"Shogun" Rua vs "Iceman" Liddell @ UFC 97 - the AM thread

[SpargelJanusz]

If you can, watch Chuck vs Overeem from 2003 that took place under the PRIDE banner.
Compare that explosive, fast Chuck with the one that fought Rua, and the difference is night and day. Does he not notice himself that age has caught up with him?

 

[bla55]

What really entertained me was Dana White yelling at Chuck once the fight was over "GET BACK THERE! DON'T LEAVE!".

Dana sure as heck did not seem too fond of Chuck yesterday.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

I had never been a truly believer in Chuck; at least not to the degree others were. His win streak after his loss to Rampage is not entirely impressive, when viewed in the context of his opponents. (His opponents were much more impressive, in my opinion, in his streak prior to his first lost to Randy.)

 

[dedlifter1]

http://www.blitzcorner.com/MMA/ufc-97-shogun-rua-vs-chuck-liddell-video/

Get it while it's hot.

Shogun looked vastly improved, but: this fight only lasted one round, so I will still need to see his conditioning to claim he is back in form. As well, it seems as if any Top-10 LHW could switch Chuck off at this point, so I will reserve my re-coronation of Shogun until his next fight!

agreed. I need more than that win to use the name "shogun" and "title" in the same sentence.

 

[bigwhiteguy29]

ill tell you what everyone in SLO was ****ing pissed and sad lastnight until someone yelled atleast we will see him out more!

he did look really slow nad just flailed punches out there no fast not powerfull straight punches

 

[SpargelJanusz]

Yeah, white guy, slow he did look. As if he was caught totally off-guard (well, he WAS in fact caught totally off-guard) when Rua closed the distance for this great shot that basically ended the fight and let Chuck fall like a foul apple.

 

[SpargelJanusz]

It is now official - Chuck's done with his career, despite his "I made a mistake and got caught" talk: YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

 

[EVILADAMS]

Rua is one of the best LHW in the world. His UFC career started off with some pretty serious setbacks. This was the first fight @ 100% to date in the UFC (Tore his ACL vs F.Griffin). He may have been fighting Liddell who is not his old self anymore but I thought Rua looked sharp. All Liddell has ever been was a counter puncher anyway. Rua pushed the action and looked in good form doing it.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

Rua was one of the best LHW in the world.

My only disagreement is above in bold. I thought he looked great, but will need at least another good/great performance for me to say he is one of the best again.

 

[bigwhiteguy29]

yeah he needs to fight someone that isnt old or wandy

 

[EVILADAMS]

My only disagreement is above in bold. I thought he looked great, but will need at least another good/great performance for me to say he is one of the best again.

I believe he still is. He is only 27, too young to already be a hasbeen. Don't forget, he tore his ACL twice and had it reconstructed both times. In the fight against Griffin and while rehabbing/training after. Those are tough injuries. Remember how shitty Arlovski looked in that 3rd match against Tim Sylvia? It was because he ****ed up his leg in the fight. It is tough to perform at your best when you do infact sustain a serious injury. Thats what I believe caused Rua's first 2 fights to be so underwhelming.

 

[Mulletsoldier]

I believe he still is. He is only 27, too young to already be a hasbeen. Don't forget, he tore his ACL twice and had it reconstructed both times. In the fight against Griffin and while rehabbing/training after. Those are tough injuries. Remember how shitty Arlovski looked in that 3rd match against Tim Sylvia? It was because he ****ed up his leg in the fight. It is tough to perform at your best when you do infact sustain a serious injury. Thats what I believe caused Rua's first 2 fights to be so underwhelming.

I do not agree that his injury alone is the sole predictive factor in his lackluster performances: knee injuries are notoriously difficult to recover from, but it has been done before. Aside from the knee injury, there are other factors afoot, and; until we can be entirely sure they have been resolved [whatever they may be] I feel it is a bit preemptive to still consider him one of the best.

And believe me when I say this, I was/am an absolutely massive Shogun supporter.

 

[EVILADAMS]

I do not agree that his injury alone is the sole predictive factor in his lackluster performances: knee injuries are notoriously difficult to recover from, but it has been done before. Aside from the knee injury, there are other factors afoot, and; until we can be entirely sure they have been resolved [whatever they may be] I feel it is a bit preemptive to still consider him one of the best.

And believe me when I say this, I was/am an absolutely massive Shogun supporter.

Agree to disagree :approve:

 

[Outside Backer]

Ive been saying for the last yr its time for chuck to hang it up

sad he had to lose his last 4 to realize

 

[SpargelJanusz]

I did not know that Dana actually told Chuck already after the Rashad fight, "hang up the gloves, Mohawk man". At least now he will do so, it's overdue. But a great ride for the Iceman it was.

 

[0-hero]

After reading his book you kinda get the mentality of chuck.

He's a fighter, nothing more, there arent many layers to peel away, just that this guy wants to fight, he also spoke very fondly of his coaching experience in TUF 1.

Chuck talks about his fights in his book and basically the only thing that changes is the name of his opponent, the rest of it is text book, he gets tagged a few times and knocks the guy out, he also goes on and on about letting guys hit him because he has a naturally amazing chin.

Hes never really had respect for any of his opponents and when hes lost always seemed to place the blame on himself, not accepting the other fighter was superior.

I love the guy, but the point im making is it doesnt suprise me he came out this way. On the plus side his take down defense and recovery is still stellar.

 

[Jessep76]

It is now official - Chuck's done with his career, despite his "I made a mistake and got caught" talk: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9aZugTVwyw

Ah man that was great. Chuck's gonna be calling up Randy pretty soon and asking for his lawyer's phone number.

 

[Rodja]

That was the best that Shogun has looked since pre-Coleman injury. His boxing was crisp, he actually had a good burst, and he showed that he still has all of the tools to be the #1 LHW again.

 

[SpargelJanusz]

Chuck will be remembered as "The potbellied assassin".

 

[jas123]

This was definitely the highlight of that night. Shogun looked explosive and had a good gameplan. He's still got a wide open style, and he's going to have a hard time with all the great counter punchers at 205 like Page, Rashad, and Machida. Regardless, he could hover in the top 5.

 

[Jessep76]

As a chuck fan, I too, hope that he can do the right thing, and just let it go. Have some dignity about it.

You guys are not taking into account that he could fight for strikeforce or whatever or any other mma fixture...whats the one where babaloo is holding the 205 title??.... Anyway he'd kill any and every apponent in those chumpfests. Or even go to japan and get some more real competition which maybe ..ok he shouldn't.

Move to Affliction or Strikeforce Chuck!!!! We wanna see you beat the bums!!

 

[bla55]

Chuck is still good for a spectacle, big brawls, and slugfests, but as far as having a shot in fights where gameplans play a big role, I'd say no, unfortunally.

 

[Jessep76]

Thats why strikeforce is perfect for him. He doesn't need a game plan for most of those guys. Or else he's already beaten them.


Dude!! He could fight Ken Shamrock!! or Bobby Southworth. *fart noise*

 

[bigwhiteguy29]

dude i hate jason lambert that was so gay. i saw babaloo sobral at strike force a couple weeks ago. thats a huge down grade thats like going back to the minnors like jose conseco hahah.

 

[Emerge]

Dude!! He could fight Ken Shamrock!!

Lmao, I thought the same thing.

 

[SpargelJanusz]

Chuck fighting in another promotion would be a huge mistake of his.

 

[0-hero]

They wont or shouldnt let him go out on a loss, throw him a can, let him KO someone and do his routine and go out on a high.

 

[Emerge]

Like, who? Coleman?

 

[0-hero]

Maybe or someone from his "era", hes deserves to go out on a high, hes given too much to the sport to be remembered for the KO's recently.

 

[brownstown89]

google it shogun vs lidell video.. and ur guranteed to find a good quality full match video on some web site.

 

[SpargelJanusz]

If going out on a "high" would have been his point, he would have retired after UFC 79.

If he now enters fights with 2nd rate competition, it will further demolish his already shrinking reputation. Chuck has to let go now.

 

[Jessep76]

Didn't he talk smack about Kimbo? They could do a grudge match...
*i almost couldn't type because I was laughing the whole time*

 

[Rodja]

Remember, Babalu got cut because of a PR move, not his fighting ability.

 

[Jessep76]

What did he do?

 

[SpargelJanusz]

It's pretty sad to realize that Chuck was not that clever in picking his outside-cage appearances: http://www.mmanews.com/ufc/Video:-Chuck-Liddell-Appears-In-New-Mandy-Moore-Video.html

 

[Rodja]

What did he do?

Held on to a choke too long vs David Heath.

 

[bigwhiteguy29]

hahaha really? dude fuking royce gracie always did that annoying sh!t

 

[Jessep76]

Crap didn't they have that fight with him and Matt Hughes on that Unleased dedicated to him?? I watched it on dvr but I don't remember it being on there from the other night. Anyone else think Hughes was on the juice? He looked badass against Newton.



***sorry completely off topic here

 

[Rodja]

hahaha really? dude fuking royce gracie always did that annoying sh!t

When Royce did that, he was bitten earlier in the fight

Crap didn't they have that fight with him and Matt Hughes on that Unleased dedicated to him?? I watched it on dvr but I don't remember it being on there from the other night. Anyone else think Hughes was on the juice? He looked badass against Newton.



***sorry completely off topic here

He was even bigger when he fought Sakurai. He looked to have some bad bacne when he fought Newton.

 

[bigwhiteguy29]

i dunno he is really white and they show it more. also his training style he weight lifts a lot but yeah maybe they didnt really test back then at all.



ive seen more than one fight hes held a submission in too long

 

[Jessep76]

I think I might have too but then again you got away with a ton of sh!t that you couldn't today.
It could be they didn't test or test often enough 7 or so years ago but....ok my conspiracy theory, look at GSP now. He's a fcking truck! Could white be testing some fighters and not others maybe? GSP has always looked like a stud but against BJ he looked like a he-man action figure.
(sorta gay example and very much saying my age*)

 

[SpargelJanusz]

i dunno he is really white and they show it more. also his training style he weight lifts a lot but yeah maybe they didnt really test back then at all.



ive seen more than one fight hes held a submission in too long

Bigwhiteguy, any updates on Chuck's calves?

 

[Rodja]

I think I might have too but then again you got away with a ton of sh!t that you couldn't today.
It could be they didn't test or test often enough 7 or so years ago but....ok my conspiracy theory, look at GSP now. He's a fcking truck! Could white be testing some fighters and not others maybe? GSP has always looked like a stud but against BJ he looked like a he-man action figure.
(sorta gay example and very much saying my age*)

Dana doesn't test; the athletic commissions do the testing. GSP is a rare athlete and he did look bigger and leaner against BJ than ever. Part of that is due to muscle maturity, but it is also due to his S&C program/dedication to fighting.

 

[bigwhiteguy29]

he cuts from 190 or maybe even high to 170. hes jsut a stud and thats coming from someone who hates him.


no update on calves i havnt seen him in 4-5 months and ive been to the pit only twice.


if i was chuck i would be weighin about 245 right now after that loss so his claves would look like regualr legs lol

 

[luclyluciano]

Dana doesn't test; the athletic commissions do the testing. GSP is a rare athlete and he did look bigger and leaner against BJ than ever. Part of that is due to muscle maturity, but it is also due to his S&C program/dedication to fighting.

Yes, but his nipples look awful suspicious! (that's coming from a Canadian)

 

[Jessep76]

hahaha... nice did they really?
I hope he saves some of it for TA.

 

[bigwhiteguy29]

gsp prolly knew he didnt need gear to beat BJ. also even if he did use it was prolly after beating jon fitch then stopped a few monmths before the bj fight.

why am i backing up gsp i hate him!!!!!


he could of been on celltech

 

[Rodja]

Yes, but his nipples look awful suspicious! (that's coming from a Canadian)

He's had that for years. I can definitely recall seeing that against Trigg and Hughes.

 

[Jessep76]

gsp prolly knew he didnt need gear to beat BJ. also even if he did use it was prolly after beating jon fitch then stopped a few monmths before the bj fight.

why am i backing up gsp i hate him!!!!!


he could of been on celltech

Ya think? Wouldn't carrying around water from the Mono hinder your speed?
I think he was on the SUS and used Greg Jackson's urin during the test analysis.

 

[SpargelJanusz]

GSP himself said his walkaround weight is 185 lbs, which is also according to him the weight he comes in for the fight. Now, given that he's not tall (around 5'10''), those 185 lbs certainly look fantastic. Those 15 pounds are cut for the weigh-in by sweating it out and cutting carbs and sodium.