14 weeks out, 1st Raw Meet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    I know most people think (and to a point I agree) that oly training has little to no place in PL training...but i have learned so much about how to activate my body and making it move faster, or make it stronger with them...I just fell in love with it. Just this week I finally got how to make that kinda spring reflex on the hip that kinda has to activate between the first and second pull for snatch...even though i wasn't doing snatch...Idk it just clicked in. I ended up through up just a set of 3 for snatch and got my 115x3 MUCH easier and it felt so light and right...

    That aside, bro you are a lean, ripped, strong machine! I'm sure your oly lifts are pretty sick even without training them for a while!
    Haven't always been too good at them but I place some at the beginning of workouts to get things going. May have to start them back up again soon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bolt10 View Post
    Haven't always been too good at them but I place some at the beginning of workouts to get things going. May have to start them back up again soon.
    Well FWIW I am not a bodybuilder, and my looks are not my number 1 goal...but functionality wise, the Trap, rear deltoid and hamstring growth I have gotten from Clean-Pulls, Powercleans and Snatches is superb...Jerks have done a pretty good job on my tri's and front delts too, so it might be worth looking into for the Physique trainee too
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    http://youtu.be/7I0xjPNGtLM

    ^he's strong AND jacked
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    I know most people think (and to a point I agree) that oly training has little to no place in PL training...but i have learned so much about how to activate my body and making it move faster, or make it stronger with them...I just fell in love with it. Just this week I finally got how to make that kinda spring reflex on the hip that kinda has to activate between the first and second pull for snatch...even though i wasn't doing snatch...Idk it just clicked in. I ended up through up just a set of 3 for snatch and got my 115x3 MUCH easier and it felt so light and right...

    That aside, bro you are a lean, ripped, strong machine! I'm sure your oly lifts are pretty sick even without training them for a while!
    Here's the problem with Oly lifts: you can't just dabble in them. You have to make them your priority because they are so highly technical and, from a PL perspective, they don't have great carryover since they have no eccentric movement. While I do agree force production and bar speed is important, Oly lifts lack specificity to PL movements. The dynamic effort is enough to train the speed-strength aspect and trains the direct motor programming instead of hoping for carryover from a completely different movement.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Here's the problem with Oly lifts: you can't just dabble in them. You have to make them your priority because they are so highly technical and, from a PL perspective, they don't have great carryover since they have no eccentric movement. While I do agree force production and bar speed is important, Oly lifts lack specificity to PL movements. The dynamic effort is enough to train the speed-strength aspect and trains the direct motor programming instead of hoping for carryover from a completely different movement.
    I do agree here too...there's little to no carryover BUT...in my case Rodja, I did not get carryover at all (like you said)...BUT I did learn to move faster...Idk I know it makes no sense since you do not need mind muscle connection for powerlifting , more like staying tight through the motion but I did not even know how to activate that BOOM reflex...always had been a lazy sob and never lifted...I guess it just taught me how to tell my body to move faster.

    Agreeing with yah, it has had NO carryover whatsoever in my bench press, in my squat or deadlift as in actual numbers, but it has kinda prepared my mind to stay tight and just go BAM on a lift...and THAT has helped on my dead and squat...perhaps not muscle fiber , movement or specificity wise...but confidence and mentally wise they have helped me...idk I can't even explain it...and I'm most likely looking like a fool trying to explain it, when in the end I do agree with you...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    I do agree here too...there's little to no carryover BUT...in my case Rodja, I did not get carryover at all (like you said)...BUT I did learn to move faster...Idk I know it makes no sense since you do not need mind muscle connection for powerlifting , more like staying tight through the motion but I did not even know how to activate that BOOM reflex...always had been a lazy sob and never lifted...I guess it just taught me how to tell my body to move faster.

    Agreeing with yah, it has had NO carryover whatsoever in my bench press, in my squat or deadlift as in actual numbers, but it has kinda prepared my mind to stay tight and just go BAM on a lift...and THAT has helped on my dead and squat...perhaps not muscle fiber , movement or specificity wise...but confidence and mentally wise they have helped me...idk I can't even explain it...and I'm most likely looking like a fool trying to explain it, when in the end I do agree with you...
    wat
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    Quote Originally Posted by NomZ View Post
    wat
    Uh it's a convo I had with Rodja a while ago...I guess I should explain what I mean...

    I mean that through your mind should be going: "Stay tight, do it right" for example...on a squat, you do not think:

    "Press quads, clutch cheeks...squeeze!!" I mean to say...you need to concentrate on a MOVEMENT , as a whole...not focus on a specific muscle...more like "Stay tight..."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    Uh it's a convo I had with Rodja a while ago...I guess I should explain what I mean...

    I mean that through your mind should be going: "Stay tight, do it right" for example...on a squat, you do not think:

    "Press quads, clutch cheeks...squeeze!!" I mean to say...you need to concentrate on a MOVEMENT , as a whole...not focus on a specific muscle...more like "Stay tight..."
    Eh don't really agree, such as hips through being done so by glute activation. Lats while benching, deadlifting, etc etc.

    It's not bodybuilding, but it's not as cut and dry as you said IMO.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NomZ View Post
    Eh don't really agree, such as hips through being done so by glute activation. Lats while benching, deadlifting, etc etc.

    It's not bodybuilding, but it's not as cut and dry as you said IMO.
    Aah Idk how to explain, and I did phrase it in a really BOLD way, I just mean you have to focus (on bench for example) on flexing the back keeping it TIGHT and keeping the arch on the lower back tight...perhaps that in a way is MM connection but I see it as "staying tight" , then again you DO need to connect to it though...

    BTW You train PL too...any good Hip and Glute exercises to add in for building strength there as assistance?

    I already do and periodize Good mornings, Hip thrusts, Lunges, Lunges to the side, Romanian and hypers :/
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    Aah Idk how to explain, and I did phrase it in a really BOLD way, I just mean you have to focus (on bench for example) on flexing the back keeping it TIGHT and keeping the arch on the lower back tight...perhaps that in a way is MM connection but I see it as "staying tight" , then again you DO need to connect to it though...

    BTW You train PL too...any good Hip and Glute exercises to add in for building strength there as assistance?

    I already do and periodize Good mornings, Hip thrusts, Lunges, Lunges to the side, Romanian and hypers :/
    GHRs

    All those exercises are good.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NomZ View Post
    GHRs

    All those exercises are good.
    Roger that! Thanks bro.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    I do agree here too...there's little to no carryover BUT...in my case Rodja, I did not get carryover at all (like you said)...BUT I did learn to move faster...Idk I know it makes no sense since you do not need mind muscle connection for powerlifting , more like staying tight through the motion but I did not even know how to activate that BOOM reflex...always had been a lazy sob and never lifted...I guess it just taught me how to tell my body to move faster.

    Agreeing with yah, it has had NO carryover whatsoever in my bench press, in my squat or deadlift as in actual numbers, but it has kinda prepared my mind to stay tight and just go BAM on a lift...and THAT has helped on my dead and squat...perhaps not muscle fiber , movement or specificity wise...but confidence and mentally wise they have helped me...idk I can't even explain it...and I'm most likely looking like a fool trying to explain it, when in the end I do agree with you...
    Outside of maybe deads (and this is only for a period of time), there's not really a time when you just relax and then do the movement since tightness is always the number one requirement. I get what you're trying to say, but, when it comes to pre-meet prep, you have to dial it in and focus on getting your total. Far too often, and this really applies when you're just starting out, lifters add in too much and too many lifts.
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    Good stuff in here. I wish my gym had a GHR station. I was trying to do them by locking into a pull down apparatus and falling away from the machine...felt a little weird, but might try again.

    Good luck on prepping for first meet! Will be following.

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    Ok this past week was hectic, and a lot of mistakes were made in the gym...atm i'm on a different city & country altogether, without classes...so time to get serious since it's 11 weeks out today.

    First off Change of Plans.

    Monday: Squat ME (with assistances included) + HIIT (sprints or build ups with a 30 second hold)
    Tuesday: Bench ME + Upper pull and push assistance.
    Wednesday: LISS beach run , or walk for however much I feel like...technically just a rest day.
    Thursday: Squat DE (with assistances) + HIIT
    Friday: Bench DE + Upper Pull and Push assistance, more emphasis on prehab today.
    Saturday: HIIT.
    Sunday: Rest.

    OR

    Monday: Squat ME and assistances + HIIT
    Tuesday: Bench ME + Push/Pull assistances
    Wednesday: Deadlift ME and assistances+ HIIT
    Thursday: Bench DE + Push/Pull assistances and prehab.
    Friday: Squat DE + HIIT
    Saturday: rest
    Sunday: rest.

    Assistances for lower body ME or DE days would be 1 hip/glute movement , 1 quad movement and 1-2 core movements.

    Assistances for upper body ME or DE would be 1 back width and 1 back strength, 1 triceps push , 1 supplemental part of bench lift (weather floor press or any other movement helping the bottom or lower portion of the movement) and 1-2 shoulder and/or scapula prehab exercises.

    Thoughts? (If anyone would care to jump in) In case it's plan A (with only 4 lifting days) I would do 2-3 weeks of squats and then 1-2 weeks of deads and speed pulls...specially since I don't think it's alright to mix wide stance squat and sumo deadlift. Yet it is a contest prep...and I need Bench and Squat to really go up...so I'm up for suggestions and comments.
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    You need to be squatting and deadlifting, not one or the other. Plan B in that case, with an off day in the middle after Day 2, not 2 days off at the end of the week.

    Good luck recovering from that much HIIT as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NomZ View Post
    You need to be squatting and deadlifting, not one or the other. Plan B in that case, with an off day in the middle after Day 2, not 2 days off at the end of the week.

    Good luck recovering from that much HIIT as well.
    HIIT 3x a week bad? But yeah thought about making wednesday a recovery day...sorta like

    Mon-Squat ME
    Tue-Bench ME
    Wed-rest
    Thu-Dead ME
    Fri-Bench DE
    Sat-squat DE

    Or in that case I could skip Squat ME better and just do:

    Mon-Dead ME HIIT
    Tue-Bench ME
    Wed-LISS
    Thu-Squat DE
    Fri-Bench DE
    Sat-HIIT
    Sun-Rest
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    HIIT 3x a week bad? But yeah thought about making wednesday a recovery day...sorta like

    Mon-Squat ME
    Tue-Bench ME
    Wed-rest
    Thu-Dead ME
    Fri-Bench DE
    Sat-squat DE

    Or in that case I could skip Squat ME better and just do:

    Mon-Dead ME HIIT
    Tue-Bench ME
    Wed-LISS
    Thu-Squat DE
    Fri-Bench DE
    Sat-HIIT
    Sun-Rest
    You should be doing heavy squats.

    HIIT with proper intensity plus all the squat/dead volume is a lot to recover from, 1-2x is plenty.

    Are you doing cardio for what reason, health?
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    Quote Originally Posted by NomZ View Post
    You should be doing heavy squats.

    HIIT with proper intensity plus all the squat/dead volume is a lot to recover from, 1-2x is plenty.

    Are you doing cardio for what reason, health?
    Health and some family time...my dad never works out and kinda hates the fact I do, he came up to me today and told me he wanted to go walking or maybe even jogging with me...so basically real leisure stuff. The HIIT however, yeah that's more for fat loss. I can take not being under 10% without a problem, but I don't wanna turn into a blob.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    Health and some family time...my dad never works out and kinda hates the fact I do, he came up to me today and told me he wanted to go walking or maybe even jogging with me...so basically real leisure stuff. The HIIT however, yeah that's more for fat loss. I can take not being under 10% without a problem, but I don't wanna turn into a blob.
    Just don't go too crazy with the cardio. If fat gain is a problem, adjust your diet, too much cardio is going to slow your progress.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NomZ View Post
    Just don't go too crazy with the cardio. If fat gain is a problem, adjust your diet, too much cardio is going to slow your progress.
    I'll keep HIIT 2x a week then , cardio will be just that, liss and boding time I guess. I can always just adjust the carb intake then.
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    Final Schedule Decision for this 11 weeks left...

    Monday: Squat ME and assistances + HIIT
    Tuesday: Bench ME + Push/Pull assistances
    Wednesday: Rest.
    Thursday: Deadlift ME and assistances+ HIIT
    Friday: Bench DE + Push/Pull assistances and prehab.
    Saturday: Squat DE + assistances
    Sunday: rest.

    Todays work was Squat DE and assistance.

    -Squat DE
    Wamup:
    95x5
    95x5

    Working sets:
    -135x3
    -135x3
    -135x3
    -135x3
    -135x3
    -135x3
    -145x3
    -145x3
    -145x3
    -155x3

    All at maximum pushing speed, felt nice...it was a bit harder than I thought though.

    Lunges:
    75x8
    75x8
    95x8
    95x8
    95x8

    Leg Press (close stance full ROM and explosive, dead stop at the bottom, pushing in a DE fashion)
    2 plates x 6
    2 plates x 6
    2 plates x 6
    2 plates and a quarter x 6
    2 plates quarter x 6

    Standing Oblique weighted crunches (reps each side)
    45x10
    45x10
    45x10
    45x10
    45x10

    Decline crunches (real slow down, explosive up)
    BWx10
    BWx10
    BWx10
    BWx10
    BWx10
    BWx10

    Conditioning, no conditioning.

    Weight: Won't weight in more than once a week, it will be on sundays. Diet was adjusted to maintain for now, in this week or the next I'll decide if I drop to go into the 132 class , or if I put up some more mass for the 148lb class.

    Supps today:
    -1 scoop FXT + bronkaid
    -1g ALCAR
    -2g COP
    -2x doses of EC
    -3g mcc
    -5 caps of SNS Beta Alanine (spaced through the day)
    Forgot to add citrulline malate '
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    Woke up more sore than I had been in the past month. Anyhow, stretched a lot this morning (Dynamic Stretching) and went for a LISS beach walk with my father, some nice bonding time indeed...he also wanted to do a little race to see how fast he was compared to me in a 200m distance...aw well I smoked him but for once he told me I must be doing something right.

    kCalories are kept normal for now, yet I'll carb load in the dinner with some relatives and get ready for Sumo day tomorrow.

    Question for NomZ and/or Rodja (if he is still around ) is it a problem if I am doing Wide Stance Squat AND Sumo for just the contest prep? Or is it gonna lead to hip flexor/abductor problems? Hamstring pull risk too maybe?
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    IF those are your competition lifts, then train that way. You'll need to listen to your hip flexors/adductors, but they can handle the load when codnitioned properly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NomZ View Post
    IF those are your competition lifts, then train that way. You'll need to listen to your hip flexors/adductors, but they can handle the load when codnitioned properly.
    Yeah those are my comp lifts...thanks NomZ
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    Lower Body ME , Sumo deadlift.

    -135x5
    -135x5
    -185x3
    -225x3
    -275x3
    -285x3
    -295x1
    -300x1
    -300x1
    -305x1

    Wanted to go higher but I was feeling fatigued already, and the condition upon I am allowed to dead lift in this gym is to NOT drop the bar hard...thought if I went for 315 I would drop it today, so I decided to take the concept of ME that it's the strain and the effort put into it, not always breaking records...

    Stiff Legged deadlift:

    -135x8
    -185x8
    -185x8
    -185x8
    -185x6
    -185x5

    Hyper extensions (full stop at bottom , explosive up with a dead stop hold for 1-2 secs...)
    -BW+25x8
    -BW+25x8
    -BW+25x8
    -BW+45x6
    -BW+45x6

    Hanging leg raises, full ROM
    BWx10
    BWx10
    BWx10
    BWx10
    BWx10

    Standing Cable crunches
    80x15
    80x15
    80x15
    80x15
    80x15

    Felt good...need more power output, yet I somehow feel a bit at a loss now...my nutrition is not exactly on point due to being in this dungeon that my parents call "home"...and the fact they have a knack of complaining about my eating habits a lot...no matter I'll figure this out.
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    Your hips will be gone with your current template by the time of the meet. Even with supportive gear, two ME lower body sessions with a wide stance is a recipe for some impingements.

    With that recent session, you're starting to get close to the edge of Prilepin's chart and 5# jumps are a waste of energy.
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    Ok back to a normal more stable training habitat (the US) with a better schedule now, also we are going to a meet at the end of february to watch only, but still competing in march.

    Schedule now is: Monday, Wednesday, Friday, Saturday. Life, work and school...anyhow today was lower ME...and since I already did around 3 weeks of ME low bar squat, I decided to come back and revisit for a week or 2 my Sumo.

    ME Sumo:
    135x5
    185x5
    225x5
    245x3
    255x3
    265x3
    275x3
    285x3
    290x2
    300x1
    300x1

    Good mornings:
    135x6
    135x6
    155x6
    160x6

    I found a better position for these, and my hamstring flexibility is up so it was pretty good and I felt them even better now.

    Hip Thrust (bridges)
    225x8
    315x6
    365x6
    365x6

    Lunges
    4 sets of 115x8 each leg.

    Decline weighted abs (plate behind head and explosive eccentric with slow concentric)
    6 sets of BW+10x15

    Conditioning:
    15 minutes of Incline Treadmill @ 15% & 2.5mph

    I liked it today, my hip flexor strain I had is out of the equation again so I can train Sumo again, and I have been more mindful of my form so I don't mess it up again.

    Totals as of now:

    Sumo: 320
    Low Bar Squat: 245
    Bench: 195 paused (working hard on this one...)

    Wide stance is out of my equation for competition, I find better control and more power on the Low Bar now...
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    You know, I was just watching Dan Green doing some wide stance AND low bar squats. Ever consider those? Or are the wide feet a problem? I've been training sumo, but when the weights get really high for me, I do bring my feet in, so I can relate.
    Training log:
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    Dude...you've got to quit the tiny ass jumps in weight. 285 to 290 is mindless volume and just tires you out by the time you get to the top set. You took only 3 sets to get to 225 and then another 6 to get to 300. At most, 4 would've been sufficient.

    My take:
    135
    185
    225
    245
    265
    285
    300-315

    You also have to remember you're training for a meet and you will not have the option to take this much time and energy to get to your opener. Also, remember that you'll be fatigued going into deads and doing these small jumps will sap whatever energy you have remaining from squats and bench.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Dude...you've got to quit the tiny ass jumps in weight. 285 to 290 is mindless volume and just tires you out by the time you get to the top set. You took only 3 sets to get to 225 and then another 6 to get to 300. At most, 4 would've been sufficient.

    My take:
    135
    185
    225
    245
    265
    285
    300-315

    You also have to remember you're training for a meet and you will not have the option to take this much time and energy to get to your opener. Also, remember that you'll be fatigued going into deads and doing these small jumps will sap whatever energy you have remaining from squats and bench.
    That explains the fatigue :/ I'll make bigger jumps base on that idea better...I thought the 6-8 ME lifts should be after the warm up sets, didn't take into consideration I was just tiring myself out.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    That explains the fatigue :/ I'll make bigger jumps base on that idea better...I thought the 6-8 ME lifts should be after the warm up sets, didn't take into consideration I was just tiring myself out.
    Not sure what you mean by the 6-8. The amount of sets it takes to work up is going to vary on the persons strength level. You and I are not going to take the same amount of sets to work up to 90%.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Not sure what you mean by the 6-8. The amount of sets it takes to work up is going to vary on the persons strength level. You and I are not going to take the same amount of sets to work up to 90%.
    I thought ME was as DE , 6-8 sets and then when 3 were heavy you jumped into singles.

    And yeah...not enough weight for me to jump into 90% for me since my numbers are lower haha...I'll adjust it and try it out from now on , you know bigger jumps to reach 90% while keeping it balanced...like you said , took me 3 to get to 225 , shouldn't get me that many mroe to get to 300-315 (90%).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    I thought ME was as DE , 6-8 sets and then when 3 were heavy you jumped into singles.

    And yeah...not enough weight for me to jump into 90% for me since my numbers are lower haha...I'll adjust it and try it out from now on , you know bigger jumps to reach 90% while keeping it balanced...like you said , took me 3 to get to 225 , shouldn't get me that many mroe to get to 300-315 (90%).
    I've never read anything stating that as, like I said, it varies too much for each person. What you should be using is Prilepin's chart to monitor your volume at a certain percentage, but ME is not about sets at all. It's simply about volume at a given percentage and effort for that day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    I've never read anything stating that as, like I said, it varies too much for each person. What you should be using is Prilepin's chart to monitor your volume at a certain percentage, but ME is not about sets at all. It's simply about volume at a given percentage and effort for that day.
    I'm gonna stick more to Prilepin's chart and schedule a bit more now :/ it appears a belt is considered raw too, so I could use that as the "gear" portion of it...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    I'm gonna stick more to Prilepin's chart and schedule a bit more now :/ it appears a belt is considered raw too, so I could use that as the "gear" portion of it...
    I can't tell you enough to not even waste your time with USAPL. They're asshols that think all of the other federations are inferior to them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post

    I can't tell you enough to not even waste your time with USAPL. They're asshols that think all of the other federations are inferior to them.
    :S damn I keep hearing that from not only you man, but many more...I just don't got the knowledge about gear, the team , the gym, no one...besides I don't know anything about shirts , briefs or wraps , I don't even know the thee federations...wish I knew more or knew a team from here in the valley
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    :S damn I keep hearing that from not only you man, but many more...I just don't got the knowledge about gear, the team , the gym, no one...besides I don't know anything about shirts , briefs or wraps , I don't even know the thee federations...wish I knew more or knew a team from here in the valley
    Search here:Powerlifting Meets | Powerlifting Watch


    I'll be coaching at the USPA meet in Austin on 3/23. You don't have to do geared meets as every fed has a raw section, but USAPL is, IMO, a very arrogant and elitist fed.
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    Sucks. USAPL is the only thing close to me and within a decent amout of time.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Search here:Powerlifting Meets | Powerlifting Watch


    I'll be coaching at the USPA meet in Austin on 3/23. You don't have to do geared meets as every fed has a raw section, but USAPL is, IMO, a very arrogant and elitist fed.
    Oh that sounds fine, I'll check it out right now. Thanks bro.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sean1332 View Post
    Sucks. USAPL is the only thing close to me and within a decent amout of time.
    Same bro! You going to the one in february or march?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celorza View Post
    Oh that sounds fine, I'll check it out right now. Thanks bro.

    Same bro! You going to the one in february or march?
    In May, MA state. APA in July back in my home state.
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