Physical Effects of Superphysiological Amounts of AAS on Adolescents

  1. New Member
    ex_banana-eater's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    369
    Rep Power
    330
    Level
    19
    Lv. Percent
    28.59%

    Physical Effects of Superphysiological Amounts of AAS on Adolescents


    Introduction
    Therapy was started at a BA of 14 yr or older, adult final height significantly exceeded height prognosis at the time of start of treatment. This suggests that treatment had resulted in induction rather than reduction of growth -- this was treatment of constitutionally tall stature (CTS) children with androgen therapy (Testosterone Enanthate at 500mg/wk).

    ______________________________ ____________________ _________________

    High doses of T induce suppression of the hypothalamo-pituitary-gonadal axis (113, 136). Contraceptive studies in adult men have shown that androgen-induced suppression of gonadotropins and of spermatogenesis is reversible (137, 138). However, extrapolation of these data to the management of tall stature in pubertal boys must be viewed with caution since factors that regulate spermatogenesis in normally functioning adult testes may not be the same as during puberty (139). Androgen therapy in tall boys is usually initiated at the first signs of puberty, and it is in this peripubertal period that important maturational changes take place in the testis (139, 140, 141, 142, 143, 144). Influenced by complex hormonal actions, these maturational processes eventually lead to initiation of spermatogenesis. Onset of spermatogenesis (spermarche) as detected by urine analysis (spermuria) appears to be an early pubertal event: the median age of spermarche has been estimated to be 13–14 yr (145, 146, 147, 148). In addition, it is noteworthy that administration of T esters at high doses may cause morphological and cytological changes, as shown in rat and human adult testes (149, 150, 151).

    1. Plasma hormone levels: High T levels are obtained during treatment with supraphysiological doses of androgens suppressing the hypothalamo-pituitary-gonadal axis (152).

    Zachmann, Prader, and co-workers (98, 113) reported a slow recovery of pituitary gonadotropins during LHRH-stimulation tests after discontinuation of T therapy. Brämswig et al. (136) demonstrated normalization of gonadotropin levels in 100 tall boys after discontinuation of treatment with follow-up periods up to 48 months, although transient hypergonadotropic LH- and FSH- secretory patterns were observed. In a recently published study by the same group (153), hormonal levels and testicular function were evaluated after a follow-up period of approximately 10 yr and compared with normal volunteers. Mean values of LH, FSH, PRL, T, estradiol, and sex hormone-binding globulin were in the normal range in both groups. T was lower and FSH was higher in treated tall men compared with volunteers, but the only statistically significant difference was for T. We observed different levels of gonadotropins in previously treated tall men compared with controls (tall and ‘normal’ men) (154). Androgen-treated tall men had significantly higher FSH levels compared with controls. Levels of plasma hormones were not significantly correlated with parameters of sperm quality; however, we observed significant negative correlations between plasma FSH levels and sperm concentration as well as the age at start of therapy in the androgen-treated men. We speculate that the higher levels of FSH may reflect intratesticular changes due to androgen treatment received during a period of testicular maturation especially during the earlier pubertal stages (155). These increased FSH levels may compensate for partially disturbed germinal function to maintain normal sperm quality (156). In a subgroup of previously treated and untreated men, we also measured inhibin B, which probably is a more direct marker of spermatogenesis than FSH (157). We found similar levels, well within the normal range (F. H. De Jong and W. J. De Waal, unpublished results). On the other hand, the difference in gonadotropin levels may also reflect a change in responsiveness at the hypothalamo-pituitary level (136).

    2. Testicular volume: Treatment with high doses of androgens induces reduction in testicular volume in adult men (158) as well as in tall adolescent boys (98, 99, 113). This implies major intratesticular changes during therapy such as a decrease in seminiferous tubule size (149, 150). These processes are likely to be reversible since testicular volume normalizes after discontinuation of therapy as shown in several studies (98, 99, 113, 158). This is in contrast to the observations of Willig et al. (159, 160), who reported significantly smaller testicular sizes in previously treated men. In contrast, in our studies at a mean follow-up period of 8 yr after cessation of treatment, there was no difference in mean testicular volume between treated and untreated tall men (154).

    3. Sperm quality: When sperm quality is evaluated, one must be aware of the normal distribution in the population as well as of confounding factors interfering with parameters of sperm quality. It is well established that varicocele (161, 162, 163, 164), smoking (165), sexually transmitted disease (166), and cryptorchidism (167) are likely to affect sperm quality and/or plasma hormone levels. Semen analysis in our study of previously androgen-treated men showed that sperm quality was comparable with a control group of untreated tall men, even after correction for the above mentioned possible interfering conditions, after a mean follow-up period of 8 yr. These findings are in agreement with the experiences reported by Zachmann and Prader and co-workers (98, 113). In contrast, Willig and co-workers (159, 160) found significantly reduced sperm concentrations in previously treated tall men compared with controls. Their control group, however, showed a relative high mean value of sperm concentration of 120.2 x 10'6/ml, almost twice as high as values found in the normal population at present (168, 169). Their treated group showed a mean sperm concentration of 63.4 x 10'6/ml, which is comparable with values found in our study (154). It is possible that differences in patient selection, semen analysis methodology, and treatment regimens may account for the observed differences. In addition, the extent to which interfering conditions are present may cause important bias as well. In a recent report Lemcke and co-workers (153) showed that 10 yr after T treatment, none of the tall men had azoospermia, and the mean ejaculate parameters were in the normal range or only slightly subnormal. Overall, seminal parameters of T-treated tall men were slightly, but not significantly, lower compared with normal statured volunteers. Interestingly, they found a significantly higher prevalence of varicocele and maldescended testes in the tall men compared with their control group of normal volunteers (153). They surmised that varicocele and maldescended testes, rather than T treatment, caused the somewhat lower semen quality in the tall men. In our studies in treated and untreated tall men, we observed an overall prevalence of varicocele of 42% (12% subclinical and 30% clinical) (154). This would suggest that varicocele occurs more often than reported in the normal population (12.4–25.8%) (170, 171, 172). A relationship to androgen treatment is unlikely since no difference in the prevalence of varicocele was observed between androgen-treated men and controls. One could speculate on the impact of stature on the pathogenesis of varicocele (153, 154).

    4. Pregnancy/paternity: Thus far, only casuistic and exclusive female data have been available on successful pregnancies after height-reductive therapy. At the time of our follow-up studies five of the 43 androgen-treated men and six of the 30 untreated tall men had fathered one or more children (154). All 11 men reported that pregnancy had occurred in their partners after less than 1 yr of unprotected coitus. Two other pregnancies, fathered by a previously treated man and a control, respectively, ended in spontaneous abortion. These very limited numbers do not allow any further conclusions.

    Other clinical effects
    Many patients experience side effects during therapy (98, 99, 113, 132, 173, 174). Most of these, however, are mild and transient (see Table 7). In some patients, slight to moderate edema, notably in the pretibial or malleolar area, was associated with marked weight gain during the first 6 months of treatment. This indicates that the early gain in weight is not only due to protein anabolism but also to water retention (98). Acne was by far the most reported side effect (98, 99, 175). Occasionally acne fulminans has been reported and necessitated discontinuation of therapy (173, 176). A causal relationship with androgen therapy is likely as shown by Fyrand et al. (177). Hinkel et al. (178) investigated the effects of high doses of androgens on lipoproteins during and after the cessation of therapy. Although during treatment a significant fall of triglycerides and HDL was observed, all values normalized after the end of treatment (178). In our studies, gynecomastia occurred in 13% of the cases. Since gynecomastia is rather prevalent in population studies in pubertal boys (179), it is difficult to say whether the condition had increased. One would expect that treatment would have effects on sexuality (sex interest, masturbation). Although in one study a marked increase of sexuality in younger, but not in older patients, was noted, it never exceeded the normal range seen in adolescence (98). Treatment with supraphysiological doses of T were not shown to provoke aggressive behavior in adolescents or young adults (180, 181).

  2. Professional Member
    size's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Age
    42
    Posts
    4,232
    Rep Power
    2268
    Level
    44
    Lv. Percent
    92.94%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Nice of you to copy the study from bb.com. What is your point?

    However, as I commented there, you really need the complete study to follow it. The link: http://edrv.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/19/5/540

    It presents many interesting points, but one of the major problems it does not address is the lack of mental maturity. This is my real issue with young men using AAS. Also, as we all know, studies can contradict other studies. This study has been around for quite sometime.

    I thought this was interesting ,"The pubertal growth spurt has long been considered to be an androgen-dependent process. However, there is abundant clinical and experimental evidence showing that estrogens may be primarily responsible for accelerated growth during puberty (48). It is remarkable that peak height velocity occurs in girls and boys when estradiol levels are not only low but also quite similar (49, 50). .
    Now I find this interesting b/c many users include antiestrogen's to surpress estrogen levels in fear of developing gyno. So the surpression of estrogen during usage as an adolscent may have a negative response.
    Last edited by size; 12-17-2003 at 01:32 AM.
  3. Advanced Member
    Sheesh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Posts
    516
    Rep Power
    403
    Level
    23
    Lv. Percent
    85.93%

    Now I find this interesting b/c many users include antiestrogen's to surpress estrogen levels in fear of developing gyno. So the surpression of estrogen during usage as an adolscent may have a negative response.

    Not really a negative effect, but it would negate an effect that would only happen in the case of administering the testosterone to these pubescent boys.

    The anti-estrogen would still be useful for preventing gynecomastia, but for those teens on steroids that want another growth spurt, the use of the anti-e's wouldn't be beneficial.
    •   
       

  4. Advanced Member
    x_muscle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Posts
    640
    Rep Power
    85479
    Level
    24
    Lv. Percent
    24.88%

    wasnt this guy banned before?
  5. I am faster than 80% of all snakes
    Dwight Schrute's Avatar
    Stats
    6'1"  221 lbs.
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Age
    41
    Posts
    12,911
    Rep Power
    7017

    Who was banned?
    For answers to board issues, read the Suggestion and News forum at the bottom of the main page.
  6. New Member
    ex_banana-eater's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    369
    Rep Power
    330
    Level
    19
    Lv. Percent
    28.59%

    Quote Originally Posted by size
    Nice of you to copy the study from bb.com. What is your point?

    However, as I commented there, you really need the complete study to follow it. The link: http://edrv.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/19/5/540

    It presents many interesting points, but one of the major problems it does not address is the lack of mental maturity. This is my real issue with young men using AAS. Also, as we all know, studies can contradict other studies. This study has been around for quite sometime.

    I thought this was interesting ,"The pubertal growth spurt has long been considered to be an androgen-dependent process. However, there is abundant clinical and experimental evidence showing that estrogens may be primarily responsible for accelerated growth during puberty (48). It is remarkable that peak height velocity occurs in girls and boys when estradiol levels are not only low but also quite similar (49, 50). .
    Now I find this interesting b/c many users include antiestrogen's to surpress estrogen levels in fear of developing gyno. So the surpression of estrogen during usage as an adolscent may have a negative response.
    I've read the complete study.

    If your real issue with young men and AAS was psychological, you may want to research it. Studies show an increase in vasopressin receptor binding (v1a) in the hypothalamus and no other parts of the brain in adolescent hamsters. This is directly correlated with high androgen levels and most likely returns to baseline after androgen discontinueation.

    For some good points by myself and Patrick, refer to this thread. Feel free to post.

    http://forum.avantlabs.com/?act=ST&f=1&t=7243&
  7. Professional Member
    size's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Age
    42
    Posts
    4,232
    Rep Power
    2268
    Level
    44
    Lv. Percent
    92.94%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    It has nothing to do with that.

    The fact of the matter is that young men are not of the same maturity as adults. My point is simply. Young men are not MENTALLY mature. A 16 year old and a 28 year old think and act completely different.

    If I needed to research it I would, but I have a career and perform research in a completely different field. Arguing over why or why not a teen should use AAS is not important to me. However, if I choose to research the area of interest, I would not just copy studies and other posts and act as if I researched the topic.


    Why do young men always want to justify their drug usage?
  8. Professional Member
    size's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Age
    42
    Posts
    4,232
    Rep Power
    2268
    Level
    44
    Lv. Percent
    92.94%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheesh
    Not really a negative effect, but it would negate an effect that would only happen in the case of administering the testosterone to these pubescent boys.

    The anti-estrogen would still be useful for preventing gynecomastia, but for those teens on steroids that want another growth spurt, the use of the anti-e's wouldn't be beneficial.

    This is what I was implying.
  9. New Member
    ex_banana-eater's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    369
    Rep Power
    330
    Level
    19
    Lv. Percent
    28.59%

    Quote Originally Posted by size
    It has nothing to do with that.

    The fact of the matter is that young men are not of the same maturity as adults. My point is simply. Young men are not MENTALLY mature. A 16 year old and a 28 year old think and act completely different.

    If I needed to research it I would, but I have a career and perform research in a completely different field. Arguing over why or why not a teen should use AAS is not important to me. However, if I choose to research the area of interest, I would not just copy studies and other posts and act as if I researched the topic.

    Some teenagers are more mentally mature than an adult in alot of respects. I'll give to you that most cases you are correct, but maturity should be judged on a case by case basis.

    I am aware you have a career, but since you are on forums and whatnot you do research every day, so I thought it wasn't going to upset you.

    I never pretended that I performed these studies on adolescents. However I am the one who posted this at bb.com, as well as avant, and here.
  10. Professional Member
    size's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Age
    42
    Posts
    4,232
    Rep Power
    2268
    Level
    44
    Lv. Percent
    92.94%
    Achievements Activity ProPosting Pro

    I am not upset by it at all. i think it is good to learn as much as you can.

    One of my biggest problems is that young men are responsiblity of one's parents. To jeopardize one's family and future as a teenager inorder to gain muscle shows their lack of maturity.
  11. New Member
    ex_banana-eater's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    369
    Rep Power
    330
    Level
    19
    Lv. Percent
    28.59%

    Quote Originally Posted by size
    I am not upset by it at all. i think it is good to learn as much as you can.

    One of my biggest problems is that young men are responsiblity of one's parents. To jeopardize one's family and future as a teenager inorder to gain muscle shows their lack of maturity.
    Yes, the legal aspect is important. That is why people should only use in a country where AAS are legal. The same is with adults, some have a wife, kids, etc yet they're willing to throw away their security? If one is going to break the law it should be a single person without anyone relying on him.
  12. I am faster than 80% of all snakes
    Dwight Schrute's Avatar
    Stats
    6'1"  221 lbs.
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Age
    41
    Posts
    12,911
    Rep Power
    7017

    This is not turning into a debate about the legailty and age requirements of AAS usage. EBE we have rules here about posting in the steroid section. We let you slide because you do show maturity on the subject but as a board we do not have the time or resources to judge on case to case basis. Please respect our rules. If you want to discuss the philosphical aspects then post it in the Off-Topic section.
    For answers to board issues, read the Suggestion and News forum at the bottom of the main page.
  

  
 

Similar Forum Threads

  1. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 09-11-2012, 02:16 AM
  2. Replies: 23
    Last Post: 03-28-2008, 11:37 PM
  3. Effect of IGF-1 and Insulin on each others receptors
    By Mr.Striation in forum IGF-1/GH
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-17-2004, 12:37 PM
  4. Replies: 6
    Last Post: 08-24-2004, 09:19 AM
  5. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 06-04-2003, 01:19 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Log in
Log in