MK-677 VS GHRP

[harrybrah]

Haha awesome stuff! Let me know how your DAC goes! How are you dosing/ length of time? I used DAC personally for 4-6 weeks from what I can remember, Watchout for intense facial flush after the first pin! I dosed 2mg a week.

 

[BamBam0319]

Haha awesome stuff! Let me know how your DAC goes! How are you dosing/ length of time? I used DAC personally for 4-6 weeks from what I can remember, Watchout for intense facial flush after the first pin! I dosed 2mg a week.

I was thinking 2mg a week as well for probably 4 weeks to start off. Did you do your doses fasted?

 

[harrybrah]

I was thinking 2mg a week as well for probably 4 weeks to start off. Did you do your doses fasted?

From what I remember, I did . I dosed pre bed. I ended up doing 2x a week as I read it was superior for injuries ( which was my goal / reason for taking ) I dosed 1mg Monday, then 1mg Friday.

But for the first 4 weeks was just straight 2 mg.


4 weeks sounds good/ on the Safe side. I'd do it fasted. As the first injection Actually acts similarly to GHRP in the fact it releases a boat load of GH+ I thought it would work much better.. Which it did. Your gonna love the sleep!

 

[harrybrah]

you and BamBam0319 have any more seats available for this ride? lol

Sure welcome aboard, here's a fee vial of CJC Dac ����

 

[BamBam0319]

From what I remember, I did . I dosed pre bed. I ended up doing 2x a week as I read it was superior for injuries ( which was my goal / reason for taking ) I dosed 1mg Monday, then 1mg Friday.

But for the first 4 weeks was just straight 2 mg.


4 weeks sounds good/ on the Safe side. I'd do it fasted. As the first injection Actually acts similarly to GHRP in the fact it releases a boat load of GH+ I thought it would work much better.. Which it did. Your gonna love the sleep!

Wonderful, I was planning on doing 1mg at a time as well. My goal is to maybe decrease body fat, but honestly just better quality of life and sleep would be worth it for me.
I have a friend who cut from 260 to 235, then jumped on pharm grade HGH at the same time that he blasted with dbol and high test. He leaned out as he gained weight, got bigger, and basically improved everything about his physique. He is now 270 and climbing, 3 months into the GH.
Now I don't expect results nearly that impressive from peptides and GH secretatogues, but if I can pack on some clean weight, tighten up, and improve my skin, id be more than happy.
I'll have to see how much I can spend right now, and add CJC no DAC (mod GRF 1-29) if I can. If not, I think CJC 1295 DAC, ipam, and MK 677 will still be a damn good stack.

Sure welcome aboard, here's a fee vial of CJC Dac í*½í¸‚í*½í¸œ

Say what now????

 

[harrybrah]

Wonderful, I was planning on doing 1mg at a time as well. My goal is to maybe decrease body fat, but honestly just better quality of life and sleep would be worth it for me.
I have a friend who cut from 260 to 235, then jumped on pharm grade HGH at the same time that he blasted with dbol and high test. He leaned out as he gained weight, got bigger, and basically improved everything about his physique. He is now 270 and climbing, 3 months into the GH.
Now I don't expect results nearly that impressive from peptides and GH secretatogues, but if I can pack on some clean weight, tighten up, and improve my skin, id be more than happy.
I'll have to see how much I can spend right now, and add CJC no DAC (mod GRF 1-29) if I can. If not, I think CJC 1295 DAC, ipam, and MK 677 will still be a damn good stack.

Say what now????

that certainly would be a potent stack! CJC dac alone is amazing. 1mg at a time sounds good, 2x a week for best fat loss. I'd lower your Carbs and take HUP a each day, that way you're gonna get some amazing results-GH wise. Lower carbs+ good diet and training and your gonna chip away fat.

 

[warbird01]

Interesting. What company/dosage?

25mg/day for 60 days

Geo

 

[Deleted member 238667]

MK-677 is not a placebo, but if you don't buy it from reputable company, it could be. Just buy it from a reputable company and it works great!

 

[K_pem]

What is the general consensus on women taking MK in a lighter dose? Say 10-20mg

 

[criticalbench]

not on everyone

On all the AAS forums I frequent.. I've read minimal not complain about the hellish bloat. Yea, not everyone but its more common then not from what I read and see.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

MK-677 is not a placebo, but if you don't buy it from reputable company, it could be. Just buy it from a reputable company and it works great!

What have you noticed, that made you go "Aha! That's the MK-677 doin' it's thing!"? I take it too, but other than some tingling at 20mg, I can't tell what the MK-677 is doing, vs the Ostarine, Clen, Deficit, Fasted Cardio, Yohimbine, Eviscerate, Vasoburn, Caffeine, etc...

 

[Danes]

One thing is for sure:
Pretty many MK677 products are nothing than garbage !
I know one company which is 100% legit and their products are tested. This brand also makes Peptides, steroids and many other compounds (included Research compounds) and they make products for lab tests ++.

 

[BamBam0319]

One thing is for sure:
Pretty many MK677 products are nothing than garbage !
I know one company which is 100% legit and their products are tested. This brand also makes Peptides, steroids and many other compounds (included Research compounds) and they make products for lab tests ++.

I gotta disagree with you there, man. I've had good experiences with three different MK-677 products now.
I am interested in what company you are referring to, though.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Scott on the PED Podcast just read off his labs after taking 25mg MK-677 Caps before bed each night (didn't say what brand):

Serum GH 10
IGF 310

He's in his 40's. He said both those numbers are way above where he is normally. Looking at the lab ranges they are both at the upper end, but nothing crazy.

 

[kboxer7]

Scott on the PED Podcast just read off his labs after taking 25mg MK-677 Caps before bed each night (didn't say what brand):

Serum GH 10
IGF 310

He's in his 40's. He said both those numbers are way above where he is normally. Looking at the lab ranges they are both at the upper end, but nothing crazy.

Sounds about right.

I'd compare it to a SERM in the sense that it will aid in taking you to the top of your naturally possible peak output, but not into supra physiological levels.

It's nice to see some blood work done though.

 

[Just Jake]

Does he take it with any somatostatin inhibitor or by itself?

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Does he take it with any somatostatin inhibitor or by itself?

He didn't mention that he did. Download and listen - it's near the end before they sign off.

 

[Danes]

I gotta disagree with you there, man. I've had good experiences with three different MK-677 products now.
I am interested in what company you are referring to, though.

Have you lab tested your MK677? If yes, then well done. If not, how do you know your MK677 is legit ???
Getting "good" results does not mean its real MK677 or the dose is right.
I bet you would feel difference if you tried lab tested MK677 which is used by scientists and research groups

 

[Danes]

Does he take it with any somatostatin inhibitor or by itself?

You really dont need any Somatostatin Inhibitor such as Huperzine A as exampe.
MK677 is "clever drug" and does not lead to increase of Somatostatin

 

[BamBam0319]

Have you lab tested your MK677? If yes, then well done. If not, how do you know your MK677 is legit ???
Getting "good" results does not mean its real MK677 or the dose is right.
I bet you would feel difference if you tried lab tested MK677 which is used by scientists and research groups

So you're saying OL's Ghar1ne doesn't actually contain MK-677?

 

[Danes]

So you're saying OL's Ghar1ne doesn't actually contain MK-677?

I am not saying that. I am not mentioning any brands at all. I am just saying many of those RC products are underdosed or does not contain whats written on the label.

 

[BamBam0319]

I am not saying that. I am not mentioning any brands at all. I am just saying many of those RC products are underdosed or does not contain whats written on the label.

Gotcha. I don't run any MK from research companies. Only have run OL, Primeval, and now Focused Nutrition's MK.

 

[Danes]

Gotcha. I don't run any MK from research companies. Only have run OL, Primeval, and now Focused Nutrition's MK.

I hope you liked them but it seems like you did

 

[The_Old_Guy]

I am not saying that. I am not mentioning any brands at all. I am just saying many of those RC products are underdosed or does not contain whats written on the label.

I'm actually going to try out my preferred RC MK -677. It's basically free for me, so I'll see if it differs from OL. Now that you mention it, I should crack open the FN 677 that I have and switch to it for a while too.

 

[Danes]

I'm actually going to try out my preferred RC MK -677. It's basically free for me, so I'll see if it differs from OL. Now that you mention it, I should crack open the FN 677 that I have and switch to it for a while too.

Sounds good

 

[datsthat]

Edit: Never mind, I found my answer

 

[BamBam0319]

I'm actually going to try out my preferred RC MK -677. It's basically free for me, so I'll see if it differs from OL. Now that you mention it, I should crack open the FN 677 that I have and switch to it for a while too.

I switched from OL to FN about 2 weeks ago, and so far they seem to be on par with each other. I know I said I'm going to run 10mg daily for a whole year, but I think I'm going to try 20mg for a couple months to see what happens.
Also got my CJC 1295 DAC today so stacking the two together along with ipamorelin

 

[UncleSarm]

Yeah thats good stuff man, When i was on GH was similar. Went from cracking wrists closing 200 pounds heavy gripper, to smashing out 250 pounds 20 reps with ease haha. Me and the old man did a grip test and i nearly broke his hand! before he made my hand sore, now he didnt! haha. GH is very awesome for joints/tendons/ligaments and pure connective tissue strength. When you take GH make sure your diet is in check and look into something like "apple cider vinegar" to help boost metabolism and to help the body ward of cancer.

Can you expand on the "apple cider vinegar to help the body ward of cancer" thing?

 

[UncleSarm]

I'm using our Elite MK-677 right now and getting comparable results to the recently discontinued OL UK Ghar1ne, if not slightly better. I don't bloat from MK-677 but damn do I sleep like a rock.
I can inquire about purity harrybrah but based on real-world results I would say FN's purity of compounds is competitive with the current top brands on the market.
We're not new but I believe we did leave AM for a while and now we're back and ready to make a name for ourselves. We have some stuff in the making that sounds pretty awesome.

I'm looking forward to giving Elite MK-677 a go. I'm waiting for the post Osta cycle blood results before pulling the trigger. Glad you guys are still in the SARM business.

 

[BamBam0319]

I'm looking forward to giving Elite MK-677 a go. I'm waiting for the post Osta cycle blood results before pulling the trigger. Glad you guys are still in the SARM business.

I believe we only sell the SARMs in Europe now, and I don't think I'm actually even supposed to promote our SARMs here, but I personally use it and other MK-677 products so I don't mind just discussing my experiences with it!

 

[smith_69]

I believe we only sell the SARMs in Europe now, and I don't think I'm actually even supposed to promote our SARMs here, but I personally use it and other MK-677 products so I don't mind just discussing my experiences with it!

 

[harrybrah]

Can you expand on the "apple cider vinegar to help the body ward of cancer" thing?

Google is your friend on this one.

 

[Deleted member 238667]

What have you noticed, that made you go "Aha! That's the MK-677 doin' it's thing!"? I take it too, but other than some tingling at 20mg, I can't tell what the MK-677 is doing, vs the Ostarine, Clen, Deficit, Fasted Cardio, Yohimbine, Eviscerate, Vasoburn, Caffeine, etc...

Well, when you start taking it, you'll probably gain a few pounds in the first week (water weight.) You'll want to eat everything, and you'll have crazy dreams and extremely restful sleep.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Well, when you start taking it, you'll probably gain a few pounds in the first week (water weight.) You'll want to eat everything, and you'll have crazy dreams and extremely restful sleep.

I'm already on it - I wanted to know what you saw. I'm in a 2300kcal cut (~700kcal deficit) and have no increased hunger, and if this stuff is causing me to hold water, I can't wait to see what I look like off it... cuz I look good now I've always had great sleep, can't use that as an indicator I'm afraid. I hit the "zero sides" jackpot with this stuff... unless it doesn't work on me I switched to 20mg of FN last night, want to see if anything is different from the OL.

 

[Canes325]

-taken from Datbtrue's forum. Posted by Datbtrue

Five years ago I was very much interested in Stress and started a thread -> Stress - temporary notepad. The idea, if I remember correctly was to change the receptor expression in key regions of the body in regard to cortisol- active, cortisol - inactive. By changing the quantity of the enzymes responsible for some of this activity such as 11b-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase type 1 (11b-HSD1) the idea was that insulin sensitivity could be increased in insulin resistant states... in specific tissues. The idea was that perhaps depression could be alleviated in the brain. The idea was to use this area to positively impact body-shape change, enhance mood, enhance health, etc.

What wasn't consider so much was the question of "what happens if you change the quantity or activity of receptors for extended durations in the brain. ...does this become permanent? Blunting the 11b-HSD1 enzymatic activity sounds great but what if you impair it?

Valsamakis et al. showed that impaired 11b-HSD1 activity in obese adults may help preserve insulin sensitivity and prevent diabetes mellitus. Failure to downregulate 11b-HSD1 activity in patients with diabetes may potentate dyslipidemia, insulin resistance, and obesity. Therefore, inhibition of 11b-HSD1 activity may represent a therapeutic strategy in patients with type 2 diabetes mellitus and obesity. - Valsamakis G, 11b-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase type 1 activity in lean and obese males with type 2 diabetes mellitus, Journal of Clinical Endocrinology and Metabolism 2004 89 4755–4761.

I saw some good in the Valsamakis study. What I failed to understand is that impairing 11b-HSD1 activity in normal people leads to set-point changes which can become ingrained. These changes can result in receptor activity that may never come back. I paid the price for that failure to understand and through my self-experimention ...

Here's an example of loss of receptor expression in the brain.

Mood Disorders: Clinical Management and Research Issues, Eric J. L. Griez, Wiley; 1 edition (March 18, 2005),
.
Recent work has shown that corticosteroids regulate the genomic expression and function of a number of monoamine receptors in the brain. For example, it has been shown that corticosteroids can decrease the expression of postsynaptic 5-HT1a receptors in the hippocampus; this finding has led to the suggestion that excessive cortisol secretion may precipitate depressive states through decreasing 5-HT neurotransmission. Experimental studies of animals have also linked excessive cortisol secretion in depression to damage to neurons in the hippocampus. Subsequently it has been suggested that chronic cortisol hypersecretion could be associated with the cognitive impairment which may be a particular feature of chronic depression.

How do we lose GHSR1a (Ghrelin receptor's) in the brain?

It appears that transient stimulation such as what one would get with GHRPs (GHRP-2, GHRP-6, Ipamorelin, Hexarelin) leads to a rapid desensitization and internalization of the receptors in the brain and this is a good thing. On the other hand administration of long acting Ghrelin-memetic (ibutamoren mesylate (MK-0677) likely leads to a habitual loss receptor status. This is a very bad thing.

Ghrelin mimetics (or agonists) do more that create growth hormone

I'm not sure most people understand that the Ghrelin mimetics do more than create GH. The Growth hormone secretagogue receptor 1a (GHSR1a) is the primary receptor for Ghrelin and the Growth Hormone Releasing Peptides as well as the non-peptide Growth Hormone Secretagogues. There are subtype receptors that both acyl-Ghrelin and the GHRPs bind to that the non-peptide GHS's do not. However the primary receptor is the GHSR1a and it is located on somatotrophs (GH-releasing cells) in the anterior pituitary. Ghrelin or a GHRP or non-peptide GHS bind to these receptors sometimes in concert with Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (GHRH) and cause growth hormone release.

However GHSR1a are located in all sorts of non-pituitary tissue. When Ghrelin or GHRP-2 or GHRP-6 or Ipamorelin or Hexarelin bind to these receptors in these tissues they generally have positive effects. In some instances they can increase local acting growth hormone in those tissues. Their receptor interaction is transient because peptides break down. They do not over-stimulate receptors on the heart, lung, spleen, muscle or brain.

GHS molecules that do not break down readily cause non-physiological states. They overstimulate and in regard to the brain they create chronic stresses that are potentially neurologically damaging or altering of physiology that can lead to states of unhealth.

Ghrelin in the brain is a stress hormone that acts independent of cortisol. Whether this activity is good or bad depends on how long the GHSR1a is activated

Brain GHSR1a activation is biphasic:

Acute Ghrelin or agonists (GHRP-2, Ipamorelin, GHRP-6, Hexarelin):
.
- anti-depressive
- anti-anxiety
- protective of stress
- potentially neurologically protective

Chronic (non-pulsed) Ghrelin agonists (ibutamoren mesylate (MK-0677) :
.
- depression producing
- anxiety producing
- fear conditionoing producing effects of chronic stress
- potentially neurologically damaging

It's important to understand what follows. A tip toe through the literature often reveals the good that Ghrelin produces. However those studies used acute methodologies.

The recent study A ghrelin–growth hormone axis drives stress-induced vulnerability to enhanced fear, RM Meyer, Molecular Psychiatry (2014), 1284 – 1294 distinguishes it's results by using a low dose but longer lasting Ghrelin mimetic (ibutamoren mesylate (MK-0677)) in creating a chronic situation. I will elaborate from the study...
.
GH is created not only in the pituitary but also in brain regions such as basolateral complex of the amygdala (BLA) . The growth hormone secretagogue receptor 1a (GHSR1a) is found in the BLA. This is the region that regulates emotional states such as fear.

Over-expression of recombinant GH in the BLA does not alter fear acquisition but it does enhance long-term fear memory that is created by chronic Ghrelin.

Chronic Ghrelin or long-lasting agonists such as ibutamoren mesylate (MK-0677) can create the fear/stress response, in the absence of an externally stressful event (in other words the chronic Ghrelin engenders the stressful state) and the presence of GH can amplify it.

Prolonged stress "load" and neuronal dysfunction are correlated. So one would expect chronic Ghrelin to lead to neuronal dysfunction.

Again it is important to remember that GHRPs do more than increase GH release from GH-releasing cells in the pituitary. They also do so peripherally. By peripherally I mean tissue that generally does not release factors systemically but rather uses what it makes locally within the neighboring tissue (paracrine). That tissue does not need to be all of the same type. For instance bone and muscle sometimes share locally released factors.

Not all GHRPs produce the same peripheral GH. They appear to differ somewhat in their ability to bring about GH locally via GHSR1a (growth hormone secretagogue receptor 1a).

In this RM Meyer study stimulation of the GHSR1a in BLA cells by ibutamoren mesylate (MK-0677) led to significantly elevated release of brain GH. Antagonizing the GHSR1a to prevent it's activation prevents the fear conditioning stress response.

However chronic stimulation of the GHSR1a led to the severe brain stress-enhancing effects.

How would Ghrelin or ibutamoren mesylate (MK-0677 readily crosses the blood–brain barrier and has a half-life of >6h) would be available in the amygdala (BLA):
.
"Ghrelin may also be synthesized by small populations of neurons in the hypothalamus, the cerebral cortex and the brainstem, where it may act as a paracrine hormone rather than being secreted into the blood stream. However, immunoreactive ghrelin-containing fibers have never been reported in amygdala. Thus, it seems that the most likely source of bioactive ghrelin affecting fear lies in the periphery, although a role for centrally derived ghrelin cannot be fully eliminated."

Thus higher amounts or long-lasting agonists would likley supply the activation of GHSR1a in the amygdala (BLA). Peptidyl Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone are short lived and would be expected to exert positive effects (as discussed in the follow on sections) and not likely be, if used physiologically, capable of the detrimental effects.

Whereas non-peptidyl longer lived agonists would be expected to exert negative effects and as the RM Meyer study demonstrates are capable of the detrimental effects.

Most of the Discussion from A ghrelin–growth hormone axis drives stress-induced vulnerability to enhanced fear, RM Meyer, Molecular Psychiatry (2014), 1284 – 1294


They found that the
.
...effects of stress are not simply downstream from glucocorticoids or adrenal catecholamines. We also show that increased ghrelin receptor activity is sufficient and necessary for stress-enhanced fear and is dissociable from HPA activity. Repeated activation of ghrelin receptors in nonstressed animals significantly enhances fear learning without elevating HPA stress hormones, whereas systemic blockade of the ghrelin receptor during chronic stress prevents stress-related enhancement of fear, even in the presence of elevated adrenal stress hormones We demonstrate that the amygdala, a brain region that displays enhanced function in chronically stressed animals and in patients with trauma-related disorders, is likely the locus of the fear enhancing effects of repeated ghrelin receptor stimulation. Finally, we show that GH, a downstream effector of ghrelin receptor activation, is increased in the BLA by chronic stress, is sufficient to enhance fear learning and plays a necessary role in the fear potentiating effects of ghrelin. Thus, ghrelin and growth hormone act together in the amygdala to enhance fear.

Our study is the first to explicitly examine the effects of protracted exposure to elevated ghrelin, as observed following chronic stress. We show that there are profound differences in the behavioral consequences of ghrelin exposure following different exposure durations, similar to the cumulative nature of stress. We also provide the first evidence to link prolonged exposure to elevated ghrelin with a specific, detrimental consequence of stress, enhanced fear memory, which typifies trauma-induced anxiety disorders such as PTSD. Because PTSD is a multifaceted disorder producing many symptoms, including those related to avoidance and hyperarousal, it will be interesting to determine whether chronically elevated ghrelin contributes to these sequelae of PTSD in addition to promoting changes in fear learning and memory.

Our study is also the first to show that GH is a critical downstream mediator of the effects of ghrelin in amygdala. Such a relationship between ghrelin and GH has not been described outside of the pituitary.51 We also provide the first evidence to link elevated amygdala GH with chronic stress and enhanced fear memory. Taken together, our data reveal that the amygdala may be especially sensitive to ghrelin-mediated effects of stress because chronic stress amplifies both ghrelin and GH.

In contrast to our findings that link ghrelin to a pathological condition, prior studies have argued that ghrelin promotes adaptive changes during stress, including antidepressant effects ( Lutter M, The orexigenic hormone ghrelin defends against depressive symptoms of chronic stress. Nat Neurosci 2008; 11: 752–753) and reduction in anxiety.(Spencer SJ, Ghrelin regulates the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis and restricts anxiety after acute stress. Biol Psychiatry 2012; 72: 457–465) However, these studies are problematic because they either focused exclusively on acute ghrelin manipulations, which we show can have profoundly different effects from repeated ghrelin manipulations or used short- and long-term ghrelin manipulations interchangeably. In addition, the alterations in ghrelin levels were achieved through artificial states: heightened ghrelin levels were attained by extreme food deprivation or a single bolus injection of the short-lived peptide. The antidepressant effect of ghrelin requires extremely high levels of ghrelin, as found in food-restricted rodents after 10–15% weight loss.13 We find that this level of food deprivation leads to increased exploratory motor activity (Supplementary Figure 10; F(1, 13)¼7.51, Po0.05). A recent study has also reported similar motor effects following acute ghrelin manipulations.57 These motor effects can be a significant confound for measures that require locomotor activity, such as social interaction or exploration. Thus, the ghrelin may alleviate the psychomotor effects of depression in a manner similar to amphetamine.58 It is also important to note that the antidepressant effect of ghrelin reported following a single injection of exogenous ghrelin was only a mild improvement of a stressmrelated impairment in social interaction;13 enhanced ghrelin signaling did not promote ‘normal’ function following stress. Indeed, our results reported here are consistent with limited human data showing that patients with treatment-resistant major depressive disorder have higher ghrelin levels than control patients.59

Here we demonstrate changes in endogenous ghrelin following stress and also use a low-dose, long-acting agonist to replicate the naturally occurring ghrelin state. We also provide clear evidence that acute and chronic ghrelin receptor manipulations have profoundly different effects. It is important to note that the changes in fear reported here occurred following small, but persistent, changes in ghrelin signaling, and all were in the absence of any locomotor effects. We suggest that the utility of ghrelin in the stress response may be similar to glucocorticoids: under ‘normal’ conditions, there is an optimal level of the hormone,60 and too little61,62 or too much hormonal signaling16 can lead to dysfunction in neuronal circuits. Repeated activation of ghrelin and glucocorticoid pathways together contributes to stress-induced ‘load’ on the body. In this regard, heightened ghrelin signaling may have both advantageous and undesirable consequences, but these must be carefully considered with respect to the length and level of elevated ghrelin exposure.

It is not clear why acute and repeated ghrelin receptor stimulation have opposite effects on fear learning. Although GHSR1a activation engages excitatory Gq-dependent molecular cascades, GHSR1 also exhibits an extremely high level of constitutive activity in the absence of bound ligand.77 Accordingly, transient stimulation of GHSR1a leads to rapid desensitization and internalization of the receptor that is slow to recover.78 Such a change is consistent with the decreased fear learning we observed 24 h after a single injection of ghrelin receptor agonist. It is also consistent with the observation that transient bath application of ghrelin to lateral amygdala slices leads to decreased excitatory neurotransmission.15 The electrophysiological changes elicited by chronic ghrelin receptor stimulation in amygdala are completely unexplored, but our work suggests that the change must be opposite to that seen after acute ghrelin receptor stimulation. We suggest that the internalization of the ghrelin receptor may habituate63 following either chronic administration of ghrelin receptor agonist or chronic stress exposure. The differences in receptor kinetics following acute versus chronic ghrelin receptor stimulation represent an especially promising area for future research.

Practical notation...

Although the study highlights conditioned fear (term used to describe a cluster of behavioral effects produced when an initially neutral stimulus is paired with an aversive stimulus. A stressfull condition becomes married to the ordinary which in turn evokes a chonic stress response). - The Role of the Amygdala in Fear and Anxiety Annual Review of Neuroscience Vol. 15: 353-375 (Volume publication date March 1992)) it has much wider implications. Those wider implications may not be felt but may increase vulnerability to future disease states.

Pulsed GHRPs or spaced GHRPs give their receptors in the brain time off. Activation of those receptors does not become chronic. This is a good thing especially in the presence of growth hormone. GHRPs or any Ghrelin mimietc such as long-lasting analog have functions independent of growth hormone release. If made available physiologically they can reduce Vascular Stress (reducing insulin resistance) - Ghrelin has novel vascular actions that mimic PI 3-kinase-dependent actions of insulin to stimulate production of NO from endothelial cells, M. Iantorno, American Journal of Physiology, vol. 292, no. 3, pp. E756–E764, 2007; act in muscle repair similiar to muscle IGFs - Ghrelin and Des-Acyl Ghrelin Promote Differentiation and Fusion of C2C12 Skeletal Muscle Cells, Nicoletta Filigheddu, MBoC Vol. 18, Issue 3, 986-994, March 2007; acts as an anti-inflammatory - GH-releasing peptide-2 administration prevents liver inflammatory response in endotoxemia, Miriam Granado, AJP - Endo January 2008 vol. 294 no. 1 E131-E141, exhibit some anti-cancer effects - The antiproliferative effect of synthetic peptidyl GH secretagogues in human CALU-1 lung carcinoma cells, Ghe C, Cassoni P, Catapano F, Marrocco T, Deghenghi R, Ghigo E, Muccioli G, Papotti M, Endocrinology 2002, 143, 484–491

However when allowed to activate their receptors beyond their pulsed nature (aside from situations such as drastic calorie deprivation) Ghrelin-mimetics can bring ill effects that may only manifest themselves many years later as a result of increase stress responses that create degeneration.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Ah crap..... I scare easily

 

[dreamcrusher]

Haven't run MK-677 but have 2 bottles of Elite MK-677 to run after I get done with my Ostarine cycle and pct.

Do you guys think running a test base like Dermacrine or Sustain Alpha would help with the lethargy while on the MK-677?

 

[Danes]

Haven't run MK-677 but have 2 bottles of Elite MK-677 to run after I get done with my Ostarine cycle and pct.

Do you guys think running a test base like Dermacrine or Sustain Alpha would help with the lethargy while on the MK-677?

Lethargy on Mk677 has nothing to do with T levels actually. Lethargy is a "common" side when you increase GH/IGF1 levels.

 

[BamBam0319]

Haven't run MK-677 but have 2 bottles of Elite MK-677 to run after I get done with my Ostarine cycle and pct.

Do you guys think running a test base like Dermacrine or Sustain Alpha would help with the lethargy while on the MK-677?

Why wait till after PCT? Why not start it like right now?
A "test base" will have no effect on the lethargy that MK-677 can initially cause. Not sure if you've read anything about it yet, but MK-677 has nothing to do with testosterone or anything like that, it only stimulates a higher production of your own natural GH levels.

 

[dreamcrusher]

I wanted to wait till after pct because I wanted to see the effects of each cycle individually. Also, this is my first cycle of Osta so I didn't want to do too much my first go-round.

I have read up on MK-677 and just thought since a test base helps lethargy on other cycles that it might help with this but guess not.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Anyone smarter than me have any opinion on Canes325's re-post of Datbetrue's information?

 

[Deleted member 238667]

Anyone smarter than me have any opinion on Canes325's re-post of Datbetrue's information?

There are an awful lot of words there...

 

[The_Old_Guy]

I wanted to wait till after pct because I wanted to see the effects of each cycle individually. Also, this is my first cycle of Osta so I didn't want to do too much my first go-round.

I have read up on MK-677 and just thought since a test base helps lethargy on other cycles that it might help with this but guess not.

You may not have any MK-677 sides at all... I didn't/haven't/don't. And correct, Bases only replenish Testosterone/DHT levels, nothing to do with MK.

 

[Danes]

I wanted to wait till after pct because I wanted to see the effects of each cycle individually. Also, this is my first cycle of Osta so I didn't want to do too much my first go-round.

I have read up on MK-677 and just thought since a test base helps lethargy on other cycles that it might help with this but guess not.

Testbase = for low testosterone levels during the cycle. Lets say you inject Tren. It is not testosterone but your head/body "believe it is"(or a replacement for your Testosterone) and it lower the production. Then you get sides such as lethargy,libido issues ++. Adding a testbase will increase T levels and that will reduce those sides.
It has NOTHING to do with growth hormon etc

 

[Deleted member 238667]

I'm seeing increased sleep and hunger with mine but I'm also running LGD-4033. Both are in capsule form and I'm thinking my MK-677 might be fake. Lesson learned.

 

[Danes]

You may not have any MK-677 sides at all... I didn't/haven't/don't. And correct, Bases only replenish Testosterone/DHT levels, nothing to do with MK.

Honestly, he sounds like a geek. Does he have any proof for his statements? Just a wall of text for me

 

[Danes]

Anyone smarter than me have any opinion on Canes325's re-post of Datbetrue's information?

Canes325 can ask that guy to join this thread

 

[Canes325]

Canes325 can ask that guy to join this thread

This part is what is concerning-

Ghrelin in the brain is a stress hormone that acts independent of cortisol. Whether this activity is good or bad depends on how long the GHSR1a is activated

Brain GHSR1a activation is biphasic:

Acute Ghrelin or agonists (GHRP-2, Ipamorelin, GHRP-6, Hexarelin):
.
- anti-depressive
- anti-anxiety
- protective of stress
- potentially neurologically protective

Chronic (non-pulsed) Ghrelin agonists (ibutamoren mesylate (MK-0677) :
.
- depression producing
- anxiety producing
- fear conditionoing producing effects of chronic stress
- potentially neurologically damaging

I'm not smart enough to try and dig through all those sources, but if you are a member of his forum you learn to trust his credibility and vast amounts of knowledge he has backed up by studies

 

[Canes325]

Honestly, he sounds like a geek. Does he have any proof for his statements? Just a wall of text for me

In that wall of text are the studies he cites.

 

[Danes]

In that wall of text are the studies he cites.

And all studies are human studies?