Donald Trump running for president

thebigt said:
i wonder how many cop's widow's wish their husbands wouldn't have hesitated?
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A police officer is only justified in using lethal force IF they have reasonable grounds to believe the person is an active threat to the officers or another persons life.

This isnt a hunch.

This isnt a "I'll shoot him just in case".

This isnt a "I better not hesitate as he may have a gun that he may use to shoot me with".

This is a reasonable ground. It's a high threshold. Invalid Link Removed
 
Jiigzz said:
Doesnt it? What about Charles Kinsey? Daniel Shaver?

Ah, you mean it mostly doesnt get you shot. Like a 90% chance the cop can remain calm enough to not pull the trigger on someone lying on the ground with his hands in the air
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If you were a cop maybe you would realize that mistakes can be made. It the Kinsey Casey, the officer wasn’t aiming or indenting to shoot Kinsey. He missed his intended target and Kinsey was hit.

In Shaver, although the officer was charged and I believe the officer was too amped up, Shaver was waving what ended up being a pellet rifle around in his hotel room and staff thought there was a hostage situation. Shaver reached for his waistband area when he was shot.

Oh that’s right you were a cop in NZ but maybe you didn’t stay in long enough to realize officers are human and do make mistakes. That’s why I said “most of the time” in my post. But you’re being an ass hat, ****-tard again and twisting things.

So you think riots should be happening over the Kenosha shooting? You think that’s ok? All the facts aren’t out, but we do know a knife was found in the floorboard of his vehicle and I bet he has it in his hands the entire time.
 
Jiigzz said:
A police officer is only justified in using lethal force IF they have reasonable grounds to believe the person is an active threat to the officers or another persons life.

This isnt a hunch.

This isnt a "I'll shoot him just in case".

This isnt a "I better not hesitate as he may have a gun that he may use to shoot me with".

This is a reasonable ground. It's a high threshold. Invalid Link Removed
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so, you are saying that no cop ever gave someone the benefit of doubt even against their better judgement because he was hesitant to take a life....and it ended up costing the cop his life?

tell me you don't believe this has ever happened-c'mon man tell me!!!!

remember your post was in response to my post #38,902 so we can keep things in perspective.
 
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'biden overlooks ferguson in claiming no racial riots , national guard under obama'

biden isn't overlooking anything-the man has dementia.
 
sammpedd88 said:
If you were a cop maybe you would realize that mistakes can be made. It the Kinsey Casey, the officer wasn’t aiming or indenting to shoot Kinsey. He missed his intended target and Kinsey was hit.

In Shaver, although the officer was charged and I believe the officer was too amped up, Shaver was waving what ended up being a pellet rifle around in his hotel room and staff thought there was a hostage situation. Shaver reached for his waistband area when he was shot.

Oh that’s right you were a cop in NZ but maybe you didn’t stay in long enough to realize officers are human and do make mistakes. That’s why I said “most of the time” in my post. But you’re being an ass hat, ****-tard again and twisting things.

So you think riots should be happening over the Kenosha shooting? You think that’s ok? All the facts aren’t out, but we do know a knife was found in the floorboard of his vehicle and I bet he has it in his hands the entire time.
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Ah yes, a child sitting on the ground with his toy truck is a threat to life. An officer even stated over the radio it was a toy and the second officer fired anyway.

People dying to a human mistake is a huge f***en mistake. It's not just a "oh well hes only human" mistake, it's a "he just shot someone" or "he killed someone" kind of mistake.

Stop killing people by making mistakes. You're a cop, act better
 
thebigt said:
so, you are saying that no cop ever gave someone the benefit of doubt even against their better judgement because he was hesitant to take a life....and it ended up costing the cop his life?

tell me you don't believe this has ever happened-c'mon man tell me!!!!
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It's the officers job to assess each situation on it's own merits. Just because one gets shot by someone with a gun doesnt mean the next cop can shoot someone on a hunch.

They still have to follow their use of force policies AND have a reasonable ground to apply that force before it is applied.
 
thebigt said:
please explain why you think widow's losing husbands is funny-TO YOU?
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Someone losing their husband isn’t funny. The fact that you would use someone dying in the line of duty as a justification for police shootings is just sad.

How many widows wish police hesitated more against unarmed men? How many mothers wish police hesitated before shooting their child who was playing?
 
Jiigzz said:
It's the officers job to assess each situation on it's own merits. Just because one gets shot by someone with a gun doesnt mean the next cop can shoot someone on a hunch.

They still have to follow their use of force policies AND have a reasonable ground to apply that force before it is applied.
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you don't seem to have much sympathy for cops who have lost their lives for being hesitant to use lethal force and having lost their lives because they were decent men who didn't want to take a life?
 
sammpedd88 said:
If you were a cop maybe you would realize that mistakes can be made. It the Kinsey Casey, the officer wasn’t aiming or indenting to shoot Kinsey. He missed his intended target and Kinsey was hit.

In Shaver, although the officer was charged and I believe the officer was too amped up, Shaver was waving what ended up being a pellet rifle around in his hotel room and staff thought there was a hostage situation. Shaver reached for his waistband area when he was shot.

Oh that’s right you were a cop in NZ but maybe you didn’t stay in long enough to realize officers are human and do make mistakes. That’s why I said “most of the time” in my post. But you’re being an ass hat, ****-tard again and twisting things.

So you think riots should be happening over the Kenosha shooting? You think that’s ok? All the facts aren’t out, but we do know a knife was found in the floorboard of his vehicle and I bet he has it in his hands the entire time.
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Wasn’t he shot in the back outside of his vehicle? Did elastagirl have a baby with frozone?
 
Jiigzz said:
A police officer is only justified in using lethal force IF they have reasonable grounds to believe the person is an active threat to the officers or another persons life.

This isnt a hunch.

This isnt a "I'll shoot him just in case".

This isnt a "I better not hesitate as he may have a gun that he may use to shoot me with".

This is a reasonable ground. It's a high threshold. Invalid Link Removed
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You’re so wrong. An imminent threat not active. You don’t know case law from the US so don’t act like you’re trained in it.
 
ax1 said:
Wow, I know someone posted this, but wtf, anything to keep Groper Joe hiding in his basement!

Pelosi says Biden shouldn't debate Trump: 'I wouldn't legitimize a conversation with him'
House speaker says Trump would 'belittle' presidential debates
Invalid Link Removed
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If Biden doesn’t debate, his nomination should be pulled by whatever means possible. Debate. I already bought popcorn.
 
Woody said:
Someone losing their husband isn’t funny. The fact that you would use someone dying in the line of duty as a justification for police shootings is just sad.

How many widows wish police hesitated more against unarmed men? How many mothers wish police hesitated before shooting their child who was playing?
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is your reading comprehension really that bad!!!

re-read post #38,902...you aren't a lawyer, no way i can believe you practice law with the kind of nonsense you post.
 
Woody said:
If Biden doesn’t debate, his nomination should be pulled by whatever means possible. Debate. I already bought popcorn.
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i am putting this post number on paper so i have a record of it.
 
This is what I’ve noticed - Democrat’s jump to justify everything the suspect did and blame the cop. Republicans justify everything the cop does and blame the suspect for everything. Both sides will dig up dirt on the other and use it as a justification. As if weed arrests makes you a threat or being a 40 year police officer that has happened to be involved in shootouts before means you run around looking to kill people.

Both sides are guilty. Both sides refuse to look in the mirror.
 
thebigt said:
you don't seem to have much sympathy for cops who have lost their lives for being hesitant to use lethal force and having lost their lives because they were decent men who didn't want to take a life?
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I have as much sympathy for them as I do unarmed people gunned down by cops for a "hunch".

What I'm interpreting you as saying is that a cop is always justified, even when they're wrong, and an unarmed person is just collateral to that decision.

As long as the cop goes home, f*** everybody else?
 
thebigt said:
i am putting this post number on paper so i have a record of it.
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While you’re doing that, find the other posts where I have been supportive of Biden. You can’t. Because I’m not. I think he’s a piss poor nomination and same with Harris. I’ve said that often on here
 
'cnn's don lemon says anti-trump rhetoric doesn't make him biased'

typical democrat, lol.
 
sammpedd88 said:
You’re so wrong. An imminent threat not active. You don’t know case law from the US so don’t act like you’re trained in it.
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What does imminent mean?

Think real hard on that.

Because I'm 99.9% sure imminent doesnt mean "could happen".
 
Woody said:
This is what I’ve noticed - Democrat’s jump to justify everything the suspect did and blame the cop. Republicans justify everything the cop does and blame the suspect for everything. Both sides will dig up dirt on the other and use it as a justification. As if weed arrests makes you a threat or being a 40 year police officer that has happened to be involved in shootouts before means you run around looking to kill people.

Both sides are guilty. Both sides refuse to look in the mirror.
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Yes!

They say Democrats are dividing America while they stand with a permanent marker in hand drawing the lines themselves.
 
Woody said:
While you’re doing that, find the other posts where I have been supportive of Biden. You can’t. Because I’m not. I think he’s a piss poor nomination and same with Harris. I’ve said that often on here
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i really don't think you have a clue what you support, i think you just like to argue :geek:

that is why i want a record of your post--next month you will probably be arguing just the opposite just for the sake of arguing.
 
thebigt said:
is your reading comprehension really that bad!!!

re-read post #38,902...you aren't a lawyer, no way i can believe you practice law with the kind of nonsense you post.
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Your posts says you wish how many cops widows wish their husbands wouldn’t have hesitated. Your implication is that they should not have hesitated.

My response says I wonder how many widows of unarmed men wish the police would have hesitated. Or how many mothers wish the police would have hesitated. (Stephon Clark had a cell phone, Tamir Rice was 12 with a toy gun. The officer that shot him fired his shot within literal seconds of arriving on scene).

I’m not sure where you are confused? My granny always said there are three sides to a story. I took your response and presented the second side which you so often neglect. The truth is somewhere in the middle.
 
Jiigzz said:
I have as much sympathy for them as I do unarmed people gunned down by cops for a "hunch".

What I'm interpreting you as saying is that a cop is always justified, even when they're wrong, and an unarmed person is just collateral to that decision.

As long as the cop goes home, f*** everybody else?
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you should stick with your day job, you suck as a interpreter!!!


i have posted about cops being hurt and killed several times, and i've never seen you comment on how awful that is?
 
Woody said:
Your posts says you wish how many cops widows wish their husbands wouldn’t have hesitated. Your implication is that they should not have hesitated.

My response says I wonder how many widows of unarmed men wish the police would have hesitated. Or how many mothers wish the police would have hesitated. (Stephon Clark had a cell phone, Tamir Rice was 12 with a toy gun. The officer that shot him fired his shot within literal seconds of arriving on scene).

I’m not sure where you are confused? My granny always said there are three sides to a story. I took your response and presented the second side which you so often neglect. The truth is somewhere in the middle.
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you are full of shyt...your response was 'LOL'
i took that to mean you regard widows losing their husbands as funny. i have your post number if you need to be refreshed on your asshole remark.
 
thebigt said:
i really don't think you have a clue what you support, i think you just like to argue :geek:

that is why i want a record of your post--next month you will probably be arguing just the opposite just for the sake of arguing.
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I’m quite informed with what I support. I’ve said both sides suck probably 100 times.

I don’t know the post number because quite frankly that’s a very strange thing to keep track of, but somewhere back I’ve laid out some of my beliefs. I don’t align with either party. I form an opinion on an issue by issue basis and don’t rely on Fox News or CNN to form that opinion for me.

You say all Democrats are bad and just anti-Trump and divisive and irrational etc etc etc but almost every argument in here is based on emotion and anti democrat. Almost like.... Democrat Derangement Syndrome is running rampant ITT???
 
thebigt said:
i wonder how many cop's widow's wish their husbands wouldn't have hesitated?
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Woody said:
Lol.
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thebigt said:
please explain why you think widow's losing husbands is funny-TO YOU?
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Woody said:
Someone losing their husband isn’t funny. The fact that you would use someone dying in the line of duty as a justification for police shootings is just sad.

How many widows wish police hesitated more against unarmed men? How many mothers wish police hesitated before shooting their child who was playing?
Click to expand...

thebigt said:
you are full of shyt...your response was 'LOL'
i took that to mean you regard widows losing their husbands as funny. i have your post number if you need to be refreshed on your asshole remark.
Click to expand...


I quoted the whole exchange for you as you seem to already have forgotten partz. Maybe if you read them all together in context you can following along. My reading comprehension may not be as strong as yours, but it’s quite clear I said someone losing their husband wasn’t funny, but rather your attempt to use that as a justification was funny.
 
thebigt said:
you should stick with your day job, you suck as a interpreter!!!


i have posted about cops being hurt and killed several times, and i've never seen you comment on how awful that is?
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Of course it is awful. What I'm saying is that it is also awful to be shot dead by police whilst unarmed. The thing is, I'm noticing a trend where people are much quicker to back the cop in being justified and then digging up dirt to make the victim seem to be the agitator.

Oh a cop knelt on George's neck for 8 minutes? He was justified because George had a lethal dose of fentanyl in his system anyway and was going to die.

Oh Jacob was shot 7 times in the back? He is a pedo and had a gun, he deserved it.

Oh Charles was shot while lying on the ground with his hands in the air? The cop thought his patient was holding a gun. Oh? They were told over the radio it wasn't a gun? Hmm well, hes probably in a gang anyway

Oh Mr. Atkinson had a gun drawn on him by a cop because he was picking up rubbish? Definitely 100% justified in pulling out his firearm.

Want people to trust police? Stop killing people who don't deserve it. Kind of simple really

Not everyone needs to be a saint for their death to still be unjustified.
 
Jiigzz said:
Of course it is awful. What I'm saying is that it is also awful to be shot dead by police whilst unarmed. The thing is, I'm noticing a trend where people are much quicker to back the cop in being justified and then digging up dirt to make the victim seem to be the agitator.

Oh a cop knelt on George's neck for 8 minutes? He was justified because George had a lethal dose of fentanyl in his system anyway and was going to die.

Oh Jacob was shot 7 times in the back? He is a pedo and had a gun, he deserved it.

Oh Charles was shot while lying on the ground with his hands in the air? The cop thought his patient was holding a gun. Oh? They were told over the radio it wasn't a gun? Hmm well, hes probably in a gang anyway

Oh Mr. Atkinson had a gun drawn on him by a cop because he was picking up rubbish? Definitely 100% justified in pulling out his firearm.

Want people to trust police? Stop killing people who don't deserve it. Kind of simple really

Not everyone needs to be a saint for their death to still be unjustified.
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yeah, i know what you have been saying, you sound like a broken record how broken up you are...

65 law enforcement officers have lost their live this year from jan-june, i bet that number has increased in last 2 months
 
thebigt said:
yeah, i know what you have been saying, you sound like a broken record how broken up you are...

65 law enforcement officers have lost their live this year from jan-june, i bet that number has increased in last 2 months
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Still need to follow process.

That's the job. Their job is to not shoot people on a hunch. Imminent threat.
 
Woody said:
I quoted the whole exchange for you as you seem to already have forgotten partz. Maybe if you read them all together in context you can following along. My reading comprehension may not be as strong as yours, but it’s quite clear I said someone losing their husband wasn’t funny, but rather your attempt to use that as a justification was funny.
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yeah...you got off on a bad foot with your intitial response, i have to admit i was seeing red after i read.....'lol' about widows losing their husbands--that was not a well thought out response in my honest opinion.
 
Jiigzz said:
Still need to follow process.

That's the job. Their job is to not shoot people on a hunch. Imminent threat.
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dude, are you a bot?


65 cops killed from jan-june, the process obviously didn't work for them....how many cops get killed yearly in NZ?

if 65 cops got killed in 6 months in NZ what would your people think? @Jiigzz
 
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You can be pro police and still criticize unlawful actions of police officers. That's how it should be.

You can be pro BLM and criticize unlawful actions of looters and rioters.

It's not one or the other
 
Jiigzz said:
You can be pro police and still criticize unlawful actions of police officers. That's how it should be.

You can be pro BLM and criticize unlawful actions of looters and rioters.

It's not one or the other
Click to expand...


many in this country are asking what the end game is, since police are being held to a high standard and being fired and arrested and charged for wrong doings....the police are entitled to innocence before found guilty same as anyone accused of a crime, it seems to me that everytime there is a black shot or killed by a cop the BLM want instant justice-vigilante justice.

you seem fond of 'process', well there is a process in place for dealing with police misconduct, and the police should be entitled for the process to play out instead of people taking to the streets and causing destruction of our cities before this process has taken place....these riots and lootings have become nothing more than vigilante justice and has no place in civilized society-at least no civilized society i want to belong to.
 
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trump slams nba as a 'political organization'

didn't need trump to tell me this...
 
Jiigzz said:
Of course it is awful. What I'm saying is that it is also awful to be shot dead by police whilst unarmed. The thing is, I'm noticing a trend where people are much quicker to back the cop in being justified and then digging up dirt to make the victim seem to be the agitator.

Oh a cop knelt on George's neck for 8 minutes? He was justified because George had a lethal dose of fentanyl in his system anyway and was going to die.

Oh Jacob was shot 7 times in the back? He is a pedo and had a gun, he deserved it.

Oh Charles was shot while lying on the ground with his hands in the air? The cop thought his patient was holding a gun. Oh? They were told over the radio it wasn't a gun? Hmm well, hes probably in a gang anyway

Oh Mr. Atkinson had a gun drawn on him by a cop because he was picking up rubbish? Definitely 100% justified in pulling out his firearm.

Want people to trust police? Stop killing people who don't deserve it. Kind of simple really

Not everyone needs to be a saint for their death to still be unjustified.
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Showing the dirt on the perps is not meant to justify the actions of the cops. It’s to show that the actions of the rioters are inappropriate. Child gets shot crickets. Pedo gets shot, burn the city down. The cop is irrelevant in this. It’s the reaction of the mob that has me bothered. Let’s riot and get upset when an innocent that is not a part of the criminal world gets hurt or killed, but they aren’t. Why is that you suppose?
 
'biden addresses kenosha violence as media outlets suggest ongoing unrest boosts trump'

now there is a good reason to speak out against violence, rioting and looting-eh joe?
 
dixonk said:
Showing the dirt on the perps is not meant to justify the actions of the cops. It’s to show that the actions of the rioters are inappropriate. Child gets shot crickets. Pedo gets shot, burn the city down. The cop is irrelevant in this. It’s the reaction of the mob that has me bothered. Let’s riot and get upset when an innocent that is not a part of the criminal world gets hurt or killed, but they aren’t. Why is that you suppose?
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it's a shame the media spent so little time and attention on the killing of little cannon hinnant. i can remember when a child being killed execution style like that would be a huge story-not a forgotten byline....i wonder if the race of killer and victim played a part in his death being so unimportant to the media?
 
thebigt said:
it's a shame the media spent so little time and attention on the killing of little cannon hinnant. i can remember when a child being killed execution style like that would be a huge story-not a forgotten byline....i wonder if the race of killer and victim played a part in his death being so unimportant to the media?
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If a white guy shot a black kid you would know about it. No one gives a **** about white children. No one.
 
dixonk said:
If a white guy shot a black kid you would know about it. No one gives a **** about white children. No one.
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i do!!!

i donated $50 to his familys gofundme page, i just checked and it was at $813, 276 before being closed. i really feel for those people, i was truly shocked when i heard that story!!! i've said several prayers for them.

his life mattered
 
thebigt said:
many in this country are asking what the end game is, since police are being held to a high standard and being fired and arrested and charged for wrong doings....the police are entitled to innocence before found guilty same as anyone accused of a crime, it seems to me that everytime there is a black shot or killed by a cop the BLM want instant justice-vigilante justice.

you seem fond of 'process', well there is a process in place for dealing with police misconduct, and the police should be entitled for the process to play out instead of people taking to the streets and causing destruction of our cities before this process has taken place....these riots and lootings have become nothing more than vigilante justice and has no place in civilized society-at least no civilized society i want to belong to.
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The root issue is that it's been happening for literally decades. It's not just about George Floyd or Breonna Taylor, it's about what they represent. People are sick and tired of their fellow humans being shot to death by police and it being swept under the rug. Noone has been held to account for the Breonna Taylor incident.

These latest incidents have been the straw that broke the camel's back. Yes, Police should also have due process but that's what people are protesting against - it just doesnt seem to happen UNTIL the public kick up a fuss about it.

People should be held to account for gross misconduct. That doesnt mean they need to be arrested for murder, but some kind of accountability process.

If you want people to trust the police, give them a reason to trust you. Then people say "well if you just comply you wont die", why are those the only 2 options? Non-compliance should not be a death sentence.

This really shouldnt even be argued. People have a right to life and that right to life should not be taken away without good cause.

It just seems to be such an issue for US cops to reach for the firearm as a defusal tactic. In most countries this is the literal last resort. A video I posted a while back compares US and UK police responding to a knife wielding suspects. The US police killed every single one. The UK police didnt. Why is that so controversial?
 
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Jiigzz said:
The root issue is that it's been happening for literally decades. It's not just about George Floyd or Breonna Taylor, it's about what they represent. People are sick and tired of their fellow humans being shot to death by police and it being swept under the rug. Noone has been held to account for the Breonna Taylor incident.
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Most people are full of crap, they wont think twice to vote for someone who would drops bombs on a million Africans if they get a free iPad out of it.
 
How many BLM protestors are going to vote for that mass murdering blood thirsty genocide arab killing tryant this November who voted for the war in Iraq, took part in the destruction of Libya and terrorized other nations for decades being responsible for the death and murder of far, far more innocent children than police killings in the USA the past 50 years?

When I say it I mean it, most of these protestors are all hypocritical pieces of donkey krap.

Oh internationally doesnt count? Groper Joe is a big government domestic terrorist that have enabled the oppression of Americans. So there.
 
Jiigzz said:
The root issue is that it's been happening for literally decades. It's not just about George Floyd or Breonna Taylor, it's about what they represent. People are sick and tired of their fellow humans being shot to death by police and it being swept under the rug. Noone has been held to account for the Breonna Taylor incident.

These latest incidents have been the straw that broke the camel's back. Yes, Police should also have due process but that's what people are protesting against - it just doesnt seem to happen UNTIL the public kick up a fuss about it.

People should be held to account for gross misconduct. That doesnt mean they need to be arrested for murder, but some kind of accountability process.

If you want people to trust the police, give them a reason to trust you. Then people say "well if you just comply you wont die", why are those the only 2 options? Non-compliance should not be a death sentence.

This really shouldnt even be argued. People have a right to life and that right to life should not be taken away without good cause.

It just seems to be such an issue for US cops to reach for the firearm as a defusal tactic. In most countries this is the literal last resort. A video I posted a while back compares US and UK police responding to a knife wielding suspects. The US police killed every single one. The UK police didnt. Why is that so controversial?
Click to expand...

you did not answer my question...how would the people of new zealand react if 65 police had been killed in 6 months?
 
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