Epi and Your Nuts... - AnabolicMinds.com

Epi and Your Nuts...

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    Epi and Your Nuts...


    Anyone else experience the condition I've come to know as "epi nuts"?

    Usually I don't get any atrophy symptoms until the very end of a cycle, or post cycle therapy, if at all. But both times I've used epi, I found I'm ll shriveled by day two. Is it just me?

    Anyone?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThisGuy02 View Post
    But both times I've used epi, I found I'm practically gagging on those bad boys by day two. Is it just me?
    PLACEBO.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThisGuy02 View Post
    "epi nuts"?

    I found I'm practically gagging on those bad boys by day two. Is it just me?

    Anyone?
    That's nasty!
    •   
       

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThisGuy02 View Post
    Anyone else experience the condition I've come to know as "epi nuts"?

    Usually I don't get any atrophy symptoms until the very end of a cycle, or post cycle therapy, if at all. But both times I've used epi, I found I'm practically gagging on those bad boys by day two. Is it just me?

    Anyone?
    Ummmm....Wow!

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
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    Homo?
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    LOL!!!!!!!!

    I think he meant that he gets such bad "shutdown" that his balls shrink up to the point where they near turtle-up into his body... At which point he "chokes" on them....?

    Likely not the best wording, given the audience! LOL
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    Quote Originally Posted by Insidious1 View Post
    LOL!!!!!!!!

    I think he meant that he gets such bad "shutdown" that his balls shrink up to the point where they near turtle-up into his body... At which point he "chokes" on them....?

    Likely not the best wording, given the audience! LOL
    You got it, dude. Anyway, I reworded it for all the rectal raiders around here who were trying to project their closet preferences onto me. LOL

    Anyway, there's no way that $h!t is placebo. No one else experiences the same thing?
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    i noticed some shutdown around week 2. finished week 3 without much more and after a week on torem i was back to normal. Hope you had a serm.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weebs View Post
    i noticed some shutdown around week 2. finished week 3 without much more and after a week on torem i was back to normal. Hope you had a serm.

    i 2nd that!
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    Quote Originally Posted by SOLARUS View Post
    PLACEBO.
    im going to need an explination on that one. Being able to see a placebo is news to me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Insidious1 View Post
    i 2nd that!
    Naturally. Always got my Nolva and my Clomid on hand before ever starting.

    To be honest, I'm really on my second week, I just don't count that first one because I did 4 days at 10mg, and 3 days at 2mg, just so I wasn't starting right at 30mg, like I did last time. Still, 2nd day at 30, and I'm at it again. In all fairness, it's not like permanent shrinkage. They drop back to normal every now and again, but a good part of the day is spent...should I say, wound up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThisGuy02 View Post
    Naturally. Always got my Nolva and my Clomid on hand before ever starting.

    To be honest, I'm really on my second week, I just don't count that first one because I did 4 days at 10mg, and 3 days at 2mg, just so I wasn't starting right at 30mg, like I did last time. Still, 2nd day at 30, and I'm at it again. In all fairness, it's not like permanent shrinkage. They drop back to normal every now and again, but a good part of the day is spent...should I say, wound up.
    Thats really weird. The changing in size throughout the day or from day to day is new to me. Shrinkage is usually pretty consistent. Once it starts it just slowly gets worse and worse until you begin PCT and as long as all goes as planned they'll be back to normal in no time.

    I ran Epi myself and didn't have any noticeable shrinkage. Only real noticeable side was a complete loss of libido around the middle of the third week. Well that and my newly developed gyno (two months after finishing up PCT).
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    I'm with Weight - I noticed little shrinkage with Epi.

    But - I didn't have any libido drop (mine seemed to go up somewhat) and no gyno.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmh80 View Post
    I'm with Weight - I noticed little shrinkage with Epi.

    But - I didn't have any libido drop (mine seemed to go up somewhat) and no gyno.
    The libido effects seem to differ from one person to the next. Mine was sky high the first two and a half weeks and then suddenly was non-existent.

    The gyno was delayed, two months after my PCT. I'm running Letro right now to try to get rid of it right now and it seems to be working.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MovinWeight View Post
    Thats really weird. The changing in size throughout the day or from day to day is new to me. Shrinkage is usually pretty consistent. Once it starts it just slowly gets worse and worse until you begin post cycle therapy and as long as all goes as planned they'll be back to normal in no time.

    I ran Epi myself and didn't have any noticeable shrinkage. Only real noticeable side was a complete loss of libido around the middle of the third week. Well that and my newly developed gyno (two months after finishing up PCT).

    well newly developed gyno means that your body had an influx in estrogen and nothing to block it, this can happen after any cycle or even with a natty test booster if an AI isnt taken.

    I dont think you can even try to correlate this with Epi but only with cycleing in general and more likely what else you may have been running in your down time.

    What did you use for your pct just wondering?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThisGuy02 View Post
    You got it, dude. Anyway, I reworded it for all the rectal raiders around here who were trying to project their closet preferences onto me. LOL

    Anyway, there's no way that $h!t is placebo. No one else experiences the same thing?

    Epi is kinda harsh on my nuts after a few weeks, but nothing like 1-test. That was like 4 days, and my nuts were the size of nipples.
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    Quote Originally Posted by poopypants View Post
    well newly developed gyno means that your body had an influx in estrogen and nothing to block it, this can happen after any cycle or even with a natty test booster if an AI isnt taken.

    I dont think you can even try to correlate this with Epi but only with cycleing in general and more likely what else you may have been running in your down time.

    What did you use for your post cycle therapy just wondering?
    Don't worry I'm not bashing Epi. It worked great and I will definitely consider running it again. I gained 8 pounds while dropping a little bodyfat.

    My post cycle therapy was 4 weeks of nolva, 60/40/30/20, along with Anabolic Innovation's Post Cycle Support. I finished up PCT on December 15th.

    The only reason I wonder if it's not a delayed result of the Epi is because I haven't ran any supplements at all since the Epi cycle. Just basic protein powders, BCAAs, EFAs, etc. Plus I have seen a few other mentions of people who have ran Epi who are now experiencing signs of some delayed gyno.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MovinWeight View Post
    Don't worry I'm not bashing Epi. It worked great and I will definitely consider running it again. I gained 8 pounds while dropping a little bodyfat.

    My post cycle therapy was 4 weeks of nolva, 60/40/30/20, along with Anabolic Innovation's Post Cycle Support. I finished up post cycle therapy on December 15th.

    The only reason I wonder if it's not a delayed result of the Epi is because I haven't ran any supplements at all since the Epi cycle. Just basic protein powders, BCAAs, EFAs, etc. Plus I have seen a few other mentions of people who have ran Epi who are now experiencing signs of some delayed gyno.
    my only criticism of your pct would be the lack of an AI.... as your body has been raising in test levels you werent protecting any of it from ever turning into estrogen. A suicidal inhibitor is the best choice since it will get rid of the aromatase permanantly till it can remake some, limiting how much estrogen can even be made over then next months of your body building back up to normal test levels.

    I think that this could very well be one of the reasons why you experienced it... the second you stop the serm (well 48 hours after given its long halflife) the estrogen is still there and free to attack the receptors... it takes a while for it to actually create any effects it doesnt happen over night, its constant (over)saturation of the est receptors that will cause the sides to start.

    This is why its really imparitive that you get blood work doen a week after you finish pct, that way everything has cleared halflife wise and you can get an idea as to where your sitting and what else you may need to do.... wether it be continue on with test boosters to raise it to desierd leves or make sure to take an AI or continue low dose SERM to combat high est levels.

    this is all JMO. also I think many taking Epi are newbs or guys that are taking it too lightly and only using OTC pct's... I think thats a nono regardless of compound.
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    when i ran epidrol i hardly had any shrinkage......i guess you got the tren batch of epi LOL. jk.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pistonpump View Post
    when i ran epidrol i hardly had any shrinkage......i guess you got the tren batch of epi LOL. jk.
    Weird, I know. Now that you mention it, I've run two seperate cycle of Tren with no shrinkage to speak of in the first and only during week 3 of p.c.t. in the second.

    I don't know, this morning the boys are chillin'. I'm also taking t2, venom and napalm, so maybe the combination of stimulants in the venom and the napalm? you know, like my nuts are geting into racing mode, maybe?
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    Quote Originally Posted by MovinWeight View Post
    Don't worry I'm not bashing Epi. It worked great and I will definitely consider running it again. I gained 8 pounds while dropping a little bodyfat.

    My post cycle therapy was 4 weeks of nolva, 60/40/30/20, along with Anabolic Innovation's Post Cycle Support. I finished up post cycle therapy on December 15th.

    The only reason I wonder if it's not a delayed result of the Epi is because I haven't ran any supplements at all since the Epi cycle. Just basic protein powders, BCAAs, EFAs, etc. Plus I have seen a few other mentions of people who have ran Epi who are now experiencing signs of some delayed gyno.
    I don't buy into the whole "epi to combat gyno" thing, but epi is reportedly VERY low risk for gyno.

    As for the libido, the general consensus is that there is none. It affects everyone differently. Personally, it has had no negative effect on me, neither on my last cycle (6 weeks) nor this one up until now. I won't say it's gone up, but it definitely hasn't suffered.

    Now, back to tren...that $h!t will KILL your libido!
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    I dont know man, whenever I pulse epi my balls fluctuate back and forth from normal size to slightly bigger.. I'm sure it's just one of those things that vary from person to person..
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    Quote Originally Posted by poopypants View Post
    my only criticism of your pct would be the lack of an AI.... as your body has been raising in test levels you werent protecting any of it from ever turning into estrogen. A suicidal inhibitor is the best choice since it will get rid of the aromatase permanantly till it can remake some, limiting how much estrogen can even be made over then next months of your body building back up to normal test levels.

    I think that this could very well be one of the reasons why you experienced it... the second you stop the serm (well 48 hours after given its long halflife) the estrogen is still there and free to attack the receptors... it takes a while for it to actually create any effects it doesnt happen over night, its constant (over)saturation of the est receptors that will cause the sides to start.

    This is why its really imparitive that you get blood work doen a week after you finish pct, that way everything has cleared halflife wise and you can get an idea as to where your sitting and what else you may need to do.... wether it be continue on with test boosters to raise it to desierd leves or make sure to take an AI or continue low dose SERM to combat high est levels.

    this is all JMO. also I think many taking Epi are newbs or guys that are taking it too lightly and only using OTC pct's... I think thats a nono regardless of compound.
    I agree that I probably should have added an AI. I talked to a lot of guys and I was convinced that it wasn't needed, at least for an Epi cycle, but I will always been running an AI from now on inversely tapered with a SERM. I feel I might be gyno prone and you can never be too careful. You only get one body and better safe than sorry. Luckily my current Letro use seems to be working. The bump is nearly non-existent now.

    Thanks for your thoughts. I wouldn't call myself a newb though. This was only my second cycle but I did a lot of research before starting both cycles. Probably a good 6 months prior to the first cycle. Thanks for your input and for putting out a great product with Epi.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MovinWeight View Post
    I agree that I probably should have added an AI. I talked to a lot of guys and I was convinced that it wasn't needed, at least for an Epi cycle, but I will always been running an AI from now on inversely tapered with a SERM. I feel I might be gyno prone and you can never be too careful. You only get one body and better safe than sorry. Luckily my current Letro use seems to be working. The bump is nearly non-existent now.

    Thanks for your thoughts. I wouldn't call myself a newb though. This was only my second cycle but I did a lot of research before starting both cycles. Probably a good 6 months prior to the first cycle. Thanks for your input and for putting out a great product with Epi.

    Im sorry I hope you didnt think I was calling you a newb, I was reffering to most others that are reporting gyno as well... Im glad to hear though that the Letro is doing its work.

    I too am prone to gyno, obviously(if you caught my log). I dont think you cant ever do too much in PCT and dont see any reason not to just go over board with it, not only to make sure sides arent incurred but so that all gains are maintained if not improved upon.... wich I usually do in my PCT's .

    Thanks for the comps on Epi, belive me when I say theres nothing but more good things to come from IBE, a enitre line up of reformulations and maybe a new item as well
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    Quote Originally Posted by poopypants View Post
    Im sorry I hope you didnt think I was calling you a newb, I was reffering to most others that are reporting gyno as well... Im glad to hear though that the Letro is doing its work.

    I too am prone to gyno, obviously(if you caught my log). I dont think you cant ever do too much in PCT and dont see any reason not to just go over board with it, not only to make sure sides arent incurred but so that all gains are maintained if not improved upon.... wich I usually do in my PCT's .

    Thanks for the comps on Epi, belive me when I say theres nothing but more good things to come from IBE, a enitre line up of reformulations and maybe a new item as well
    No offense taken. Had to create a new account about a week or two ago so if you just glance at my stats it looks like I just got here.

    Can't wait to see what IBE's got up their sleeves in the future.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MovinWeight View Post
    No offense taken. Had to create a new account about a week or two ago so if you just glance at my stats it looks like I just got here.

    Can't wait to see what IBE's got up their sleeves in the future.
    I hadnt even checked that, Ive known your name round here for a lil while, I know you aint a newb.
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    Quote Originally Posted by poopypants View Post
    Im sorry I hope you didnt think I was calling you a newb, I was reffering to most others that are reporting gyno as well... Im glad to hear though that the Letro is doing its work.

    I too am prone to gyno, obviously(if you caught my log). I dont think you cant ever do too much in PCT and dont see any reason not to just go over board with it, not only to make sure sides arent incurred but so that all gains are maintained if not improved upon.... wich I usually do in my PCT's .

    Thanks for the comps on Epi, belive me when I say theres nothing but more good things to come from IBE, a enitre line up of reformulations and maybe a new item as well
    Please, please, PLEASE...tell me Orotropin is coming back!! Or Ectotropin, maybe???
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThisGuy02 View Post
    Anyone else experience the condition I've come to know as "epi nuts"?

    Usually I don't get any atrophy symptoms until the very end of a cycle, or post cycle therapy, if at all. But both times I've used epi, I found I'm ll shriveled by day two. Is it just me?

    Anyone?
    I've noticed that I have a tendancy to shutdown very quickly after starting a PH cycle. at least once it's happened within 10 days or so.
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    Quote Originally Posted by poopypants View Post
    I too am prone to gyno, obviously(if you caught my log). I dont think you cant ever do too much in PCT and dont see any reason not to just go over board with it, not only to make sure sides arent incurred but so that all gains are maintained if not improved upon.... wich I usually do in my PCT's .
    if you go overboard with PCT don't you have to worry about gyno rebound after PCT?
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    Some people make post cycle therapy harder on their body than it could be. More is not always better. That's why blood work is so important.
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    Quote Originally Posted by delsolrob View Post
    if you go overboard with PCT don't you have to worry about gyno rebound after PCT?
    That's what I thought.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frequency View Post
    im going to need an explination on that one. Being able to see a placebo is news to me.
    it's pretty straightforward. if you THINK something is going to happen, even if it doesnt you manifest the result in your brain and you think it has happened. like a bunk pill for fat loss....or Airborne for colds...or steroids that are actually just oil in vials.

    when an outcome is utterly impossible, like getting the kind of complete testicular shutdown and stopping of leydig cell activity that would cause noticeable, appreciable shrinkage of testicles when having only used a not-extremely suppressive steroid for just 2 days...i would call that a placebo effect. likely the user is just paying a lot of attention to his balls because he read that steroids can cause shrinkage of them...

    either that or he is suppressed from something else....

    anyway, i notice some very mild shrinkage from epi after about 3 weeks, but no libido loss.

    i suppose the possibility exists that the user is incredibly susceptible to suppression and responds instantly the way another would after several weeks...but the odds are against that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by matthew76 View Post
    Some people make post cycle therapy harder on their body than it could be. More is not always better. That's why blood work is so important.
    Bah.

    I don't make $700 orders to use 2 things in PCT...
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    Quote Originally Posted by delsolrob View Post
    if you go overboard with PCT don't you have to worry about gyno rebound after PCT?
    ummm no, did I say that?

    I said its worth it doing more then less.

    The only way to make sure you dont get gyno rebound is to do I stated in a later post and that is to get post PCT bloodwork done, at least a week after to make sure PCT was even succesfull.

    My point made in the paragraph quoted was it will be better to do more then not do enough and it will help you maintian if not improve upon your gains as well.... this will NOT make up for getting solid feedback if it worked or not by getting bloodwork done.

    Good job taking my post outta context though
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThisGuy02 View Post
    Anyone else experience the condition I've come to know as "epi nuts"?

    Usually I don't get any atrophy symptoms until the very end of a cycle, or post cycle therapy, if at all. But both times I've used epi, I found I'm ll shriveled by day two. Is it just me?

    Anyone?
    Yup...same here bro. There was a couple others as well on another board who experienced it. Very few people so far.

    Mine got very very tight and uncomfortable within 3 days or so! Just hugged up fast, wasnt my imagination either...who could it be...felt like BLUE BALLS LOL!

    tightness subsided in PCT more fully around week 3-4
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    Quote Originally Posted by matthew76 View Post
    Some people make post cycle therapy harder on their body than it could be. More is not always better. That's why blood work is so important.
    This is where "over board" needs to be smart.

    I make sure to hit it from every angle/pathway/factor that needs to be addressed in PCT, from estrogen control (both direct and from aromatase) to cortisol, to cellular hydration (poseidon and creatine), to nutrient partitioning, to testosterone boosting/htpa restart, to preworkout driving supps and most importantly a change in diet and/or routine to suit pct. ect ect ect....

    not just a simple start taking serm and a test booster for me and keep on with the same old diet and hardcore routine....
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    Quote Originally Posted by poopypants View Post
    ummm no, did I say that?

    I said its worth it doing more then less.

    The only way to make sure you dont get gyno rebound is to do I stated in a later post and that is to get post PCT bloodwork done, at least a week after to make sure PCT was even succesfull.

    My point made in the paragraph quoted was it will be better to do more then not do enough and it will help you maintian if not improve upon your gains as well.... this will NOT make up for getting solid feedback if it worked or not by getting bloodwork done.

    Good job taking my post outta context though
    hey Poopy!

    I don't see how I took it out of context...I read what you wrote (as well as the rest of the thread) and I had a question about your position on the topic...I'm here to learn, so I posed a question regarding it. I thought you were advocating the "everything but the kitchen sink" approach to PCT.

    Thanks for taking the time to respond and let me know how I missinterpreted what you had posted.
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    Quote Originally Posted by delsolrob View Post
    hey Poopy!

    I don't see how I took it out of context...I read what you wrote (as well as the rest of the thread) and I had a question about your position on the topic...I'm here to learn, so I posed a question regarding it. I thought you were advocating the "everything but the kitchen sink" approach to PCT.

    Thanks for taking the time to respond and let me know how I missinterpreted what you had posted.

    my bad, I thought you were being a smart ass bout what I wrote....

    guess you know what you know what you look like when you ASS-u-me things eh?

    my bad bro.
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    Quote Originally Posted by poopypants View Post
    The only way to make sure you dont get gyno rebound is to do I stated in a later post and that is to get post PCT bloodwork done, at least a week after to make sure PCT was even succesfull.
    or you could just monitor your nips and administer a well-designed nolva protocol in response to any puffiness or tenderness.

    lots of guys dont have PCT problems...if you've run a cycle 3 times and had no gyno flare-ups, then 4th time likely wont do it, but if it does, you are equipped to battle it.

    that said - everyone who can afford it should get bloodwork done - but seeing as steroid use is generally ephermeral damage, those who cant afford it can get by with a critical approach and lots of research and planning, IMHO.
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