Homemade preworkout vs premade one

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    You won't get an Rx as most physicians regonize stimulant-induced adrenal fatigue is non existent. But that combo is awesome, yup
    Yea I know thats what I'm a bit leery about.. I'm goin to tell them straight up that it's from abuse of stimulants..Besides, how hard is it to prescribe hydrocortisone in small doses? .I hope they aren't ignorant b/c I can't deal with the brain fog 24/7

    edit: I know adrenal fatigue results in low cortisol levels (hence why im looking to get IsoCort rx) but will I get "fatter" using this? I have a squeaky clean diet as it is, but hormones can affect this.. Thanks


  2. Quote Originally Posted by mcc23 View Post
    I like this combo.. I'm on a major stim break as I have epic adrenal fatigue so caff/stims are a no go.. S*** sucks horribly.. Got a doc appt on Thurs to get a hydrocortisone rx. Hopefully it'll work...Anyways, that was off track..I was thinkin Citrulline, Agmatine, Alcar, and a nitrate, plus maybe Beta-Alanine.
    Where is the sublingual dose of B12, that will help a ton with natural energy as will a high dose of ALCAR (2-4 grams).
    If my direct and cynical approach bothers you, just ignore it. I'm just saying what you need to hear ;).
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by oufinny View Post
    Where is the sublingual dose of B12, that will help a ton with natural energy as will a high dose of ALCAR (2-4 grams).
    I've been doin a b complex along w/ vitamin c every morning.. Hasn't really seemed to do anything for me, tbh

  4. Quote Originally Posted by mcc23 View Post
    I've been doin a b complex along w/ vitamin c every morning.. Hasn't really seemed to do anything for me, tbh
    Did you miss the SUBLINGUAL part I posted? The absorption rate is so much higher that way.
    If my direct and cynical approach bothers you, just ignore it. I'm just saying what you need to hear ;).

  5. Quote Originally Posted by mcc23 View Post
    Yea I know thats what I'm a bit leery about.. I'm goin to tell them straight up that it's from abuse of stimulants..Besides, how hard is it to prescribe hydrocortisone in small doses? .I hope they aren't ignorant b/c I can't deal with the brain fog 24/7

    edit: I know adrenal fatigue results in low cortisol levels (hence why im looking to get IsoCort rx) but will I get "fatter" using this? I have a squeaky clean diet as it is, but hormones can affect this.. Thanks
    There is no reason to use cortisone. One cannot induce adrenal fatigue by using basic stims like caffeine, even at megadoses.
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by oufinny View Post
    Did you miss the SUBLINGUAL part I posted? The absorption rate is so much higher that way.
    It's actually near identical (quantified via study) unless you have an intrinsic factor deficiency (which I happen to have lol).

  7. ALCAR 1g, Agmatine 1g, Citrulline Malate 4g, Beta Alanine/Creatine 3g/3g GMS 6g; Gplc at 3-4 grams and Leucine or amino complex, nootropics too!
    Knowledge is power- The power to do your part and make a difference.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    There is no reason to use cortisone. One cannot induce adrenal fatigue by using basic stims like caffeine, even at megadoses.
    Then what could be the cause? Everything I've read point to overuse of caffeine

    Several sources also say this.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by mcc23

    Then what could be the cause? Everything I've read point to overuse of caffeine

    Several sources also say this.
    Cell receptors bro. Thy body wants thou homeostasis! Look up adenosine and caffeine. It is fascinating.
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  10. Quote Originally Posted by mcc23 View Post
    Then what could be the cause? Everything I've read point to overuse of caffeineSeveral sources also say this.
    I'm guessing the sources saying this are either homeopathic quacks or e-scientists

  11. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    I'm guessing the sources saying this are either homeopathic quacks or e-scientists
    Ugh that's not good. I mean all of the symptoms of it match to what I'm feeling. Lack of energy, motivation, Signs of depression, brain fog, sudden hair loss, etc... The only cause I can think of is my excess use of caffeine in my pwo's. I know something's out of whack and I want to get it fixed ASAP.

    Edit: I can start a new thread about AF, as it kind of deviates from the initial thread topic..but I don't think anyone really cares lol
  12. Unbreakable
    David Dunn's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by mcc23 View Post
    Ugh that's not good. I mean all of the symptoms of it match to what I'm feeling. Lack of energy, motivation, Signs of depression, brain fog, sudden hair loss, etc... The only cause I can think of is my excess use of caffeine in my pwo's. I know something's out of whack and I want to get it fixed ASAP.

    Edit: I can start a new thread about AF, as it kind of deviates from the initial thread topic..but I don't think anyone really cares lol
    You are welcome to start a new thread. Research the board first. You may find that it is an "urban myth"

  13. Quote Originally Posted by David Dunn View Post
    You are welcome to start a new thread. Research the board first. You may find that it is an "urban myth"
    I really dont believe that tbh. These things don't just happen.
  14. Unbreakable
    David Dunn's Avatar

    I am not dismissing your anecdotal experience.

    Let me ask you - you are 5'11" tall and 160lbs? That is quite thin even if you are very very lean. In the event that you are very very lean your leptin and other brain/body physiology can casue those symptoms. In the event that you are not very lean than that is very skinny.

    How is your diet? Macros? EFA? When is the last time you over-ate and or ate in surplus (with lots of complex carbs) for extended periods?

    Lots of other factor can produce the symptoms you are experiencing.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by David Dunn View Post
    Come on dude! Read what I linked you. No disrespect but you have the information right at your finger tips. It will answer your questions.
    Just being lazy, will read it now.

  16. Quote Originally Posted by David Dunn View Post
    I am not dismissing your anecdotal experience.

    Let me ask you - you are 5'11" tall and 160lbs? That is quite thin even if you are very very lean. In the event that you are very very lean your leptin and other brain/body physiology can casue those symptoms. In the event that you are not very lean than that is very skinny.

    How is your diet? Macros? EFA? When is the last time you over-ate and or ate in surplus (with lots of complex carbs) for extended periods?

    Lots of other factor can produce the symptoms you are experiencing.

    Well im 166 now. But I carb cycle. On my lifting days I consume ~3400 calories (320P,250c,~100f), and on off days its about 1800..But it's a muscular 166 I'm like 7% bf...I usually don't even binge eat on carbs. Only hiccup I can think of w/ diet is that I eat pretty much the same stuff every day. Chicken, Tuna, Egg/Egg Whites, Brown Rice, Oats, Natty PB, almonds..

    Edit: Supps include:
    Protein
    Creapure
    Fish Oil
    GDA/NP (new)
    Non-stim Pwo
    Multi
    Vit C
    B complex
  17. Unbreakable
    David Dunn's Avatar

    How long do you believe you can stay at 7% bodyfat before you start to get some negative feedback? IMHO you should put on some bodyfat and see how you feel. I'm sure that is not what you want to hear. Consider I'm no expert.

    Best of luck!

  18. Quote Originally Posted by David Dunn View Post
    How long do you believe you can stay at 7% bodyfat before you start to get some negative feedback? IMHO you should put on some bodyfat and see how you feel. I'm sure that is not what you want to hear. Consider I'm no expert.

    Best of luck!
    Well, 7% IMO isn't drastically low. I figure its a level that you can hover around year round.. 4% on the other hand is a bit low. Anyway, I honestly don't understand how adding fat would help. And yes, it isn't exactly what I wanted to hear.. But I'm lean bulking atm and can expect to put on a little, but it'll still come off come cut time around January

    edit: I know Leptin levels are positively coorelated to bf% but don't see how it would produce the symptoms I've listed

  19. Quote Originally Posted by mcc23

    Well, 7% IMO isn't drastically low. I figure its a level that you can hover around year round.. 4% on the other hand is a bit low. Anyway, I honestly don't understand how adding fat would help. And yes, it isn't exactly what I wanted to hear.. But I'm lean bulking atm and can expect to put on a little, but it'll still come off come cut time around January

    edit: I know Leptin levels are positively coorelated to bf% but don't see how it would produce the symptoms I've listed
    At 166 pounds 5'11" why are you even cutting?
    You should probably go on a very long lean bulk. There is no point in you only adding a few pounds just to cut it off unless you are gaining serious weight at your size.
    Unless that is, you just want to be small/skinny/cut guy and not strong/big/muscular/attractive guy
    Your choice goal dependent

  20. Quote Originally Posted by Mitch5 View Post
    At 166 pounds 5'11" why are you even cutting?
    You should probably go on a very long lean bulk. There is no point in you only adding a few pounds just to cut it off unless you are gaining serious weight at your size.
    Unless that is, you just want to be small/skinny/cut guy and not strong/big/muscular/attractive guy
    Your choice goal dependent
    While he didn't ask for advice, I do echo this. The amount of calories you're taking in from your protein will be next to useless once you've reached the optimal intake (which hasn't been proven to be anything more than 1.2-1.4g/kg for even weight training individuals) as you will utilize at best ~10% of the extra calories for energy-needs IIRC.

    But, to each their own.
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  21. Quote Originally Posted by Mitch5 View Post
    At 166 pounds 5'11" why are you even cutting?
    You should probably go on a very long lean bulk. There is no point in you only adding a few pounds just to cut it off unless you are gaining serious weight at your size.
    Unless that is, you just want to be small/skinny/cut guy and not strong/big/muscular/attractive guy
    Your choice goal dependent
    Not cutting for atleast 2 months. We're getting off track from what the initial conversation was..Well, it diverted from pwo's to adrenal fatigue but I'd like to get some more advice about the adrenal fatigue part.

    I understand im not the ideal weight, but I'm definetly not skinny either..These symptoms began occuring roughly 4 months ago. I've got a dr. appointment tomorrow, and I don't really feel like payin a co-pay to a doctor thats just gonna tell me that adrenal fatigue does not exist. I've always been lighter than usual, but I don't see why now it would become an issue

  22. Quote Originally Posted by mcc23

    Not cutting for atleast 2 months. We're getting off track from what the initial conversation was..Well, it diverted from pwo's to adrenal fatigue but I'd like to get some more advice about the adrenal fatigue part.

    I understand im not the ideal weight, but I'm definetly not skinny either..These symptoms began occuring roughly 4 months ago. I've got a dr. appointment tomorrow, and I don't really feel like payin a co-pay to a doctor thats just gonna tell me that adrenal fatigue does not exist. I've always been lighter than usual, but I don't see why now it would become an issue
    I meant it more in a way of if your lifting really hard and not gaining much weight then switching to a cut and losing ( something) that's going to make you tired/weak. Calories are energy, if your lean bulk to cut is keeping you at a near deficit all the time your not getting enough to keep your body turning properly. That's why bb'ers bulk crazy hard then cut extremely hard in a short period and only hold that through comp then eat after that like a horse.
    My point is maybe your symptoms are not "adrenal fatigue" but just "run down" from training/stimulating/calorie deficient for a long time. Just a thought.

  23. Quote Originally Posted by Mitch5 View Post
    I meant it more in a way of if your lifting really hard and not gaining much weight then switching to a cut and losing ( something) that's going to make you tired/weak. Calories are energy, if your lean bulk to cut is keeping you at a near deficit all the time your not getting enough to keep your body turning properly. That's why bb'ers bulk crazy hard then cut extremely hard in a short period and only hold that through comp then eat after that like a horse.
    My point is maybe your symptoms are not "adrenal fatigue" but just "run down" from training/stimulating/calorie deficient for a long time. Just a thought.
    I understand your point, and appreciate your input..So would adjusting daily calories be a good start? I like the idea of carb cycling b/c it minimizes fat gains. If I eat at maintenance on off days (instead of 200cal deficit) and increase my on day cals up to say 3600, that would be sufficient for recovery and prevent me from feeling run down? Oh and also another member mentioned about my protein intake being too high.. Well, I've heard 1g/lb, 1.5g/lb and up to 2g/lb.. Main reason why I err on the high side is because I have a slight carbophobia lol.. I'm getting better as I put down upwards 290g on leg days, but I've been told that I shouldn't worry about eating so many as eating the majority of them around my workout window will prevent de novo lipogensis..Also, I have a little R-ala and SS that I could use for sanity purposes..

    edit:Perhaps I should re-consider the whole carb/calorie cycling thing..I'd like to think a lean bulk is possible by means other than carb cycling.. Just a 300-500 cal surplus each day, regardless of lifting or not? And adjust macro-comp accordingly.?

  24. Quote Originally Posted by mcc23 View Post
    edit:Perhaps I should re-consider the whole carb/calorie cycling thing..I'd like to think a lean bulk is possible by means other than carb cycling.. Just a 300-500 cal surplus each day, regardless of lifting or not? And adjust macro-comp accordingly.?
    I was going to harp on this as the end-all-be-all regarding weight gain. If you lift appropriately in the gym, eat appropriately in the kitchen, get ample rest in the bedroom, the gains will come. I personally advertise nothing more than 1g PRO/lbs at most, as that is already more than the studied amount at 1.4g/kg (.7g/lbs). Carbs are where we derive our energy, as are fats and neither should necessarily 'scare' you; however, I understand the phobia.

    The simple response is energy in > energy out; however, protein intakes that exceed our body's needs (read: natty, not on gear as that would warrant a higher protein intake) will not be utilized for energy as carbs and fats would. I started out with 2g/lbs protein, low fat, and moderate carbs when I first started and had to chug down so many shakes; but the reality is that I've made more gains lately with 1g/lbs protein, moderate fat and moderate carbs, as the extra energy from the increased fat/carbs has aided more so than the excess protein ever did (anecdotally).
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  25. Quote Originally Posted by neddo View Post
    I was going to harp on this as the end-all-be-all regarding weight gain. If you lift appropriately in the gym, eat appropriately in the kitchen, get ample rest in the bedroom, the gains will come. I personally advertise nothing more than 1g PRO/lbs at most, as that is already more than the studied amount at 1.4g/kg (.7g/lbs). Carbs are where we derive our energy, as are fats and neither should necessarily 'scare' you; however, I understand the phobia.

    The simple response is energy in > energy out; however, protein intakes that exceed our body's needs (read: natty, not on gear as that would warrant a higher protein intake) will not be utilized for energy as carbs and fats would. I started out with 2g/lbs protein, low fat, and moderate carbs when I first started and had to chug down so many shakes; but the reality is that I've made more gains lately with 1g/lbs protein, moderate fat and moderate carbs, as the extra energy from the increased fat/carbs has aided more so than the excess protein ever did (anecdotally).
    Thanks for the reply..So regardless of on day or off day, shoot for ~3500 calories (which is about 500 cal surplus), but the only thing that changes is the composition of carbs/fats on lifting/off days? Fat gains will be minimized through proper nutrient timing, sources of these macros, modest surplus of total calories, adequate rest, and some light intensity cardio 2-3x/week...?


    edit: I know this thread has taken several detours but either way it's helpin me get back on track.I'm hopin the food is the culprit and not actual adrenal damage...Thanks in advance.
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