Dinosaurs in the Garden of Eden...

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by mmowry View Post
    Theres a BIG difference between evil acts and evil beings.
    Example:

    You see someone being raped and tortured...you have a gun and can prevent it, yet you do nothing.

    Are you good person?

    I think not...

    Same as "God" sitting by when he CAN do something...


  2. I can't believe in a god that would allow all the suffering of innocent people and animals to continue. Humans have been torturing each other for thousands of years, when is enough, enough?

    Once again. It has nothing to do with God, we chose to not follow God's rules and this is why we suffer! When enough is enough? When everyone on Earth realize we are all one, learn to love each other, get along and follow God's rules again and bring Heaven here on Earth.

    At some point long ago, this god would have shown it's self and put a stop to everything.

    He did that already two thousand years ago, people refused to follow Him.

    Right now, in my mind, this god is not all loving and/or simply just doesn't care what we do to each other.

    You are wrong about Him. If you ever ask for His help He will answer you.
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by DmitryWI View Post
    I can't believe in a god that would allow all the suffering of innocent people and animals to continue. Humans have been torturing each other for thousands of years, when is enough, enough?

    Once again. It has nothing to do with God, we chose to not follow God's rules and this is why we suffer! When enough is enough? When everyone on Earth realize we are all one, learn to love each other, get along and follow God's rules again and bring Heaven here on Earth.
    Please demonstrate how a 6 month old child "chooses not to follow god's rules" and must therefore suffer heinous punishment inflicted by some sick bastard.
    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Flawless Skin Couture - We give you the tools to make you Flawless

  4. Hebrews 11:6 (New International Version)

    And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.


    I wish you all the best and this was a good discussion but we will all know for sure when we draw our last breath and then it will be too late to change our minds.We'll have to live with the decision weve made for eternity.


    Trust in the LORD with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding; In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall direct your paths . Proverbs 3:5-6

  5. Quote Originally Posted by DmitryWI View Post
    I can't believe in a god that would allow all the suffering of innocent people and animals to continue. Humans have been torturing each other for thousands of years, when is enough, enough?

    Once again. It has nothing to do with God, we chose to not follow God's rules and this is why we suffer! When enough is enough? When everyone on Earth realize we are all one, learn to love each other, get along and follow God's rules again and bring Heaven here on Earth.

    At some point long ago, this god would have shown it's self and put a stop to everything.

    He did that already two thousand years ago, people refused to follow Him.

    Right now, in my mind, this god is not all loving and/or simply just doesn't care what we do to each other.

    You are wrong about Him. If you ever ask for His help He will answer you.
    If he truelly loved us all, he would wait any longer (or nearly as long as he has) for us to figure it out. I think we've proven quite well that we will not get it right. The suffering and cruelity should have been stopped. Period.

    At some point I may believe in him, but I will not love him or believe he loves us. Right now, if he exists, then he's indifferent to us, not caring one way or the other what we do to each other. That is what I bleieve.
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  6. And I believe he should help me with typos!

  7. Quote Originally Posted by dsade View Post
    Please demonstrate how a 6 month old child "chooses not to follow god's rules" and must therefore suffer heinous punishment inflicted by some sick bastard.
    It's not her, she's innocent. People in general refuse to follow God's rules very long time ago and many innocent people suffer because of that.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by CRUNCH View Post
    If he truelly loved us all, he would wait any longer (or nearly as long as he has) for us to figure it out. I think we've proven quite well that we will not get it right. The suffering and cruelity should have been stopped. Period.

    At some point I may believe in him, but I will not love him or believe he loves us. Right now, if he exists, then he's indifferent to us, not caring one way or the other what we do to each other. That is what I bleieve.
    So what do you want Him to do? Take your free will away from you? Will every person on Earth agree with you? I don't think so.
    You can make a difference in this world yourself by helping other's and trying to follow God's advice. You can use your free will by doing something good and making differnce in your and your loved ones life. And if everyone would do that, world would be a better place.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by DmitryWI View Post
    It's not her, she's innocent. People in general refuse to follow God's rules very long time ago and many innocent people suffer because of that.
    And if he loves us, he would have put a stop to it.

  10. Quote Originally Posted by DmitryWI View Post
    So what do you want Him to do? Take your free will away from you? Will every person on Earth agree with you? I don't think so.
    You can make a difference in this world yourself by helping other's and trying to follow God's advice. You can use your free will by doing something good and making differnce in your and your loved ones life. And if everyone would do that, world would be a better place.
    I want him to show himself to everybody, in the flesh. Stop the world in it's tracks and say here I am, no more questions about my existance. Tell us all in one big voice to stop hurting each other and live by my rules.

    I do try to help people every day. I make it a point in my life to be a good person with the people that I come in contact with.

  11. Quote Originally Posted by CRUNCH View Post
    I want him to show himself to everybody, in the flesh. Stop the world in it's tracks and say here I am, no more questions about my existance. Tell us all in one big voice to stop hurting each other and live by my rules.

    I do try to help people every day. I make it a point in my life to be a good person with the people that I come in contact with.
    Unfortunately, (for some reason) it has to be a big mystery...

    All the atheists in the world would believe if he/she just showed himself, so why wouldn't he just do that?

    I also help people & animals (especially!) and I don't follow any book.

  12. Quote Originally Posted by EESCHMan View Post
    All the atheists in the world would believe if he/she just showed himself, so why wouldn't he just do that?
    What about Jesus? He showed Himself in a flesh, did people believe Him. Nope. Why do you think you'll believe Him now, if He'll show up?

  13. Quote Originally Posted by DmitryWI View Post
    What about Jesus? He showed Himself in a flesh, did people believe Him. Nope. Why do you think you'll believe Him now, if He'll show up?
    Testimony of "This guy I know saw something happen (like a miracle)" is not even admissible in court of law. If someone appearing is to be evidence, then the appearance must happen to EVERYONE in order to be held to some standard.

    Someone appearing to people 2000 years ago, said people then claiming they witnessed miracles, means nothing.

    All powerful here, right? Ok, so materialize and cast all doubt aside. Thereafter, we can choose to be good or not just the same as we can now, correct?

    Also, still waiting on that non-contradictory description of the qualities of the supreme being. Anyone?
    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Flawless Skin Couture - We give you the tools to make you Flawless

  14. Quote Originally Posted by DmitryWI View Post
    What about Jesus? He showed Himself in a flesh, did people believe Him. Nope. Why do you think you'll believe Him now, if He'll show up?
    One of them NEEDS to do it again, and in a big way. No mysteries, no telling us to just believe, nothing left to interpretation. I will not believe in, let alone love, any god until all needless suffering is put to a stop.

    He needs to give us a new book to live our lives by. One in his words, and his words alone. Nothing that been touched by man. Faith is not working and god or jesus needs to accept this. Man has screwed up, millions have suffered needlessly and continue to. Put it to a stop.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by CRUNCH View Post
    One of them NEEDS to do it again, and in a big way. No mysteries, no telling us to just believe, nothing left to interpretation. I will not believe in, let alone love, any god until all needless suffering is put to a stop.

    He needs to give us a new book to live our lives by. One in his words, and his words alone. Nothing that been touched by man. Faith is not working and god or jesus needs to accept this. Man has screwed up, millions have suffered needlessly and continue to. Put it to a stop.
    Yes, we need an updated version of the Bible...

  16. Quote Originally Posted by CRUNCH View Post
    One of them NEEDS to do it again, and in a big way. No mysteries, no telling us to just believe, nothing left to interpretation. I will not believe in, let alone love, any god until all needless suffering is put to a stop.

    He needs to give us a new book to live our lives by. One in his words, and his words alone. Nothing that been touched by man. Faith is not working and god or jesus needs to accept this. Man has screwed up, millions have suffered needlessly and continue to. Put it to a stop.
    I wish it would be so easy... I don't know what else to tell you. I guess I could ask God few of those questions, but I can't do that for few more days I don't think.

  17. That's just it, it COULD be that easy. It's god's choice, and he's choosing to let us continue to hurt each other. He's wrong and I can't love him even if he does exist.

  18. It's not God's choice, it's human's choice, but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

  19. We will have to respectfully disagree.

    I feel man does not have the ability to make the right choice, that's proven every day. God and Jesus need to accept this and change it. It's their choice to let things continue.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by DmitryWI View Post
    "Your Keys To Heaven" by Gary Spivey.

    http://www.yourkeystoheaven.com/

    This book is from God.
    I can't believe anything from a guy with hair (hat?) like that!

  21. [QUOTE=CRUNCH;847295]That's just it, it COULD be that easy. It's god's choice, and he's choosing to let us continue to hurt each other. He's wrong and I can't love him even if he does exist.[/QUOTE

    you are talkin here about a perfect world!wich is teh heave after we die after all ppl who get heaven are purified from lal teh bad in them " like hate, jealousy...ec" it s not like that in earth ,if so it ll be easy to belive in god if , god interact directly and dont allow any harm,! happen like to blast evry killer ! or burn it..ect
    how can god judge us after that ! he lets bad stuff happen that doesnt mean he likes it!
    that whol secret of faith good test us when and innocent got hurt
    like a baby ...ect , god let it happen for many reason like to keep teh evidence and test teh parents althro that!
    and tahts all about a test i can feel its hard to understand but after teh bad the good come!

  22. Quote Originally Posted by EESCHMan View Post
    I can't believe anything from a guy with hair (hat?) like that!
    Well, again, you keep judging without knowing anything about him. It makes me wonder about him sometimes too, but when you get to know him, he's the nicest guy you'll ever meet. And he's very serious about what he does, except he makes it more intertain and his look helps him do that.

  23. Quote Originally Posted by DmitryWI View Post
    I agree with you on that one. And it'll be a good question for God, when Brian will have time to ask Him. I've been pretty ****ed up lately, so I can't really do that myself right now...
    when u say brian ll talk to god! do u mean talk ta him directly same as human communicate!

  24. Quote Originally Posted by DmitryWI View Post
    "Your Keys To Heaven" by Gary Spivey.

    http://www.yourkeystoheaven.com/

    This book is from God.
    That wouldn't work for me. I need god to stick his face through the clouds, announce himself to the world and hand each and every one of us a new book. One without another man's hands on it, like Gary Spivey.

  25. Quote Originally Posted by CRUNCH View Post
    That wouldn't work for me. I need god to stick his face through the clouds, announce himself to the world and hand each and every one of us a new book. One without another man's hands on it, like Gary Spivey.
    You know, it's not gonna happen.

  26. Quote Originally Posted by CRUNCH View Post
    That wouldn't work for me. I need god to stick his face through the clouds, announce himself to the world and hand each and every one of us a new book. One without another man's hands on it, like Gary Spivey.
    If He did most atheists would invent some theory about an atmospheric phenomenon occuring so they could continue to disbelieve.This argument is as old as time and has no easy answers,but I would like to add that the notion that suffering/pain itself is evil is a buddhist belief system,the Bible clearly teaches that suffering/pain is a symptom of the problem which is sin.Sin is the cause of suffering/pain in a fallen world and not necessarily the sin of the person suffering(such as an abused child).God could just remove our ability to choose and thereby eliminate sin but that would also eliminate our ability to have any real relationship with him.I believe it was CS Lewis who said that the problem of pain is the aethist's most potent argument against faith.I was raised by an atheist father and was programmed to feel the same from birth,and I had these same arguments,even now it does make me wonder but I have less of a problem with it now.I had an opportunity to go away to college and get a degree and as I studied human anatomy and I saw the structure and organization that is a human being I began to have some questions about the likelihood of such order and structure occuring by chance.I am not a scholar or physicist but I do have common sense and when I can see the fingerprints of a designer in our universe from the sub-atomic level to the fine tuning of our solar system this has made me a firm believer in a creator.The so called "proofs"of evolution have never been shown to me. I have seen alot of examples of adaptation but I have never seen even one example of evolution that cannot and has not been either disproven or at the very least had serious doubt cast upon it the subject of the origins of our universe and of man are at this point a matter of faith you either have faith in a creator or you have faith in random chance.When I was a kid I was told the earth was a billion years old my kids are now being taught that the earth is 5 billion years old(no I am not 4 billion years old) evolutionists continue to need more and more time to make thier theories work I say take all the time you want it will never work out to me energy+matter+any amount of time=nothing at all.just my two cents

  27. Well said, BuckNuts. Reps for ya.

  28. Darwin had written "If my theory be true, numberless intermediate varieties must assuredly have existed". However evolutionists, who have been doing excavations all over the world, have been unable to uncover even a single intermediate form.Living species emerge very distinctly in the fossil record. There is no trace of the "intermediate forms" that were expected to link these species

  29. The theory of evolution holds that living beings differentiated from each other over a very long period of time with linked, gradual modifications. If this theory were true, then numerous "intermediary species" should have lived in history linking different living species. For instance, if birds had indeed evolved from reptiles, then billions of half-bird/half-reptiles should have lived in history. Darwin knew that the fossil record ought to be full of these "intermediate transitory forms". Yet he was also well aware that no transitional form fossils were available. That was why he asked these troubled questions in his book The Origin of Species: "

  30. Trilobites, one of the oldest living species, appeared 530 million years ago. Their eyes represent the first visual system in the world. These eyes, with their extremely sophisticated and flawless design, deal a fatal blow to the claim of the theory of evolution that "Life evolved from primitive to advanced forms".

    One of the living species that appeared suddenly in the Cambrian Period was an invertebrate sea-dwelling creature called the "trilobite". The eye of the trilobite had a "compound eye design". It consisted of hundreds of tiny eyes. Moreover, each of these tiny eyes had two different lenses. It is reckoned that this structure called the "doublet structure" allowed the trilobites to see underwater perfectly, without distortion. A professor of geology from the University of Harvard, David Raup says: The trilobites used an optimal design which would require a well trained and imaginative optical engineer to develop today. This perfect eye structure was brought into being 530 million years ago all of a sudden in its perfect form. No doubt, the sudden appearance of such a wondrous design can by no means explained by chance, all the more proving creation. Additionally, the compound eye system of the trilobites has survived to our day without a single change. Some insects such as bees and dragonflies have the same eye structure as did the trilobite. This situation disproves the evolutionary thesis that living beings developed from the primitive to the complex.
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