supplement that gives the dry appearance

[snagencyV2.0]

Protocols are very different when dealing with insulin and peptides for fullness.. pharma diuretics for dryness.. pgcl and laxatives to flatten the midsection.. seo to bring up lagging muscles or making muscles fuller without weight gain to make wt classes. Etc.

Bodybuilding not natural is quite the ordeal. Fun but scary to live and do.

you love reading things into my posts don't you!
eissh..i think things are getting skewed here. :hypnotized:

let me say Mike, that half the things you just said, i have no clue about.
my experience is in natural training/prep, not drug-aided approaches.

so - i speak more of dietary discretion, and to this point, simple steroid use vs. non-steroid use -- to me, there is not a whole lot of difference in dietary discourse. what worked for me natty, also works for me with steroidal product.

i was simply trying to infer to bdcc, per his reference to Matt's post on an example approach listed, that there is no 'magical' secret for otc supps for the natty individual, or for that matter no dietary 'secret approach'.

i applaud your obvious knowledge, am now a little more aware of what i will be up against in Nationals, and now back out of this conversation. :wave2:

 

[HereToStudy]

I am strictly no AAS/PH products. I don't compete though, fitness modelling is where I am at so in theory I could take AAS and it wouldn't matter as I don't get tested, they are just not for me.

Cool, didn't meant to imply you should or shouldn't, just was curious.

 

[mr.cooper69]

you love reading things into my posts don't you!
eissh..i think things are getting skewed here. :hypnotized:

let me say Mike, that half the things you just said, i have no clue about.
my experience is in natural training/prep, not drug-aided approaches.

so - i speak more of dietary discretion, and to this point, simple steroid use vs. non-steroid use -- to me, there is not a whole lot of difference in dietary discourse. what worked for me natty, also works for me with steroidal product.

i was simply trying to infer to bdcc, per his reference to Matt's post on an example approach listed, that there is no 'magical' secret for otc supps for the natty individual, or for that matter no dietary 'secret approach'.

i applaud your obvious knowledge, am now a little more aware of what i will be up against in Nationals, and now back out of this conversation. :wave2:

I would unquestionably trade carbs for protein while using exogenous hormones (higher nitrogen retention; less need for protein-sparing effect of carbs). Fat intake should stay approximately the same but metabolic demands would theoretically be reduced since exogenous hormones would downregulate steroid hormone biosynthesis.

 

[snagencyV2.0]

I would unquestionably trade carbs for protein while using exogenous hormones (higher nitrogen retention; less need for protein-sparing effect of carbs). Fat intake should stay approximately the same but metabolic demands would theoretically be reduced since exogenous hormones would downregulate steroid hormone biosynthesis.

ahaaaa.
yes cy, a minute change perhaps, but you may have something there.
i did notice i could utilize more carbs thruout the process while not sacrificing leaning, but -- in that last 2-week window before landing that plane, i had to get just as stringent w/ carbs/cals as when i was natty (even moreso really, as i was striving for personal-low bf levels).
so, once again, for bdcc and his question - really no diff between the two.

btw - how many bodybuilding preps/model shoots have you prepped for, or guided someone thru?
i wasn't aware you had such experience.

 

[mr.cooper69]

btw - how many bodybuilding preps/model shoots have you prepped for, or guided someone thru?
i wasn't aware you had such experience.

Zero. Ignore me.

 

[bdcc]

ahaaaa.
yes cy, a minute change perhaps, but you may have something there.
i did notice i could utilize more carbs thruout the process while not sacrificing leaning, but -- in that last 2-week window before landing that plane, i had to get just as stringent w/ carbs/cals as when i was natty (even moreso really, as i was striving for personal-low bf levels).
so, once again, for bdcc and his question - really no diff between the two.

btw - how many bodybuilding preps/model shoots have you prepped for, or guided someone thru?
i wasn't aware you had such experience.

Once again, I was asking Matt for any particular supplement protocol he uses for peaking, not for differences in diet lol.

BDCC,

Snag is of course saying very accurate things regarding diet is always key regardless of drugs or no drugs...

I think you after how exactly I 'peak' and 'dry out' a natty guy opposed to an assisted? I will actually look at those guys files and I can literally just paste it..

If you noticed -- I dont keep secrets like these other guru/prep guys.

I believe in sharing info on forums that I PERSONALLY would appreciate learning about.

Too many shady, agenda ridden people out there...

No secrets -- this stuff isn't always novelty information

-Matt

Yes please, this is exactly what I was asking for. As your first protocol depends heavily on PEDs I was curious to know what you could do with natural athletes when these were not allowed.

Strategies for contest/photoshoot week vary so much I like collecting information from people with a background in doing it.

 

[snagencyV2.0]

Zero. Ignore me.

lol.

Once again, I was asking Matt for any particular supplement protocol he uses for peaking, not for differences in diet lol.

yes, we already established that. :lol:
hence - why i included that thread link, where your exact question is asked by someone else, and covered.

Matt is great with these things, srs talent he has.
and he is very generous with his time and advice.

my apologies for even attempting to step in to help.

 

[OrganicShadow]

Protocols are very different when dealing with insulin and peptides for fullness.. pharma diuretics for dryness.. pgcl and laxatives to flatten the midsection.. seo to bring up lagging muscles or making muscles fuller without weight gain to make wt classes. Etc.

Bodybuilding not natural is quite the ordeal. Fun but scary to live and do.

It's always something that interested me. Just simply as another dimension to shaping the human form and syncing physiology.

 

[neddo]

Welp, I see it wasn't mentioned -- as it's a relatively new product on the market but MAN's Nolvadren XT is along the lines of what you want. Very similar to Erase, which has been mentioned aplenty (as arimistane is a stud in and of itself).

NXT combines arimistane for an AI (at a solid dose of 75mg), DIM for test modulation, and a cortisol control complex.

It's catching face as a few logs pop up here/there; but as an extra bonus -- NP has it on sale ($10 off) and there is also a promo up for a bottle.

 

[MattPorter]

For bdcc

Nothing special here....

 

[bdcc]

Awesome, thank you.

 

[HereToStudy]

I would unquestionably trade carbs for protein while using exogenous hormones (higher nitrogen retention; less need for protein-sparing effect of carbs). Fat intake should stay approximately the same but metabolic demands would theoretically be reduced since exogenous hormones would downregulate steroid hormone biosynthesis.

Ahh, but there is nothing like the fullness of on cycle + carbs.

 

[MattPorter]

Awesome, thank you.

Yes,

Let em know if you anymore questions?

-Matt

 

[snagencyV2.0]

nice dietary guidelines Matt!

hmmm..no crazy supp protocol..how bout that...

 

[bdcc]

nice dietary guidelines Matt!

hmmm..no crazy supp protocol..how bout that...

That's what I was curious about but he answered my question either way.

 

[bdcc]

Thanks again Matt. I was curious to know if you used AIs, cortisol modulators and diuretics during the final phase.

I thought you might use a more comprehensive supplement protocol, you answered my question.

In future if I have further questions I will just PM you.

Thanks again.

 

[MattPorter]

Thanks again Matt. I was curious to know if you used AIs, cortisol modulators and diuretics during the final phase.I thought you might use a more comprehensive supplement protocol, you answered my question.In future if I have further questions I will just PM you. Thanks again.

Actually I prefer to ONLY answer questions in the open because other members can sometimes find info valuable to them and learn a bit.

Too many people not giving out good info these days and threads starting to suck with redundancy.

Yes I will various things as you mentioned above depending on the persons situation.


-Matt

 

[MattPorter]

nice dietary guidelines Matt!

hmmm..no crazy supp protocol..how bout that...

I have gotten a bit "crazy" on specific people ....but no one size fits all to everyone...

Variations non stop....

-matt

 

[criticalbench]

I have gotten a bit "crazy" on specific people ....but no one size fits all to everyone...

Variations non stop....

-matt

Really enjoy what your posting.. a good read.

Mike

 

[MattPorter]

Really enjoy what your posting.. a good read.Mike

Thanks Mike,Always value your input too-Matt

 

[MattPorter]

Progesterone has diuretic-like effects

Tren + DHT would be 'dry'

-Matt

 

[OrganicShadow]

Matt, what's your suggestion for a natty guy who has difficulty with water retention. I hold a lot.

 

[HereToStudy]

Matt, what's your suggestion for a natty guy who has difficulty with water retention. I hold a lot.

Probably should define natural (yes I know, here goes that again).

What I mean is, natural = no hormones, or natural = only over the counter.

 

[Blergs]

Is there a supplement/stack that isn't a ph that will give that dry/vascular look?

If so which?

Thanks

Extra vitC will help dry you out, and add some caffein maybe.
its more where your body is at, not supps. im vascular with nothing, some can take a boat load of stuff and still not have much of anything.

GPLC may help also

 

[MattPorter]

Matt, what's your suggestion for a natty guy who has difficulty with water retention. I hold a lot.

Lower carbs, high fluid intake. Eat cucumbers and asparagus.

-Matt

 

[OrganicShadow]

Probably should define natural (yes I know, here goes that again).

What I mean is, natural = no hormones, or natural = only over the counter.

Lol you know I love that argument of "define natural." Natural means only OTC. Things not found on the banned substance list of the INBF or FDA.

Cucumber huh? Ok

 

[LiveToLift]

Matt, what's your suggestion for a natty guy who has difficulty with water retention. I hold a lot.

Erase pro works wonders as well.

 

[BPjohn123]

Matt some great info just had a chance to read through. Thanks for sharing

 

[oufinny]

Erase pro works wonders as well.

Erase is great, the problem with Erase Pro is if you don't need 75mg but 50, now you have negative sides of too much AI. I always want a product I can choose the dose to suit me, BPS FormaSurge is the way to go.

 

[LiveToLift]

Erase is great, the problem with Erase Pro is if you don't need 75mg but 50, now you have negative sides of too much AI. I always want a product I can choose the dose to suit me, BPS FormaSurge is the way to go.

Very true. This is exactly why the first time I ran Epro I dosed it every other day. Now I've been dosing daily for two months with no issue.

 

[oufinny]

Very true. This is exactly why the first time I ran Epro I dosed it every other day. Now I've been dosing daily for two months with no issue.

I could see the EOD dosing working well. I have often wondered if the additional ingredients make a difference but it sounds like they do.

 

[DKPhysiqueAX]

A good diuretic always helps. I prefer natural ones such as dandelion root. But caffeine products also aid in producing that washed out look

Sent from my iPhone using Am.com

 

[Clemenza]

Erase pro works wonders as well.

Can't beat Erase Pro for dryness.

 

[fightbackhxc]

Erase and agmatine make me so vascular I appear dry

 

[BPjohn123]

Erase and agmatine make me so vascular I appear dry

Nice combo

 

[MattPorter]

Star Caps used to contain lasix --- and the ingredient label read something like papaya enzymes and something else weak lol

-Matt

 

[linedriver465]

Anabeta Elite dried me out quite nicely during a clean bulk stage - have yet to try Erase

GF-T21 by Fahrenheit also increased my vascularity nicely, which gave the appearance of drying out

 

[OrganicShadow]

Straight up 1g of niacin does me well.

 

[kevinhy]

Erase and agmatine make me so vascular I appear dry

So true! I lose a ****load of water on Erase (or any strong AI). Agmatine on refeed days definitely causes extra glycogen storage in my experience, which assists in the "dryness".

 

[MattPorter]

So true! I lose a ****load of water on Erase (or any strong AI). Agmatine on refeed days definitely causes extra glycogen storage in my experience, which assists in the "dryness".

What form and what brand of Agmatine?

-matt

 

[kevinhy]

What form and what brand of Agmatine?

-matt

On refeeds: 1-2g Synthetic Supplements Agmatine Sulfate.

 

[MattPorter]

Client Mike looking rather 'dry' 5 days out from next show.

-Matt

 

[jswain34]

Yah...id say that's pretty dry...

 

[criticalbench]

Client Mike looking rather 'dry' 5 days out from next show.

<img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=68818"/>

-Matt

Freaky.. looks good!

Mike

 

[OrganicShadow]

That's 5 days out? Wow, I can't imagine what his peak would be then.

 

[oufinny]

Client Mike looking rather 'dry' 5 days out from next show.

View attachment 68818


-Matt

Looks like he has his diuretic and AI just right. The question is will be carb up and look as paper thin on day of? Impressive work no doubt, he is in ridiculous shape!

 

[HereToStudy]

Wow, great wheels.

 

[snagencyV2.0]

^^
great work, and shout out to the coach!

 

[truthornothin]

Yah...id say that's pretty dry...

Yeah but is it that the result of something non hormonal????I'll wager not


Give UR Spray a try, it has almost immediate tightening and seemingly diuretic effects it will definitely increase the vascularity no hormones required

 

[ryansm]

UR Spray definitely has my attention...