SD and Epi Cycle
- 08-24-2012, 07:17 PM
- 08-24-2012, 08:28 PM
I actually read a article that I linked earlier. It talks about cutting on cycle and bulking off cycle... So I'm cutting carbs this last week of Epi for the cycle and will not do a "heavy" bulk during PCT. this way all that gains I have made on cycle where just that, muscle gains not fat or bloat. Sure I won't gain 20lbs on cycle like you read about on here. But I'd rather gain 10lbs of real muscle in a cycle, instead of 20lbs and it be half fat, half muscle. The idea is that I will up my calories in PCT to hold onto gains...
PCT is actually more important than the cycle. If you don't do PCT right you will lose all your gains. Doing cardio and cutting during PCT is highly unadvised.
I realize that after cycle most of us feel crappy and bloated. So you want to cut.
By bulking the first 3-4 weeks then cutting backs carbs (make sure you leave enough cals to grow) then you will firm and define up the last 2 weeks, do you won't feel so crappy about after the cycle and you can continue to eat right during PCT so you hold onto the gains...
That's the plan anyways!
- 08-24-2012, 09:31 PM
Yeh. I wanted to try bridgeing SD with something to keep the gains. I hope this works out. I need to decide quick its almost ban timeGAME ON! MOVAH FUKAZ!
08-25-2012, 10:15 AM
Not condoning the sale of "banned" drugs, but...
You can always buy them now and sale them later when people start to run out if you choose not to take them.
Apparently lots of people are doing this, or so I've read on here.
08-27-2012, 09:54 PM
Follow me on facebook, twitter and youtube, where I share information and videos to help you achieve your physique goals, John Smeton Ftness
08-28-2012, 07:45 AM
I'm trying to make sure I eat at least 250 calories over my maintenance. Although I was debating on making it 500. Which seems a little bit high, but figuring out my maintenance is harder than for most. I work on computers and work in a 4 story building. I refuse to take the elevator cause it's slow. So on bad days i'm running around I probably can go up 50 flights of stairs easy... Some days i get to just sit at my desk all day. So that was my thinking on 500 over maintenance. I'm sure i'm just going to watch what i do for that day.
08-28-2012, 09:26 AM
If u keep it low, keep an eye on ur weight and adjust as needed. Ur on the epi now. Hows that treating u
GAME ON! MOVAH FUKAZ!
08-28-2012, 10:52 AM
I actually started PCT today. Hoping to get some pic up tonight.
My end weight was 215.3. (+12lbs)
So I lost 3lbs when I switched to Epi only, but my strength is still up. Still setting PR on all lifts. I also am noticing my abs popping more and veins in my thighs and such I never had.
I'm still probably 15-17% bf, but I know I put on good clean muscle. So now to make sure I keep it. I will also be taking measurements tonight as well, I didn't feel the need to "before" as most people don't seem to have a problem putting on the muscle. It's holding on to them during PCT. so that is really what I'm focusing on.
I log my PCT as well along with all my supps. Will post tonight, effin crazy day at work.
08-28-2012, 10:49 PM
So I'm not good at posing, and I don't need to be, lol. So if the poses are off don't hate too bad. Also on measurements I'm not sure where to measure on most, just made my best guess.
Thighs (8" below hip bone)
Not sure about chest measurements. As I could breathe in and move it out to 53 1/8". So IDK
Which surprised me since all my pants are 32-34 lol. Stupid marketing people tryin to make you feel skinnier than you are, lol.
08-28-2012, 11:01 PM
So up 12lbs.
Here are some before and after pictures.
I'll be honest in my head I feel like I gained more mass than I did, my strength went up so much.
08-29-2012, 12:11 PM
Just so my diet is on here as well, comments and critics are welcome... for now.
here are the stats of my supplements
Amount Per Serving % DV*
Calories From Fat 0
Total Fat 0g 0
Saturated Fat 0g 0
Cholesterol 0g 0
Trans Fats 0g 0
Sodium 0g 0
Total Carbs 50g 16.6
Dietary Fiber 0g 0
Protein 0g 0
Karbolyn® 50g **
(Homopolysaccharide) Derived From Potato, Rice And Corn
Amount Per Serving % DV*
Calories From Fat 10
Total Fat 1g 2%
Saturated Fat 0.5g 4%
Cholesterol 30mg 10%
Total Carbohydrate 30g 10%
Other Carbohydrate 15g
Calcium 186mg 19%
Sodium 150mg 6%
Potassium 430mg 12%
AMINO STACK™: 8g**
A Proprietary Non Steroidal, Highly Anabolic Formula Consisting Of Muscle Volumizers, Strength And Recovery Agents.
Magnesium Creatine Chelate
Magnesium Glycyl Glutamine
Molecularly Bonded Glutamine
BCAA's (Branched Chain Amino Acids) 7.25g**
Joint Repair: 1500mg**
(Glucosamine Sulfate, Chondroitin Sulfate, MSM)
Antioxidant Blend: 1500mg
Vitamin A 1000IU 20%
Vitamin C 1000mg 1666%
Vitamin E 60IU 200%
B1 (Thiamin) 3mg 200%
B2 (Riboflavin) 3mg 200%
B3 (Niacin) 40mg 200%
B5 (Pantothenic Acid) 20mg 200%
B6 4mg 200%
B9 (Folate) 800mcg 200%
B12 12mcg 200%
Phosphorus 109mg 11%
Magnesium 400mg 100%
Alpha Lipoic Acid 100mg **
** Daily Value not established
* Percent Daily Values are based on a 2,000 calorie diet
AFTERSHOCK Fast Absorption Protein Blend™ (Partially Hydrolyzed Whey Protein Isolate, Lactose Free Whey Protein Isolate And High Growth Factor Ultra-Filtered Whey Protein Rich In Lactoferrins And Immunoglobulins), Glycogenx™: A Polymerized Glyconutrient Providing Cellular Rehydration And Glycogen Replenishment (Long Chain Polysaccharide Maltodextrin), Cane Juice Solids, Natural And Artificial Flavors, Citric Acid, Potassium Citrate, Sodium Citrate, Vegetable Juice (For Color), Sucralose.
Allergen Statement: This Product Contains Ingredients Derived From Milk. Manufactured In A Facility That Proceses Milk, Soy, Eggs, Wheat.
Serving Size:1Instant-Mix Scoop(9g)
Servings Per Container:111
Amount Per Serving % Daily Value
Total Carbohydrates 0g 0%
Vitamin B3 (As Niacin) 20mg 100%
Vitamin B6 (As Pyridoxine HCl & Pyridoxal-5'-Phosphate [P5P]) 2mg 100%
Vitamin B9 BioB9™ (As Calcium L-5-Methyltetrahydrofolate & Folic Acid) 400mcg 100%
Vitamin B12 (As Methylcobalamin & Dibencozide) 6mcg 100%
AMINOCORE [45:30:25] Pure 100% Instantized BCAAs 8,180mg †
L-Leucine 3,681mg †
L-Isoleucine 2,454mg †
L-Valine 2,045mg †
KIC (Alpha Ketoisocaproic Acid) 100mg †
† Daily Value not established.
Acesulfame Potassium, Sucralose, Natural And Artificial Fruit Punch And Strawberry Flavors, Citric Acid And Silicon Dioxide.
AllMax Nurtrition Casein
I always have 2 scoops so double these numbers
Serving Size 1Scoop(33g)
Servings Per Container27
Amount Per Serving % Daily Value*
Calories From Fat 5
Total Fat 0g 0%
Saturated Fat 0g 0%
Trans Fat 0g 0%
Cholesterol 0mg 0%
Total Carbohydrate 4g 2%
Dietary Fiber 2g 8%
Sugars 2g %
Protein 25g 50%
Sodium 21mg 1%
Potassium 130mg 5%
Vitamin A -
Vitamin C -
* Percent Daily Values are based on a 2,000 calorie diet
† Daily Value not established
AllMax Nurtition Whey
Servings Per Container75
Amount Per Serving % Daily Value*
Fat 0.1g 0%
Saturated 0.1g 0%
+ Trans 0g -
Cholesterol 1.5mg 1%
Carbohydrates 0.5g 0%
Sugars 0.5g -
Fiber 0.3g 0%
Sodium 53mg 2%
Potassium 140mg 4%
Protein 27g -
Percent Of Recommended Daily Intake
Vitamin C 2%
Amino Acid Profile Per Serving (30 G)
L-Aspartic Acid 2835mg
L-Glutamic Acid 4617mg
I take only 3 pills as i'm trying to cut back, hopefully i can get down to 2 without caffeine headaches during the day. Since it's no longer available...
Serving Size: 1 capsule
Servings per Container: 120
Amount Per Serving % Daily Value
Motivation Propietary Complex:
L-Glutamine, L-Taurine, Schizandra Extract, Geranamine (1, 3-Dimethyllamylamine), Caffeine Anhydrous USP (40 mg)
I also take 1g of krill oil a day. I like krill oil better than fish oil, it doesn't leave as bad as an after taste, and is supposed to be more potent...
Last edited by bmattstevens; 08-29-2012 at 12:36 PM. Reason: adding information to the post
08-29-2012, 12:25 PM
wake up, pre workout shake,
Karbolyn, amminocore, AI Motivate, (right now AI Post Cycle Support, Erase Pro, Forma Stanza)
arrive at gym, warm up
Start work out
Post Workout Shake
AfterShock, 1/2 scoop Amminocore
9-9:30am (I shoot for 9, but being realistic, it's 9:30am at least half the time)
Eat meal 1
2 Chicken breasts,
I try to throw some carbs in here as well, but it doesn't always happen, sometimes it's a whole grain begal, sometimes oat meal, but 80% of the time it's just chicken
All-Max Cassin Protein 2 scoops
2 Chicken Breasts
3/4lb turkey meat, usually made into Hamburger Helper,
Some kind of veggy, peas, green beans, broccoli
All-Max Cassin 2 scoops
All-Max Whey 1 scoop
big scoop PB crunchy, not that it matters that it's crunchy, but i like to specify cause everyone loves one or the other, lol
2% milk around 6oz, sometimes up to 10, just to get it to blend.
Ends up being over 85g protien 40g carbs. If I don't eat that I end up starving when I wake up... Actually i'm starving when i wake up anyways...
** Since Chicken breasts are not all the same size. I basically have 24oz of Chicken a day, sometimes it's 3 small ones, or what not. I buy a 3lb bag of chicken, and eat half each day... So 24oz a day.
08-29-2012, 12:55 PM
Daily Totals are as follows:
calories might be my problem after adding it all up. But honestly I know i'm over 3K cause I always am sneaking a snake somewhere, be it an extra scoop of PB, or some string cheese. But i'm probably not over 3K by much.
Any thoughts or comments?
08-29-2012, 01:40 PM
OD with the protein that's almost double what u need. Carbs, good mi would go higher. Keep the water up. Are u taking creatine?
Most SD gains are water and glycogen. So water and carbs are important.
How long are u into pct. How much have u lost so far.
GAME ON! MOVAH FUKAZ!
08-29-2012, 04:12 PM
Started PCT yesterday still at 215, well I was this morning anyways...
The creative is in the aftershock
08-29-2012, 04:16 PM
So up the carbs?
I posted the aftershock ingredients above, it's pretty much has everything you want post workout, all in one, it's expensive but I don't have to put 5 things in my shake just 1.
It has BCAAs, creatine, carbs, protein, to much else I can't spell while I'm driving lol
08-29-2012, 04:25 PM
Sounds good G. Good luck with pct u where going with clomid?
08-29-2012, 06:54 PM
Yeah 100 first two days then
These 2 days of high Clomid have sucked... Lol. Price we pay I guess lol
08-29-2012, 06:55 PM
So maybe drop protein 100g
Up carbs 100g
That sound good?
Calories look ok?
08-30-2012, 08:00 AM
That's a daily dose? U need clomid at least 4 weeks.Originally Posted by bmattstevens
To be honest u will lose almost half of what u gained from SD once u drop the bloat
08-30-2012, 09:23 AM
No that's the weekly dose per day.
So 100mg day 1&2
75 day the rest of week 1
75 per day week 2
50 per day week 3
50 per day week 4
25 per day week 5 ( I may not need this week but I leave it here in case I feel I do)
I have enough Clomid on hand to do that twice...
I like to have plenty on hand. Probably should have ordered some Nolvadex just to have both, but with Forma, erase, and Clomid I feel I covered all my bases.
I'm hoping I don't lose too much, that's why my protein is so high, and I don't really do cardio during PCT to minimize loss. I will cut more once PCT is done but right now I'm trying to eat any protein in site in order to minimize loss, I will probably taper that down around week 3 and try to maintain at that point.
So far I haven't lost any strength, in fact I pushed my max rep up by 1.
So maybe I'm past the SD bloat loss...
Day 1-31 I was on 20mg of SD
Day 21-34 I was on 30mg of Epi
Day 35-42 I was on 40mg of Epi.
So today is day 44. So I've been off SD for 2 weeks tomorrow, i assume that's where I lost some weight from and hopefully I can keep the rest.
08-30-2012, 09:29 AM
I like it G! Make sure ur getting enuff carbs. I would probably start formasurge and erase 2 week, earlier wouldn't hurt. Just might be a waste. Keep us updated
08-30-2012, 10:06 AM
I started erase at 2 caps a day on day 28 to act more as an AI.
I use AI Sport Nutrition Post Cycle Support as my staple PCT supplement. The erase I use as a bonus.
I'm going on Vaca in the morning until Monday. Waking up early hitting arms and light chest. So training will be limited on sat, sun, and Monday.
But eating carbs this weekend should be no prob lol
08-31-2012, 07:41 AM
216 this morning. Still feeling strong... Pre-cucle i can't do weighted pull ups over a 35 plate...
Do 4 sets superseded with shoulder press, no rest I between.
50lb dumbells single arm shoulder press x6
Pull ups. No weight x6
25lb plate pull ups x6
45lb place pull ups x6
45+25 plate pull ups x4
To be 2 weeks off SD and 4 days into PCT I'm pretty happy with that, especially since I gained a pound back
08-31-2012, 10:31 AM
Yeh nice G
08-31-2012, 01:54 PM
That's not all I did this morning just what I was happiest with lol
09-04-2012, 12:52 PM
Weighed 213 this morning.
I did chest and back. My strength is still all there so that is a plus, on the 5th set I normally can only get 3-4 reps at 255, got 5 and 6 with a tiny spot.
I had a rough weekend so I'm attributing the weight loss to my diet or lack there of. My grandpa has parkensins, well he had a bad spell, didn't eat for 4 weeks they hospitalized him, put in a feeding tube. Sad stuff, totally there mentally but can't so much as talk more than 2-3 words together. Can't walk, so I went and helped and took them on one last vaca kind of. But without me to move him he can't get out of the house. So for him to drive and just be able to look out the window was huge to him.
Anyways long story short. I didn't eat right at all this weekend or nearly enough. And did nothing until today.
But it's a humbling experience. You never know what life will throw at you, don't take today for granted, you never know about tomorrow.
09-04-2012, 06:09 PM
I just wanted to throw this out there for fun too....
**** clomid headaches!
09-04-2012, 07:34 PM
Yeh and trouble focusing. I thought I was going blind. But I think I was dosing to high at 100mcg a day
09-04-2012, 07:59 PM
I'm at 75mg for another 5 days. But I'm hoping when I drop to 50 the headaches will go away.
I'm not a fan of headaches. I have to stare at a screen all day so when I can't focus and my head hurts i feel so useless I just want to go back to bed lol.
So how long until the Clomid kicks in and the boys come back online? I never really lost libido on my other cycles. So it's a weird/scary feeling being shutdown lol
09-05-2012, 06:00 AM
Its pretty quick as long as u got an array of test boosters. I had trouble with libido after my cycle and pct
I think what really helped me was the formasurge / formastane
09-05-2012, 05:21 PM
intense log bro, incredible results and was def thinkin the same stack sometime down the road; def goin hard as a motha in there, best of luck during and after your pct and look forward hearing about the rest.
09-05-2012, 08:17 PM
I weighed 212.7 this morning. Just ran two miles trying to get ready for a race my wife suckered me into. It's kind of like the warrior dash which I ran in may but she couldn't since she was prego. So now I guess I have to do this one... So I'm going to up my carbs and protein just to counter the running since I don't want to lose any more than I have to.
Feeling ok didn't have any Clomid headaches today. First time out of 9 days so that's a plus...
09-06-2012, 06:44 AM
I think everyone thought considered SD n epiOriginally Posted by SinX
Don't know how many ppl did it thought
09-06-2012, 09:11 AM
Day 10 of PCT.
Still holding on to all my strength, I'm down just 3lbs which I think is good, and I can tell some bloat is going away.
I worked out shoulders/traps today and through in one exercise of bi/tri just to keep going.
Weight 212 this morning, and last night I took a BMI test with one of those pincher auto measurements things lol.
First time (my wife taking measurements), it said 28.7.... Which I was like, that's wrong!!!
Took it 3 more times each came in at 13.1, 13.7, 14.
So I'm probably around 13-14%
In my head I felt like I was like a 17% but all my WO partners and bigger than me and under 10% so I could have a complex... Lol what do y'all think?
This pic was after workout but I'm not flexing...
Ok I'm flexing my abs...
09-06-2012, 10:47 AM
U have the accumesure LOL. That's the one I use one pinch above the hip. Its actually some what accurate
09-07-2012, 07:42 AM
weighed 213.6 this morning... still feeling good, having some clomid headaches but at least i know it's good stuff that way!
Did arms this morning, totally blew them up. Feeling good, but looking forward to some R&R on this weekend, i will run 2 miles again on either Saturday or Sunday.
09-07-2012, 10:01 AM
Good job holding on to ur gains. And ur deff not 28%, 13% seems more like it.Originally Posted by bmattstevens
09-10-2012, 08:47 AM
Had a rough weekend, did a server migration this weekend, moved email to the cloud... And it was a bitch.
So didn't eat right and didn't sleep at all Friday night so I was up from Friday morning at 5am until Saturday around 10pm...
Ran 2 miles Sunday afternoon.
Did chest this morning, weighed 211. Not surprising after my weekend.
Strength is still there so I'm happy about that.
I finally moved into the 100lb dumbbells on this cycle, I can definitely feel how I'm not "craving" the weight if that makes any sense. It feels heavier than they did on cycle... But I still got 7 reps on 4 set. Where as I could get 5-7 while on cycle... So I can still do the weight they just felt heavier...
Still happy I have kept my strength up. I can tell I'm leaning out still. Probably the Forma and estrogen blockers
09-10-2012, 09:40 AM
Its hard to keep those gains. A lot of it is glycogen and water. What was ur pre cycle weight
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