said if your trying to build mass- m14add with a bridge into epistane or p-mag

 

[Trento]

No


First problem here(in my opinion of course) epistane CUTS estrogen- therefore nolvadex is not the serm he needs and it could be harmful(estrogen IS usefull for hormonal balance in controlled amounts in men)- I reccomend clomid- much better at reversing the shut down


epistane at 30/30/40/40? That hardly leaves him enough time to make gains on the epithio compound- epistane is GREAT but mild in side effects- and not the best bulker- it would work- but not the best if you do run epistane run this

40/40/50/50/50/50

you'll be fine


But like geek poop said if your trying to build mass- m14add with a bridge into epistane or p-mag

Thanks for the advice, guys. I appreciate it.

I'm going to show my noobness with this question, but by a bridge did you mean overlapping the two for a week or two in the cycle? Like doing m14add for a few weeks then the epistane?

Also, would clomid be good as PCT for m14add as well?

Thanks again for the input guys.

 

[RickRock13]

Thanks for the advice, guys. I appreciate it.

I'm going to show my noobness with this question, but by a bridge did you mean overlapping the two for a week or two in the cycle? Like doing m14add for a few weeks then the epistane?

Also, would clomid be good as PCT for m14add as well?

Thanks again for the input guys.

m1,4add is an aromatizing steroid (converts to estrogen), therfore not only would Nolva be the best for PCT, you may want to add an AI on cycle also, or at least have one on hand in case of puffy nips, etc.

 

[schwellington]

m1,4add is an aromatizing steroid (converts to estrogen), therfore not only would Nolva be the best for PCT, you may want to add an AI on cycle also, or at least have one on hand in case of puffy nips, etc.

nolva would be good so would clomid- combine the two gaurenteed gyno protection and restart of the hpta- talk to unrealmachine he can guide you in this


yes a bridge is an overlap for example- 40/-represents one week right?

so! m14add-60/90/90/90/0/0
epistane-0/0/0/40/40/40


but if this is ur first cycle- I wouldnt reccomend a bridge

 

[Trento]

Man, I can't thank you guys enough. I guess m14add (60/90/90/90) with Nolva starting in week three through end of week six? Is it advisable to start the SERM a week or two before end of cycle to prevent gaps, or would that just be a waste?

I'm almost tempted to do the epistane bridge, but still wise enough to listen to those who know more than I. It's not technically my first cycle of PH or otherwise, but I feel like it will be my first cycle done right. The last time I just picked up some Torque from the corner nutrition store and started downing them that day. I bought an OTC PCT for follow-up, but got very little results other than some hardening (of muscle, not the downstairs gear. That part was AWOL for a month; nerfed the wife). Think I might have gotten test flu, too.

Are there any AI's you guys would recommend?

OnTheRoadTo, Geek Poop, schwellington, RickRock, thanks again for your input. You guys don't know how much I've been sweating my selection here. Us old guys have to be more cautious with our health.

 

[OnTheRoadTo]

No


First problem here(in my opinion of course) epistane CUTS estrogen- therefore nolvadex is not the serm he needs and it could be harmful(estrogen IS usefull for hormonal balance in controlled amounts in men)- I reccomend clomid- much better at reversing the shut down


epistane at 30/30/40/40? That hardly leaves him enough time to make gains on the epithio compound- epistane is GREAT but mild in side effects- and not the best bulker- it would work- but not the best if you do run epistane run this

40/40/50/50/50/50

The fact that estrogen is lowered during an epistane cycle is WHY you should use Nolvadex. After the cycle is over, you will get a supercompensation of estrogen production - this is why "rebound gyno" happens. As such, it is important to consider a SERM with high affinity for the estrogen receptor in breast tissue. The light cycle I recommend would be very easy to recover from.

As far as gains go, I went from 226 to 252 on that 4 week cycle, (some of that was rebounding from a cut from ~242 or so). Epi bulks just fine with adequate calories. Too many people on this board over-supp and under-train and under-eat. I stand by my recommendation for a first cycle in full. 30 30 40 40 is also exactly 1 bottle.

Whatever you do, PCT starts the last day of cycle. Running an aromatizing compound you could just add an aromatase inhibitor for estrogen control.

 

[Trento]

Would it be a good idea to run Nolva on cycle as well? Should I add the clomid to the Nolva PCT?

 

[OnTheRoadTo]

No, only do it in PCT. Look for a clomid/nolva combo, they're pretty easy to find at research chemical sites and are the best of both worlds (HPTA restoration + gyno prevention)