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    Quote Originally Posted by faaipdeoiad View Post
    if ur really worried maybe just take some arganine aakg or something with bcaas.on second look it seems like what ur taking is essentially that.
    basically it is, so im just going to keep it up. how has the progress been on your cut? i know you told me your cardio, but hows your diet look?

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    While using ECY at quite high doses I'd not mess with any sort of stims, but I always threw my daily Neovar in.

    So don't know, I don't think you need the stim out of an NO, but you could certainly use a nice creatine product.
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    Quote Originally Posted by KgTomCat View Post
    basically it is, so im just going to keep it up. how has the progress been on your cut? i know you told me your cardio, but hows your diet look?
    ive been cutting for a good couple of months now. overall progress has been pretty good, lost alot of bf but a bit of muscle too. i was on dcp/geranium/recreate before the ecy and to be honest i noticed more from that which surprised me. ive been doing ecy for about 2 weeks and i think im making a little progress but not at the rate i expected. im gonna keep it up for 2 more weeks then increase calories for a bit.

    im down to about 190, im eating an average of 2700 cals a day. (doing low intensity cardio every morning, lifting 5 times a week w/ hiit on non lift days). i was implementing a form of carb cycling but ive gotten a bit less strict with it. on my off days i keep it at about 50g carbs, high days 250-300 (1-2 a week) and the rest at about 100-150 carbs. Im aiming for higher protein now since i started losing size so about 300-350g. rest is fats.

    i primarily just eat fruits for carbs, with occasional oats/grain bread. berries seem to be a wonder for me since they fill me up and taste delicious with so little carb content. i blend them into all my shakes with sugarfree soymilk and peanut butter and protein powder. i found this to be a good way of staying full/ quickly eating healthy. aside from that i stick to beef/chicken/turkey with occasional fish. vegetables (primarily celery and spinach and onions) and tons of almonds. let me know if u need any more specifics, i usually just grill whatever meat i can find with some vegetables and fruit in the morning/pre/postworkout.

    im thinking im stalling just because ive been cutting for so long and i might just need a break. i love having abs again though. also my tolerance to stims is beginning to scare me. i can sleep pretty soon after taking 25mg ephedra, 10mg yohimbine and 200 caffine whereas before id be up all night. i love the effects of ephedra though even if i dont notice the fatburning as much.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bla55 View Post
    While using ECY at quite high doses I'd not mess with any sort of stims, but I always threw my daily Neovar in.

    So don't know, I don't think you need the stim out of an NO, but you could certainly use a nice creatine product.
    ive been wondering about that. ive always been told to use creatine while cutting but imo i dont notice much from them. i have a couple tubs of green mag/ cell mass. i guess i could give it a shot. it would give me a break from no for a bit
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    Any opinions on this product?

    Mahuang (10% extract for 10mg of ephedra alkaloids) 100mg
    Norephedrine 40mg
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    Caffeine USP 200mg
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    Boswellia 250mg
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    Chromium Picolinate 1mg
    Pantothenic Acid 200mg
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    would i take an eca stack before working out?
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    ECA stack pre workout yes.

    For me it worked best at 30mins prior.

    I also cycle for 2 weeks on and 2 off. As when i was on a constant dose of 30mg, after maybe 5 weeks, i needed 50mg and then that wasent cutting it, so cycling helped me a great deal.
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    Quote Originally Posted by faaipdeoiad View Post
    ive been cutting for a good couple of months now. overall progress has been pretty good, lost alot of bf but a bit of muscle too. i was on dcp/geranium/recreate before the ecy and to be honest i noticed more from that which surprised me. ive been doing ecy for about 2 weeks and i think im making a little progress but not at the rate i expected. im gonna keep it up for 2 more weeks then increase calories for a bit.

    im down to about 190, im eating an average of 2700 cals a day. (doing low intensity cardio every morning, lifting 5 times a week w/ hiit on non lift days). i was implementing a form of carb cycling but ive gotten a bit less strict with it. on my off days i keep it at about 50g carbs, high days 250-300 (1-2 a week) and the rest at about 100-150 carbs. Im aiming for higher protein now since i started losing size so about 300-350g. rest is fats.

    i primarily just eat fruits for carbs, with occasional oats/grain bread. berries seem to be a wonder for me since they fill me up and taste delicious with so little carb content. i blend them into all my shakes with sugarfree soymilk and peanut butter and protein powder. i found this to be a good way of staying full/ quickly eating healthy. aside from that i stick to beef/chicken/turkey with occasional fish. vegetables (primarily celery and spinach and onions) and tons of almonds. let me know if u need any more specifics, i usually just grill whatever meat i can find with some vegetables and fruit in the morning/pre/postworkout.

    im thinking im stalling just because ive been cutting for so long and i might just need a break. i love having abs again though. also my tolerance to stims is beginning to scare me. i can sleep pretty soon after taking 25mg ephedra, 10mg yohimbine and 200 caffine whereas before id be up all night. i love the effects of ephedra though even if i dont notice the fatburning as much.
    Quote Originally Posted by faaipdeoiad View Post
    ive been wondering about that. ive always been told to use creatine while cutting but imo i dont notice much from them. i have a couple tubs of green mag/ cell mass. i guess i could give it a shot. it would give me a break from no for a bit
    Ive read about carb cycling also, Im a little against it though...a break may do u good, I'd suggest 2-3 weeks, if you've been cutting for a few months, and u have a high tolerance for the stims...i've been taking creatine ethyl ester and love it, also Ive started to incorporate Y into my cut...deff can feel the difference, Im dosing 1/2/3/3/2/1...so ultimately a 6 week ECY but we'll see how it goes
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0-hero View Post
    ECA stack pre workout yes.

    For me it worked best at 30mins prior.

    I also cycle for 2 weeks on and 2 off. As when i was on a constant dose of 30mg, after maybe 5 weeks, i needed 50mg and then that wasent cutting it, so cycling helped me a great deal.
    I may try this, depending on how it goes, this is my first cut using an ECY so I'm not sure how it will work out
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    eca or clen never gave me the shakes.. and i ran clen up to 200
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJbreed View Post
    eca or clen never gave me the shakes.. and i ran clen up to 200
    what were your results
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRONPOPE View Post
    No fat burner is more effective than the ECA stack...or if u can stand it the ECY stack...so why waste money on fat burners that dont stack up...

    i dont get it? none of them can touch the ECA..
    if they could...they would be banned for fat loss just like Ephedra is
    To make bold statements such as this, one must first have data for which to justify the statement. Without delving into the legality dilemma, I would have to say there are things out there that can compare the the ECA stack, and perhaps even outperform.

    As for your question, I think you've answered it, implicitly. If the other fatburners were as strong as ephedra, they would be banned. Why don't people buy ECA? Probably because it is banned. For example, to get it in my state, you are limited to so many mg's per month. When you purchase, you must shown identification, and sign a waiver. This waiver is then sent to the DEA for documentation. If you go over your limit, you get a visitor. Remember, this compound is also used to make illegal drugs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by thesinner View Post
    To make bold statements such as this, one must first have data for which to justify the statement. Without delving into the legality dilemma, I would have to say there are things out there that can compare the the ECA stack, and perhaps even outperform.

    As for your question, I think you've answered it, implicitly. If the other fatburners were as strong as ephedra, they would be banned. Why don't people buy ECA? Probably because it is banned. For example, to get it in my state, you are limited to so many mg's per month. When you purchase, you must shown identification, and sign a waiver. This waiver is then sent to the DEA for documentation. If you go over your limit, you get a visitor. Remember, this compound is also used to make illegal drugs.
    Agreed, SX wipes the floor with ECA/Clen.

    Especially in terms of risk Vs reward.
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    Ive never understood from the start why we would even compare ECA/ECY to Clen lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by thesinner View Post
    To make bold statements such as this, one must first have data for which to justify the statement. Without delving into the legality dilemma, I would have to say there are things out there that can compare the the ECA stack, and perhaps even outperform.

    As for your question, I think you've answered it, implicitly. If the other fatburners were as strong as ephedra, they would be banned. Why don't people buy ECA? Probably because it is banned. For example, to get it in my state, you are limited to so many mg's per month. When you purchase, you must shown identification, and sign a waiver. This waiver is then sent to the DEA for documentation. If you go over your limit, you get a visitor. Remember, this compound is also used to make illegal drugs.
    QUESTION? if EPHEDRA was unbanned tommorrow... how fast would AX have a ECA based Fatburner on the marker?
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0-hero View Post
    Agreed, SX wipes the floor with ECA/Clen.

    Especially in terms of risk Vs reward.

    Thats a BOLDDDDDDDDDDDDD statement
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    Quote Originally Posted by KgTomCat View Post
    what were your results
    Summer clen fun
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    thanks
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRONPOPE View Post
    Thats a BOLDDDDDDDDDDDDD statement
    You know it brah.

    Run in excess of 10 ECA supps over 8 years and nothings come close to 2 SX caps at 6am.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0-hero View Post
    You know it brah.

    Run in excess of 10 ECA supps over 8 years and nothings come close to 2 SX caps at 6am.
    Hello

    you talk about of Slim Xtreme or what?
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    bump...SX-Slim Xteme?
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRONPOPE View Post
    QUESTION? if EPHEDRA was unbanned tommorrow... how fast would AX have a ECA based Fatburner on the marker?
    No idea. AX isn't about using the latest fad regardless of safety. Our products, goal, and current arsenal are geared toward innovative and new ideas that show real results within very acceptable safety parameters. For example, 3-AD came out as a non-methyl with very low sides and a high safety factor. Could we have put out a methyl with harsh sides, need for a SERM for PCT and other toxicity issues? Sure! But why??? I've used ephedra products back in the day, specifically the original Ultimate Orange, and it was incredible. But I didn't know the risks nor understand why my heart was racing so much to the point where I became really concerned. Even if it was approved for wide-spread use again, I'm sure that it'd take a LOT of thought, research, and even legal investigation/consultation before AX even had something using it on the backburner.

    Quote Originally Posted by 0-hero View Post
    Agreed, SX wipes the floor with ECA/Clen.

    Especially in terms of risk Vs reward.
    Exactly, and IMHO, there's not a single person here that should ever disregard risk vs reward. Take the risks, but don't cry when you can't take 'em.

    Quote Originally Posted by KgTomCat View Post
    bump...SX-Slim Xteme?
    Yes - SX = Slim Xtreme Some of us type so many words that abbreviations are a necessity!
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    Quote Originally Posted by KgTomCat View Post
    bump...SX-Slim Xteme?

    bump .... is it SLIM EXTREME?
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    lol...gotta love those good ole' abbreviations
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    I have a dumb question. Ive been trying to figure out my dosage for Y. I weigh 220-225lbs and one cap is 2.5mg of Y....so what should my daily total be to take?
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    Quote Originally Posted by KgTomCat View Post
    I have a dumb question. Ive been trying to figure out my dosage for Y. I weigh 220-225lbs and one cap is 2.5mg of Y....so what should my daily total be to take?
    i read somewhere that it should be like 1 mg per 10 lbs. so 22/23 mg for u daily?start off with 2 or 3 caps and work ur way up id say. im up to 3-4 4x a day at 2.5 mg each but i think im kind of desensitized to it.

    ive also read that u should start with just ec for a week or so and then add in the y after to get better results. i started off with ec and y and the effects diminished a bit.
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    Quote Originally Posted by faaipdeoiad View Post
    i read somewhere that it should be like 1 mg per 10 lbs. so 22/23 mg for u daily?start off with 2 or 3 caps and work ur way up id say. im up to 3-4 4x a day at 2.5 mg each but i think im kind of desensitized to it.

    ive also read that u should start with just ec for a week or so and then add in the y after to get better results. i started off with ec and y and the effects diminished a bit.
    I read that also, I did start out with just E&C and just started adding in Y...I can tell somewhat of a difference
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRONPOPE View Post
    QUESTION? if EPHEDRA was unbanned tommorrow... how fast would AX have a ECA based Fatburner on the marker?
    Honestly, I don't think AX would go that route.

    Think about it.

    (1) By this point, everyone and their brother has "heard" something about ephedra. It's somewhat of a taboo, associated with nasty cardiovascular effects.
    (2) 1 capsule of SX works (for most) 12+ hours strong. Ephedrine gives you a nice, debilatating crash after about 6-8 hours. Furthermore, users get heavy withdrawal periods when discontinuing, during which, they usually gain the weight back; whereas, (from my experimentations) you can skip a day of SX, and never miss a beat.
    (3) As Tim alluded to, our design team tries to take the users health into consideration. From a business model perspective, it is hard to sell supplements to dead people, so we try not to deliver results so good that they're to die for, but good enough to keep on living. The profiles in SX and LeanFX are designed not only to help you down the pounds, but also provide some nice general health benefits as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by faaipdeoiad View Post
    i read somewhere that it should be like 1 mg per 10 lbs. so 22/23 mg for u daily?start off with 2 or 3 caps and work ur way up id say. im up to 3-4 4x a day at 2.5 mg each but i think im kind of desensitized to it.

    ive also read that u should start with just ec for a week or so and then add in the y after to get better results. i started off with ec and y and the effects diminished a bit.
    It's really tough to dose a stimulant because we have to incorporate available adrenergic receptors as well as body size. There's a wide range of body sizes, literally ranging from midgets (or little people, to be more PC) to giants, and everyone in between. Unfortunately, receptor availability/density has a similarly wide range.

    One guy can take 200mcg of clen and be fine, another guy will take it and wind up in the hospital.
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    Sorry if this is a stupid question but where the heck do you get E from?

    I did ECA ages ago when Ripped Fuel had ephedrine in it but haven't used ephedrine since it was banned.

    Also, haven't we learned that any kind of anti-inflammatory like aspirin impairs muscle growth? Or do people doing ECA not care about that so long as they are cutting?
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    Quote Originally Posted by thesinner View Post
    It's really tough to dose a stimulant because we have to incorporate available adrenergic receptors as well as body size. There's a wide range of body sizes, literally ranging from midgets (or little people, to be more PC) to giants, and everyone in between. Unfortunately, receptor availability/density has a similarly wide range.

    One guy can take 200mcg of clen and be fine, another guy will take it and wind up in the hospital.
    I need your advice on a thought I have...can I send you a PM?
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    Quote Originally Posted by LAGear View Post
    Sorry if this is a stupid question but where the heck do you get E from?

    Also, haven't we learned that any kind of anti-inflammatory like aspirin impairs muscle growth? Or do people doing ECA not care about that so long as they are cutting?
    I got mine at a pharmacy, Bronkaid....but it also has 400mg of Guaifenesin
    thats why Im not using Aspirin in mine, instead doing Yohimbine
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    Quote Originally Posted by KgTomCat View Post
    I got mine at a pharmacy, Bronkaid....but it also has 400mg of Guaifenesin
    thats why Im not using Aspirin in mine, instead doing Yohimbine
    So the only way to get ephedrine is in cold medicine?

    Is there a safety issue or possible side effects from regularly taking cold medicine? If cold medicine is the only option it's unappealing to me.
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    I got a question regarding the EC stack. Do you necessarily need the caffeine or is it just to help aid in fatloss? Also, has anyone ran EC at half doses instead of the full doses.
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    Quote Originally Posted by xjmacx View Post
    I got a question regarding the EC stack. Do you necessarily need the caffeine or is it just to help aid in fatloss? Also, has anyone ran EC at half doses instead of the full doses.
    research it man, every component has a purpose...as stated above, you figure out your own doses
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    Quote Originally Posted by LAGear View Post
    So the only way to get ephedrine is in cold medicine?

    Is there a safety issue or possible side effects from regularly taking cold medicine? If cold medicine is the only option it's unappealing to me.
    I guess so, the G helps with respiratory issues, lately when I get short of breath, I can tell its from the G, but it feels really good, its scary but in a good way
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRONPOPE View Post
    No fat burner is more effective than the ECA stack...or if u can stand it the ECY stack...so why waste money on fat burners that dont stack up...

    i dont get it? none of them can touch the ECA..
    if they could...they would be banned for fat loss just like Ephedra is
    Very broad and sweeping statement.

    When you consider VAT and SAT, Alpha and Beta receptors as well as cortisol.

    ECA will fail you eventually.

    Advanced Fat Loss Discussion (alpha/beta receptors)
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    anyone have a link to get ec i'll get the a myself
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    guys add aspirin every other day,it was used in the original eca for a reason and is has a patent on it.

    There is scientific testing done on it,It keeps the body from stopping the norephrine down regulation.

    add yohimbe to block the bad receptors if you can handle the stim.Here is a paste of an old write up.

    Ephedrine enhances the release of the hormone norepinephrine in the body, and also binds to the same receptors as that hormone, causing excess calories to be converted to heat instead of being stored as fat. It also raises blood pressure. Epinephrine and norepinephrine are also known as adrenaline and noradrenaline. Ephedrine thus acts to stimulate an "adrenaline rush".

    Interactions with caffeine and aspirin can increase the effects of ephedrine. Norepinephrine works in part by increasing the levels of cyclic AMP in cells. Caffeine inhibits the enzyme that breaks down cyclic AMP. Together, ephedrine makes more cyclic AMP, and caffeine prevents it from breaking down. Aspirin inhibits the receptors that turn off release of norepinephrine. So ephedrine releases norepinephrine, and aspirin prevents the release from being turned off.

    Ephedrine by itself has been shown to be ineffective as a weight loss treatment. Ephedrine combined with either caffeine or aspirin was effective. The effect appears to be caused by a reduction in appetite, and preventing the metabolic rate decrease usually associated with a reduced calorie diet.
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    Green Tea Extract (ECGC) will provide similar benefits as it is a COMT inhibitor with the added benefit of being a potent anti-oxidant.

    Take Green Tea Extract (ECGC) and you don't need the caffeine or the aspirin.

    TEA-GCG™ (Green Tea Caps) (100 caps)
  

  
 

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