Mind Steriods or Noots

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  1. Why not quit your job, buy a camera, and live in Costa Rica for a year. That would be a great learning experience and a great test for you. lol


  2. Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    Why not quit your job, buy a camera, and live in Costa Rica for a year. That would be a great learning experience and a great test for you. lol
    Well, I've already got the cameras, two, a Canon with several lenses and a small Lecia. Your idea is excellent as obviously it is the job that is time consuming and gets in the way of learning new stuff, but it's that MONEY thing, as it's comforting to have it and a bit of an anchor in my life. Damn! Maybe when I reach 65 as I will get about $350 per month more than I would now for retirement. I do get half price tuition at the local college now, and at 65 I believe it's free. I will consider doing something like that trip in at 65, it would be cool.

    Just had my coffee, and I'm getting ready to go for workout. Another anchor I don't want to do without -- two anchors, the coffee, and the workout.

    I finally received my two books on neuroplasticity, and I am curious about insights they may have.
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  3. I'll do a followup to the Aniracetam use in a couple of weeks and check in to see if Red tries the Noopept. I may comment on the two books then also.

    Thanks kisaj, your thoughts on Aniracetam helped me to try it first and it has the effects I was hoping for in a racetam.

  4. Awesome, I am glad you are as happy with it as I am.

  5. Should I take Choline with the Nootept ?
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by RedRaptor View Post
    Should I take Choline with the Nootept ?
    Yep, some kind.

  7. I just finished off my test run of androdrive, and I'm definitely a fan. I need to read through this more, but what noots are best for focus AND creativity? I tend to have bad focus normally, very A.D.D. but I've been training myself to get better. It's been very dibilatating in the past. A big help was to quit internet porn since I work at a computer and online. I tend to gravitate towards porn when I get very stressed. Strange response to stress, but I've been that way for years. I think cutting that out will help me out a lot, by moving my system away from being primarily running on the sympathetic nervous system.

    Anyhow, I need something that won't block creative thinking. I am a designer (mainly motion graphics / video work). Stimulating supps can be great in crunch time, but they can block creative thinking. I find I am more creative when not highly stimulated or racey at all (not that androdrive was racey - it was great and I'll be ordering more for longterm use at a low dose).

    I thought I'd give ALCAR another try. Here is what I'm currently trying for a couple weeks:

    4 grams of Choline/Inositol mix per day (2 grams of each, split morning and afternoon)
    3 grams of ALCAR in the form of Acetyl L-carnatine Arginate Dihydrochloride (Primordial Performance ArginoCarn) in am.
    Now's enteric coated P5P - 1 -2 caps daily

    ArginoCarn says to take once per day at 3 grams. Do you think it'd be better to split the dose, or just double it by taking another 3 grams in afternoon? Any suggestions for this trial? Thanks

    As a side note, I've also heard there is a racetam that has been used to treat bipolar disorder in some countries. Anyone familar with this racetam? Would it help with ADD symptoms as well?

  8. GP,

    I'll get back to you on this stuff as I've come across some mind opening reading in these areas the last few days. It's hard knowing what is likely to help what, but there are a least interesting stories and insights that can point to possibilities. That's what these conversations are about, not ultimate understanding or truth.

    Before reading on the brain, I use to suppose that NGF would be a major feature for the hippocampus's ability to create new neurons. Turns out that NGFs are only a small part and in fact consistent exercise is the primary factor that helps new neuron growth, but various brain NGFs are hugely important for several other reasons for how well we use our brains. The strength of our attention, or our passionate interest given through our attention is a major consideration of Brain NGFs.

  9. kisaj,

    I definitely have a euphoric feeling at the stage between sleep and awaking most days. It goes away a few minutes after getting up. I had a lucid dream about memory two days ago and the euphoria was stronger in my dream self. No punishing come down from these little episodes. The dream was a reassurance about memory, as I was in a house that I had seen in my teenage years and could remember every single minor detail of four different rooms I had visited down to the magnets on the refrigerator. Although my memory is not near as sharp upon waking up, I know that the memory details were accurate, and this was not just some "dream fantasy place," it was from memory.

  10. I've been able to lucid dream since being a child. I remember being able to fly out my window, around my neighborhood (I was 5 or 6 yrs old and still remember this) and control the things that I did. In my teens, I also used to do things like hook up with girls, snowboard (and land any trick I tried), etc. I haven't been having lucid dreams in ages though, but I do have quite a stockpile of galantamine for further attempts when I'm ready.

  11. Quote Originally Posted by Gutterpump View Post
    I've been able to lucid dream since being a child. I remember being able to fly out my window, around my neighborhood (I was 5 or 6 yrs old and still remember this) and control the things that I did. In my teens, I also used to do things like hook up with girls, snowboard (and land any trick I tried), etc. I haven't been having lucid dreams in ages though, but I do have quite a stockpile of galantamine for further attempts when I'm ready.
    The Acetyl L-carnatine Arginate you are going to try is supposed to be a great NGF creator. Acetyl L-carnatine Arginate along with hupererzine-a may be my first two add-ons to Aniracetam. Noopept is an even stronger at promoting NGF and also is great for BDNF. I need to differentiate these two more and learn more clearly which does what and how they interact. NAC is supposedly a good BDNF creator too.

    I want to learn more about the Nucleus Basalis and how it effects the attention abilities (or how powerful our attention is to subjects). It has to do with processing speeds in the brain (very important, but not quite the full story). The Nucleus Basalis may be better reached by brain exercises rather than noots, but noots would help.

    AndroDrive is more for analytic drive rather then creativity, but it doesn't completely cut off free flowing creative abilities. I would move toward the areas that are more choline and GABA oriented, or anything that's relaxing for the creativity side. Yet that's not completely true and things are not quite that simple. I really feel that combining the powerful attention focusing abilities of the Nucleus Basalis with the more relaxed noots would go a long way toward giving full access to creative abilities of the non-analytical type. Yet I do not understand enough and this could be corrected by me in the future.

    I may try one AndroDrive per day in the future along with some creativity oriented noots to see if that creates a positive effect, and maybe add in some extra Preg.

    As I try these noots and/or brain exercises I will also get a better general grasp of why these things work in general by looking into brain studies and the brain scientists insights.

  12. The two areas I'm most captivated by now are Gamma-Wave Rhythms from the aSTG, and attention promoting and plasticity promoting abilities of the Nucleus Basalis. The aSTG when it is radiating Gamma is the creative insight part of the brain that allows Aha! moments by bringing together past information into new patterns. This is a major part of creativity. The Nucleus Basalis is part of totally new sensory input, and is involved with attention and how strong or passionately we embrace new information.

    For me, Aniracetam adds to the insight abilities of putting together past information into new patterns. it seems excellent in that area. There is, again it seems to me, stimulant based focus and non-stim based focus. I am looking for a non-stim based focus that allow strong attention to new sensory information without the "burnout" effect that stims cause, thus my interest in the Nucleus Basalis.

    So we have how well we can put old information into new patterns, and how well we can learn from new sensory information. This is all somewhat separate from straight concrete memory either long-term or short-term. Another great subject is how much short-term (call it RAM) memory an individual has to work with at any given time and how long and how powerfully we can hold onto and work with short-term memory.

  13. I ordered some Noopept earlier this morning and it shipped this afternoon. It should reach me by Tuesday or Wednesday next week. I'll keep at the Aniracetam until next Tuesday, then take 2 days off before trying the Noopept at 25-30mg per day in 2 doses. I'll use the Noopept by itself for about 12 days, then if I like it's effects, I've try the Aniracetam and Noopept together for 2-3 weeks.

  14. Just got home from Africa to find a bunch of packages.
    Some I forgot why I bought them so I'll have to do my research to remember why I bought them!
    Started with 750mg Ani and 500mg of CDP. That stuff is nasty!
    I opted for the powder CDP and it smells horrid and tastes as bad as it smells. A little grape BCAA powder to hide the taste but it still tastes horrid.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by RedRaptor View Post
    Just got home from Africa to find a bunch of packages.
    Some I forgot why I bought them so I'll have to do my research to remember why I bought them!
    Started with 750mg Ani and 500mg of CDP. That stuff is nasty!
    I opted for the powder CDP and it smells horrid and tastes as bad as it smells. A little grape BCAA powder to hide the taste but it still tastes horrid.
    I didn't know what CDP taste like as I've always bought it in caps. I've got a 10 week supply left of the caps as the place I purchased had a 14% off sale, so I got 2 -- 150 cap bottles. I would have warned you about the taste had I known, but I'll try bulk after I run out. Bad taste usually doesn't bother me.

    I got my Noopept in today and will probably start checking it out Friday.

  16. Ani and Choline CDP.
    I capped up some Choline to avoid the smell and taste.
    First day I only felt a mild "good mood" and a little clearer thinking than normal for a man who just crossed 6 time zones and a 15 hour flight. Day 2, woke up after a vivid dream feeling refreshed. Second day went good. Felt much more alert and had clearer thinking than I usually do when I'm feeling the jet lag. 750mg Ani / 500mg CDP in the morning and another around 2pm.
    Went to bed about 10:30pm, very sleepy but couldn't sleep. Started feeling some anxiety and it kept me from falling asleep. More vivid dreams just before waking. Now it's 5am on day 3 and I'm wondering if I should take more. Don't like that anxiety feeling.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by RedRaptor View Post
    Ani and Choline CDP.
    I capped up some Choline to avoid the smell and taste.
    First day I only felt a mild "good mood" and a little clearer thinking than normal for a man who just crossed 6 time zones and a 15 hour flight. Day 2, woke up after a vivid dream feeling refreshed. Second day went good. Felt much more alert and had clearer thinking than I usually do when I'm feeling the jet lag. 750mg Ani / 500mg CDP in the morning and another around 2pm.
    Went to bed about 10:30pm, very sleepy but couldn't sleep. Started feeling some anxiety and it kept me from falling asleep. More vivid dreams just before waking. Now it's 5am on day 3 and I'm wondering if I should take more. Don't like that anxiety feeling.
    I did not get anxiety from the CDP + Ani combo, but over a year ago when my right knee became severely damaged I had strong bouts of anxiety due to feeling helpless, as I couldn't get around. I could not drive and could only walk stiff legged for a few feet at a time. I used Bacopa as acute remedy and it worked well enough. Bacopa used long-term is supposed to be an excellent noot itself, but the noot effects take months to lock in, but the anxiety reducing effects are immediate, and get a bit stronger with continued use.

    So if this combo continues to cause anxiety, then take a break and start it again after using Bacopa for 2-3 days. Just a thought.

  18. I highly doubt the Ani is giving the anxiety, it does the exact opposite. Be careful with the dose, as like all racetams, it works on a bell curve. 1500 a day is the most recommended and workable amount. I've gone over thinking I wanted more, and it made me pretty "zoney" and kind of stoned feeling.

    If you are getting anxiety at night, try some ZMA and L-theanine. L-theanine was about the best anti-anxiety I had encountered before Ani. Together, there is a synergy and a calmness.

  19. I actually have some L-Theanine and ZMA so I'll take those tonight.
    I felt the anxiety again about 2 hours after my morning dose.
    Now just a slight headache similar to the headache I get from DAA. Right in the middle of the head.
    Can't be anything else. I'm taking a multi-vitamin, B-12 with folic acid, Ani and CDP is all.
    I'll take another does how as it's about 1:50pm and see what happens tonight with the ZMA and L-Theanine.

    Compared to AndroDrive I would rate Ani as very mild at this point. I don't feel the focus or clear thinking of AndroDrive even at only 3 per day.

  20. Yeah, I guess it could be the energy from Ani, but I didn't view it as anxiety. The thing is, everyone responds differently to noots. Some swear by ones that others hate.

    Also- it is much more common to take up to 2 weeks to notice effects. Some of us just get lucky really early. For me, Ani has never been strong in recall or direct memory enhancement, rather a strong anti-anxiety feeling that helped clear my head for clear thinking. It just clams and clears everything- like a clutter clean up.

  21. Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    Yeah, I guess it could be the energy from Ani, but I didn't view it as anxiety. The thing is, everyone responds differently to noots. Some swear by ones that others hate.
    Here is the way these work for me. AndroDrive does give me more DRIVE, but Ani opens me up to more sense flow, so bringing in new information from the senses is easier. If I want to have more refined logic, math skills, or work on problems of that nature, then AndroDrive is great. Yet if I want to improve reflexes to what is going on in the moment or if I want to have the auditory skills to quickly learn a new language, then Ani is much better. AndroDrive would have some positive effects in response to new sense input too, because of the alertness factor, yet it wouldn't be near as good as Aniracetam for this area.

    I can see where Ani would work well in the speaking to groups area, as the sense input flow allows you to catch subtle social nuances as they happen without effort.

    And I do get a mild euphoric effect from Ani that I don't get from AndroDrive. I've seen any number of times where people will respond in the opposite or close to opposite direction that I get. Four years ago I tried some very minimal doses of SSRIs (Zoloft at it's smallest dose) to do a low carb diet, and it worked for me. I gave my brother 1/2 of this 50 mg dose, and he had severe anxiety with a racing mind and racing heart rate. I read after that this is not uncommon.

  22. Quote Originally Posted by tuberman View Post
    I look at this as CDP and hu

    I've always been somewhat absent minded, even at a young age, and CDP Choline and Lion's Mane have caused a huge improvement over the last year or so. Also, something to enhance choline is a positive with all racetams, so CDP Choline is not an extra, but I could discontinue the Lion's Mane for a bit, as it would be interesting to see how I am without after more than a year. My guess is that it's effects will last anyway.
    I'm just curious how long it took before you felt the benefits of Lion's Mane?


    I just started a few weeks ago. I've read that it can take up to 6 months before the benefits are noticed. I've been disappointed by Bacopa but I haven't given up. I've just about been able to do without coffee which I think has done some damage to my nerves and memory. I drank strong tall cups of Peets and Starbucks everyday for years and years and followed up with second cups of coffee or diet coke.

  23. Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    I've been in IT on the support side for 17 years- that is really what is messing you up. haha
    Same here, what brain/soul destroying line of work. The technology keeps changing faster and faster. In fact, that is what got me interested in nootrops, I was studying constantly and starting to have difficulty keeping up with recent grads still in their 20's. Drinking coffee all day was taking its cumulative toll, even though it keeps you going when the pressure is on. I'm still experimenting with different noop stacks for the ultimate learning/remembering/critical thinking effects.

  24. Quote Originally Posted by jkshnanamnds View Post
    I'm just curious how long it took before you felt the benefits of Lion's Mane?


    I just started a few weeks ago. I've read that it can take up to 6 months before the benefits are noticed. I've been disappointed by Bacopa but I haven't given up. I've just about been able to do without coffee which I think has done some damage to my nerves and memory. I drank strong tall cups of Peets and Starbucks everyday for years and years and followed up with second cups of coffee or diet coke.
    You never really feel much of anything with Lion's Mane. After about 8 months I noticed... Hmmm, my sharpness and memory, especially memory seem much better than ever before, but I also used the CDP Choline too that whole time. I've never used Bacopa consistently, 3-4 days in a row is about max then some time away. I took the Lion's Mane ability to up NGF on faith after reading several studies a couple years ago, like fish oil it's long-term.

    I'm still reading several brain science books on neuroplasticity, as that gives powerful hints about how things work.

    What noots are you using now besides the Lion's Mane and Bacopa?

  25. Quick note: Started taking Noopept yesterday, and 3 doses so far. I stopped the aniracetam a couple of days before starting this. Noticeable intensity, but don't know what it does yet. Going to go after studying language as in Spanish with noots as a test and for the fun of it. Ordered a Spanish/English electronic translator I can use at work. it's pocket size. Cost me $63 with shipping.

    Cannot use the office computers for internet personal use very often so this is my solution.

  26. Stopped taking the Ani and started taking the Noopept two days ago.
    Started with 20mg and upped to 30mg today.
    Probably too early to judge but it feels good so far. Hard to pin down the feeling but it's overall good mood with increased focus.
    I started the Noot experiment with certain expectations. I was expecting something like AndroDrive. It hits you and there is a noticeable change. The Noots seem to be much more subtle.

  27. Quote Originally Posted by jkshnanamnds View Post
    Same hear, what brain/soul destroying line of work. The technology keeps changing faster and faster. In fact, that is what got me interested in nootrops, I was studying constantly and starting to have difficulty keeping up with recent grads still in their 20's. Drinking coffee all day was taking its cumulative toll, even though it keeps you going when the pressure is on. I'm still experimenting with different noop stacks for the ultimate learning/remembering/critical thinking effects.
    I will say that if you don't mind taking mild steroids, AndroDrive at 3-4 caps per day, once after you wake up will allow you to pick up new analytic skills much quicker and with less stress, and you will feel it kick in when it starts to help. At 3 caps a day you get through one bottle in 8 weeks and that is plenty for me to feel strong effects. Eight weeks is usually enough time to bring you up to snuff with new tech stuff. I'm just interested in more things than techie info as that has lost its "magic" for me.

  28. Quote Originally Posted by RedRaptor View Post
    Stopped taking the Ani and started taking the Noopept two days ago.
    Started with 20mg and upped to 30mg today.
    Probably too early to judge but it feels good so far. Hard to pin down the feeling but it's overall good mood with increased focus.
    I started the Noot experiment with certain expectations. I was expecting something like AndroDrive. It hits you and there is a noticeable change. The Noots seem to be much more subtle.
    I'm into third day of Noopept and yep, there is focus factors to it. Has it got some stim effects? I'm not sure.

    I'll have to go back and check the material I read, but I believe it increases the neural growth factors as well, perhaps even more, much more than lion's mane.The growth factors are important for neural repair as well as growing new ones, and they help strengthen the Attention abilities which is critical. Attention itself is a two-way loop as the stronger attention you give to your interests, the stronger the parts of the brain dedicated to attention become. That's why the motivators say find something you really love to focus on, and catch fire. That Fire is Attention.

  29. Don't want to make this some sort of day to day log of my Noot experiments but I wanted to relate today's experience.
    Woke up from 9 hours sleep with a headache and stiff neck (I never sleep 9 hours!) Thought it was going to be a wasted day. Turned on the coffee machine and while waiting for it to heat up I started feeling better, then much better, then slightly euphoric. Now after morning noots and two shots of espresso my mind is snappy and I'm smiling with a feeling of being able to get some things done. Mikey likes it!

  30. I'd be curious what role the 9 hours of sleep had to do with the added noots. I would personally not like that amount of sleep and part of what I love about Rhodiola mixed with Ani, is the ability to feel refreshed and functioning on 5-6 hours of sleep. Too much sleep and I am groggy all day and less productive.
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