Epistane, 6 week cycle

[Marc-Antony]

In.

Keep me updated on the hair loss, if any ...

 

[2skinny]

Day 16
Epistane 40mg

Day off. Feeling good.

 

[2skinny]

Consider adding formestane for the libido drop. Some love the combination, others ache somethin fierce. If it becomes too dry you might want to consider a trib as a temporary quick fix.

I added some eform to my epi cycle a few wks ago and my lower back gave me constant problems. I've never experienced back pumps, but I'm thinkin that's what was goin on. Celc is correct though, there are tons of ppl that have had a lot of success w/ the form.

Thanks for the info guys. I can deal with the libido drop for now...it's keeping me out of trouble. This is good to know for future reference though.

 

[Marc-Antony]

Thanks for the info guys. I can deal with the libido drop for now...it's keeping me out of trouble. This is good to know for future reference though.

Are we talking on cycle here? Lipido drop after 18 days? dang.

 

[celc5]

I added some eform to my epi cycle a few wks ago and my lower back gave me constant problems. I've never experienced back pumps, but I'm thinkin that's what was goin on. Celc is correct though, there are tons of ppl that have had a lot of success w/ the form.

Just to clarify, AI's have the potential to irritate joints. I believe the theory is that when estrogen gets too low, it "dries out" the joints so to speak. I've never seen any theory that an AI could play a role in lower back pumps. Trust me, when you get em, you KNOW EXACTLY what's going on cause it sucks! In other words, I'd guess your back symptoms were pumps from the epi OR vertebral joint issues from the formestane... you'd have to be an old fart with pre-existing arthritis to have the vertebral joint issues be a problem IMO.

In my experience, 6oxo WRECKS my joints when I get up around 5 or 600mg/day. 6bromo and formestane have no effect on my joints although haven't exactly double dosed them like I did with 6oxo. All 3 were great products.

If libido is not a concern, no need to add anything. As we've discussed before, if it's no broke, don't fix it because your results seem to be above average for epi already :head:

 

[2skinny]

Keep me updated on the hair loss, if any ...

I haven't noticed any hair loss so far...hopefully it stays like this.

Are we talking on cycle here? Lipido drop after 18 days? dang.

Well, I'm on my 17th day now and my libido has dropped a little. Nothing major though and looking at the gains I've made so far, it's well worth it to me.

 

[UNCfan1]

Thats awesome so far!! Your nips do look smaller and less shinny:lol: Really awesome job!

 

[2skinny]

Day 17
Epistane 40mg
Weight: 194

Today my mood seemed a little better than is has for the past week. I wasn't as irritable and my libido was almost back to normal today. I not sure if my body is "adjusting" to the Epi or if today was just unusually good. I'll have to see how I feel the next few days.

I felt great in the gym today. Strength and energy were excellent. My appetite has been good.

Gyno is still there but has improved a great deal. I am very happy with this so far.

Chest & Bis
Flat BB - 185/4, 185/2, 225/4, 245/3, 225/6
Incline DB - 80/8, 90/5, 80/6
DB fly w/slight incline - 45/8, 45/8, 35/10
BB curl - 85/8, 85/6, 85/6
DB curl standing - 40/8, 40/7, 30/8
abs

 

[2skinny]

Day 18
Epistane 40mg
Weight: 194

Today I was a little busier than usual so I was not able to eat as much as I wanted to. As a result my energy was down a little in the gym today. Strength was good but endurance was lacking.
I planned on working legs and shoulders today but my workout got cut short. This was probably a good thing though because tomorrow I'll be fresh and ready for a good shoulder workout.

Legs:
Squats 185/6, 225/6, 275/8, 275/6, 225/10
Stiff legged deadlift 185/10, 185/10, 185/10
Leg press 580/8, 580/6, 490/10

 

[2skinny]

Day 19
Epistane 40mg
Weight: 194

I haven't been stuffing my face like I should the past few days. I've been feeling pretty good though. My strength is slowly increasing and my clothes are getting tighter.
I haven't been doing any cardio lately but I think I'm going to start soon. Nothing major, just something light. But I will definately be trying to eat more to make sure I'm not losing pounds.

Shoulders:
DB press 60/8, 70/6, 75/3, 60/8
Cable lateral 2/8, 2/8, 2/8
DB rear delts 15/10, 15/10, 15/10
Upright row 115/5, 115/5, 115/5, 115/5
Hang clean 135/6, 155/6, 175/2, 175/2, 175/2
BB shrug 225/6, 295/4, 225/6, 225/8
Calfs
Abs

I'm thinking about increasing my dose to 50mg/day pretty soon. This should be interesting.

 

[celc5]

Are you counting your macros to be sure you're making lean gains?

Check with some others at your size who have ran epi at 50mg to strategize with length of cycle. If you run 6 weeks like you originally planned at that dosage, post cycle might be more difficult than anticipated.

 

[2skinny]

Are you counting your macros to be sure you're making lean gains?

Check with some others at your size who have ran epi at 50mg to strategize with length of cycle. If you run 6 weeks like you originally planned at that dosage, post cycle might be more difficult than anticipated.

I'm not counting my macros. I'm currently on a military base and I'm eating from the dining facility. I eat what's being served. :food: I do my best to guesstimate my way to a balanced diet.

Before I decide to go to 50mg I will do more research. I might even have to shorten my cycle to 5 weeks because of some upcoming work related stuff that could interfere with my PCT.

 

[2skinny]

Day 20
Epistane 40mg
Weight: 194.5

Today was a good day. I was dragging a little at the beginning of my workout but once I got going, I was fine. I'm feeling stronger every workout. My weight is not changing much recently. I have lost some definition but I don't feel like it will be hard to get back.

Gyno is almost gone. Awesome!

Back & Tris
Pull ups 8, 8, 8, 4, 4
Deadlift 135/10, 225/6, 315/6, 365/2, 365/4
Reverse BB row 155/10, 155/10, 155/8
DB row 100/6, 100/6, 85/10
Overhead DB press 90/8, 90/8, 90/6
V bar cable pushdown 9/10, 9/10, 9/8
DB kickbacks 15/10, 15/10

 

[celc5]

Thank you for your service bro.

Congrats on the gyno. Be sure to plan future supplementation and cycles so as not to instigate a repeat occurence. Once you experience gyno, you become VERY susceptable to aggravation.

 

[2skinny]

Day 21
Epistane 40mg
Weight: 194

Day off

 

[vicmack777]

Day 21
Epistane 40mg
Weight: 194

Day off

Has this hurt your appetite at all? I feel its hurt my appetite.

 

[king1033]

i have heard grea things with epistan and appetite i hear it makes you starved

 

[vicmack777]

i have heard grea things with epistan and appetite i hear it makes you starved

Its doing the exact opposite to me.

 

[3clipseGT]

i have heard grea things with epistan and appetite i hear it makes you starved

Epistane in the range of 60mgs-80mgs makes me so hungry.. Ill eat a good sized meal and i feel as if i havnt touched it once done.

 

[king1033]

Epistane in the range of 60mgs-80mgs makes me so hungry.. Ill eat a good sized meal and i feel as if i havnt touched it once done.

hey do you see any sides at those doses??

 

[larue38462]

60-80mg?? Damn bro that's huge. I got up to 50 and felt like I couldn't eat enough to fill myself for an hour.

 

[2skinny]

Has this hurt your appetite at all? I feel its hurt my appetite.

My appetite actually went down within the first few days of my cycle and I'm not sure why. It did go back up within the first week and it has been about normal since. I was hoping Epi would increase my appetite but it hasn't so far. No complaints though.

 

[2skinny]

Day 22
Epistane 40mg
Weight: 194

I've hit a plateau with my weight gains but I am still making strength gains. This could mean that I'm leaning out (gaining muscle while shedding some fat). I'll take pics on day 28 and compare them with day 14 to see if this is so.

Today I was looking at my hairline and it's looks like I may have lost a little hair on this cycle. I am prone to MPB but I shave my head so I'm not too concerned with this. I will begin to monitor this more closely.

Gyno does not seem to be changing much lately. It has gone down a lot so far but it is not totally gone yet.

Chest
Incline DB 60/6, 80/7, 90/7, 100/3
Flat BB 185/6, 225/5, 225/5
Cable fly 35/10, 42.5/8, 35/10
Decline BB 135/10, 185/OUCH!
Sharp pain in my right shoulder on decline BB. Kind of scary but I don't think it was too bad. I stopped my workout then and there. I've never had a shoulder injury and I really don't want one. To prevent any problems I will focus more on proper warm up, manageable weight, good form and stretching.

 

[2skinny]

Well it looks like this is going to be a 5 week cycle now rather than 6. I'm going to shorten it because I want to make sure I'm finished with my PCT within the second week of Jan. This being said, I think it will be safe to up my dose to 50mg per day. I will try it for this 4th week (starting tomorrow) and for the 5th week I can either stay at 50mg or go back to 40mg.
I'm hoping that increasing the dose will finish off my gyno and also increase my appetite somewhat. And also, I have ADD and I'm getting bored :yawn: with 40mg. Ha ha!

 

[3clipseGT]

hey do you see any sides at those doses??

Only side i saw at that dosage was minor back pumps here an there ( nothing close to superdrol or M1T tho so i was ok with it) and i looked lean as hell but was a tad bloated. BUT with what i gained and how strong i got ill take the minor back pumps and the little bloat for that. I think i was also that bloated because of how much i was eating. The nutrient repartitioning at that dosage though is insane. Reminds me a lot of tren.

 

[king1033]

Only side i saw at that dosage was minor back pumps here an there ( nothing close to superdrol or M1T tho so i was ok with it) and i looked lean as hell but was a tad bloated. BUT with what i gained and how strong i got ill take the minor back pumps and the little bloat for that. I think i was also that bloated because of how much i was eating. The nutrient repartitioning at that dosage though is insane. Reminds me a lot of tren.

i think if i ever run epi ill run it 40 for the first week and see if i can handle anything more after that

 

[2skinny]

Day 23
Epistane 50mg
Weight: 195.5

Today is my first day at 50mg. I was really tired and I did not want to do my legs, but I'm glad I did. I felt really strong once I warmed up and squatted more than I ever have before.

Legs
Squats 225/6, 275/10, 295/6, 225/10
Leg press 360/10, 540/10, 540/10
Stiff legged deadlift 175/10, 195/10, 195/10
Calfs

 

[king1033]

Day 23
Epistane 50mg
Weight: 195.5

Today is my first day at 50mg. I was really tired and I did not want to do my legs, but I'm glad I did. I felt really strong once I warmed up and squatted more than I ever have before.

Legs
Squats 225/6, 275/10, 295/6, 225/10
Leg press 360/10, 540/10, 540/10
Stiff legged deadlift 175/10, 195/10, 195/10
Calfs

i think you should go heavier, i weigh 20lbs less and can do those numbers im just as tall you should be able to push alittle harder IMO, you should be pushing those muscles to the limit your on a steroid, but keep it up!

 

[celc5]

i think you should go heavier, i weigh 20lbs less and can do those numbers im just as tall you should be able to push alittle harder IMO, you should be pushing those muscles to the limit your on a steroid, but keep it up!

Everyone is different regarding strengths and weaknesses. I squat, deadlift, and shrug close to 450 but my bench rarely goes over 225.

There are certainly other ways to increase intensity on cycle without lifting heavier weights such as increased frequency, decreased rest periods, intensity techniques (supersets, drops, etc), and increased volume. I do not encourage substantially heavier weights on cycle as this is a recipe for injury.

Specifically regarding 2skinny, his numbers are really nice for BB row, upright rows, and flat BB bench (assuming strict form of course). In response to King1033, 2skinny increased his heaviest set of squats by 20 pounds since his last leg session. I think that's a pretty substantial increase, don't you?

 

[hman85]

Sorry i am late SUBBED!!!!!

 

[king1033]

Everyone is different regarding strengths and weaknesses. I squat, deadlift, and shrug close to 450 but my bench rarely goes over 225.

There are certainly other ways to increase intensity on cycle without lifting heavier weights such as increased frequency, decreased rest periods, intensity techniques (supersets, drops, etc), and increased volume. I do not encourage substantially heavier weights on cycle as this is a recipe for injury.

Specifically regarding 2skinny, his numbers are really nice for BB row, upright rows, and flat BB bench (assuming strict form of course). In response to King1033, 2skinny increased his heaviest set of squats by 20 pounds since his last leg session. I think that's a pretty substantial increase, don't you?

i agree with you but i just think he isnt lifting as heavy as he REALLY could im taking x-factor rpm and drive and my heaviest squat last week was 315x7 and this week it was 345x6 30lb increase! all im saying is that a person his size i know can handle more than he is doing i think he is relying on the epi mentally a little more than his workouts and diet, No offense what so ever 2skinny but he upped his dosge to 50mg and in the last post he said "he didnt wanna work his legs but hes glad he did he felt really strong etc" but i think you can **** **** up (meant that in a good way) a little better... no??

cause this is his chance to make the improvements he really wants and i wouldnt wanna see him come out of his cycle with the most max gains possible that he could be making and IMO hes not, 2skinny i think you should go heavy or focus on your form more those numbers should go up up and away!!!!:dance:
your on day 23 utilize all that power and put it to work!!! ALL OF IT!

 

[hman85]

Day 20
Epistane 40mg
Weight: 194.5

Today was a good day. I was dragging a little at the beginning of my workout but once I got going, I was fine. I'm feeling stronger every workout. My weight is not changing much recently. I have lost some definition but I don't feel like it will be hard to get back.

Gyno is almost gone. Awesome!

Back & Tris
Pull ups 8, 8, 8, 4, 4
Deadlift 135/10, 225/6, 315/6, 365/2, 365/4
Reverse BB row 155/10, 155/10, 155/8
DB row 100/6, 100/6, 85/10
Overhead DB press 90/8, 90/8, 90/6
V bar cable pushdown 9/10, 9/10, 9/8
DB kickbacks 15/10, 15/10

When you say reverse bb row do just mean your hand placement?

 

[2skinny]

i think you should go heavier, i weigh 20lbs less and can do those numbers im just as tall you should be able to push alittle harder IMO, you should be pushing those muscles to the limit your on a steroid, but keep it up!

King, thanks for the encouragement, I appreciate your opinion. I know I can probably squat more but lately I've been somewhat cautious. I've hurt my back a few times in the past from over doing it with squats and deadlifts. I'm also focusing on good (ass to the grass) form squats. It bothers me to see guys in the gym stacking tons of weight and then only going halfway down. I am very happy with my progress so far and I do plan on pushing even harder next leg workout. Again, thanks puushing me, it seems like you'd make a good workout partner. :head:

 

[2skinny]

There are certainly other ways to increase intensity on cycle without lifting heavier weights such as increased frequency, decreased rest periods, intensity techniques (supersets, drops, etc), and increased volume. I do not encourage substantially heavier weights on cycle as this is a recipe for injury.

Well said!:thumbsup:

 

[2skinny]

When you say reverse bb row do just mean your hand placement?

Sorry for the confusion. I am talking about hand placement. When I say "reverse" I'm talking about palms facing my head. Hopefully that clears things up. And I think the correct name for this exercise is "reverse grip bent over BB row." :think:

 

[hman85]

Sorry for the confusion. I am talking about hand placement. When I say "reverse" I'm talking about palms facing my head. Hopefully that clears things up. And I think the correct name for this exercise is "reverse grip bent over BB row." :think:

thats what i thought but wasn't sure!

 

[2skinny]

Day 24
Epistane 50mg
Weight: 195.5

My day was good but I'm a bit frustrated with my workout. I usually work out alone because I am able to stay focused and use my time efficiently. Well today I ended up working out with a couple buddies and I ended up spending more "down time" in the gym than I wanted to. My workout could have been a little better but not a huge deal. Tomorrow is a new day!

Shoulders
Seated mil press 95/10, 135/6, 155/6, 155/4, 135/7
standing DB lateral 25/10, 25/10, 25/10
Upright row 115/6, 115/6, 115/6
Hang clean 135/8, 175/4, 175/4, 175/4
DB shrugs 90/10, 90/8, 90/7

 

[2k2ser]

Just looking at your bench reps....(haven't read every single post). It looks like you're doing PL. You might benefit more by doing more reps in your sets. Some were 2 sets of 3, back to back. Not sure if power is your goal. Start off with 185/190 and get some nice reps. Then next workout, go up 5 pounds or so. I would be dead after doing reps that low every workout.

 

[king1033]

King, thanks for the encouragement, I appreciate your opinion. I know I can probably squat more but lately I've been somewhat cautious. I've hurt my back a few times in the past from over doing it with squats and deadlifts. I'm also focusing on good (ass to the grass) form squats. It bothers me to see guys in the gym stacking tons of weight and then only going halfway down. I am very happy with my progress so far and I do plan on pushing even harder next leg workout. Again, thanks puushing me, it seems like you'd make a good workout partner. :head:

i just wanna see all my AM buddies on here get as much possible outta their workout regimens and yes i do make a hell of a work out partner, my partner now even tho hes bigger than me he knows i know my **** on form etc etc because i was once bigger than him and i studied personal trainer books, hes up 45 lbs on his bench 50lbs on his squat and up 5 lbs and down 10 lbs fat,
not only do i get on his ass about his lifts but i assist him on his diets etc etc. i just know you coulda gained a little bit more before jumping in the epi cycle you shoulda maxed out your genetic limit first, and it is good you are concentrating on your form that is key, and always make sure to stretch your muscles to the fullest before working out that way you can utilize every ounce of power you have and make sure your also timing your supps, yo man if you got any questions dont hesitate to pm me im more than happy to help out.
-King

 

[celc5]

ialways make sure to stretch your muscles to the fullest before working out that way you can utilize every ounce of power you have

Stretching should take place after a workout when muscles are warm, not before when muscles are cold.

I've never seen any research that suggests that power is affected by stretching. King1033, if you have a link to a study/abstract that suggests a connection, I'd be all ears.

 

[king1033]

Stretching should take place after a workout when muscles are warm, not before when muscles are cold.

I've never seen any research that suggests that power is affected by stretching. King1033, if you have a link to a study/abstract that suggests a connection, I'd be all ears.

http://www.mensfitness.com/fitness/strength_training/167

ok well this is the basics on loaded stretches and sorry let me clarify when i say before obiously you warm up on a bike or somthing to get that blood pumping before the lifting so technically when you stretch your muscles wont be cold

 

[2skinny]

Just looking at your bench reps....(haven't read every single post). It looks like you're doing PL. You might benefit more by doing more reps in your sets. Some were 2 sets of 3, back to back. Not sure if power is your goal. Start off with 185/190 and get some nice reps. Then next workout, go up 5 pounds or so. I would be dead after doing reps that low every workout.

Good point.

 

[2skinny]

Day 25
Epistane 50mg
Weight: 196

I had to drag my ass into the gym today. The workout was hard but good. Strength was good but energy seemed a little down. I haven't noticed any changes in my appetite since increasing my dose.
Gyno is doing really well. Almost all sensitivity is gone but the stubborn little lumps are still not completely gone.

Back
Wide pull ups 10, 6, 8, 6
Bent over BB row 125/10, 175/6, 155/10, 155/8
DB row 85/10, 90/10, 90/10
Neutral grip cable pull down 160/10, 160/8, 160/8
Low back hyperextensions 15, 12, 12
abs

 

[2skinny]

Day 26
Epistane 50mg
Weight: 195.5

Not too much to report today. Good day, good workout. Calories were down a little.

Gyno, no change.

Bis & Tris
Skull crusher 85/10, 85/10, 105/6, 95/6
EZ bar curl 85/10, 85/9, 85/7
Dip machine 270/10, 270/9, 250/10
Seated incline DB curl 35/10, 40/7, 35/8
Rope pushdown 100/10, 120/8, 110/8
DB concentration curls 30/10, 35/8, 35/8

 

[2skinny]

Day 27
Epistane 50mg
Weight: I didn't get my weight today so I just posted yesterday's weight on the pics.

Day off today. I'm suppose to work chest tomorrow but my right shoulder has been bothering me from my last chest workout. I think I further agitated it yesterday while using the dip machine. Maybe I'll work legs tomorrow.
I'm going to be traveling in a couple days so this is going to throw off my workouts and eating. Hopefully I don't get way off track here. But maybe this traveling will give my shoulder a couple days to recover.
I was originally going to post pics tomorrow (day 28) but I'm going to be busy so I'm doing it today.

From looking at the pics I see a little more definition in today's pic as compared to day 14. Otherwise there's not much change. I have continued to make strength gains so I know the weight I have today is leaner than what I had on day 14.

 

[Nabisco]

Just caught up with your log boss, can't believe I missed it. Definitely a fine job, arms look a lot thicker, as does your back and chest. And it seems from the pictures that you maintained the same lean look. I'd say kick ass progress, keep it up and good luck in post cycle.

 

[2skinny]

Just caught up with your log boss, can't believe I missed it. Definitely a fine job, arms look a lot thicker, as does your back and chest. And it seems from the pictures that you maintained the same lean look. I'd say kick ass progress, keep it up and good luck in post cycle.

Thanks yo! :head:

 

[2skinny]

Well, I've been traveling so my workout routine/eating/logging has been a little off. Now that I am temporarily settled I will try and get back up and running.

Day 28
Epistane 50mg
Weight: 196
I was really happy with my squats. 315 is a new PR for me and I was able to get 6 clean reps and then 5. :head: My pants are getting tight. Ha ha!

Legs
Squats 135/15, 185/6, 225/10, 315/6, 315/5, 275/10
Walking DB lunge 50/10, 50/10, 50/10
Seated leg curl 130/10, 145/10, 145/10
Single leg extension 100/10, 115/8, 100/10
calfs, abs

Day 29
Epistane 50mg
Spent all day traveling. My calorie intake was definately down.

Day 30
Epistane 50mg
Weight: ?

I am staying at a hotel right now with an ok weight room in the dungeon. It will do for now. No scale to check my weight and eating is mostly fast food. I will adjust accordingly and continue to make gains.
Today I did chest. I was a little nervous about my right shoulder because it has been bothering me since my last chest workout. It has improved a good amount so I decided to test it out. I took extra time to warm it up today and was very careful with my lifts. I did feel a dull ache throughout my workout but it wasn't bad enough to worry me. I think it was more of a tightness than anything else. I also made sure to stretch it thoroughly after my workout.
My strength and endurance were way down today. I think it was a combination of my traveling/lower calories (this always takes a toll on me) and me being cautious about my shoulder. I did feel a really good pump and I "felt" big but the weight I was lifting was....humbling. It was still a good workout.

Gyno is almost gone but does not seem to be making any more progress.
Appetite was great today. I think my body is trying to make up for yesterday.

Chest
Flat BB 135/10, 185/10, 225/5, 205/8, 185/9
Incline DB 75/7, 65/8, 65/9
DB fly w/slight incline 35/12, 35/10, 35/10
DB pullover 65/10 (only one set, just wasn't feeling it)
Pushups, slow perfect form 20, 15

 

[celc5]

I am staying at a hotel right now with an ok weight room in the dungeon. It will do for now. No scale to check my weight and eating is mostly fast food.

Maybe pick up a cheap Wal Mart protein and drink shakes every few hours. Instead of fast food, I prefer buffets, especially post workout. Both will save you tons of cash so you can take in as much protein as possible.

Props for keeping the workouts going in the hotels :head:

 

[2skinny]

Day 31
Epistane 50mg
Weight: ?? (Sorry, no access to a scale right now.)

I can't believe I'm on day 31 already. I'm pretty happy with my results to date. Four more days and I will begin my post cycle therapy. I'm actually looking forward to this as I have never done PCT for any of my previous cycles.

I felt pretty good in the gym today. My workout was a lot later than I'm used to but I don't think this really affected me.

Back
Deadlift 135/10, 135/5, 225/8, 315/6, 365/2, 405/1
Wide pull-ups 12, 10, 8, 6
Reverse grip BB row 155/8, 145/10, 145/8
DB row 90/10, 90/8, 90/8