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    OOO Im dumb...damn bro, 4 ED, wow, I felt amazing at 3 ED...

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    Quote Originally Posted by IRONPOPE View Post
    No fat burner is more effective than the ECA stack...or if u can stand it the ECY stack...so why waste money on fat burners that dont stack up...

    i dont get it? none of them can touch the ECA..
    if they could...they would be banned for fat loss just like Ephedra is
    Agree. I used ECAY(green stinger)+Keto. Really does work compare to clen
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    yea...on the low carb/keto issue, Im only going to eat carbs pre-WO, and those will be 1/4-1/2 cup of oats, and NO CHEATING
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    4 is my highest.

    Im sensative to stimulants and they keep me up.

    has anyone dosed 2 bronk's(50 ephedrine) with 200 caffiene. can one do this. id rather take two doses. for best results a person is not to take them less than 4 hours apart. i try to dose 4 hours apart and if I go any more than this I cannot sleep! does any one know what I mean or has done this?
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    Ive never done it
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    Quote Originally Posted by smeton_yea View Post
    itll wear off after 1-2 weeks then you have to up the dosing
    Yeah I'm already noticing a small drop off on day 3. I'm leaning towards cycling 2 weeks on/off.
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    its best to run it strait though. cycling off 2 weeks on and 2 off works well for Clen. Eca is a whole different thing and people got this mixed up
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    Quote Originally Posted by smeton_yea View Post
    its best to run it strait though. cycling off 2 weeks on and 2 off works well for Clen. Eca is a whole different thing and people got this mixed up
    I thought it was cycled to prevent rapid tolerance buildup? Or is tolerance building inevitable when on ECA?
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDK5386 View Post
    I thought it was cycled to prevent rapid tolerance buildup? Or is tolerance building inevitable when on ECA?
    nope thats clen. people got them mixed up. they work in different ways
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDK5386 View Post
    Yeah I'm already noticing a small drop off on day 3. I'm leaning towards cycling 2 weeks on/off.
    not 2 on 2 off, maybe 4 on 2 off....
    Quote Originally Posted by JDK5386 View Post
    I thought it was cycled to prevent rapid tolerance buildup? Or is tolerance building inevitable when on ECA?
    tolerance is inevitable...on anything
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    Quote Originally Posted by DAdams91982 View Post
    The Y coupled with the E causes a baseline heart increase to a pretty good amount, and spiking blood pressure is an issue. The problem with those two things combined is the micro abrasions the extra pressure and increased rate of blood flow causes when cells strikes the artery walls, giving LDL a place to gain a foothold and build up extra plague at an early stage. With these factors, heart disease has a much more likelihood in the future.

    Y gives you a mental boost because it speeds you up pretty good, and hurts the old appetite, it does nothing in the stack... you cannot even call it a stack. A stack is synergistic, this is just throwing a tin can on a fire to hear it crackle.

    Adams


    Adams what do you think of ECA + Alpha-Y stack? Now that DSADE has alpha burn this is a real possibility and seems it would not cause the same HR and BP problems as the Y with E but I would love to hear your feedback?

    Mr.50
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    Hey all, appreciate the active thread here.

    Started the ECA cycle on Monday, and I'm here on Saturday having dropped 5 pounds (265 to 260) and on schedule with daily workouts (upper body/ HIIT).

    Just ramped up to 2 Bronks, 2 No Doz, and 2 baby aspirins this morning with no sides. Curious...gradually in the next week or two should I be ramping up the E,C, and A past 4/4/4?
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    I wouldnt go more than 4...but its your decision
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    also, just so everyone knows, I had a little cortisol rebound when I went off of ECA, Im taking DHEA now, and its subsiding
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkinnyMinnie View Post
    The government just prefers to be totalitarian in banning them and not risk having people kill themselves with them, even though there are people who are sensible when they use them.
    and its a great thing that all people sensibly use cigarettes, or the government would ban them to. as long as we keep smoking deaths in the usa between 450,000-500,000 every single year, we know its totally sensible and people arent killing themselves that much as the ephedrine users who are just junkies and should be a crime.
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    This is a great video for coming off . He talks about it at the beginning

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqU6mwTmo7A"]YouTube - Drug Withdrawals, Psychiatry, Mental Health Medications[/ame]
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    Quote Originally Posted by KgTomCat View Post
    also, just so everyone knows, I had a little cortisol rebound when I went off of ECA, Im taking DHEA now, and its subsiding
    Did you taper off or just quit cold turkey?
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    good video
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarkHalf View Post
    Did you taper off or just quit cold turkey?
    I know its bad to stop cold turkey, espec on stims such as ECA, I did a 2 day taper...wasn't enough, obviously
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    I love my ECA stack... just as effective as clen IMO
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.50 View Post
    Adams what do you think of ECA + Alpha-Y stack? Now that DSADE has alpha burn this is a real possibility and seems it would not cause the same HR and BP problems as the Y with E but I would love to hear your feedback?

    Mr.50
    I haven't seen any studies to support or defeat AlphaY + ECA. Honestly I am not on board with Alpha-Y, but I am not on board with Yohimbine either. To many factors make Y pretty useless in our uses besides transdermally.

    Don't take this as a jab toward D's product, I am just not well versed in Alpha-Y, as the only things I have read with a strong defense has been put out by vendors. I am sure D has done his homework on it, so may be able to speak better on the subject of Alpha-Y + ECA.

    be that said, to test things out, I would first gather a baseline. Take your BP 3 times per day... say First morning, mid day, and pre bed. Do that for a week to gather an average baseline of unadulterated BP. Then begin ECA for a few days, gathering the same data. Then add in your Alpha-Y, see if you see a rise in resting BP average. Also pay attention to your heart rate... obviously resting heart rate is important, but also gather the data of middle and post exercise... see how long it remains elevated post exercise. These data points are going to be the only way to see how the stack affects your vitals in the long run. I know it sounds like a pain, but better than the long run heart disease.

    It can always be a pretty interest experiment overall as well. I used a blood glucose meter for some of these Insulin "Potentiators" or mimickers or whatever you want to call them... did the gamit of what is available.. and the funny thing... the only thing that really impacted my numbers in any way? Good old ALA (Of any isomer flavors R, K-R, Na-R)... the rest impacted my numbers pretty minimally.

    Doing these little experiments really puts you in touch with your own body chemistry... really helped me decide what supps are junk, and ones stand out.

    Adams
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derekb95svt View Post
    I love my ECA stack... just as effective as clen IMO
    Much safer as well... be it minimal or not, Heart necrosis has been shown in rats dosing clen.

    Don't care if it hasnt been reproduced or not, or what doses they were on... just doesn't tickle my fancy as being worth it... I think i would rather be a bit heavier set!

    Adams
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    DAdams, here is the thread I was talking about earlier supporting Y for better fat loss
    Advanced Fat Loss Discussion (alpha/beta receptors)
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    Quote Originally Posted by KgTomCat View Post
    DAdams, here is the thread I was talking about earlier supporting Y for better fat loss
    Advanced Fat Loss Discussion (alpha/beta receptors)
    I have read that thread, and i believe you missed my point about risk vs. benefit. The risk vs. reward is just not there, and oral Y is a crappy way to stimulate lipolisys unless you are that magical area where the moon lines up with Jupiter.

    A localized Y product stacked with ECA would be fine, and beneficial, but stimulating every receptor in the heart is just downright a stupid idea.

    Adams
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    I see what you mean by stimulating the hearts receptors...
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    Quote Originally Posted by KgTomCat View Post
    I see what you mean by stimulating the hearts receptors...
    I just believe the risk/reward just is not there... now don't get me started on anabolics and any type of fat burner!

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    Quote Originally Posted by DAdams91982 View Post
    I have read that thread, and i believe you missed my point about risk vs. benefit. The risk vs. reward is just not there, and oral Y is a crappy way to stimulate lipolisys unless you are that magical area where the moon lines up with Jupiter.

    A localized Y product stacked with ECA would be fine, and beneficial, but stimulating every receptor in the heart is just downright a stupid idea.

    Adams
    I sort of agree but am giving alpha-y a shot because its cheap enough
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    question guys :

    i am taking lipodrene which has

    sida cordifolia ( 25mg ephedrine group alkaloids ), green tea extract ( 12.5mg caffeine group alkaloids ), YOHIMBE EXTRACT ( bark) ( 1mg yohimbine alkaloids), hydroxytriptophan, and a few other stuff in it

    plus it has 100mg caffeine.


    now for my question, i typically take one of these with a baby aspirin, a cup of coffee or two, and a pill or two of l arginine alpha ketogluterate. is that unsafe? i haven't seen any bad effects, but this discussion has made me wonder if there are any unseen effects on my heart.

    im 22 and healthy btw.
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    Quote Originally Posted by soontobbeast View Post
    question guys :

    i am taking lipodrene which has

    sida cordifolia ( 25mg ephedrine group alkaloids ), green tea extract ( 12.5mg caffeine group alkaloids ), YOHIMBE EXTRACT ( bark) ( 1mg yohimbine alkaloids), hydroxytriptophan, and a few other stuff in it

    plus it has 100mg caffeine.


    now for my question, i typically take one of these with a baby aspirin, a cup of coffee or two, and a pill or two of l arginine alpha ketogluterate. is that unsafe? i haven't seen any bad effects, but this discussion has made me wonder if there are any unseen effects on my heart.

    im 22 and healthy btw.
    it is pretty low on the Yohimbine, so that should not be a concern, I personally wouldnt dose Green Tea with the aspirin, one or the other. As for why they incorporate a mild CNS depressant I can only imagine is to mellow out the EC, but wouldnt trust it since it in and of itself has shown some heart valve issues... that and it is either up or down... not both.

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    so i can get away with not taking the aspirin even if it has that small amount of GTE in it?

    will i lose any of the fat burning effects by getting rid of the aspirin?
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    Quote Originally Posted by soontobbeast View Post
    so i can get away with not taking the aspirin even if it has that small amount of GTE in it?

    will i lose any of the fat burning effects by getting rid of the aspirin?
    Depends... what is the amount of GTE, and not just the caffeine content within the GTE?

    Aspirin is the way to go overall... it has the effect on cAMP you are looking for, prolonging the life of ephedrine. That is why I advocate the ECA stack, none of the other fluff, cause really it is all just marketing in the long run.
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    How can GTE hurt?
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    i dont know how much GTE is actually in it.

    stupid proprietary blend.

    what i do know is that it has 557mg of stuff in the blend.

    25mg is ephedrine ( 1st ingredient ), citrus aurantium ( 10mg synephrine ) and the GTE is the third ingredient.

    so, i really am not sure lol. however, the plus side is i just found out that synephrine is in fact bitter orange.
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    Quote Originally Posted by justreading View Post
    How can GTE hurt?
    GTE can simulate aspirin in some facets, mixing the two can thin the blood quite a bit... some substitute GTE for Aspirin, but it does not provide the prostaglandin/cAMP activity that Aspirin does. So adding GTE does not add in any benefits, but can produce some unwanted effects. So I personally would just remain safe and leave it out for your ECA run. if you want the antioxidants, there are plenty of ways to add those in without the GTE.

    Just more of a unnecessary risk... overblown... probably, but why tempt it without and added benefit?

    you should not mix green tea and aspirin because they both prevent platelets from clotting. Using the two together may increase your risk of bleeding.
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    another question :

    when i first started taking my ECA stack about 7 weeks ago, when i would go to the gym i'd feel like i was on cocaine or something. extreme focus, completely deferred fatigue, increased strength,basically i felt like i could keep working out all day

    now when i go i don't get that strong of effect anymore. i've taken two 5 day breaks in the past 2 months.

    my question is, even if i am not getting that strong of a body high anymore, am i still getting the thermogenesis? if not, how long should i get off of the stack to make my tolerance go back down?

    my two bottles have exp dates of august, so ive been trying to avoid taking breaks or i won't be able to get through them in time. given that info, please advise
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    Quote Originally Posted by soontobbeast View Post
    another question :

    when i first started taking my ECA stack about 7 weeks ago, when i would go to the gym i'd feel like i was on cocaine or something. extreme focus, completely deferred fatigue, increased strength,basically i felt like i could keep working out all day

    now when i go i don't get that strong of effect anymore. i've taken two 5 day breaks in the past 2 months.

    my question is, even if i am not getting that strong of a body high anymore, am i still getting the thermogenesis? if not, how long should i get off of the stack to make my tolerance go back up?

    my two bottles have exp dates of august, so ive been trying to avoid taking breaks or i won't be able to get through them in time. given that info, please advise
    The extreme energy tails off after time, but the chemical reactions are still in the works.

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    awesome. thanks so much adams . you're the man dude.
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    So do you think the a-yoh is a bad idea?
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    Quote Originally Posted by justreading View Post
    So do you think the a-yoh is a bad idea?
    I am not sure.. i am not well versed in the alpha... you can watch your vitals as I detailed out on the last page, and you can gauge for yourself. I know regular Yohimbine and ECA is a no-no, I dont know the effects on the CNS/BP/HR of the alpha product.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KgTomCat View Post
    I know its bad to stop cold turkey, espec on stims such as ECA, I did a 2 day taper...wasn't enough, obviously
    You probably should taper off one week at a time..so run your ECA 1/2/3/4/3/2/1 done.
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