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16 year old in my class placed in mental hospitol

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Reguardless of your beliefs,
you can go I for an eye and be remembered as a violent person who always sought revenge.
Or you can always turn the other cheek and be know to those who knew you as "the wisest man they ever met."
 
Reguardless of your beliefs,
you can go I for an eye and be remembered as a violent person who always sought revenge.
Or you can always turn the other cheek and be know to those who knew you as "the wisest man they ever met."
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Or continually get picked on because you wont stand up for yourself...
 
Whiskey Steve said:
Reguardless of your beliefs,
you can go I for an eye and be remembered as a violent person who always sought revenge.
Or you can always turn the other cheek and be know to those who knew you as "the wisest man they ever met."
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Wow...You assume too much.

Put it this way, Jesus would be treated similarly now as he was 2000yrs ago. Only difference, he'd probably end up in a mental institution and people would write him off as a whacko, and he'd skip the execution. He may end up dead, however, because he turned the other cheek, and the people would still think he was a whacko and an idiot. edit: I'm not trying to crack on Jesus here, I'm trying to tell you society won't conform to such idealism...they're just not capable, unfortunately.

Society is not much different now than it was then.

That being said, if you act like Jesus and just take a beating and turn the other cheek, people may understand you're a nice guy, but an idiot.They most likely wouldn't believe that you're the "wisest man they've ever known." Its not too wise if you end up dead, for example. And, standing up for yourself also won't necessarily make you a despised person, who was violent and sought revenge either. You're waaaaaaaay out there. All you can see is the two extremes. How often do you hear of the guy on TV who beats up the criminal (instead of turning the other cheek) by characterized as a "violent person"? They characterize them as heros! But, I guess, according to you, because they reacted and didn't sit there and get robbed and/or killed, they're violent people. :rolleyes: They could have done the "wise thing" and been killed/robbed/both and "hoped" there is really a God.
 
kwyckemynd00 said:
Wow...You assume too much.

Put it this way, Jesus would be treated similarly now as he was 2000yrs ago. Only difference, he'd probably end up in a mental institution and people would write him off as a whacko, and he'd skip the execution. He may end up dead, however, because he turned the other cheek, and the people would still think he was a whacko and an idiot. edit: I'm not trying to crack on Jesus here, I'm trying to tell you society won't conform to such idealism...they're just not capable, unfortunately.

Society is not much different now than it was then.
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Ya, and then the earth trembled upon his death and everyone said "surely this man spoke the truth."

Dont call my/your savior a wacko.

I would also like to point out that we base time itself upon him. (BC, AD) But now sick bastard darwinist historians think they need to replace it with BCE and ACE (before/after the common era :rolleyes: ) these are the same kind of people that tear down public nativity scenes.
 
Also Christ said, no man takes my life, i give it freely.

He was not prey to anyone. in the garden of gethsemany when i think peter draws his sword to prevent Jesus from being taken Christ says something like "do ye not know that i could call legions of angels to protect me." and he picks up the mans ear that peter cut off and heals in back onto the mans head. And then willingly walkes off with the men he knew would beat and kill him. And during the whole time he was praying to The Father begging for these mens forgiveness for "they know not what they do."
 
Ya, and then the earth trembled upon his death and everyone said "surely this man spoke the truth."
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You're quoting words out of 2000+ year old texts and claiming
them as facts. Ever play telephone when you were a kid? The books the apostles wrote were written many years after the death of Jesus - I wonder how much 'creative liberty' they took when recording the events they witnessed.

Dont call my/your savior a wacko.
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He isnt calling your savior a wacko, he's saying that if someone were walking around behaving as Jesus did then, he would be considered a wacko. And, unless he had the evidence to back himself up, he most definitely would be.

I would also like to point out that we base time itself upon him. (BC, AD) But now sick bastard darwinist historians think they need to replace it with BCE and ACE (before/after the common era ) these are the same kind of people that tear down public nativity scenes.
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Even though Im not a Christian, I think people being all PC about Christian traditions adopted by our society are absurd. However,I dont think Darwin evolutionists are sick bastards ...evolution is a proven fact of science. Whether you believe in God or not, it is how life on this earth developed.
 
BigVrunga said:
Even though Im not a Christian, I think people being all PC about Christian traditions adopted by our society are absurd. However,I dont think Darwin evolutionists are sick bastards ...evolution is a proven fact of science. Whether you believe in God or not, it is how life on this earth developed.
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Its "The Theory of Evolution". A theory is something that has not been proven.
 
Whiskey Steve said:
Its "The Theory of Evolution". A theory is something that has not been proven.
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Gravity is also a theory... Call me crazy but i'd say it exists. Evolution is a theory and a fact.
 
how the **** did this turn into a damn religious debate?

let it go guys, religion can't be argued. you either believe it or you don't. arguing on a board isn't going to change someone's beliefs, it's a personal change that the person discovers on his/her own.
 
ya, but this is (i think) kind of the direction spatch wanted this to go......he supported all his arguments with quotes of Christ's teachings



and i think it is of value to share our beliefs for others to consider.
 
Its "The Theory of Evolution". A theory is something that has not been proven.
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Bro while it is impossible to 'prove beyond a shadow of a doubt' that evolution is real, there have been enough studies and evidence to call it 'the fact of evolution'.

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to name a couple...

This isnt saying that God still isnt behind it all, but evolution happens, and is going on all around us and will continue to do so.

Give me one shred of scientific evidence that the universe was created in 7 days, and Ill buy you a beer:)

BV
 
let it go guys, religion can't be argued. you either believe it or you don't. arguing on a board isn't going to change someone's beliefs, it's a personal change that the person discovers on his/her own.
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And this is coming from a guy named after the Philistine God of Flies! I know what you're up to, Beelzebub!:D

I agree though, the argument is pointless. Makes for a good discussion as long as it doesnt turn into a flame war (which Im sure it will)

BV
 
BigVrunga said:
Bro while it is impossible to 'prove beyond a shadow of a doubt' that evolution is real, there have been enough studies and evidence to call it 'the fact of evolution'.

Invalid Link Removed
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to name a couple...

This isnt saying that God still isnt behind it all, but evolution happens, and is going on all around us and will continue to do so.

Give me one shred of scientific proof that the universe was created in 7 days, and Ill buy you a beer:)

BV
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If if meet you face to face I could show you scriptures and have you pray reguarding the truth of them and the Holy Ghost would testify of them to you. You would become more sure of the God's existence than anything you have ever been "sure" of.

Dont take evolution because it might be true. You may feel it is close to the truth, but 2+2 is close to five but it is actually four. Dont believe evolution by defalt..........seek the truth fpr your self.
 
Dont take evolution because it might be true. You may feel it is close to the truth, but 2+2 is close to five but it is actually four. Dont believe evolution by defalt..........seek the truth fpr your self.
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I could make a long, lengthy post here but these pages say it best:

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By accepting evolution, you are not denying the existence of your God. You are ascribing to a scientific method that has passed a myraid of rigourous tests for generations. This is how science works - most scientific theories arent 'proven' , mathematically speaking, but they are held as fact because it is the best explaination for a phenomena that we have. And, until someone can provide a test that shows this is not the case, there is reason to believe the hypothesis is indeed a fact of science.

If if meet you face to face I could show you scriptures and have you pray reguarding the truth of them and the Holy Ghost would testify of them to you. You would become more sure of the God's existence than anything you have ever been "sure" of.
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Or I could eat some peyote and have a native american shaman guide me to the spirit plane...

You're challenging scientific methods but stating metaphysical self-realizations as hard facts. To you, that may be the case and if you believe that, then more power to you.

The Bible is a collection of historical accounts, and also parables and stories. Because a historical account in the Bible is proven to be accurate, does not mean that every sentance in the book is a scientific fact.
 
Whiskey Steve said:
......dont support either side, they are both in the wrong.
But if one is worse than I would definitely say it is the jocks. Its only because of the bullies/jocks that we have a problem.

How many school shootings do you think their would be if when parents asked their "geeky" child about school and they said "the home work sucks but everyone is nice to me."......ummm, im going to guess NONE.
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restate my opionion on the base of this thread
 
bpmartyr said:
You miss the whole point of Christianity. There are no "good people" Christian or not. We are all sinners and have all fallen short of the glory of God. This is why Christ died, to be our scapegoat, to atone for our sins, to pay the price we owe for our disobedience.

It is human nature to think we are right, everyone feels that at one time or another and we are all hypocrytes. I am not the one that said it is my way or the highway, Jesus did. According to Him there are not many paths to God but through Him only can we be reconciled.

Not to be an ass but it makes me wonder about your wifes decision to marry an unbeliever. Or yours to marry her.How can you have a partnership with two world views that are diametrically opposed? Just askin, def no offense meant, curious an to the justification because God explicitly warns against this type of union. That is what screwed Solomon up and he was the second wisest man to every walk the earth.
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Because I am a good person and my wife sees that. Until people of different beliefs learn to respect one another, I do not believe there will ever be peace. Your post leads me to believe that you don't respect the fact that I don't believe the same way as you do. How can you expect me to respect your belief? It is nothing but a belief based on writing in a book. You are willing to question the validity of our relationship because of your belief. Makes no sense to me. I choose not to be a part of it. If there is a God, I don't think it is what this God had in mind.
 
Beelzebub said:
how the **** did this turn into a damn religious debate?

let it go guys, religion can't be argued. you either believe it or you don't. arguing on a board isn't going to change someone's beliefs, it's a personal change that the person discovers on his/her own.
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I'm with you man. I know of no religious belief that can stand up to logic and reasoning. Some choose to believe based on writings in a book, emotions and maybe some circumstances in their life that they choose to associate with it. While others choose to believe what the empirical evidence strongly suggests. Ultimately, I don't believe any of us know. I don't claim to know. I admit that I have a belief. It just seems that those who believe in religion can't admit that maybe they are wrong, but will criticize me because they think I am going around saying I'm right. I guess then they will feel they are falling short of what their religion expects of them.
 
rhunt000 said:
I'm with you man. I know of no religious belief that can stand up to logic and reasoning. Some choose to believe based on writings in a book, emotions and maybe some circumstances in their life that they choose to associate with it. While others choose to believe what the empirical evidence strongly suggests. Ultimately, I don't believe any of us know. I don't claim to know. I admit that I have a belief. It just seems that those who believe in religion can't admit that maybe they are wrong, but will criticize me because they think I am going around saying I'm right. I guess then they will feel they are falling short of what their religion expects of them.
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And I could say the same thing about evolutionists. They may think they are on their way to solving something. I must wonder why you would seek to disprove God? Why would you seek to remove this security blanket? If God did not exist and it was common knowledge that he did not I and many others would live lawless lives. (i talked about this in the bible study thread).



and I congratulate you on a happy marrage. I dont think I could do what you are doing.
 
Whiskey Steve said:
And I could say the same thing about evolutionists. They may think they are on their way to solving something. I must wonder why you would seek to disprove God? Why would you seek to remove this security blanket? If God did not exist and it was common knowledge that he did not I and many others would live lawless lives. (i talked about this in the bible study thread).



and I congratulate you on a happy marrage. I dont think I could do what you are doing.
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You must first believe in a God in order to try and prove a God wrong. The security blanket first has to be there in order to remove it. It seems some people who believe in a religion fail to realize this simple requirement. I simply cannot ignore the facts that are around me.

Society created laws. A society of people.

Thank you. It's really not that hard. We have a mutual respect. Harmony if you will. It is a wonderful thing. She takes our children to church and I don't have a problem with it. I just don't want them to be sheeplike and follow someone or something just because that someone says so. I want them to question what they hear, do the research and come to their own conclusion without fear. Whatever they choose will be fine with me. My philosophy is that a person should believe whatever they need to in order to be the best person they can be. It is more important to me to treat people with kindness than to memorize a book. Some people who strongly believe a religion and do not listen to logic and reasoning can be scary. :run:
 
Yes but please do not preach evolution as fact.....it has not been proven. It is still a theory. But you can believe with all your heart that someday it will be. But at this time please acknowledge what all scientists acknowledge....and that is that evolution has not yet been proven.
 
I haven't. The scientific community admits that all theories are subject to change pending new discoveries and new empirical data. They will also admit that there is overwhelming evidence that suggests it. Again, please remember that the admittance of the existence of evolutution (population change over time due to environmental pressures and/or genetic mutation) does not in any way suggest that a God does or does not exist. That is not a question for science. It is a belief. I'm not sure why people get that confused. So, is it fair for me to ask you to not preach your belief as fact?
 
Yes but please do not preach evolution as fact.....it has not been proven. It is still a theory. But you can believe with all your heart that someday it will be. But at this time please acknowledge what all scientists acknowledge....and that is that evolution has not yet been proven.
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Again, it hasnt been 'proven' because no one has devised a logical or mathematical proof for evolution. There is, however a mound of scientific evidence 10 miles high that thoroughly supports the theory. This is why evolution is accepted as fact by so many - because no one has been able to provide a scientifically accepted method to show otherwise.

By saying 'It hasnt been proven!' you are relying on a grammatical technicality to support your argument. There are literally thousands of studies,experiments, and cases of empirical evidence that show evolution is real - name one in support of creationism.

Think of it this way: evolution is a "theory" in the same sense as Newton's "theory" of gravity and Einstein's "theory" of relativity.

Religion is a 'belief' the same way the I 'believe' that the Loch Ness Monster is real. There is no empirical evidence to show that either is fact, and yet as a human being you choose to believe what you do through faith. Which is fine.

Saying evolution exists does not in any way deny the existence of God. It does, however, show you that every parable and story in the Bible can not be taken literally as fact. How do we know what god meant by 7 days? What if he meant 7 billion years? Without God actually coming down here and explaining himself - no human can really know the truth.

You must first believe in a God in order to try and prove a God wrong. The security blanket first has to be there in order to remove it. It seems some people who believe in a religion fail to realize this simple requirement. I simply cannot ignore the facts that are around me.
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Exactly. WS Im not going to argue with you about your beliefs, because that's your own personal choice. By supporting evolution, I am not trying to disprove God. I am trying to explain through science and reason how the universe works.

Whatever though man, there's really no point in arguing about it. I dont believe in God, but Im not denying that there's not a higher power out there either. Its not really something I concern myself with.

BV
 
I respect all beliefs because I know how important they are to people. I think the religious mainstream (of any religion) understand the importance of that respect to be given and received. It is the extremists who are constantly trying to run it down my throat that get on my nerves.

I think religion as a whole is a fascinating subject. I'm definitely far from an expert and never claimed to be, but the little that I do study it is very interesting.

I just hope the 16 yr old turns out ok.
 
thanks again for killing another thread that started out great and ended a flaming death due to the inability to stay on the topic at HAND
 
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