Sides (MPB, gyno) from 4ad run w/ 4oht and m4ohn

[joebiggie]

I am ready to do my next cycle, and I am unsure exactly what to run on it. My primary goals are:

1. Lean mass gains with not too much water retention.
2. Easily retainable gains.
3. A minimization of side effects, namely gyno and MPB.

I am willing to sacrifice a pound or two in gains to reduce my chance of sides. Most important to me is that I keep my hair and not exacerbate my pubertal gyno (which, although admittedly very slight, I plan on getting surgery for this winter). My last cycle was a 3 week Custom m4ohn run at 20-24 mgs per day. I was very happy with this, although in the back of my mind I would really like to try 4ad and see if I can gain a little more this time around. My main concerns with this PH is that I am unsure about the risk of MPB from running this compound. Has anyone experienced hair loss on 4ad? Is MPB from 4ad preventable using proscar or propecia? I understand 4ad has intrinsic activity aside from the activity from conversion to test. If my reasoning is correct than 4ad undergoes a 5 alpha reduction similar to testosterone. In this case propecia would be effective in reducing or preventing MPB from 4ad. Does this sound correct?

With this in mind, I have a few ideas for my next cycle. I am tentatively planning on using 4ad as the base. I am perfectly fine running 4ad by itself but I am concerned with sides... please give me feedback if you have experience running it by itself. I am considering running m4ohn and 4oht alongside it, but I am unsure of the consequences of stacking these compounds. People make broad mention of the fact that any nortestosterone derivative, with its high affinity for the progesterone receptor, combined with any heavily aromatizing compound (i.e. test from 4ad) is asking for gyno. However, when I ran mdien for 1 week (which, keep in mind is a nortestosterone derivative) I got a small gyno flare-up. However, m4ohn, which is also a nortestosteron derivative, did not give me any gyno flare-up at all. This makes me believe that m4ohn has little progesterone activity (please understand this is only my hypothesis, please let me know if indeed this is not the case). I would love to hear from anybody who has tried m4ohn along with 4ad; please tell me your results as well as your sides.

I designed the cycle primarily to minimize sides. I have read before, and have deduced from personal experience (namely, the fact that it seems to have regrown a bit of my temporal hairline) that m4ohn acts in inhibiting action of the 5ar enzyme. This, I hope, will reduce chances of androgenic sides from the 4ad. The 4oht is primarily in there to reduce the chance of estrogenic side effects, as I hear it has this effect. In addition, I hope to contribute to an easier PCT in this way by reducing the chance of an estrogenic negative feedback loop with the HPTA. I have not decided on doses yet, but I imagine I will do something like the following (please give me some feedback on the doses):

4ad transdermal week 1-3: 400mg ED
4oht transdermal week 1-3: 100mg ED
m4ohn oral week 1-3: 20mg ED
clen week 4-5: pyramid up to 140mcgs ED
nolva week 4-6: 20mgs ED, during cycle as needed
(unsure... lotsa $$$) IGF-1 LR3: week 3-5: 40mcgs ED

Please let me know how this sounds.

 

[Longdog]

I don't think you will gain much of anything only running that cycle for 3 weeks. You will just be starting to make gains week 3, & then stop? The stack looks good, just run it 6-7 weeks. There is no benefit to a 3-week cycle, and you'd likely lose any gains quickly.

I still bloat from 4ad with OHT at a 25% ratio. You may want to consider taking letro or dex to keep the water retention in-check. Custom has both now for cheap.

I would run the IGF the last 2 weeks of the cycle into the first 2 weeks of PCT. You could just run 20mcg on non-workout days to extend it for 4 full weeks. It will really help solidify gains that way.