Upping my dose.

Rjg1225

New member
Hey Guys,

29 years old and started taking TRT because levels were low 300's and started experiencing negative side effects. This was about 5 months ago, and I've seen some benefits but would like more, including taking advantage of my age. Most benefits I've seen have been leaning down, but not putting on a lot of size yet. Goal is go from 200lb to 215-220 at 10% body fat or within that range. I'd rather start to up the dose now, vs later on but want to do this incrementally. My doctor suggested upping to 300ng weekly vs the 200ng I'm currently on and after about 4-6 months going to 500ng plus anavar or something along those lines. I wanted to ensure I get everything out of this dose before just immediately upping my dose though, is this too early to up the dose and should I wait longer. Or is 5 months on this good enough for me to say I've gotten the max benefits of this and to go ahead and begin to up the dose?
 
When you say ng, you mean mg.

Upping 100 mg per week won't make a significant difference but doubling your dose might.

With that said, your goal is to add 15-20lbs of muscle? That's a 2-4 year process depending on how dedicated you are with your food and training.
 
Rjg1225 said:
Hey Guys,

29 years old and started taking TRT because levels were low 300's and started experiencing negative side effects. This was about 5 months ago, and I've seen some benefits but would like more, including taking advantage of my age. Most benefits I've seen have been leaning down, but not putting on a lot of size yet. Goal is go from 200lb to 215-220 at 10% body fat or within that range. I'd rather start to up the dose now, vs later on but want to do this incrementally. My doctor suggested upping to 300ng weekly vs the 200ng I'm currently on and after about 4-6 months going to 500ng plus anavar or something along those lines. I wanted to ensure I get everything out of this dose before just immediately upping my dose though, is this too early to up the dose and should I wait longer. Or is 5 months on this good enough for me to say I've gotten the max benefits of this and to go ahead and begin to up the dose?
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In five months you don’t have your TRT protocol dialed in yet. It easily takes a year to do that. Get dialed in and work on your diet and workout program. Once all that is in place, then start a blast. TRT isn’t magic but it is a huge help in getting your health on track. Don’t expect overnight results. Like Smont said, what you’ve mentioned can take years to obtain.
 
sammpedd88 said:
In five months you don’t have your TRT protocol dialed in yet. It easily takes a year to do that. Get dialed in and work on your diet and workout program. Once all that is in place, then start a blast. TRT isn’t magic but it is a huge help in getting your health on track. Don’t expect overnight results. Like Smont said, what you’ve mentioned can take years to obtain.
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I didn't notice the 5 months part. Definitely too early to screw with the dose. The fact that his Dr. Offered to up the dose shows he's probably using a shady trt clinic. A good trt Dr. would be solely focused on getting him dialed in "for lack of a better word".
 
I've got a diet coach, and he's telling me to defer to my doctor at this point for upping the dose based off my levels. It's taken my levels from low 300's to around 1200 currently. Both have said all my bloodwork looks good, and it's up to me at this point. So, at this point you both believe to stay on this dose as I begin to raise calories and beginning of next year potentially raise the amount? I'd like to slowly raise this, as I have nothing but time. Even if the gains were slight, I'd still only up to 300 initially. Stay on that for 3-5 months, then go up to 500 while stacking anavar most likely. Does this sound reasonable?
 
Smont said:
I didn't notice the 5 months part. Definitely too early to screw with the dose. The fact that his Dr. Offered to up the dose shows he's probably using a shady trt clinic. A good trt Dr. would be solely focused on getting him dialed in "for lack of a better word".
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Yeah any dr that’s going to up a “TRT dose” to 500 mgs and prescribe Anavar is definitely from a shady clinic.
 
Adding that kind of muscle is all about diet and training not drugs. You want to add 15 not 50 that's all nutrition bro hate to break that to you
 
@Smont @Hyde @match Hey bros how come every time someone asks about adding muscle the first thing they ask or talk about is the drugs and not diet or training? Sorry op not picking on you specifically but this happens everytime not some of the time or most of the time EVERY time
 
No, I completely understand why you would say that and that's why I wanted to ask the question in the first place. Diet has been dialed in, and that's what's gotten me down to 200lb and around 10%. Thats why I was asking if 5 months in was too soon to think about raising it as I'm adding calories back in. It seems y'all suggest instead just up calories and continue to work with this dose. My doctor is very reputable within the Texas area, but I do know he doesn't argue with me upping the dose, and that's why I consult my coach as well and have been getting blood work done regularly. Bloodwork was taken last week on the 28th, total is at 1476, Free is at 391.8, and SHBG is 33.6 currently. All other markers are within a good range, and that's also why I was thinking about just upping it slightly vs full on going to 500mg right now. Time is not an issue for me, I'd rather this be over a multiple year process. That's why when I do go up, I'll only up to 300mg for 4-6 months and then eventually go to a more normal cycle dosage.
 
Rjg1225 said:
No, I completely understand why you would say that and that's why I wanted to ask the question in the first place. Diet has been dialed in, and that's what's gotten me down to 200lb and around 10%. Thats why I was asking if 5 months in was too soon to think about raising it as I'm adding calories back in. It seems y'all suggest instead just up calories and continue to work with this dose. My doctor is very reputable within the Texas area, but I do know he doesn't argue with me upping the dose, and that's why I consult my coach as well and have been getting blood work done regularly. Bloodwork was taken last week on the 28th, total is at 1476, Free is at 391.8, and SHBG is 33.6 currently. All other markers are within a good range, and that's also why I was thinking about just upping it slightly vs full on going to 500mg right now. Time is not an issue for me, I'd rather this be over a multiple year process. That's why when I do go up, I'll only up to 300mg for 4-6 months and then eventually go to a more normal cycle dosage.
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What are the reference ranges for those levels? If they’re the usually lab corps levels, and your labs were taken in your trough, then you don’t need to up your dose. Even considering 500 mgs is cray. That’s not a TRT dose. That’s a cycle. And if you’re dr is recommending using your dose then he’s not a reputable TRT Dr. He’s awesome if you’re wanting to blast and cruise, but not for TRT.
 
These were taken at Baylor college of medicine when I went in for most recent appointment on the 28th prior to the follow up with my current Dr. They will generally send me to a CPL but did it there for these most recent results. I know this isn't a TRT dose, and 500mg is blasting. This is what some of initial questions were about, I'm on 200mg currently which some consider to not be TRT as is. I plan on upping to that point and "blasting" at some point over the next year or couple years but slowly getting to that point. That is why I'm asking if it's too soon to up my current dose to 250mg or 300mg or stick with my dose and see the results I get through the year and wait till the beginning of next year to up to 300mg. The plan is as you just stated to blast and then cruise, but I'd like to slowly ease up and get everything I can out of lower dosages before jumping straight to 500mgs...
 
Rjg1225 said:
These were taken at Baylor college of medicine when I went in for most recent appointment on the 28th prior to the follow up with my current Dr. They will generally send me to a CPL but did it there for these most recent results. I know this isn't a TRT dose, and 500mg is blasting. This is what some of initial questions were about, I'm on 200mg currently which some consider to not be TRT as is. I plan on upping to that point and "blasting" at some point over the next year or couple years but slowly getting to that point. That is why I'm asking if it's too soon to up my current dose to 250mg or 300mg or stick with my dose and see the results I get through the year and wait till the beginning of next year to up to 300mg. The plan is as you just stated to blast and then cruise, but I'd like to slowly ease up and get everything I can out of lower dosages before jumping straight to 500mgs...
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Here’s what I would do. I’d cut my current dose back to get within reference range, then assess how I felt and go from there. I’d also be sure my labs were done for E2, pregnenolone, DHEA, thyroid, complete CBC panel, free tests total test and SHBG. Once all those are in check and I felt good, which will more than likely take about 1 year total, then I will know my TRT dose. Afterwards if you wanted to blast or add other things on a blast cycle you could and you would know where to go back to on your TRT dose to cruise.

Also, just as important, keep your diet in check and put the work in, in the gym.
 
Mikereyn513 said:
@Smont @Hyde @match Hey bros how come every time someone asks about adding muscle the first thing they ask or talk about is the drugs and not diet or training? Sorry op not picking on you specifically but this happens everytime not some of the time or most of the time EVERY time
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Everyone wants to hit that Easy button, and most people have been fed the lie that steroids do all the work.

They see someone who is obviously on gear (see ironhands Dedicated to natural bodybuilders thread for reference) and they think that the steroids produced those gains. These people don't understand the dedication to the training, diet and rest that are required. They don't understand the years of work and effort, the constant balance and fine tuning of macros and training regimens. They're clueless about the nagging injuries, surgeries for torn muscle/connective tissues, and level of punishment felt during every workout and practically every set.

I think OP has a good head on his shoulders. He came here for advice, has said he has his diet dialed in, claims to be 200lbs at 10% (pretty great starting point if true) and is willing to be patient. So he knows this is a marathon, and also seems to have achieved a respectable level of success already in terms of physique. If anyone was a good candidate for a blast/cruise plan, OP certainly seems to be.

And OP: you came to a great place for advice. Listen to these dudes and continue to do your own research to make sure what you're being told passes muster bro. I hope you reach your goals and do so in the healthiest manner possible!
 
Not looking for any easy button, I've been lifting for 16 years coming up on 17 and been through two coaches to achieve all my "natural goals" before adding anything in. Not to say that I know everything by any stretch or have half the experience that many people on these forums have, but that is why I'm on here to get educated opinions on the decisions I'll be making going forward. I know my Dr. is a good guy, but you tell him you want to "compete", and he is more willing to prescribe, and I've seen that. I'm not wanting to just jump into a big cycle, and truly believe that easing your way into the bigger things and getting the most out of the little things is the way to go. I'll stay within the range I'm in through the year, and get my bloods checked at the beginning of next to see where things are again before I add more in. All feedback is truly appreciated and would love to hear/see more on this topic so please continue to add in your opinions and advice. I've taken everything Ya'll have said very seriously and will use this all to my advantage going forward.
 
Rjg1225 said:
Not looking for any easy button, I've been lifting for 16 years coming up on 17 and been through two coaches to achieve all my "natural goals" before adding anything in. Not to say that I know everything by any stretch or have half the experience that many people on these forums have, but that is why I'm on here to get educated opinions on the decisions I'll be making going forward. I know my Dr. is a good guy, but you tell him you want to "compete", and he is more willing to prescribe, and I've seen that. I'm not wanting to just jump into a big cycle, and truly believe that easing your way into the bigger things and getting the most out of the little things is the way to go. I'll stay within the range I'm in through the year, and get my bloods checked at the beginning of next to see where things are again before I add more in. All feedback is truly appreciated and would love to hear/see more on this topic so please continue to add in your opinions and advice. I've taken everything Ya'll have said very seriously and will use this all to my advantage going forward.
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First off I do wanna say thank you for keeping an open mind most guys freak the f out when we tell them what we've told you they think we're a bunch of dumb meatheads that'll give them what they want to hear and say he'll you bro up that $**** when in all reality were actually a bunch of smart meatheads trying to help each other out
 
Tbh I would keep your doctor if you do wanna blast and cruise because then you don't have to lie and hide it like most guys I would rather be up front and honest. I blast and cruise so I'm not gonna sit here and act all high and mighty when in 2 weeks and upping my test and adding deca and anadrol lol
 
I have no issue with the Dr., he's very reputable in my area and I've heard his name on countless "Anabolic Doc" videos if any of you are familiar with his YouTube. He's a good guy and checks bloodwork regularly but I know he's used to having guy come in to see him to blast for bodybuilding shows or whatever their sport might be. Again, that's why I love the feedback I get on here because its more tailored to honestly and the information I'm giving vs. what people go into him for. He doesn't ask as many questions as he should lol, but again I agree he's great for what I'm looking to do. I just want this more honest feedback from people who have been where I am and understand the magnitude of upping your doses to quickly and getting the most out of the small doses before moving up.
 
I’m going against what everyone says and say up the dose, 300 won’t be too much difference so I would double the dose (to 400mg) for a few months, add the Var in the end. If you mind is already set on gaining muscle I see no reason to hold back, it’s great that you have a Dr to monitor and help on the way.

Btw I just want to remind everyone that this is a steroid forum and not a “parent” forum, if OP wants to hear what he “should” do he could ask his mom. 😜
 
BBiceps said:
I’m going against what everyone says and say up the dose, 300 won’t be too much difference so I would double the dose (to 400mg) for a few months, add the Var in the end. If you mind is already set on gaining muscle I see no reason to hold back, it’s great that you have a Dr to monitor and help on the way.
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I was going to actually post the exact same thing actually, almost verbatim.

OP, you are 29. You aren’t getting any younger; now is THE time to get busy getting busy if you want to bodybuild. Risks go up as you age and the joints only get more beat down; there is an expiration date on all of this. If you want to add 20lbs of muscle at a similar bodyfat, a fairly low one at that, you are going to need real drug exposure and it is going to take significant training & drug cycles to accomplish this.

The 2 ignorant things people can mistakenly be led to assume is that A) serious muscle can be obtained for the average person on trivial weekend warrior doses or B) because most people will need quite a bit in the end, you should start at those doses.

The truth is in the middle.

I would get the doctor to give you a script for 300 test and 20-30mg Var if you can call your own doses. Bump the test for a month or two, then add the Var for 12 weeks. That’s a good 16-20 week course of fairly safe, easy to control drugs that escalate in dosage and will provide a solid boost. Then you come back to your 200 for 12 weeks, and if blood values are alright maybe next run you go up to 500 & the var. Then maybe you start looking at adding some HGH the next run, or Nandrolone, etc, and begin adding L-Carnitine.

You don’t have to always raise the dose from blast to blast either; sometimes repeating a blast at the exact same doses is essentially just as effective as the first time. This shows the importance of sleep, diet, efficacy of training methods, and taking periods to cruise and let myostatin & such reset. But, like you said over time your usage will generally increase, so being progressive with your drug overload is just as important as for food and training.

There will be time to dial a legitimate TRT protocol when you are ready to back off being maximally large and actually done blasting.
 
I just wasn't gonna recommend any cycle advice. I know my place, and that definitely ain't it! :ROFLMAO:

I was hoping some of you guys would swing by this thread if it stayed active enough to give your guidance and opinions.
 
match said:
I just wasn't gonna recommend any cycle advice. I know my place, and that definitely ain't it! :ROFLMAO:

I was hoping some of you guys would swing by this thread if it stayed active enough to give your guidance and opinions.
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I'm going to agree hear with match like I said I'm starting a blast next week so I'm not going to sit here and sat don't up it my point was and is always diet diet diet but I also realize like @match that there are bros way smarter than me who i would defer to in saying whether or not to up it. And 2 of who's opinions I respect the most have said go ahead and up it so I'm in
 
I love this, and this is exactly what I was hoping for in the sense of honest opinions. So now that the real talk has started lol, my doc said do 300mg. 150mg twice a week with 50mg of Deca for joints, the more I've looked into the Deca the less I want to do it especially considering it pretty gives a false idea that your joints are doing better. Do you guys not believe that I would see significant gains going up too 300mg for the next 3 months and then beginning of next year going to 500mg and adding the Var in? That was the plan, but want to get all feedback and see if there is anything else besides the Deca to add in. I don't like the negative side effects that Deca could give especially at higher doses and would like to stay away from it if possible but open to hearing more if you guys believe it's the way to go. Would like to hear more personal experiences if that was the case, and what dose's you had taken. 50mg is considered low I know that and wouldn't be for adding mass. I've heard upwards of 150mg, or more is needed so really curious as to what doses would be recommended. Again, though the side effects and negatives seem to be pretty high with case by case.
 
I was on TRT for about 2 years before I ever blasted. My first blast I went up to 500mg test, with BP meds and a few other ancillaries. Started to put on some good size but HCT and BP shot way up. Now on my blasts I don't go past 250mg test/week, and this last blast I'm using 300mg primo/week also. Of course my results aren't as drastic as 500mg of test, but I feel very good in all ways, consistently getting stronger, leaner and have an overall good look going on. I would start lower (like 300mg suggested by your doc and the other guys in this thread) and on each subsequent blast push it a little more than the previous one until you find your sides vs results threshold. Some guys will deal with the sides in order to get max results which is cool, but for me I want to feel awesome on cycle. Obviously my body doesn't handle higher doses too well so I'll stay lower.
 
Thats what I'm thinking, I'd like to stay away from adding anything until I fully am ready to blast but always curious to hear opinions on if I should add anything to the 300mg of test a week that isn't too drastic at this point. I'm definitely going to slow roll this whole process and get the max out of each move up as I can. I plan to stay on 300mg for the next 4-6 months as I'm upping my calories. All this said, any feedback as to what I should be expecting to put on muscle wise if diet/training is all in line throughout this process? I'm just curious ballpark wise to know what I should expect.
 
Rjg1225 said:
I love this, and this is exactly what I was hoping for in the sense of honest opinions. So now that the real talk has started lol, my doc said do 300mg. 150mg twice a week with 50mg of Deca for joints, the more I've looked into the Deca the less I want to do it especially considering it pretty gives a false idea that your joints are doing better. Do you guys not believe that I would see significant gains going up too 300mg for the next 3 months and then beginning of next year going to 500mg and adding the Var in? That was the plan, but want to get all feedback and see if there is anything else besides the Deca to add in. I don't like the negative side effects that Deca could give especially at higher doses and would like to stay away from it if possible but open to hearing more if you guys believe it's the way to go. Would like to hear more personal experiences if that was the case, and what dose's you had taken. 50mg is considered low I know that and wouldn't be for adding mass. I've heard upwards of 150mg, or more is needed so really curious as to what doses would be recommended. Again, though the side effects and negatives seem to be pretty high with case by case.
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I'm a huge deca fan as most of the bros know so I say go ahead and up it to 300mg and deca at 150 and go from there. This week I'll be going to 500 test and 300 deca split into 2 pins and in 3-4 weeks going to 750 test 450 deca split into 3 (m/w/f) haven't decided when to add the anadrol that'll be more of a feel thing
 
Rjg1225 said:
Thats what I'm thinking, I'd like to stay away from adding anything until I fully am ready to blast but always curious to hear opinions on if I should add anything to the 300mg of test a week that isn't too drastic at this point. I'm definitely going to slow roll this whole process and get the max out of each move up as I can. I plan to stay on 300mg for the next 4-6 months as I'm upping my calories. All this said, any feedback as to what I should be expecting to put on muscle wise if diet/training is all in line throughout this process? I'm just curious ballpark wise to know what I should expect.
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The thing about bumping your test to 300 for 6 months is that you don’t know what your blood values are going to do - plenty of guys cannot run test that high indefinitely because of things like hematocrit, hemoglobin, RBC elevating too much. You could get to the end of that 6 months and your blood might tell you that you must back down to a modest cruise to get your blood thinned out. It’s not realistic to blast for 9 months generally for many.

This is why I like the doctor’s idea of 300 test & 100 deca. It’s double your current dose and you WILL see real gains, definitely better than 300 test solo. It’s not about using threshold doses of certain compounds so much as the threshold of total drug exposure. Nandrolone is more anabolic per mg than test, and only using 100mg means test is 3:1 so odds of sexual disfunction are much lower (and if they occur, you can clear the deca out much faster, and you will know it’s just not for you). And if it goes awesome, you will know to explore the nandrolone road further later.
 
Hyde said:
This is why I like the doctor’s idea of 300 test & 100 deca. It’s double your current dose and you WILL see real gains, definitely better than 300 test solo. It’s not about using threshold doses of certain compounds so much as the threshold of total drug exposure. Nandrolone is more anabolic per mg than test, and only using 100mg means test is 3:1 so odds of sexual disfunction are much lower (and if they occur, you can clear the deca out much faster, and you will know it’s just not for you). And if it goes awesome, you will know to explore the nandrolone road further later.
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^This^
I would add the Var also.
 
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Hyde,

I'll give a shot the next 3-4 months then and see the results of this then drop back to 200mg of test for a couple months before going up again. Does this sound more reasonable? Also, with the Deca will I do 50mg with each 150mg of test or just do 100mg with one of my injections? I don't know if either way will even make a difference more curious at this point.

BBiceps,

As far as the var goes, I'll wait to add that in for my full first blast at some point next year, I'd like to slow roll this as stated before and don't think I need to add that in considering this would be my first "cycle". I'd like to see what the 300mg and the 100mg Deca do alone before adding anything else. Only way I'd even consider that would be if I reacted negatively to the Deca.
 
Rjg1225 said:
Hyde,

I'll give a shot the next 3-4 months then and see the results of this then drop back to 200mg of test for a couple months before going up again. Does this sound more reasonable? Also, with the Deca will I do 50mg with each 150mg of test or just do 100mg with one of my injections? I don't know if either way will even make a difference more curious at this point.

BBiceps,

As far as the var goes, I'll wait to add that in for my full first blast at some point next year, I'd like to slow roll this as stated before and don't think I need to add that in considering this would be my first "cycle". I'd like to see what the 300mg and the 100mg Deca do alone before adding anything else. Only way I'd even consider that would be if I reacted negatively to the Deca.
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Just pin all 100mg once per week in one of the test shots. Deca doesn’t aromatize and has a good 10 day half-life or more, so there’s zero reason to split it up. It will also offer greater peak drug exposure administered once per week, which is a positive for muscle growth.
 
Hyde said:
The thing about bumping your test to 300 for 6 months is that you don’t know what your blood values are going to do - plenty of guys cannot run test that high indefinitely because of things like hematocrit, hemoglobin, RBC elevating too much. You could get to the end of that 6 months and your blood might tell you that you must back down to a modest cruise to get your blood thinned out. It’s not realistic to blast for 9 months generally for many.

This is why I like the doctor’s idea of 300 test & 100 deca. It’s double your current dose and you WILL see real gains, definitely better than 300 test solo. It’s not about using threshold doses of certain compounds so much as the threshold of total drug exposure. Nandrolone is more anabolic per mg than test, and only using 100mg means test is 3:1 so odds of sexual disfunction are much lower (and if they occur, you can clear the deca out much faster, and you will know it’s just not for you). And if it goes awesome, you will know to explore the nandrolone road further later.
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This×2☝
 
Rjg1225 said:
BBiceps,

As far as the var goes, I'll wait to add that in for my full first blast at some point next year, I'd like to slow roll this as stated before and don't think I need to add that in considering this would be my first "cycle". I'd like to see what the 300mg and the 100mg Deca do alone before adding anything else. Only way I'd even consider that would be if I reacted negatively to the Deca.
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That’s responsible of you and nothing wrong with it, I just like to add a little bit of DHT to Deca to control some of the sides it can bring but 100mg shouldn’t give you any sides and you should have a good cycle, good luck and let us know how it goes.
 
Gentlemen,

Did my first 150mg shot today and will do the other 150mg on Thursday with the 100mg of Deca. Will be continuously following up on this thread for feedback and results as the months progress. I truly appreciate all the feedback, and honest advice. This is exactly what I was looking for when I initially started this thread. It's hard to find people who actual give this kind of feedback, and I truly don't get that. Looking forward to these next couple months for sure at this point!
 
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Looking forward to hearing how things go for you.

I'm always encouraged when people take the advice they get from the gurus here, there's hope for the brommunity (is that a term? I think I just made it up... 🤣).
 
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